SALVATION offered by Jesus: COMPLETED and IRREVOCABLE

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justbyfaith

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OK, went there. The OP comes from one Victor Jedidiah, and is a mess, to be frank.

He claims sinless perfection for the believer, then contradicts that claim with a statement that includes "as long as...". But one cannot have it both ways. So his claims are contradictory.

The words "wet pain principle" was never defined or described. So it seems he wasn't too concerned about communicating.
The wet paint principle was defined and described in chapter 5 (also in 1:8 and 1:26). Evidently you never made it that far. Also, there aren't any contradictions in the document, but it is written in spiritual language that is spiritually discerned and understood.
 
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justbyfaith

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I asked this:
"How many times in a year do you read through all the epistles?"

Are you claiming you read through Romans - Revelation every week? Remember, I said READ THROUGH. That means every verse in every epistle.
Romans-Jude every week. My gospels, Acts and Revelation reading is separate, and I read less there per day than I do in the epistles.

Day 1: 1-3 John, 1-2 Peter, John 6:35, 4:13-14, 7:37-39, 6:47, 5:24, 8:31-36, 11:25-27, James, Romans 6-8, Hebrews 10, Jude.
Day 2: Romans. Day 3: 1 Corinthians. Day 4: 2 Corinthians. Day 5: Galatians-Colossians, Revelation 1:16-end of chapter 3. Day 6: 1 Thessalonians-Philemon. Day 7: Hebrews.
 
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Missgrundy

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SALVATION offered by Jesus: COMPLETED and IRREVOCABLE!!

God does not take back nor allow man to give back His SALVATION...PAST completed TENSE! (AORIST!)

John 5:24 (all NASB) “Truly, truly, I (Jesus) say to you,
he who hears My word, and believes Him who sent Me, HAS eternal life,
and does not come into judgment, but HAS PASSED out of death into life.

Ephesians 2:4-10
(by grace you HAVE BEEN saved),

Luke 19:1-10...[ Zaccheus Converted ]
9 And Jesus said to him,
“Today salvation has come to this house, because he, too, is a son of Abraham.
10 For the Son of Man "has come" to seek and to save that which was lost.”

Mark 2:17
And hearing this, Jesus said to them,
“It is not those who are healthy who need a physician, but those who are sick;
I did not "come to call" the righteous, but sinners.”

John 3
17 For God did not send the Son into the world to judge the world,
but that the world might "be saved" through Him.
18 He who believes in Him is not judged;
he who does not believe has been judged already,
because he "has not believed" in the name of the ONLY begotten Son of God.

John 6
35 Jesus said to them,
“I am the bread of life;
he who COMES to Me WILL not hunger,
and he who BELIEVES in Me WILL never thirst.
36 But I said to you that you have SEEN Me, and yet do not BELIEVE.
40 For this is the will of My Father,
that everyone who beholds the Son and BELIEVES in Him "WILL (is certain to) have "eternal life"", (now!!)
and I Myself will raise him up "on the last day".”

John 10
27 My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me;
28 and I "GIVE eternal life to them", and they will never perish;
and no one will snatch them out of My hand.
29 My Father, who HAS GIVEN them to Me, is greater than all;
and no one is able to snatch them out of the Father’s hand.
30 I and the Father are one.” (IN SPIRITUAL ESSENCE AND NATURE!)

John 17:2-3 ...Jesus' High Priestly Prayer to the Father about Jesus' followers
even as You gave Him authority over all flesh,
that to all whom You "have given" Him,
He MAY GIVE "eternal life".
This is "eternal life",
that they MAY KNOW You, the only true God, and
(KNOW) Jesus Christ whom You have sent.

John 1:12,14 (NIV)
Yet to all who "RECEIVED" him,
to those who "BELIEVED" in His name, (Jesus the Christ)
He gave the right to become CHILDREN of God...

QUESTIONS:
1. Can one lose or give back the completed saving work of Jesus the Divine Messiah? If so, copy and paste supporting verses in context.
2. What must one DO to be saved? UNsaved?
3. Does one need to spiritually discern anything further than John 3 as explained in Ephesians 2 to be saved? Romans 10? Acts 16:31?
4. Is Salvation an EVENT?
5. Is Sanctification a PROCESS?
Sometimes we do complicate the simple things. Salvation is a one time thing you never get unsaved just rededicate n reignite the flame. Tranformation holistic transformation is a process but I do hope you found your answers :) but why complicate the simple :) Gods not complicated we just complicate Him at times lol . I hope somewhere you found your answers . God bless you
 
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Grip Docility

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@justbyfaith , When a man sins... he is being a sinner.

