pitabread

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pitabread

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Man, this thread is just off the rails.

So, it is safe to say that creationism does not offer an explicit explanation for specific biological cases. That neither creationism nor ID have any chance whatsoever of supplanting evolutionary theory as the best explanation of biological diversity we have?

Case closed? Anything else relevant to add?

The best creationism apparently has is to explain anatomy with respect to function. Which in the end offers nothing beyond what we already know, and doesn't require invoking a designer whatsoever.
 
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Phred

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Prove it.
In your case there's nothing I can show you that you would accept as proof. You want a dog giving birth to a cat. That simply does not happen. In fact, that would prove the theory of evolution to be false if it happened. So please, don't ask me to prove anything to you. It's not possible.
 
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Phred

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And I should be clear. Science doesn't "prove" anything. We offer evidence for things. We continue to offer evidence for things until there's basically no doubt of those things. But, there's always the chance that something could come along... for example. Gravity is generally accepted to be caused by mass warping spacetime and causing objects to "fall" toward each other. But... there could be invisible beings grabbing every object whenever we let go of them and pulling them down toward the earth. It's not bloody likely but it's not impossible. So... we don't deal in proof. The evidence is what we deal with. When it comes to evolution we have multiple lines of evidence from multiple disciplines that all point to the same conclusion. Life evolves. The Theory of Evolution describes HOW life evolves. I'm not going to be cutting and pasting thousands of pages of information for you here. If you want to learn more it's up to you to visit some places like this: http://www.nas.edu/evolution/
 
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Phred

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I know, and there is a reason for that, you haven't any. And you are correct, "it's not possible".
No... that's not why. I've tried with you before and it's not possible because you're simply intractable. You have your own ideas about what evolution means, what it should be and what you think it is and none of them are remotely correct. You're willfully ignorant in pursuit of your own belief. I'm just not going to let you be flippant and pretend that you're correct. You're not. And I'm not willing to spend time finding and presenting evidence only to have you dismiss it out of hand.
 
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Kenny'sID

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And I should be clear. Science doesn't "prove" anything.

Seems I heard that somewhere before?

We offer evidence for things. We continue to offer evidence for things until there's basically no doubt of those things. But, there's always the chance that something could come along...

They already tried that one on me, its just spin/an excuse because you have no proof. Here's how we handle that...prove it, call it proof, and if something comes along to disprove it in the future, then deal with it, but until then, it's proof.

So simple a scientist can understand it. It's the way it's always been done, and the dictionary agrees.

If you guys spent a fraction of the time trying to prove evolution as you do trying to weasel out of it, you might at least get someone to pay attention to you.
 
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Speedwell

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Wrong post
Yes, that post was my first attempt to straighten you out when you tried to misrepresent what I meant when I said I was not "convinced" of the truth of evolution. And yes, the scare quotes are in the original because no sensible person, no person who knows anything about science, is ever "convinced" that evolution is the "truth." The theory of evolution is not absolute truth; it's a scientific theory, accepted provisionally just like all scientific theories.
 
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Kenny'sID

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No... that's not why. I've tried with you before and it's not possible because you're simply intractable. You have your own ideas about what evolution means, what it should be and what you think it is and none of them are remotely correct. You're willfully ignorant in pursuit of your own belief. I'm just not going to let you be flippant and pretend that you're correct. You're not. And I'm not willing to spend time finding and presenting evidence only to have you dismiss it out of hand.

Specially, what ideas have I about evolution that are "not remotely correct?
 
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Kenny'sID

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Yes, that post was my first attempt to straighten you out when you tried to misrepresent what I meant when I said I was not "convinced" of the truth of evolution. And yes, the scare quotes are in the original because no sensible person, no person who knows anything about science, is ever "convinced" that evolution is the "truth." The theory of evolution is not absolute truth; it's a scientific theory, accepted provisionally just like all scientific theories.

The "not convinced" post is the one I need.
 
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Kenny'sID

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For what? Your attempt to twist what I had to say has failed.

You all are so predictable. Seems to me if it was a problem with me, you'd be happy to post it as proof, but instead you avoid it. Now, of course I have to wonder if it doesn't show something you said to be untruthful.

If I get time, I'll find it myself.
 
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Kenny'sID

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You mean besides calling it a " made up lie"? :p

Yes, since we have already determined you claim it true, but cannot can't prove it, hence my view it's a lie, :p what else, specifically, am I incorrect about when it comes to evolution?
 
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pitabread

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Yes, since we have already determined you claim it true, but cannot can't prove it, hence my view it's a lie, :p what else, specifically, am I incorrect about when it comes to evolution?

To be honest, other than you claiming you think it's a fairy tale or lie or whatever, I don't even know what you think evolution really is. The fact you're starting with that claim doesn't bode well, though...

Tell ya what, how about you describe what you think evolution is, how you think the process of evolution works, what are the major mechanisms, and so on?

Let's find out how much you know.
 
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Speedwell

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You all are so predictable. Seems to me if it was a problem with me, you'd be happy to post it as proof, but instead you avoid it. Now, of course I have to wonder if it doesn't show something you said to be untruthful.

If I get time, I'll find it myself.
Go for it.
 
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Speedwell

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You all are so predictable. Seems to me if it was a problem with me, you'd be happy to post it as proof, but instead you avoid it. Now, of course I have to wonder if it doesn't show something you said to be untruthful.

If I get time, I'll find it myself.
You mean this one?
I'm not "convinced" I take the theory of evolution in the same way as any other scientific theory--as the best scientific explanation of a phenomenon currently available, but provisional, like any other scientific theory. Evolution, as such, is a "fact." There is no doubt that species have changed and diversified over time. They still do. The theory of evolution is an attempt to explain how that happens. Being a scientific theory it is still provisional, but no more satisfactory explanation has yet been advanced.
Your response was,

Thanks for telling me that, I misunderstood, if you are undecided, then you have no solid stance/reason to debate this, the reason I won't reply to your other comments.

Seriously, why debate an issue that you don't even know is an issue or not?
To which I answered,
What makes you think I am "undecided?" I accept the theory of evolution as a plausible and well-evidenced explanation for the diversity of life. I accept it with the provisionality which is built into all scientific theories. I am not "convinced" of its "truth" because in the end it may prove to be wrong, just like any other scientific theory.
So what is it, exactly, that I am supposed to be "undecided" about?
 
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