[Orthodox] Resurrection of the body - are nonbelievers glorified?

AMM

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The title pretty much says it all. When believers are raised, they receive a glorified body (as taught by Saint Paul in 1 Cor 15). What about unbelievers?

(Additionally, how does this relate to different views of heaven and hell? I.e. in the view where heaven and hell are the same place, but people perceive God's love differently (a burning fire or a warming flame), is God's love felt through the glorified body? Do non-believers receive a glorified body and this is hell for them?)

I hadn't ever thought about this, but my girlfriend was asking me questions about the resurrection (pray for her, she's an inquirer) and asked me this.
 
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AMM

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More resurrection-world questions and how I answered them. Is this correct?

Is there any disagreement? (No, because everyone is in one accord with each other and with the person of Truth)
Aren't a lot of jobs lost? (yeah but there's no need for an economy anymore)
Is hunting a sport/would there be guns? (I don't know, I don't know, but people wouldn't die)
Is the population stagnant, or could it increase? (I don't know. I thought of Mt 22:30 but there's disagreement it seems amongst biblical scholars about whether or not that means people can still have kids in the resurrection)
Why are we judged?
What happens to the people who aren't saved?
Why are we saved/what are we saved for?
Are we glorified before or after we are judged?


Thanks. Prayers would be really appreciated, as stated above.May I be granted to speak the Truth in humility, patience, and love, and may my sins and errors in teaching, though innumerable and great, never lead any astray or into sin! Lord be merciful to me, the chief of sinners.
 
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AMM

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yes, everyone gets a glorified body. for the sinner, that act of love is experienced as condemnation and judgment.
Why? This is because they don't want to be partakers of the divine nature, but they become such anyway?
 
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ArmyMatt

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Why? This is because they don't want to be partakers of the divine nature, but they become such anyway?

in a way. God doesn't force that on them, but they will be confronted by it, and there will be nowhere to turn to escape it. when someone loves you, and you don't live them, that love can be utter torment.
 
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Isnt there a fear of over population if everybody is restored?
I don't think we need to worry about it. God created the world, the cosmos, the bio system to function perfectly. I'm sure He will manage to do it again when everything is restored.

IF (for example) the whole world is temperate and there are no large oceans, we would have what - about 10x our available land? Or maybe it's larger. Or the dimensions given go up as well, don't they? Or ... Anyway. God will sort it out. :)
 
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ArmyMatt

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Isnt there a fear of over population if everybody is restored?

no, because all of the cosmos is fallen, to include our understanding and experience of
three dimensional space
 
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The7thColporteur

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The title pretty much says it all. When believers are raised, they receive a glorified body (as taught by Saint Paul in 1 Cor 15). What about unbelievers?

(Additionally, how does this relate to different views of heaven and hell? I.e. in the view where heaven and hell are the same place, but people perceive God's love differently (a burning fire or a warming flame), is God's love felt through the glorified body? Do non-believers receive a glorified body and this is hell for them?)

I hadn't ever thought about this, but my girlfriend was asking me questions about the resurrection (pray for her, she's an inquirer) and asked me this.
There are many scriptures [KJB] to give, but, can I give you a shortcut? See Revelation 20, combined with Isaiah 24.

The answer is that the wicked in their resurrection do not receive a glorified body, but are raised in that decaying/dying body which they generally had just before they died.

"... At the close of the thousand years, Christ again returns to the earth. He is accompanied by the host of the redeemed and attended by a retinue of angels. As He descends in terrific majesty He bids the wicked dead arise to receive their doom. They come forth, a mighty host, numberless as the sands of the sea. What a contrast to those who were raised at the first resurrection! The righteous were clothed with immortal youth and beauty. The wicked bear the traces of disease and death. {GC 662.1} ..." - The Great Controversy 1911, page 662.1

Check out the best book on the life of Christ, which also covers a few things on resurrecton; The Desire of Ages - Myers Media

Check out the best book on the controversy between Christ and satan, also deals with the final scenes and resurrections, The Great Controversy -

FREE GC Audio Book

Would be interested in what you think of the audio materials.

If you would like more scriptural [KJB] information, I would be glad, and you can even PM me if needful.
 
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ArmyMatt

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There are many scriptures [KJB] to give, but, can I give you a shortcut? See Revelation 20, combined with Isaiah 24.

The answer is that the wicked in their resurrection do not receive a glorified body, but are raised in that decaying/dying body which they generally had just before they died.