When a man accepts Jesus... his life debt of sins... past, present and future are paid in full.

We sin because we’re not GOD!

Only God is Immutably GOOD! He said so!

God didn’t die so we can sin, but because we abuse our free will daily in our hearts and minds... never mind when we go the full mile and physically see the sin through.

God died because we NEED Him! He died because we Sin!

We don’t stop sinning until we escape our bodies of death.

The very one that opposed God in the garden... and opposed God as God walked among us... that has the POWER of death (Hebrews 2:14) will strike his final blow on the Christian when life is lost...

But that seed of our soul... anchored in Christ Jesus... springs forth and yields a NEW Body! That’s when we no longer sin!

Don’t believe me?!? Consult 1 Corinthians 15.

All Christian Love to you, brother in Him.
 
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Grip Docility

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That's because you have a r*pr*b*t* mind.

Calvinism would say that. Jesus wouldn’t! You have judged wrong, Brother...

You stand in the grasp of Romans 2:1-3 now!

Please refrain from such an accusation to @FreeGrace2 ... who is saved by the same blood that saves you.

Doctrinal disagreement amongst Salvation by faith believers has no room for such words!
 
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Gr8Grace

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Let's read it again to see what it actually says.

1 John 3:10
In this the children of God are manifest, and the children of the devil: whosoever doeth not righteousness is not of God, neither he that loveth not his brother.

Notice it says 'WHOSOEVER doeth not righteousness is not of God'? Nothing is said about behavior not being of God. Whosoever definitely refers to a person, and a trait. Besides, behavior can't love his brother.
There is no righteousness in teaching loss of salvation or maintaining salvation for a born-again believer. WHOSOEVER teaches this, it is not from God.......John 10:28. John is not saying that you are not really saved or you will lose salvation.......You are just deceived and what you preach is NOT from God. There is NO righteousness in loss of salvation or maintaining salvation. There is a LOT of human good or self righteousness, but no divine righteousness.
 
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Gr8Grace

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There is nothing in the verse you provided which remotely states anything about loss/maintenance of salvation. As you said above, 'your ilk read way too much into the verses you quote'.
Correct, there is nothing about loss of salvation/maintaining salvation anywhere in the Bible. It is actually a eternal security verse.

Those believers who day in and day out fight for sending believers to the eternal lake of fire and preach fruits/good works/moral living/stopping 'most' sin for salvation or to maintain salvation .......crucify Christ DAILY and put Him to OPEN shame......John 10:28,John 5:24,Rom 8.

They will have SHAME at His Bema seat and be saved as if through fire.

1 John 2:28~~New American Standard Bible
Now, little children, abide in Him, so that when He appears, we may have confidence and not shrink away from Him in shame at His coming.

1 Cor 3:15~~New American Standard Bible
If any man's work is burned up, he will suffer loss; but he himself will be saved, yet so as through fire.
 
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Grip Docility

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Correct, there is nothing about loss of salvation/maintaining salvation anywhere in the Bible. It is actually a eternal security verse.

Those believers who day in and day out fight for sending believers to the eternal lake of fire and preach fruits/good works/moral living/stopping 'most' sin for salvation or to maintain salvation .......crucify Christ DAILY and put Him to OPEN shame......John 10:28,John 5:24,Rom 8.

They will have SHAME at His Bema seat and be saved as if through fire.

1 John 2:28~~New American Standard Bible
Now, little children, abide in Him, so that when He appears, we may have confidence and not shrink away from Him in shame at His coming.

1 Cor 3:15~~New American Standard Bible
If any man's work is burned up, he will suffer loss; but he himself will be saved, yet so as through fire.

Bingo!!! Amen!!!
 
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EmSw

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There is no righteousness in teaching loss of salvation or maintaining salvation for a born-again believer.

Can I play this game and make something up? Here goes -

There is no righteousness in teaching once saved/always saved.

WHOSOEVER teaches this, it is not from God.......John 10:28.

And I can make up that one who teaches OSAS is not from God.

John is not saying that you are not really saved or you will lose salvation.......You are just deceived and what you preach is NOT from God.

No, John is saying you are not a child of God; you are a child of the devil.

It must make you proud that you are not deceived, just like FG2.

