State of Israel

Inkfingers said:

Hold, a moment ago you were doubting the Joseph connection. Now you accept it?

Click to expand...

Jesus is descended from King David through Mary.

Mary is not listed in the genealogies. But her father was - in being Heli. Heli was Joseph's father-in-law, Mary's father.

In Matthew 1:16, Joseph's actual father is listed - Jacob (begot Joseph)

Differently....

In Luke 3:23, Joseph's father-in-law is listed, Heli - Mary's father. (does not say Heli begot Joseph, like Jacob begot Joseph)

Which Jesus is descended from David through Mary. Mary is not listed directly, but because her father was, it means Jesus was descended from David through Mary.

Douggg said:

You don't have anything in the bible that says the church has become Israel.

Click to expand...

Really Douggg. It seems your Bible gathers dust on the shelf.

The true Christian Church are Israelites:

Those believers who love the Lord and keep His commandments, that is: every faithful Christian person are designated by God to be Israelites. Galatians 6:16 The New Testament writings are clear: there is only one Israel, who are the only one Church, only one elect, be they Jew or Gentile by birth.

1/ Israel, the chosen people of God: Exodus 15:13, Deuteronomy 33:3, Ezra 3:11
Christians, chosen of God: Romans 9:25, Ephesians 5:1, Col. 3:12, 1 John 3:1, Rev. 7:9

2/ Israel, the children of God: Deut. 14:1, Isaiah 1:2-4, Isaiah 63:8, Hosea 11:1
Christians, the children of God: John 1:12, Romans 8:14-16, Galatians 4:5-7, 1 John 3:1

3/ Israel, the scattered sheep of God: Psalms 78:52, Isaiah 40:11, Jer. 23:1-4, Ezekiel 4:12
Christians, His sheep: among the nations: John 10:14-16, Hebrews 13:20, 1 Peter 2:25

4/ Israel, God’s household: Hebrews 3:5, 1 Chronicles 29:14-18
Christians are God’s household: Hebrews 3:6, Hebrews 10:20-21, I Timothy 3:15, 1 Cor.3:9

5/ Israel are the priests of God: Exodus 19:6, Deuteronomy 27:9
Christians are the priests of God: Isaiah 66:21, 1 Peter 2:5-9, Rev. 1:6, Revelation 5:10

6/ Israel is the bride of God: Isaiah 54:5-6, Jeremiah 2:2, Ezekiel 16:32, Hosea 1:2
Christians are the bride of Christ: Isaiah 62:4-5, 2 Corinthians 11:2, Ephesians 5:29-32

7/ Israel is the vine and the olive tree: Isaiah 5:7, Hosea 9:10, Hosea 14:6-7
Christians are the vine and the olive: Luke 20:16, Romans 11:24

8/ Israelites are the circumcised: Genesis 17:9-14, Judges 15:18
Christians are the ‘circumcised’: Romans 2:25-29, Philippians 3:3, Col. 2:11

9/ Israelites are the children of Abraham: 2 Chronicles 20:7, Psalms 105:5-6, Isaiah 41:8
Christians are the spiritual children of Abraham: Romans 4:13-18, Gal. 3:7& 29, John 4:23

10/ The Covenant is with Israel: Deut. 4:31, 2 Kings 17:34-36, Psalms 105:7-10
The New Covenant is with Christians: 1 Corinthians 11:25, Hebrews 8:6-10, Ezekiel 34:25

The above 10 proofs totally negate any argument that the true Church and faithful Israel are 2 separate entities. That premise is held and promoted by the pre-trib rapture exponents, who must have 2 groups; one removed to heaven, [themselves] and the Jews, [Israel] who remain on earth to face the Great Tribulation.
The idea of Two peoples, Two Promises, is a lie upon the 'rapture to heaven' lie.

keras said:

Really Douggg. It seems your Bible gathers dust on the shelf.

The true Christian Church are Israelites:

Those believers who love the Lord and keep His commandments, that is: every faithful Christian person are designated by God to be Israelites. Galatians 6:16 The New Testament writings are clear: there is only one Israel, who are the only one Church, only one elect, be they Jew or Gentile by birth.