"... At the close of the thousand years, Christ again returns to the earth. He is accompanied by the host of the redeemed and attended by a retinue of angels. As He descends in terrific majesty He bids the wicked dead arise to receive their doom. They come forth, a mighty host, numberless as the sands of the sea. What a contrast to those who were raised at the first resurrection! The righteous were clothed with immortal youth and beauty. The wicked bear the traces of disease and death. {GC 662.1} ..." - The Great Controversy 1911, page 662.1

Check out the best book on the life of Christ, which also covers a few things on resurrecton; The Desire of Ages - Myers Media

Check out the best book on the controversy between Christ and satan, also deals with the final scenes and resurrections, The Great Controversy -

FREE GC Audio Book

Would be interested in what you think of the audio materials.

If you would like more scriptural [KJB] information, I would be glad, and you can even PM me if needful.

this is not what we teach. nowhere does Scripture say the body of the unrighteous will be decaying.
 
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The7thColporteur

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... IF (for example) the whole world is temperate and there are no large oceans, we would have what - about 10x our available land?...
Interesting that you mentioned that, since that is exactly what is going to happen in the New Heaven and New Earth:

Please read these texts together, what do you see [ignore for a moment the chapter division]?

Revelation 20:14 KJB - And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.

Revelation 20:15 KJB - And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

Revelation 21:1 KJB - And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.

Revelation 21:2 KJB - And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.

Revelation 21:3 KJB - And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God.

Revelation 21:4 KJB - And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.

Revelation 21:5 KJB - And he that sat upon the throne said, Behold, I make all things new. And he said unto me, Write: for these words are true and faithful.​

While Revelation 21:1 KJB states that in the New Heaven and New Earth there will be no more "sea" [water, the vast chasm of] as such we have now [due to the flood of Noah], with restless waves, separating friends and loved ones, but instead broad rivers, etc, as per:

Isaiah 33:14 KJB - The sinners in Zion are afraid; fearfulness hath surprised the hypocrites. Who among us shall dwell with the devouring fire? who among us shall dwell with everlasting burnings?

Isaiah 33:15 KJB - He that walketh righteously, and speaketh uprightly; he that despiseth the gain of oppressions, that shaketh his hands from holding of bribes, that stoppeth his ears from hearing of blood, and shutteth his eyes from seeing evil;

Isaiah 33:16 KJB - He shall dwell on high: his place of defence shall be the munitions of rocks: bread shall be given him; his waters shall be sure.

Isaiah 33:17 KJB - Thine eyes shall see the king in his beauty: they shall behold the land that is very far off.

Isaiah 33:18 KJB - Thine heart shall meditate terror. Where is the scribe? where is the receiver? where is he that counted the towers?

Isaiah 33:19 KJB - Thou shalt not see a fierce people, a people of a deeper speech than thou canst perceive; of a stammering tongue, that thou canst not understand.

Isaiah 33:20 KJB - Look upon Zion, the city of our solemnities: thine eyes shall see Jerusalem a quiet habitation, a tabernacle that shall not be taken down; not one of the stakes thereof shall ever be removed, neither shall any of the cords thereof be broken.

Isaiah 33:21 KJB - But there the glorious LORD will be unto us a place of broad rivers and streams; wherein shall go no galley with oars, neither shall gallant ship pass thereby.

[see also Ezekiel 47:1-6 KJB]
Isaiah 33:22 KJB - For the LORD is our judge, the LORD is our lawgiver, the LORD is our king; he will save us.

Isaiah 33:23 KJB - Thy tacklings are loosed; they could not well strengthen their mast, they could not spread the sail: then is the prey of a great spoil divided; the lame take the prey.

Isaiah 33:24 KJB - And the inhabitant shall not say, I am sick: the people that dwell therein shall be forgiven their iniquity.
The text also reveals that the "lake of fire", even the fiery "sea" will have passed away also [for to "pass away", is to "die"], for it was upon this old earth, look again [ignore the chapter break for a moment, just read it straight through]:

Revelation 20:14 KJB - And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.

Revelation 20:15 KJB - And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

Revelation 21:1 KJB - And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.​

In scripture, a "Sea" = "Lake" [whether of water, fire, etc]:

Luke 5:1 - "the lake of Gennesaret" [see "sea of Chinnereth" [Numbers 34:11 KJB], [see also "Chinnereth" [Deuteronomy 3:17; Joshua 19:35 KJB]] or "sea of Chinneroth" [Joshua 12:3 KJB], or "of Gennesaret" [Matthew 14:34; Mark 6:53 KJB]; Matthew 8:27; Mark 4:39,41 KJB uses the word "sea" and John 6:1 says, "sea of Galilee, which is the sea of Tiberias".

The very word "lake" in the Koine Greek in Revelation 20:14,15 is λιμνην [limnen].

