The Sabbath-day Law Can Be Violated

1stcenturylady

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There is a difference between early [Pentecost] and latter rains [our days, soon to come]. Please notice that Peter spoke in future tense [shall come] after Pentecost was already going on, and the "may be", just before Jesus' second advent.

I agree there is a latter rain and we are in it. But Acts 3 is still the beginning of the early rain and is about accepting Christ.

Isaiah 28:12 To whom He said, “This is the rest with which You may cause the weary to rest,” And, “This is the refreshing”;

Matthew 11:28 " 28 Come to Me, all you who labor and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest. 29 Take My yoke upon you and learn from Me, for I am gentle and lowly in heart, and you will find rest for your souls.
 
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The7thColporteur

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... Dwell on righteousness.
Righteousness:

Psalms 119:172 KJB - My tongue shall speak of thy word: for all thy commandments are righteousness.

Psalms 19:7 KJB - The law of the LORD is perfect, converting the soul: the testimony of the LORD is sure, making wise the simple.

Psalms 119:146 KJB - I cried unto thee; save me, and I shall keep thy testimonies.

Hebrews 1:9 KJB - Thou hast loved righteousness, and hated iniquity; therefore God, even thy God, hath anointed thee with the oil of gladness above thy fellows.​

Contrasting:

Psalms 119:150 They draw nigh that follow after mischief: they are far from thy law.​
 
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1stcenturylady

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Righteousness:

Psalms 119:172 KJB - My tongue shall speak of thy word: for all thy commandments are righteousness.

Psalms 19:7 KJB - The law of the LORD is perfect, converting the soul: the testimony of the LORD is sure, making wise the simple.

Psalms 119:146 KJB - I cried unto thee; save me, and I shall keep thy testimonies.

Hebrews 1:9 KJB - Thou hast loved righteousness, and hated iniquity; therefore God, even thy God, hath anointed thee with the oil of gladness above thy fellows.​

Contrasting:

Psalms 119:150 They draw nigh that follow after mischief: they are far from thy law.​

So what is edifying to me about Psalms 119:150? I love righteousness.
 
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1stcenturylady

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We are not in the latter rain, we are in the time of its counterfeit.

The Antichrist wants us to worship him, not Christ. You are missing a great blessing by telling yourself lies.
 
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The7thColporteur

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So what is edifying to me about Psalms 119:150? I love righteousness.
Speech. Where is the doing? Exodus 20:8-11 KJB.

James 2:18 KJB - Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works.
 
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The7thColporteur

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The Antichrist wants us to worship him, not Christ. You are missing a great blessing by telling yourself lies.
Christ Jesus is Lord of the Sabbath, the 7th Day. AntiChrist is the Baal [lord] of the Sunday.

Ezekiel 8:16 KJB - And he brought me into the inner court of the LORD'S house, and, behold, at the door of the temple of the LORD, between the porch and the altar, were about five and twenty men, with their backs toward the temple of the LORD, and their faces toward the east; and they worshipped the sun toward the east.
 
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1stcenturylady

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Christ Jesus is Lord of the Sabbath, the 7th Day. AntiChrist is the Baal [lord] of the Sunday.

Ezekiel 8:16 KJB - And he brought me into the inner court of the LORD'S house, and, behold, at the door of the temple of the LORD, between the porch and the altar, were about five and twenty men, with their backs toward the temple of the LORD, and their faces toward the east; and they worshipped the sun toward the east.

Sunday is not a commandment. Jesus is.
 
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1stcenturylady

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Jesus is the living embodiment of the Ten Commandments.

Sunday will be a 'commandment' soon enough, as foretold in scripture [KJB] - Sunday Law News - Mark of the Beast Update for 2017 - 2018

It comes in two stages, as per Daniel 3 & 6 KJB.

I have faithfully warned you.

I am dead to sin. I don't keep a day of the week as those who want to be justified by their own works. I concentrate on loving Jesus and loving others.