1/ Israel, the chosen people of God: Exodus 15:13, Deuteronomy 33:3, Ezra 3:11
Christians, chosen of God: Romans 9:25, Ephesians 5:1, Col. 3:12, 1 John 3:1, Rev. 7:9

2/ Israel, the children of God: Deut. 14:1, Isaiah 1:2-4, Isaiah 63:8, Hosea 11:1
Christians, the children of God: John 1:12, Romans 8:14-16, Galatians 4:5-7, 1 John 3:1

3/ Israel, the scattered sheep of God: Psalms 78:52, Isaiah 40:11, Jer. 23:1-4, Ezekiel 4:12
Christians, His sheep: among the nations: John 10:14-16, Hebrews 13:20, 1 Peter 2:25

4/ Israel, God’s household: Hebrews 3:5, 1 Chronicles 29:14-18
Christians are God’s household: Hebrews 3:6, Hebrews 10:20-21, I Timothy 3:15, 1 Cor.3:9

5/ Israel are the priests of God: Exodus 19:6, Deuteronomy 27:9
Christians are the priests of God: Isaiah 66:21, 1 Peter 2:5-9, Rev. 1:6, Revelation 5:10

6/ Israel is the bride of God: Isaiah 54:5-6, Jeremiah 2:2, Ezekiel 16:32, Hosea 1:2
Christians are the bride of Christ: Isaiah 62:4-5, 2 Corinthians 11:2, Ephesians 5:29-32

7/ Israel is the vine and the olive tree: Isaiah 5:7, Hosea 9:10, Hosea 14:6-7
Christians are the vine and the olive: Luke 20:16, Romans 11:24

8/ Israelites are the circumcised: Genesis 17:9-14, Judges 15:18
Christians are the ‘circumcised’: Romans 2:25-29, Philippians 3:3, Col. 2:11

9/ Israelites are the children of Abraham: 2 Chronicles 20:7, Psalms 105:5-6, Isaiah 41:8
Christians are the spiritual children of Abraham: Romans 4:13-18, Gal. 3:7& 29, John 4:23

10/ The Covenant is with Israel: Deut. 4:31, 2 Kings 17:34-36, Psalms 105:7-10
The New Covenant is with Christians: 1 Corinthians 11:25, Hebrews 8:6-10, Ezekiel 34:25

The above 10 proofs totally negate any argument that the true Church and faithful Israel are 2 separate entities. That premise is held and promoted by the pre-trib rapture exponents, who must have 2 groups; one removed to heaven, [themselves] and the Jews, [Israel] who remain on earth to face the Great Tribulation.
The idea of Two peoples, Two Promises, is a lie upon the 'rapture to heaven' lie.

Click to expand...

An example of how truly obsessed you are about the rapture - Nothing - Nothing said here has anything to do with a rapture - to ignorantly apply rapture to every statement you can because of your obsession with it
You being unable to make a post without somehow squeezing rapture into it , shows how little you understand it

seventysevens said:

An example of how truly obsessed you are about the rapture - Nothing - Nothing said here has anything to do with a rapture - to ignorantly apply rapture to every statement you can because of your obsession with it

Click to expand...

The Two Peoples of God doctrine has everything to do with the Pretrib rapture doctrine.
If there is no Two Peoples of God, then there is no Pretrib removal of the Church.

The claim that the "Church Age" comes to an end and then God goes back and deals with modern Israel under the Old Covenant system is destroyed by Hebrews 13:20.
The New Covenant is "everlasting".
Therefore, it cannot come to an end before the Second Coming of Christ.


.

BABerean2 said:

The Two Peoples of God doctrine has everything to do with the Pretrib rapture doctrine.
If there is no Two Peoples of God, then there is no Pretrib removal of the Church.

The claim that the "Church Age" comes to an end and then God goes back and deals with modern Israel under the Old Covenant system is destroyed by Hebrews 13:20.
The New Covenant is "everlasting".
Therefore, it cannot come to an end before the Second Coming of Christ.



.

Click to expand...

Your endless barrage of nonsense , I was not an endorser of dispensations , but since you are wrong so very much of the time , I decided to look at it more closely and have found it is far more accurate than you begin to understand
As far as the rapture - AL people who have accepted Christ as Lord and savior are raptured at the same time , even if they accepted Christ the day before or even the day it happens - just like the thief on the cross was taken to paradise that same day he asked Jesus to remember him
the rapture -the snatching away at a time when no one knows when it will happen is at a different time than when the gathering if those who have been raptured to those who have gone through the first half of the Tribulation testing caused by Jesus , just before the worst of his wrath happens
As so very often you misunderstand scripture as you follow a doctrine of men and not of God

BABerean2 said:

The Two Peoples of God doctrine has everything to do with the Pretrib rapture doctrine.
If there is no Two Peoples of God, then there is no Pretrib removal of the Church.

