Jewish naming of YHWH

Anguspure

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And yet, the very title Creator denotes a complexity.

Then again, perhaps that is the point. God makes God’s self known, but by name, deeds and all the like, it will take eternity to begin to fully understand our King.

This reminds me of these verses:

John 21:24 This is the disciple who is bearing witness about these things, and who has written these things, and we know that his testimony is true.

25 Now there are also many other things that Jesus did. Were every one of them to be written, I suppose that the world itself could not contain the books that would be written.
Yes.
So before He is Creator, He simply "IS". The philosopher says "I think therefore I am", to which God replies, even more fundamentally: "I AM".

Basically the name the God of Abraham and Moses gives Himself denotes His status not only as the uncaused cause but as the fundamental consciouness of the cosmos, more fundamental than any other god or force identified by mankind throughout history.

With this identifier in place there is no room for debate as to which god of which religion is the God of all that is, when clearly "I AM" trumps all comers.
 
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DamianWarS

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Curious...

Can you show me a passage in the NT that was authored by a witness of Jesus ministry quoting him talking about the "New Covenant"?

It would have to come from one of these testimonies.

Matthew, John, James, Peter, Jude.

I was contextualizing. Jesus is the new covenant and Jesus is quoted saying " Before Abraham was I am". Pretty sure that fits in your narrow scope canon
 
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LittleLambofJesus

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And yet, the very title Creator denotes a complexity.
Then again, perhaps that is the point. God makes God’s self known, but by name, deeds and all the like, it will take eternity to begin to fully understand our King.
This reminds me of these verses:

John 21:24 This is the disciple who is bearing witness about these things, and who has written these things, and we know that his testimony is true.
25 Now there are also many other things that Jesus did. Were every one of them to be written, I suppose that the world itself could not contain the books that would be written.
Yeah, that is true . Shock and Awe........The great I AM.....

Revelation Chapter 1 Verses
Revelation 1:8

Col 1:16
For by Him all things were created that are in heaven and that are on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or principalities or powers.
All things were created through Him and for Him
.

Reve 1:17
And when I saw him, I did fall at his feet as dead, and he placed his right hand upon me, saying to me, 'Be not afraid; I/egw<1473> AM/eimi<1510> the First and the Last

Reve 4:11
Thou art worthy, O Lord, to receive glory and honour and power:
for Thou hast created all things, and for Thy pleasure they are and were created.

I+Am+2.gif
 
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Shek

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Grip Docility

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Yeah, that is true . Shock and Awe........The great I AM.....

Revelation Chapter 1 Verses
Revelation 1:8

Col 1:16
For by Him all things were created that are in heaven and that are on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or principalities or powers.
All things were created through Him and for Him
.

Reve 1:17
And when I saw him, I did fall at his feet as dead, and he placed his right hand upon me, saying to me, 'Be not afraid; I/egw<1473> AM/eimi<1510> the First and the Last

Reve 4:11
Thou art worthy, O Lord, to receive glory and honour and power:
for Thou hast created all things, and for Thy pleasure they are and were created.

I+Am+2.gif

Amen!!!!

 
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Grip Docility

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I think that you missed the point of this passage, which has nothing to do with a new covenant and he's not declaring himself to be God.

Patriarch

John 8:58

Edit:

So, let’s recap. Jeremiah is about a new “Ark of the Covenant”, according to you.

Also, The Pharisees about to Stone Jesus in response to Him saying “I AM” after (Before Abraham), and then the Pharisees specifying He made Himself equal to God with those words, has nothing to do with “I AM that I AM”, according to you.

Am I understanding you correctly?
 
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Shek

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Daniel9v9

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Why is it that the Jews do not use YHWH?

They claim it is too sacred.

But they are told to "proclaim his name" in Isaiah 12:4 and to call upon it in Psalms 105:1, so who came up with the idea of not saying Yahweh's name? It cannot have come from YHWH himself, as He told them to proclaim his name and I am unaware of any point in the Bible where the Jews are told (by Yahweh) to refer to Yahweh as "Adonai".

So what is going on here, and more importantly WHO thought they could countermand Yahweh himself?

Apologies if someone already explained this, but the reason they stopped using YHWH is simply as a means of not breaking the Law: "You shall not take the name of the Lord your God in vain"
This practice developed during the intertestamental period along with many other strange practices (as found in the NT), but perhaps common from about 200 AD.

