Whale Fossils Discovered High Up In Andes Mountains

DamianWarS · Jun 2, 2018

The Barbarian said:
Barbarian asks:
The Coconino sandstone is made of great deposits of eroded rock, forming desert dunes, which were subsequently buried and hardened.

How did this get formed in soft sediment by very fast moving water?

The image is to small to tell, but it appears not to have eroded out. Normally, canyons have a stream running through them. Got a higher-res shot?

It appears to be a gully, in soft sediment. It looks a lot like the gullies I saw at Mt. St. Helens from soft volcanic ash; again, it's a bit difficult with such a low-resolution shot,but it appears that the walls of the gully slump if they get more than a few meters high. Do you have a better image?

If you can get some closer, better resolution shots, we can probably figure it out. You do realize that the Earth is constantly reworking the crust and it would be astonishing to find a 4 billion year old canyon on it, do you not?

And could you answer my question?

you need to learn how to use Google's reverse image search. drag and drop them in a google image search and it will give you the high res you want and locations. The first is first is Burlingame Canyon and the second is Mt. St. Helens

Isaiah60 · Jun 2, 2018

Colter said:
The flood is rejected because its obviously illogical. God doesn't regret his previous actions, besides, the world didn't even change.

The uplift happened long after the fossils were incorporated into the layers that were lifted up and in some cases are still rising.

You still do not have a scientific view about how the whales became fossils that will hold water---besides, denying the Flood which would have provided the necessary conditions of fossilization.

All the ancients recorded this Flood. It must have been an historical event worth writing down and passing on to generation after generation. Obviously God wanted that Flood to be remembered.

The Promise of the Lord’s Coming
3 This is now, beloved, the second epistle I am writing to you, in which I am stirring up your sincere minds by way of reminder, 2 that you should remember the words that were spoken previously by the holy prophets and the commandment of our Lord and Savior spoken through us, the apostles.
3 Know this first, that there shall come scoffers in the last days who walk after their own lusts, 4 and say, “Where is the promise of His coming? For since the fathers fell asleep, all things have continued as they were since the beginning of the creation.” 5 For they willingly ignore that, by the word of God the heavens existed long ago, and the earth was formed standing out of the water and in the water, 6 by which the world that then existed was flooded with water and perished. 7 But by the same word, the heavens and the earth that now exist are being reserved for fire, kept for the Day of Judgment and destruction of the ungodly.

As you can see in this passage, these scoffers will deny the Flood just to justify their sins. I want you to ponder on this passage for a bit because when this passage was written the entire world accepted the reality of the Flood. It wasn't until the Darwinian synthesis that this prophecy is much more clearly understood--and, fulfilled. What isn't fulfilled is the Day of Judgment. But all the events leading to it have now become past fulfilled prophecy.

Colter · Jun 2, 2018

Isaiah60 said:
You still do not have a scientific view about how the whales became fossils that will hold water---besides, denying the Flood which would have provided the necessary conditions of fossilization.

All the ancients recorded this Flood. It must have been an historical event worth writing down and passing on to generation after generation. Obviously God wanted that Flood to be remembered.

The Promise of the Lord’s Coming
3 This is now, beloved, the second epistle I am writing to you, in which I am stirring up your sincere minds by way of reminder, 2 that you should remember the words that were spoken previously by the holy prophets and the commandment of our Lord and Savior spoken through us, the apostles.
3 Know this first, that there shall come scoffers in the last days who walk after their own lusts, 4 and say, “Where is the promise of His coming? For since the fathers fell asleep, all things have continued as they were since the beginning of the creation.” 5 For they willingly ignore that, by the word of God the heavens existed long ago, and the earth was formed standing out of the water and in the water, 6 by which the world that then existed was flooded with water and perished. 7 But by the same word, the heavens and the earth that now exist are being reserved for fire, kept for the Day of Judgment and destruction of the ungodly.