The claim that the "Church Age" comes to an end and then God goes back and deals with modern Israel under the Old Covenant system is destroyed by Hebrews 13:20.
The New Covenant is "everlasting".
Therefore, it cannot come to an end before the Second Coming of Christ.

Click to expand...

The foundation of the two peoples doctrine is the claim that the two covenants (old and new) run concurrently. 2 Corinthians 3:7 and Hebrews 8:13 (and numerous other verses) make it clear that the new covenant ended the old covenant.

keras said:

The idea of Two peoples, Two Promises, is a lie upon the 'rapture to heaven' lie.

Click to expand...

Misleading, keras, because your statement is implying that others are saying there are two ways to salvation. And they are not. Only one way to be saved and that is by believing upon the Lord Jesus Christ, His death and resurrection.
_______________________________________________________

In Christ, there is neither Jew nor gentile. In Israel, there are Jews.

Salvation is in Christ. Separately, to Israel, God keeps His other promises made exclusively to them - one of which that has been fulfilled, destroys the theology you are promoting that the church is Israel - when in 1948 Israel became a nation again, and them who hold your theology have been in denial of that reality every since.

Why? Because it shows the church is not Israel.

Douggg said:

Salvation is in Christ. Separately, to Israel, God keeps His other promises made exclusively to them - one of which that has been fulfilled, destroys the theology you are promoting that the church is Israel - when in 1948 Israel became a nation again, and them who hold your theology have been in denial of that reality every since.

Why? Because it shows the church is not Israel.

Click to expand...

The statement above is a part of one of the greatest deceptions in the history of the Church.

Who really created the modern State of Israel? See 1 John 2:22-23, and Revelation 3:9.



.

In 1967 the Arab league, led by Egypt, attacked Israel on Yom Kippur, the
Day of Atonement. This is one of Israel's most holy days of the year. It seemed, in the first day or two, that Israel was doomed. However, that war lasted, due to Israel's amazing military prowess, only 6 Days. Millennialists hailed Israel's victory as a positive sign that Jehovah was protecting her, and that, of course, we must be living in the last days! Let's take a closer look.

Instead of being a proof that Israel remains as God's chosen people, the Yom Kippur attack in 1967, and the attack on Passover, on 3/27/02 prove beyond a shadow of a doubt that Israel is not in covenant relationship with Jehovah. We know this from scripture.

Read Exodus 34:23: "Three times in the year all your men shall appear before
the Lord, the Lord God of Israel [passover, pentecost, tabernacles]. For I will cast out the nations before you and enlarge your borders; neither will any man covet your land when you go up to appear before the Lord your God three times in the year." The promise here is simple and profound. As long as Israel was in covenant relationship with Jehovah, their enemies would not attack them during their holy feast days!

For 1500 years there were no attacks against Israel during her feast days [During the Mosaic Age]. However, the siege of Jerusalem in A.D. 70 took place, the city fell, during Pentecost. What are the implications of that attack in light of Exodus 34? The Seven Day War of 1967 took place on Yom Kippur, Israel's most Holy Day. What are the implications in light of Exodus 34? And Also, the attack on Passover on 3-27-02. What are the ramifications of this attack, on Israel's Holy Day?

If Israel is still God's chosen people, that Palestinian bomber should never have been allowed by Jehovah to attack during the Passover. If Israel is still God's chosen people the attack of 1967 should never have happened. Instead of Israel's victory at that time being a sign of her elect status, it was, and is, a sign of the direct opposite. It proved, and proves, beyond a shadow of a doubt that the Covenantal promise of Exodus 34 is no longer applicable! But if the Covenantal promise of Exodus 34 is no longer applicable, then the other promises of that Covenant, i.e., the promises of national restoration (e.g. Deuteronomy 30), are also now invalid, abrogated by Jehovah Himself.

Further, the attacks on Yom Kippur, and now Passover, also prove something else, a direct corollary to everything else. Either the Covenant promise of Exodus 34 is no longer valid, or, the people claiming to be Israel today are not the people of the Covenant of Exodus 34. If the Covenant of Exodus is still valid, but the people in Israel today were attacked in violation of Exodus 34, then what does it say about the identity of the people in Israel today? It says that they cannot be the people of the Covenant of Exodus 34!