But I see where your mind is. :sigh:
 
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Bob S

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Why would Paul have written Gal 3:19, 25, 2Cor 3:7-11, Eph 2:14-15 if as some are teaching on the forum we are still under the Law?
Gal 3:19 Then why do we have the Law? It was given because of sin. It was to be used until Christ came.

Gal3:25 Now that our faith is in Christ, we do not need the Law to lead us.

2Cor 3:7 The Law of Moses was written on stone and it brought death. But God’s shining-greatness was seen when it was given. When Moses took it to the Jews, they could not look at his face because of the bright light. But that bright light in his face began to pass away. 8 The new way of life through the Holy Spirit comes with much more shining-greatness. 9 If the Law of Moses, that leads to death, came in shining-greatness, how much greater and brighter is the light that makes us right with God? 10 The Law of Moses came with shining-greatness long ago. But that light is no longer bright. The shining-greatness of the New Way of Worship that brings us life is so much brighter. 11 The shining light that came with the Law of Moses soon passed away. But the new way of life is much brighter. It will never pass away.


Eph 2:14 We have peace because of Christ. He has made the Jews and those who are not Jews one people. He broke down the wall that divided them. 15 He stopped the fighting between them by His death on the cross. He put an end to the Law.

Some argue that Jesus in Matt 5:17-18 didn't fulfill the Law putting an end to it. As you can plainly see in Eph 2:15 Paul writes that indeed Jesus did put an end to the Law.

17 “Do not think that I have come to do away with the Law of Moses or the writings of the early preachers. I have not come to do away with them but to complete them. 18 I tell you, as long as heaven and earth last, not one small mark or part of a word will pass away of the Law of Moses until it has all been done. 19 Anyone who breaks even the least of the Law of Moses and teaches people not to do what it says, will be called the least in the holy nation of heaven.

Jesus was speaking to those under the Law. The Law would not end until Jesus was crucified. With His own Blood He ratified the new covenant. A better covenant with better promises and not like the old one. Praise God from whom all blessing flow.

Oh you foolish Galatians.............Reminds me of those who are trying to make us believe we have to go back to the law of sin and death. Your teachings may work in third World countries where little is known about real Christianity. How is it working here where we do have access to the real truth?
 
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The7thColporteur

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Why would Paul have written Gal 3:19, 25, 2Cor 3:7-11, Eph 2:14-15 if as some are teaching on the forum we are still under the Law?...
"Under the law" [Romans 6:14 KJB] means to be under condemnation, "guilty before God" [Romans 3:19 KJB]. No one here is teaching that anyone in Christ Jesus is "guilty before God".

The issue isn't "under the law".

... Some argue that Jesus in Matt 5:17-18 didn't fulfill the Law ...
The issue isn't Jesus fulfilling the law.

It's when things like the following are said:

... putting an end to it. ... The Law would not end until Jesus was crucified. ...
If you mean the Ten Commadments not so, because one would sooner have to destroy God Himself, than to 'put an end' to His own written transcript of His character.

To fulfil, is to fill up to the fullest:

Matthew 3:15 KJB - And Jesus answering said unto him, Suffer it to be so now: for thus it becometh us to fulfil all righteousness. Then he suffered him.​

It is to be the same in us, as the Head, so too the Body:

Romans 8:4 KJB - That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

Romans 2:27 KJB - And shall not uncircumcision which is by nature, if it fulfil the law, judge thee, who by the letter and circumcision dost transgress the law?

Romans 13:8 KJB - Owe no man any thing, but to love one another: for he that loveth another hath fulfilled the law.

Romans 13:10 KJB - Love worketh no ill to his neighbour: therefore love is the fulfilling of the law.

Galatians 6:2 KJB - Bear ye one another's burdens, and so fulfil the law of Christ.

Galatians 5:14 KJB - For all the law is fulfilled in one word, even in this; Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.