There is NO righteousness in loss of salvation or maintaining salvation. There is a LOT of human good or self righteousness, but no divine righteousness.

I will make something up too - there is no righteousness in saying there is no loss of salvation or maintaining salvation. Wow, it's so easy to make stuff up, and try to get others to believe as you do.

Want to know what John said righteousness is?

1 John 3:7
Little children, let no man deceive you: he that doeth righteousness is righteous, even as he is righteous.

Did you get that? 'HE THAT DOETH RIGHTEOUSNESS IS RIGHTEOUS'. Go ahead, and make something else up about this passage.
 
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EmSw

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Correct, there is nothing about loss of salvation/maintaining salvation anywhere in the Bible. It is actually a eternal security verse.

Those believers who day in and day out fight for sending believers to the eternal lake of fire and preach fruits/good works/moral living/stopping 'most' sin for salvation or to maintain salvation .......crucify Christ DAILY and put Him to OPEN shame......John 10:28,John 5:24,Rom 8.

They will have SHAME at His Bema seat and be saved as if through fire.

1 John 2:28~~New American Standard Bible
Now, little children, abide in Him, so that when He appears, we may have confidence and not shrink away from Him in shame at His coming.

1 Cor 3:15~~New American Standard Bible
If any man's work is burned up, he will suffer loss; but he himself will be saved, yet so as through fire.

I'm not fighting you to send you to the lake of fire. I'm showing you how to avoid that.

A man's personal works are not burned up. Everyone is judged according to his works. And everyone will be given according to his works. Those who patiently continue in doing good, eternal life is given. Those who do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness, indignation and wrath is given.

1 Kings 8:32
Then hear thou in heaven, and do, and judge thy servants, condemning the wicked, to bring his way upon his head; and justifying the righteous, to give him according to his righteousness.

1 Kings 8:39
Then hear thou in heaven thy dwelling place, and forgive, and do, and give to every man according to his ways, whose heart thou knowest; (for thou, even thou only, knowest the hearts of all the children of men.

Job 34:11
For the work of a man shall he render unto him, and cause every man to find according to his ways.

Proverbs 24:12
If thou sayest, Behold, we knew it not; doth not he that pondereth the heart consider it? and he that keepeth thy soul, doth not he know it? and shall not he render to every man according to his works?

Jeremiah 17:10
I the Lord search the heart, I try the reins, even to give every man according to his ways, and according to the fruit of his doings.

Jeremiah 25:14
For many nations and great kings shall serve themselves of them also: and I will recompense them according to their deeds, and according to the works of their own hands.

Jeremiah 32:19
Great in counsel, and mighty in work: for thine eyes are open upon all the ways of the sons of men: to give every one according to his ways, and according to the fruit of his doings:

Ezekiel 7:3
Now is the end come upon thee, and I will send mine anger upon thee, and will judge thee according to thy ways, and will recompense upon thee all thine abominations.

Ezekiel 18:30
Therefore I will judge you, O house of Israel, every one according to his ways, saith the Lord God. Repent, and turn yourselves from all your transgressions; so iniquity shall not be your ruin.

Ezekiel 24:14
I the Lord have spoken it: it shall come to pass, and I will do it; I will not go back, neither will I spare, neither will I repent; according to thy ways, and according to thy doings, shall they judge thee, saith the Lord God.

Hosea 12:2
The Lord hath also a controversy with Judah, and will punish Jacob according to his ways; according to his doings will he recompense him.

Zechariah 1:6
But my words and my statutes, which I commanded my servants the prophets, did they not take hold of your fathers? and they returned and said, Like as the Lord of hosts thought to do unto us, according to our ways, and according to our doings, so hath he dealt with us.

Matthew 16:27
For the Son of man shall come in the glory of his Father with his angels; and then he shall reward every man according to his works.

Romans 2
6 Who will render to every man according to his deeds:
7 To them who by patient continuance in well doing seek for glory and honour and immortality, eternal life:
8 But unto them that are contentious, and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness, indignation and wrath,


Revelation 2:23
And I will kill her children with death; and all the churches shall know that I am he which searcheth the reins and hearts: and I will give unto every one of you according to your works.

Revelation 20:12
And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.

Not once will you find anyone judged according to their beliefs. And if you think you are not part of 'every man', you need to think again.
 
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justbyfaith

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@justbyfaith , When a man sins... he is being a sinner.

When a man accepts Jesus... his life debt of sins... past, present and future are paid in full.