As you can see in this passage, these scoffers will deny the Flood just to justify their sins. I want you to ponder on this passage for a bit because when this passage was written the entire world accepted the reality of the Flood. It wasn't until the Darwinian synthesis that this prophecy is much more clearly understood--and, fulfilled. What isn't fulfilled is the Day of Judgment. But all the events leading to it have now become past fulfilled prophecy.

The explanation was given long ago, you are trying to fit old earth reality into young earth Genesis.

Disbelief in Noahs flood has nothing to do with denying sin, that's silly.

Your claim has whales swimming around high up in the Andes, died and became fossils within 12 months???

No other ancient culture remembers great grandad Noah, only the Israelites who invented the story. All cultures have flood stories because they have all survived huge floods.

The Barbarian · Jun 2, 2018

DamianWarS said:
you need to learn how to use Google's reverse image search. drag and drop them in a google image search and it will give you the high res you want and locations. The first is first is Burlingame Canyon and the second is Mt. St. Helens

Technically, a canyon should have a stream through it. But as in Mt. St. Helens, (I got that right, because I've been there, and seen the gullies cut in soft ash) the gully slumps rather quickly. On the other hand, the entrenched meanders I showed you are nearly a kilometer deep. And as you see, entrenched meanders will not form in soft material as the examples you presented show.

The Barbarian · Jun 2, 2018

Isaiah60 said:
Sounds like philosophy to me and impossible to prove

The limestone is filled with oceanic fossils. No way to dodge that. If evidence sounds like "philosophy" to you, we've located the problem.

DamianWarS · Jun 2, 2018

The Barbarian said:
Technically, a canyon should have a stream through it. But as in Mt. St. Helens, (I got that right, because I've been there, and seen the gullies cut in soft ash) the gully slumps rather quickly. On the other hand, the entrenched meanders I showed you are nearly a kilometer deep. And as you see, entrenched meanders will not form in soft material as the examples you presented show.

I'm not part of the sides... I just stepped in to show you how to use google... I think you're comments should be directed to twin.spin

Isaiah60 · Jun 2, 2018

Colter said:
The explanation was given long ago, you are trying to fit old earth reality into young earth Genesis.

Disbelief in Noahs flood has nothing to do with denying sin, that's silly.

Your claim has whales swimming around high up in the Andes, died and became fossils within 12 months???

No other ancient culture remembers great grandad Noah, only the Israelites who invented the story. All cultures have flood stories because they have all survived huge floods.

The conditions of fossilization, again, are rare. It takes a quick and rapid burial process to make it happen. Slow and gradual uplifts don't make fossils and whales dying a natural death don't become fossils. Everyone knows this but many want to deny it. The Flood covered the entire earth. Anything that died during this event was subject to rapid burial. Thus both land and marine creatures both discovered in sedimentary rock where we would expect to find fossils of living things that died in the Flood. Not being a politically driven person, my mind is free to think clearly without having to conform my thoughts to a political view. Therefore to me the Flood explains everything well.

Evolutionists believe life on earth died out when a large asteroid hit the earth. Big problem: the nuclear strength firestorm which circles the earth kills everything. Feathered birds could not have survived this catastrophe. Water would have all been dried up by the immense heat of the firestorm and the burning acid rainfall which came in the form of molted rock which had been flung up into the atmosphere and came back to further devastate the earth. All water on earth is gone. Nothing is left alive. Firestorms do not produce a fossil record in sedimentary rock. You can try to argue that these fossils are from an earlier date than the K-T event but you cannot explain-away why each and every fossil, including fossils from the alleged Cretaceous period, are all found lumped together in sedimentary rock, found in the order of the fastest/smartest moving creatures to the slowest moving creatures. Those creatures smart enough would take the high ground long before the Flood waters reached them. Whales, being very intelligent, would stay close to the surface of the waters to prevent from drowning. So some whales would be caught in the sediments during the Flood and others would be caught in receding waters and beached, per se, on the mountains. The process of rapid erosion would further corrode landmass and dead bodies still being buried in the sediments.
The damage of the Flood is clearly seen in what is now known as the large ocean basins. These were once all landmass before the Flood.