James 2:8 KJB - If ye fulfil the royal law according to the scripture, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself, ye do well:​

The Royal Law, the Law of Christ, the Law of Liberty, is the Law of the Kings and Priests, the Ten Commandments, of which "love thy neighbour as thyself" encompasses ["briefly comprehended"; Romans 13:9 KJB, citing Exodus 20:13-17] the second table, commandments 5-10.

Jesus came not to destroy a single Law. He came to show us how to live according to God's Law. Otherwise how can that which is said to be 'put away' by Christ Jesus Himself filling to the full, obeying perfectly, still be here to be fulfilled by us?

How can a new 'law' be given to us, which we never saw Jesus fulfil? How would we know how to fulfil it, having no example? Remember, you are telling me that Jesus fulfilled an old law.
 
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The7thColporteur

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... Man cannot describe the Character of Jesus with our limited vocabulary...
The language you use, is descriptive of the character that you have. The language that you have used, perfectly represents which character you are molded after.

God's character was written by God Himself, by His own Finger [the Holy Ghost]. Man did not attempt to describe God, but God Himself did do so:

Look at what Moses asks of JEHOVAH Elohiym:

Exodus 33:12 KJB - And Moses said unto the LORD, See, thou sayest unto me, Bring up this people: and thou hast not let me know whom thou wilt send with me. Yet thou hast said, I know thee by name, and thou hast also found grace in my sight.

Exodus 33:13 KJB - Now therefore, I pray thee, if I have found grace in thy sight, shew me now thy way, that I may know thee, that I may find grace in thy sight: and consider that this nation is thy people.

Exodus 33:14 KJB - And he said, My presence shall go with thee, and I will give thee rest.

Exodus 33:15 KJB - And he said unto him, If thy presence go not with me, carry us not up hence.

Exodus 33:16 KJB - For wherein shall it be known here that I and thy people have found grace in thy sight? is it not in that thou goest with us? so shall we be separated, I and thy people, from all the people that are upon the face of the earth.

Exodus 33:17 KJB - And the LORD said unto Moses, I will do this thing also that thou hast spoken: for thou hast found grace in my sight, and I know thee by name.

Exodus 33:18 KJB - And he said, I beseech thee, shew me thy glory.

Exodus 33:19 KJB - And he said, I will make all my goodness pass before thee, and I will proclaim the name of the LORD before thee; and will be gracious to whom I will be gracious, and will shew mercy on whom I will shew mercy.

Exodus 33:20 KJB - And he said, Thou canst not see my face: for there shall no man see me, and live.

Exodus 33:21 KJB - And the LORD said, Behold, there is a place by me, and thou shalt stand upon a rock:

Exodus 33:22 KJB - And it shall come to pass, while my glory passeth by, that I will put thee in a clift of the rock, and will cover thee with my hand while I pass by:

Exodus 33:23 KJB - And I will take away mine hand, and thou shalt see my back parts: but my face shall not be seen.​

Look at what JEHOVAH Elohiym says:

Exodus 34:1 KJB - And the LORD said unto Moses, Hew thee two tables of stone like unto the first: and I will write upon these tables the words that were in the first tables, which thou brakest.

Exodus 34:2 KJB - And be ready in the morning, and come up in the morning unto mount Sinai, and present thyself there to me in the top of the mount.

Exodus 34:3 KJB - And no man shall come up with thee, neither let any man be seen throughout all the mount; neither let the flocks nor herds feed before that mount.

Exodus 34:4 KJB - And he hewed two tables of stone like unto the first; and Moses rose up early in the morning, and went up unto mount Sinai, as the LORD had commanded him, and took in his hand the two tables of stone.

Exodus 34:5 KJB - And the LORD descended in the cloud, and stood with him there, and proclaimed the name of the LORD.

Exodus 34:6 KJB - And the LORD passed by before him, and proclaimed, The LORD, The LORD God, merciful and gracious, longsuffering, and abundant in goodness and truth,

Exodus 34:7 KJB - Keeping mercy for thousands, forgiving iniquity and transgression and sin, and that will by no means clear the guilty; visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children, and upon the children's children, unto the third and to the fourth generation.