Every time, and any time, that the Palestinians attack Israel during any of
her three feast days, Bible students everywhere should be trumpeting the
Biblical fact, that this proves, emphatically, and unequivocally, that Modern Israel is not the chosen people of God.

BABerean2 said:

The statement above is a part of one of the greatest deceptions in the history of the Church.

Who really created the modern State of Israel?
.

Click to expand...

LORD GOD IS in control ! it matters Not who he uses or what He uses to accomplish HIS desired goals ,
God is the One who appoints Kings and Kingdoms !

seventysevens said:

LORD GOD IS in control ! it matters Not who he uses or what He uses to accomplish HIS desired goals ,
God is the One who appoints Kings and Kingdoms !

Click to expand...

Adolf Hitler was not appointed by God to be the ruler of Germany.
He allowed it to happen.
There is a difference.

God did not cause Satan to rebel against Him.
Satan made that choice.

God did not force Adam and Eve to eat of the forbidden fruit.
It was their choice, and they had to live with the consequences.

The same is true today.

.

BABerean2 said:

Adolf Hitler was not appointed by God to be the ruler of Germany.
He allowed it to happen.
There is a difference.

God did not cause Satan to rebel against Him.
Satan made that choice.

God did not force Adam and Eve to eat of the forbidden fruit.
It was their choice, and they had to live with the consequences.

The same is true today.

.

Click to expand...

You may think that but the bible says that God appoints Kings and kingdoms - if you look carefully through history - the type of king that was given was in line with how a nation was living in accordance to what God says - Israel has been punished multiple times for how they were in disobedience to God - and that is what is coming to Israel again in the near future

seventysevens said:

You may think that but the bible says that God appoints Kings and kingdoms - if you look carefully through history - the type of king that was given was in line with how a nation was living in accordance to what God says - Israel has been punished multiple times for how they were in disobedience to God - and that is what is coming to Israel again in the near future

Click to expand...

Wait...what?
Hitler was God's Righteous Instrument that He used to carry out His punishment upon the Jews for their disobedience?

Is that your claim?

BABerean2 said:

God did not cause Satan to rebel against Him.
Satan made that choice.

Click to expand...

I don't think anyone can argue with that, can they?

The Cross did many things but one is this ,Galatians 3:28There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.
Then Peter and Jesus tells us nothing on earth will survive this earth has an expiration date ...

Drought of the Heart said:

Then Peter and Jesus tells us nothing on earth will survive this earth has an expiration date ...

Click to expand...

Rather, Scripture teaches that the earth and material cosmos will exist forever (Ecc 1:4; Ps 78:69; 89:36-37; 104:5; 148:4-6; Eph 3:21) and that human generations are perpetual (Ps 145:13; Dan 4:3,34; Dan 7:14,18,27; Lk 1:33)

Inkfingers said:

Does it mean anything, End Times related, that the modern State of Israel was created by the UN (a global empire resting on many waters/people) through Resolution 181, and that the UN claim ownership of Jerusalem?

Click to expand...

Nope...nada.....zilch.....

National Israel is cursed forever !

Inkfingers said:

Does it mean anything, End Times related, that the modern State of Israel was created by the UN (a global empire resting on many waters/people) through Resolution 181, and that the UN claim ownership of Jerusalem?

Click to expand...

Since 2003 I've been watching a prophecy concerning the US and events in the middle east. Following this prophecy had been quite fulfilling. Ive understood during this time that this administration(Trumps)would cause a military comprised of gentiles to occupy Jerusalem and that Trump would move the embassy to Jerusalem.I did not nor do I know what military it is though if its the US military or the UN peace keeping force.
That latest news concerning Gaza and countries asking the UN for a military presence in east Jerusalem and Gaza to protect Palestinians is interesting and Im,interested to see if these actions will,cause that military Ive read of in scripture to begin is occupation of Jerusalem.
General Assembly adopts text urging greater protection for Palestinians, and deploring Israel’s ‘excessive’ use of force
For some reason I don't feel,it will be the UNpeace keeping force though.This military seems to be pro Israel in scripture.
We will see.

according to Isaiah and Romans 8-10
there has always been a reemnant of believing Jews

even today many Jewish Christians are strong christians.....
and fulfilling prophecy and the word of God