Job 14:18-19 New International Version (1984)
18 “But as a mountain erodes and crumbles
and as a rock is moved from its place,
19 as water wears away stones
and torrents wash away the soil
so you destroy man's hope.

Job witnessed, observed, erosion in his one lifetime and knew it was because of the Flood God sent on earth to destroy man's hope in Godlessness.

Open Heart · Jun 2, 2018

Isaiah60 said:
Nothing about Matt.24 is a parable. It is prophecy. Jesus compared the people of the last days to those of the Flood. Jesus said the Flood was true history as did every other Prophet before Him and after.
It wasn't until the Darwinian synthesis that the Flood was rejected. This was done to do away with historical dating methods of history and to make up a new history of the world which accounted for longer ages as to fit the evolutionary scheme.

It doesn't have to be a parable to be figurative.

I'm curious where you draw the line. I may be able to score a different point here. When Jesus says, "My flesh is real food" and "This is my body" is it literal?

Open Heart · Jun 2, 2018

Isaiah60 said:
Slow and gradual uplifts don't make fossils and whales dying a natural death don't become fossils.

You need to go back and learn about how fossils are formed. You lack basic scientific knowledge about this. What I don't understand is that people are trying to give you the information here in the thread and instead of learning from them, you are treating them disrespectfully.

Thomas Schular · Jun 2, 2018

Isaiah60 said:
The conditions of fossilization, again, are rare. It takes a quick and rapid burial process to make it happen. Slow and gradual uplifts don't make fossils

The uplifts don't make fossils.

and whales dying a natural death don't become fossils.

You clearly are irrational or have not a single clue about fossils. How the animal dies has nothing to do fossilization.

Everyone knows this but many want to deny it. The Flood covered the entire earth. Anything that died during this event was subject to rapid burial. Thus both land and marine creatures both discovered in sedimentary rock where we would expect to find fossils of living things that died in the Flood. Not being a politically driven person, my mind is free to think clearly without having to conform my thoughts to a political view. Therefore to me the Flood explains everything well.

Basic facts about fossilization and geology have nothing to do with politics. You completely make things up, such as whales dying natural deaths don't make fossils... which makes no sense. Then you string these irrational notions into an even more nonsense explanations so irrational I am a little worried about you.

Evolutionists believe life on earth died out when a large asteroid hit the earth.

Do you mean people that do not deny evolution? Do you mean evolutionary scientists?
No one believes that life on earth died out when a large asteroid hit the earth. People do find strong evidence that mass extinction events follow asteroid impacts.

Big problem: the nuclear strength firestorm which circles the earth kills everything. Feathered birds could not have survived this catastrophe. Water would have all been dried up by the immense heat of the firestorm and the burning acid rainfall which came in the form of molted rock which had been flung up into the atmosphere and came back to further devastate the earth. All water on earth is gone. Nothing is left alive. Firestorms do not produce a fossil record in sedimentary rock.

This is another example of what I was writing about above.

Even school children could tell you the problem with what you just wrote. You are saying things so incredibly wrong. The asteroid did not kill everything on earth. Acid rain does not form molted rock.

Marvin Knox · Jun 2, 2018

Colter said:
The people who wrote the Bible had faith, they wrote about the world as they understood it. We now know sooooo much more about the world then they did when they created the creation story.

The Bible is the written Word of God - every jot and every tittle.

Colter said:
No other ancient culture remembers great grandad Noah, only the Israelites who invented the story.

God told us the story and He did not "invent" it. It is the truth.

sfs said:
It's also good for that truth to have some connection to reality.

Jesus, the living Word of God, is the embodiment of all truth. The Bible is the written Word of God and it is God breathed.