Exodus 34:8 KJB - And Moses made haste, and bowed his head toward the earth, and worshipped.

Exodus 34:9 KJB - And he said, If now I have found grace in thy sight, O Lord, let my Lord, I pray thee, go among us; for it is a stiffnecked people; and pardon our iniquity and our sin, and take us for thine inheritance.​

Here is where JEHOVAH just quoted from to Moses:

Exodus 20:5 KJB - Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them: for I the LORD thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate me;

Exodus 20:6 KJB - And shewing mercy unto thousands of them that love me, and keep my commandments.

as it is written, that the name is the description of the Being:

"... for as his name is, so is he; ..."; 1 Samuel 25:25 KJB

[ie, Eve: Genesis 3:20 KJB - And Adam called his wife's name Eve; because she was the mother of all living.

ie, Noah: Genesis 5:29 KJB - And he called his name Noah, saying, This same shall comfort us concerning our work and toil of our hands, because of the ground which the LORD hath cursed.

ie, Jacob: Genesis 27:36 KJB - And he said, Is not he rightly named Jacob? for he hath supplanted me these two times: he took away my birthright; and, behold, now he hath taken away my blessing. And he said, Hast thou not reserved a blessing for me?

ie, Israel: Genesis 32:28 KJB - And he said, Thy name shall be called no more Jacob, but Israel: for as a prince hast thou power with God and with men, and hast prevailed.

ie, Ichabod: 1 Samuel 4:21 KJB - And she named the child Ichabod, saying, The glory is departed from Israel: because the ark of God was taken, and because of her father in law and her husband.

ie, Golgotha/Calvary: John 19:17 KJB - And he bearing his cross went forth into a place called the place of a skull, which is called in the Hebrew Golgotha:

Luke 23:33 KJB - And when they were come to the place, which is called Calvary, there they crucified him, and the malefactors, one on the right hand, and the other on the left.

Indeed, for the place in which Jesus sacrificed His life, should ever be imprinted into the mind, the place of the skull, the centermost place of the heart of the earth. JEHOVAH Jesus, JEHOVAH E/Immanuel, God's love, Mercy and Justice meet there, preserving God's Law, His character, His Justice and His Mercy thus preserving His eternal Kingdom and eternal Throne and also preserving those who would accept the sacrifice into that everlasting Kingdom, and so also where the Wrath of God and the Mercy of God meet in Christ Jesus.
ie, JESUS: Matthew 1:21 KJB - And she shall bring forth a son, and thou shalt call his name JESUS: for he shall save his people from their sins.]

etc, and many, many more examples that could be given ...]
Who spoke those? JEHOVAH Elohiym:

Exodus 20:22 KJB - And the LORD said unto Moses, Thus thou shalt say unto the children of Israel, Ye have seen that I have talked with you from heaven.​

Who wrote those? JEHOVAH Elohiym:

Exodus 32:16 KJB - And the tables were the work of God, and the writing was the writing of God, graven upon the tables.

Exodus 31:18 KJB - And he gave unto Moses, when he had made an end of communing with him upon mount Sinai, two tables of testimony, tables of stone, written with the finger of God.
God's name, His character is Good:

Psalms 54:6 KJB - I will freely sacrifice unto thee: I will praise thy name, O LORD; for it is good.

Proverbs 22:1 KJB - A good name is rather to be chosen than great riches, and loving favour rather than silver and gold.

Ecclesiastes 7:1 KJB - A good name is better than precious ointment; and the day of death than the day of one's birth.​

Tha Law of God, the transcript of His perfect character is Good:

Romans 7:12 Wherefore the law is holy, and the commandment holy, and just, and good.​

Now notice the connection:

Matthew 19:17 KJB - And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments.​

Therefore, as I follow Jesus Christ, and must have His character within and without, His eternal Law written upon my heart, that it may come forth from these His purchased lips, as it is written:

1 Samuel 12:23 KJB - Moreover as for me, God forbid that I should sin against the LORD in ceasing to pray for you: but I will teach you the good and the right way:

Matthew 5:44 KJB - But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you;​

And so as My Father does do and said to do, so do I for you.
 