We sin because we’re not GOD!

Only God is Immutably GOOD! He said so!

God didn’t die so we can sin, but because we abuse our free will daily in our hearts and minds... never mind when we go the full mile and physically see the sin through.

God died because we NEED Him! He died because we Sin!

We don’t stop sinning until we escape our bodies of death.

The very one that opposed God in the garden... and opposed God as God walked among us... that has the POWER of death (Hebrews 2:14) will strike his final blow on the Christian when life is lost...

But that seed of our soul... anchored in Christ Jesus... springs forth and yields a NEW Body! That’s when we no longer sin!

Don’t believe me?!? Consult 1 Corinthians 15.

All Christian Love to you, brother in Him.
I was actually just thinking of something in 1 Corinthians 15 as a response to the first part of your post...1 Corinthians 15:34, Awake to righteousness, and sin not: for some have not the knowledge of God: I speak this to your shame.
 
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justbyfaith

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If we cannot stop sinning until we get our glorified bodies, then why, in Daniel 9:24, does God give Israel a time limit to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy?

What kind of God puts a time limit on accomplishing a task that is unaccomplishable?

What kind of God requires of us something that we cannot ever accomplish, not even in Him?

God accomplishes it in us as we receive Him by faith!

He sheds abroad His love in our hearts through the Holy Ghost, and this love fulfills the righteous requirement of the law in the practical sense; while His blood covers over our sins when we fall short for whatever reason. Romans 5:5, Romans 8:4, Romans 13:8-10. Romans 5:9, Romans 4:6-8.
 
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Grip Docility

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I was actually just thinking of something in 1 Corinthians 15 as a response to the first part of your post...1 Corinthians 15:34, Awake to righteousness, and sin not: for some have not the knowledge of God: I speak this to your shame.

Context

If Christ wasn’t raised (we are in our sins)

Context...

WHEN we are immortal

Context

Hebrews 6:19

You surely can’t bypass this?

And lastly... I will digress... we all walk different, but share in His blood.

My words didn’t find your ears deaf...

When you fail... remember me... a sinner forgiven... the least of men... a chief of Sinners for which I am indeed... and remember to be not discouraged and hold onto your promise...

Also... please show mercy in your doctrine... because He desires mercy to sinners...

We are His hands, feet and much more... to a world that is deaf due to Christian discord...

- Grip
 
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BNR32FAN

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Most of King David's uses of "save" and "salvation" were in reference to his physical safety from dangers.

Verses please. As I originally stated if the word saved is not being referenced to something to be saved from it is in reference to salvation.
 
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FreeGrace2

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Since you've used soul and spirit, what is the heart and mind?
You're free to think whatever you want to about them. This thread isn't about any of these. You're just trying to derail the thread.

So sinners today don't have the ability to properly worship God; this is their death, right?
Yes, and no. Yes, unbelievers (I prefer to be specific, since ALL humans are sinners) do not have the abilityy to properly worship God. Are you arguing against what Jesus told the woman at the well? Sure looks that way.

And, no, it is not "their death", whatever that means. Humans are born spiritually dead, or didn't you get the memo. When a person places their trust in Jesus as their Savior, they are born again, or as Paul wrote, "made alive", or spiritual birth.

Or didn't you get the memo?

Is that your understanding? So sinners do not have to fear much; most don't want to worship God anyway.
What does having no fear have to do with anything? Doesn't matter what people fear or not. Reality is reality. Unless one receives the free gift of eternal life, they will end up in the lake of fire, for eternity. It all comes down to whether people believe what God has revealed. So I don't care what people fear or not.

Now what do you mean by regenerated?[/QUOT]
It's a Bible word. Are you unaware of the word in Scripture? Looks that way. I'm not your Bible teacher. If you have a pastor, go ask him.

Is regeneration the reason the spirit doesn't sin?
This is way confused, obviously. Regeneration is the REASON the human spirit is ALIVE.

The human spirit doesn't sin because it's NOT part of the soul or body that is corrupted by Adam's sin.

But somehow I suspect this is all unfamiliar information to you.

Those who are regenerated have the ability to properly worship God, right?
That's basically what Jesus told the woman.
 
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FreeGrace2

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Do you not know that being cut from God, is being cut off from the source of life?
OK, define exactly what you mean by "being cut off" and also, the "source of life".

You're comments are rather vague. The Bible speaks of physical life and spiritual life. I do not know what you're referring to.
 
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