They are both reality - if you can receive it.

sfs said:
So Christian scientists, who have the same personal relationship with God and the presence of the same Holy Spirit, but who come to radically different conclusions (based on actually looking at the data, mind you) -- where to they fit into your scheme?

I can't speak for any particular scientist. It is my opinion that many have compromised their faith and taken the easy way out with their peers and the world.

I only know for sure what my relationship is to the Holy Spirit and I am trusting that He is guiding me into truth - because Jesus told me so.

That truth, in this case, is that the creation story is dependable and that evolution is pure nonsense.

Isaiah60 · Jun 2, 2018

Open Heart said:
It doesn't have to be a parable to be figurative.

I'm curious where you draw the line. I may be able to score a different point here. When Jesus says, "My flesh is real food" and "This is my body" is it literal?

No reputable minister or theologian with any sense will say Matt.24 is figurative. Jesus uses the Flood as a comparison as to what will happen to the people of the last days. This is also confirmed in 2Pet.3:1-7. The Flood is not an allegory but an historical reference point. Then there is tradition. You will find know early Christian tradition that denies the Flood. The Flood explains what happened to the world that caused such a mass loss of life. It explains the vast ocean basins and canyons of the world. The Flood is accepted by all ancient antiquity and by scientists whose lineage comes from the founders of modern science. Atheists, who believe in evolution, are the only ones who reject the Flood. If you are not an atheist and don't believe firestorms leave behind a fossil record in sedimentary rock, then you probably should trust Scripture over hollow philosophers.

Open Heart · Jun 2, 2018

Thomas Schular said:
You clearly are irrational or have not a single clue about fossils. How the animal dies has nothing to do fossilization.

Thank you for dealing with him so patiently. I really wouldn't know where to begin with him. I don't know if he simply was never correctly taught, was taught but never learned, or learned it but rejected it because it threatened his extremely literalist fundamentalism. But I think it's a bit of all three, which makes it really, really tough.

Open Heart · Jun 2, 2018

Isaiah60 said:
No reputable minister or theologian with any sense will say Matt.24 is figurative. Jesus uses the Flood as a comparison as to what will happen to the people of the last days. This is also confirmed in 2Pet.3:1-7. The Flood is not an allegory but an historical reference point. Then there is tradition. You will find know early Christian tradition that denies the Flood. The Flood explains what happened to the world that caused such a mass loss of life. It explains the vast ocean basins and canyons of the world. The Flood is accepted by all ancient antiquity and by scientists whose lineage comes from the founders of modern science. Atheists, who believe in evolution, are the only ones who reject the Flood. If you are not an atheist and don't believe firestorms leave behind a fossil record in sedimentary rock, then you probably should trust Scripture over hollow philosophers.

You left my question completely unanswered. I guess you knew you would have to concede that there were times outside of parables where figurative speech was used. Thank you. That's all I needed.

BTW, allegory is the wrong word. completely wrong.

Isaiah60 · Jun 2, 2018

Marvin Knox. That was a perfect stance you held here. The doubters expect you to apologize for your faith but no such apology came from your lips. I like that. :amen:

Christians who doubt the Flood boggle me. I'll place my fear in the Lord my God. I do not fear evolution theory or the sinful men who made up the theory.

Isaiah60 · Jun 2, 2018

Open Heart said:
You left my question completely unanswered. I guess you knew you would have to concede that there were times outside of parables where figurative speech was used. Thank you. That's all I needed.

BTW, allegory is the wrong word. completely wrong.

I do not understand your spirit of speech here. This is just strange fire to me. Here is the entire chapter of Matt.24. It is not a parable...its end time prophecy! And even if it was a parable (which it is not) it does not detract from the historical significance of the Flood. Nobody rejected the Flood until the Darwinian synthesis. Even pagans knew the Flood happened. But since Darwin led an antichrist endeavor, pagans jumped on board with it. But the Flood was accepted by all before Darwin.