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Soyeong

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All of Paul's writings deals with the false teaching of the Judaizers, of which you seem to Advocate.

I am in complete agreement with Paul's stance against the Judaizers and have never suggested that we need to obey their works of law in order to become saved.

Galatians 3:10 states the Law is a curse, Jesus freed true Christians from the curse. Now in verse 25 of that same chapter it tells that because we have Faith in Jesus Christ, we are no longer under the Law.

How can someone have such a low opinion of the Law that they consider it to be a curse without that reflecting rather negatively on their opinion of the Lawgiver? There is nothing in the Bible that suggests that God is an unloving Father who gave the Law in order to curse His children, but much of the opposite in that God said that it was given for our own good to bless us (Deuteronomy 10:12-13), and I believe Him. The Psalms contain extremely high praise for God's Law, which certainly reflected on David's opinion of the Lawgiver. He said that he delighted in obeying God's Law, that he loved it, that it was perfect, that those who obey it will be blessed, that he wanted God to show His grace to him by teaching him to obey it, that he walked about in liberty because it, ect., and Paul also delighted in obeying it (Romans 7:22), so he was on the same page as David, yet you are not. If you consider the Psalms to be Scripture and everything in them to be true, then you should think that they therefore express a correct view of God's Law and that you should therefore share it.

In Deuteronomy 30:15-20, it says that obedience to the Law brings life and a blessing while disobedience brings death and a curse, so the curse of the Law is living in disobedience to it. Jesus gave himself to free us from sinning in disobedience to the Law so that we could be free to enjoy the blessing of living in obedience to it. Again, Titus 2:11-14 does not say that Christ gave himself to free us from the Law, but to redeem us from all Lawlessness.

In regard to Galatians 3:25, having no more need for a tutor is not at all the same as having no more need to live by what they taught you. Someone who disregarded everything that their tutor taught them after they left would be completely missing the whole point of a tutor. Now that Christ has come we have a superior teacher, but the subject matter is still how to walk in God's ways in obedience to the Mosaic Law that Christ taught by word and by example. Christ did not teach that the Law has been done away with that that repentance is no longer necessary, but quite the opposite.

In Galatians 5:2-4 states that those who are trying to live under the Law have fallen from the Grace of God and Jesus Christ. There are 100's of other verses in the new Testament that state that we are not under the old Law.

All throughout the Bible God wanted His people to repent and to return to obedience to His Law and even Jesus began his ministry with that Gospel message, so I do not see how it makes any sense whatsoever to interpret Galatians 5:2-4 as saying that if we by faith repent, return to obedience to God's commands, and seek to follow Christ's example, then we then we will fall from grace and be cut off from Christ. Do you really think that God curses those who seek to obey Him and looks with favor on those who refuse to repent? Was David falling from grace by wanting God to show His grace to him by teaching him to obey His Law? While I agree that the NT says that we are not under the law, you have not be careful to determine which law Paul was speaking about us not being under, and thus you've ended up with a convoluted mess where you've taken things that were only against obeying man-made laws as being against obeying the Law of the God that you serve.
 
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Doveaman

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You are simply in denial of the relevant point in Matt 12 which is that work is done by those involved in the Gospel - in preaching in teaching in feeding the sheep in all the activities of priests in the OT and pastors in the new testament.
It is you who is in denial of the relevant point in Matt 12, which is that the priests were desecrating the Sabbath day by their work:

“Haven't you read in the Law that on the Sabbath the priests in the temple desecrate the day and yet are innocent?” – (Matt 12:5)

Perhaps you should look up the word "desecrate" to find out what it means, because you are obviously clueless.
Yet none of that would be "violation of the Sabbath" for anyone else to do either.