The problem with this idea, as you already pointed out, is that it breaks God's first commandment: “You shall have no other gods before me" which positively does mean that we should fear, love, and trust in God above all things, and call upon Him in every trouble, pray, praise, and give thanks.

In short, YHWH is used throughout all Scripture by all sorts of people and this serves as a model for us.
As it's written: "Let us then with confidence draw near to the throne of grace, that we may receive mercy and find grace to help in time of need."
 
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Inkfingers

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I wish more Bible versions would use the Hebrew transliteration in all the forms of "God and Lord".

Both are "transliterations" of the Hebrew words #3068 and #430.

Strong's Concordance with Hebrew and Greek Lexicon

Strong's Number H3068 matches the Hebrew יְהֹוָה (Yĕhovah),

Strong's Number H430 matches the Hebrew אֱלֹהִים ('elohiym)

Gene 2:4 [Revelation 15:]
These are the generations of the heavens and of the land when they were created,
in the day that Yahweh/Yĕhovah<3068>יְהֹוָה > 'Elohiym/אֱלֹהִים ('elohiym),>430> to make the earth and the heavens,


Exodus 15
1 Then Moseh san and the sons of Yisra'el this song unto YHWH, and they spake saying,--"I will sing to YHWH for He is exalted exalted,--The horse and his rider hath He cast into the Sea.
2 My might and melody is Yah, and He became mine salvation/y@shuw'ah.--
This is my 'El and I will glorify Him, '
Elohiym of my father and I will set Him on high". '
4 YHWH man of war; YHWH
is His name.

It is also repeated in Reve 15 [coincidentally, the same chapt number]

Revelation 15:3
and They are singing the Song of-Mosheh, the bond-servant of the God, and the song of the Lamb, saying,
`Great and marvelous the works of Thee, Lord!,the God, the Almighty, just and true the ways of Thee, the king of the [*Ages/Saints] Nations

,

Yes, YHWH and Elohim are far better words to use.
 
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Inkfingers

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Yes.
So before He is Creator, He simply "IS". The philosopher says "I think therefore I am", to which God replies, even more fundamentally: "I AM".

Basically the name the God of Abraham and Moses gives Himself denotes His status not only as the uncaused cause but as the fundamental consciouness of the cosmos, more fundamental than any other god or force identified by mankind throughout history.

With this identifier in place there is no room for debate as to which god of which religion is the God of all that is, when clearly "I AM" trumps all comers.

Exactly.

Realising what YHWH, the I AM, means, is the fundamental principle to understand.
 
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DamianWarS

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I think that you missed the point of this passage, which has nothing to do with a new covenant and he's not declaring himself to be God.

Patriarch

John 8:58

Not capitalized
Careful, this is the General Theology section we don't like rejecting verses that Jesus is calling himself God. Perhaps you should state your complaint/agenda more clear or get out whatever you want to say, you seem to picking at semantics and I really don't care to engage that discussion.
 
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Shek

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Careful, this is the General Theology section we don't like rejecting verses that Jesus is calling himself God.

You're not reading the context of the surrounding passages, he's not calling himself God otherwise he'd have been charged and convicted of heresy right there in the temple.

This passage that you used in response to the new covenant doesn't even apply and has absolutely nothing to do with it.
 
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Inkfingers

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You're not reading the context of the surrounding passages, he's not calling himself God otherwise he'd have been charged and convicted of heresy right there in the temple.

This passage that you used in response to the new covenant doesn't even apply and has absolutely nothing to do with it.
This is a fair point to make about this specific occurrence of this statement.

The specific "before Abraham was, I am" statement occurs in John 8. If it truly were a heretical claim being made, Jesus would be openly arrested long before John 18 (when he is arrested). The Pharisees would not have bothered investigating the healing in John 9:13-34 but could have easily and openly convicted Jesus of Heresy on the statement in John 8 alone.

But such is not what this thread is about so could we not take that line any further please.
 
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Radagast

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I think you had better read John, for it is used seven times in Greek :)

False. The name YHWH is never used in the Greek. I know; I read the New Testament in Greek. Even in Old Testament quotes where the Hebrew uses YHWH, the New Testament uses Kurios = Lord.

I assume that you are a Jehovah's Witness. The Jehovah's Witness "bible" changes the New Testament so that some uses of the word Kurios (the ones not referring to Jesus) are changed to "Jehovah."
 
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