Bible Gateway passage: Matthew 24 - Modern English Version

And also read this passage,

Bible Gateway passage: 2 Peter 3:1-7 - Modern English Version

Open Heart · Jun 2, 2018

Isaiah60 said:
Marvin Knox. That was a perfect stance you held here. The doubters expect you to apologize for your faith but no such apology came from your lips. I like that.

Christians who doubt the Flood boggle me. I'll place my fear in the Lord my God. I do not fear evolution theory or the sinful men who made up the theory.

All men are sinful, even men who believe in a global flood and distort scientific teaching in order to advance fundamentalism.

There is no need to apologize for truth. All truth belongs to God, ultimately, including scientific truth. It is He who made the natural world.

Open Heart · Jun 2, 2018

Isaiah60 said:
I do not understand your spirit of speech here. This is just strange fire to me. Here is the entire chapter of Matt.24. It is not a parable...its end time prophecy! And even if it was a parable (which it is not) it does not detract from the historical significance of the Flood. Nobody rejected the Flood until the Darwinian synthesis. Even pagans knew the Flood happened. But since Darwin led an antichrist endeavor, pagans jumped on board with it. But the Flood was accepted by all before Darwin.

Bible Gateway passage: Matthew 24 - Modern English Version

And also read this passage,

Bible Gateway passage: 2 Peter 3:1-7 - Modern English Version

You are throwing irrelevancies at me. It's as if you think if you add enough water to the arsenic it won't be poison. You are teaching a rotton doctrine, that a legend, which is in the Bible as a teaching story, and which Christ uses as a literary device, should be taken literally, understood as history, as science. That's rot. Poison.

Open Heart · Jun 2, 2018

Colter said:
No other ancient culture remembers great grandad Noah, only the Israelites who invented the story. All cultures have flood stories because they have all survived huge floods.

We believe the Sumerian Flood story refers to the same local event. One guy thinks that maybe the temple at Göbekli Tepe had something to do with a post-flood memorial, as it has reliefs of many animals not indigenous to the area. That site is about 11,000 years old.

Isaiah60 · Jun 3, 2018

Open Heart said:
We believe the Sumerian Flood story refers to the same local event. One guy thinks that maybe the temple at Göbekli Tepe had something to do with a post-flood memorial, as it has reliefs of many animals not indigenous to the area. That site is about 11,000 years old.

I have all Sumerian accounts of the Flood and different translations of each account. One translation is short and broken and doesn't contain enough information to know much of the details. The epic of Atrahasis and Gilgamesh are both global Floods. Evolutionists only get away with saying these accounts are not global because they don't expect people to actually go out and get these documents. But I've collected ancient antiquity for years and my library now has reached museum status. I have read these account through to the end and they are global floods.
Atheists like to argue in the hopes to put off repentance that the Biblical account is not the true account. But after reading all these accounts attentively through, all of them bear marks of authenticity in the main framework of the story. Though the embellishments of the Babylonian accounts are seen in their lack of knowledge in ship building which mankind had not perfected that far back. However, God knows how to build ships very well and He told Noah how to build an ark that would do the job it was meant to do. The Biblical ark floats and can handle harsh waves. The dimensions, as proven many times through scientific experiments done with smaller models, were perfect for doing what it set out to do. The Babylonian ark, being 120x120x120 cubits was like a big cube and it would naturally become roughly half emerged with water which means roughly 60 cubits would be under water. This is a problem because due to the lack of ship building skills of the time, water pressure would rip open the seams and the large cube would sink. Also, the Biblical ark was designed to better circular air throughout the ark. The Babylonian ark had poor circulation for lower decks, being 9 total decks just off of memory here. So when we apply science to the construction and duration of the ark we come up with an ark that survives the Flood which is the Biblical ark.

Whale Fossils Discovered High Up In Andes Mountains

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