The priest were doing what was approved by the law
The priests were desecrating the Sabbath day precisely because they were violating the 4th commandment of the law.

The desecration is the direct result of the violation.

The 4th commandment of the law forbid all work, even by the priests:

"Remember the Sabbath day by keeping it holy. Six days you shall labor and do all your work, but the seventh day is a Sabbath to the LORD your God. On it you shall not do any work" - (Ex 20:8-10)

The priests were desecrating the Sabbath day because they were violating the 4th commandment of the law by working of the Sabbath day.

The 4th commandment does not specify whether it be religious work or secular work.

All work
was forbidden by the 4th commandment of the law.
 
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Soyeong

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For all who rely on the works of the law are under a curse, as it is written: ‘Cursed is everyone who does not continue to do everything written in the Book of the Law.’e]'>[e] 11 Clearly no one who relies on the law is justified before God, because ‘the righteous will live by faith
Gal3:10&11

For if those who depend on the law are heirs, faith means nothing and the promise is worthless, 15 because the law brings wrath
Rom 4:14&15

The above cannot refer to what we often term the legalistic law, for that could be faultlessly obeyed. It was faultlessly obeyed by saul the Pharisee(Phil3:6niv) as well as Pharisees who Jesus said did not even know his Father. Therefore,you wouldn't be cursed by them, in respsect of not being able to do everything written regarding them.
Paul, in 2cor ch3 referred to the law engraved on stone(TC) as being the letter that kills/the ministry of death and condemnation. You are cursed if you rely on obeying the TC to to be justified before God, for you cannot attain to the pass mark to be righteous under them, which is 100% perfect obedience/do everything written concerning them. And in this sense, law would bring wrath.

Now I knew that and I've never studied the greek:)

In Deuteronomy 30:15-20, obedience to the Law brings life and a blessing, while disobedience brings death and a curse. The fact that the Law brings death for disobedience is hardly a good reason for someone to refuse to obey it. In Matthew 23:23, Jesus said that faith is one of the weightier matters of the Law, so God's Law is of faith. In Romans 3:27, Paul contrasted a law that was of faith with a law that was of works, so works of law are of works, while Paul said in Romans 3:31 that our faith upholds God's Law, so again God's Law is of faith. In Galatians 3:10-11, Paul was contrasting works of, which are not of faith, with the Book of the Law, which is of faith, and those who rely on works of law are under a curse because they are failing to live by faith in the Book of the Law.
 
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Marco70

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In Deuteronomy 30:15-20, obedience to the Law brings life and a blessing, while disobedience brings death and a curse. The fact that the Law brings death for disobedience is hardly a good reason for someone to refuse to obey it. In Matthew 23:23, Jesus said that faith is one of the weightier matters of the Law, so God's Law is of faith. In Romans 3:27, Paul contrasted a law that was of faith with a law that was of works, so works of law are of works, while Paul said in Romans 3:31 that our faith upholds God's Law, so again God's Law is of faith. In Galatians 3:10-11, Paul was contrasting works of, which are not of faith, with the Book of the Law, which is of faith, and those who rely on works of law are under a curse because they are failing to live by faith in the Book of the Law.
Well happily, under the NC, the law God desires the believer to follow is written in their mind and placed on their heart. And, through the law we become conscious of sin. What is in your mind, you in your mind must know, and the law in your heart, must bring heartfelt conviction of sin when you wilfully transgress it. Which makes it kinda pointless for you to try and tell me which laws I should follow doesn't it
 
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Soyeong

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Well happily, under the NC, the law God desires the believer to follow is written in their mind and placed on their heart. And, through the law we become conscious of sin. What is in your mind, you in your mind must know, and the law in your heart, must bring heartfelt conviction of sin when you wilfully transgress it. Which makes it kinda worthless for you to try and tell me which laws I must follow doesn't it

Do you believe what Paul wrote in Galatians 6:1 that we should gently restore those who are caught in sin?
 
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