G3041 [only used in the Koine Greek of the NT, I didn't find it in the (so-called) LXX either]

λίμνη limnē

Total KJB Occurrences: 10

lake, 10

Luke 5:1-2 (2), 8:22-23 (2),33;

Revelation 19:20, 20:10,14-15 (2), 21:8​

See also the alternate word for "sea":

G2281 [its also in the (so-called) LXX, in the very places of the "sea of Chinnereth" [Numbers 34:11,12 (so-called) [LXX], etc]

θάλασσα thalassa

Total KJB Occurrences: 95

sea, 93

Mat_4:15, Mat_4:18 (2), Mat_8:24, Mat_8:26-27 (2), Mat_8:32, Mat_13:1, Mat_13:47, Mat_14:24-26 (3), Mat_15:29, Mat_17:27, Mat_18:6, Mat_21:21, Mar_1:15-16 (3), Mar_2:13, Mar_3:7, Mar_4:1 (3), Mar_4:39, Mar_4:41, Mar_5:1, Mar_5:13 (2), Mar_5:21, Mar_6:47-49 (3), Mar_7:31, Mar_9:42, Mar_11:23, Luk_17:2, Luk_17:6, Luk_21:25, Joh_6:1 (2), Joh_6:16-19 (4), Joh_6:22, Joh_6:25, Joh_21:1, Joh_21:7, Act_4:24, Act_7:36, Act_10:6, Act_10:32, Act_14:15, Act_17:14, Act_27:30, Act_27:38, Act_27:40, Act_28:4, Rom_9:27, 1Co_10:1-2 (2), 2Co_11:26, Heb_11:12, Heb_11:29, Jas_1:6, Jud_1:13, Rev_4:6, Rev_5:13, Rev_7:1-3 (3), Rev_8:8-9 (3), Rev_10:2, Rev_10:5-6 (2), Rev_10:8, Rev_12:12, Rev_13:1 (2), Rev_14:7, Rev_16:2-3 (4), Rev_18:17, Rev_18:19, Rev_18:21, Rev_20:8, Rev_20:13, Rev_21:1
red [sea], 2

Act_7:36, Heb_11:29
"... The government of the kingdom of Christ is like no earthly government. It is a representation of the characters of those who compose the kingdom. "Whereunto shall we liken the kingdom of God?" Christ asked, "or with what comparison shall we liken it?" He could find nothing on earth that would serve as a perfect comparison. His court is one where holy love presides, and whose offices and appointments are graced by the exercise of charity. He charges his servants to bring pity and loving-kindness, his own attributes, into all their office work, and to find their happiness and satisfaction in reflecting the love and tender compassion of the divine nature on all with whom they associate. {RH, March 19, 1908 par. 5}

"Look unto Zion, the city of our solemnities," the prophet continues; "thine eyes shall see Jerusalem a quiet habitation, a tabernacle that shall not be taken down; not one of the stakes thereof shall ever be removed, neither shall any of the cords thereof be broken. But there the glorious Lord will be unto us a place of broad rivers and streams; wherein shall go no galley with oars, neither shall gallant ship pass thereby. For the Lord is our judge, the Lord is our lawgiver, the Lord is our king; he will save us. . . . The inhabitants shall not say, I am sick: the people that dwell therein shall be forgiven their iniquity." {RH, March 19, 1908 par. 6} ..." - Review and Herald, March 19, 1908, par. 5-6
 
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ArmyMatt

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Please explain then, what you do believe.

the body will be glorified as the righteous. however, the sinner has set his heart against Christ, so the very blessing Christ gives, he experiences as torment. Christ's love, just being love, naturally exposes and condemns sin.
 
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The7thColporteur

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the body will be glorified as the righteous. however, the sinner has set his heart against Christ, so the very blessing Christ gives, he experiences as torment. Christ's love, just being love, naturally exposes and condemns sin.
Your doctrine/belief immortalizes sin and sinners, being sustained by God by a constant miracle through eternity?
 
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ArmyMatt

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Your doctrine/belief immortalizes sin and sinners, being sustained by God by a constant miracle through eternity?

nope, sin is not a thing in itself. it is merely a corruption of what is good. the sinner desires sin but cannot have it anymore, and the only thing he gets is the love of Christ, which he does not want and can never escape from.
 
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The7thColporteur

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nope, sin is not a thing in itself. it is merely a corruption of what is good. the sinner desires sin but cannot have it anymore, and the only thing he gets is the love of Christ, which he does not want and can never escape from.
You're telling me that the immortalized wicked cannot think wickedly?
 
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