Freedom from Sin: Overcoming the Wet Paint Principle (the complete version)

justbyfaith said:

What other person?

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Well, the other person who posted in this thread is CF user called "Halbhh."

In post #5, you made a big deal out of him not responding to the whole of your post (like you did with me). So I am replying to the whole of your post so as to resolve this issue you have as proof that we are not ignoring anything that you are saying. It's going to take time to respond to the rest of your post, but I will do so.

We all need to humbly listen to Christ our savior, all He said. No doctrines are good enough to replace His words. Be the listener, don't talk over Him as you listen and hear. He saves, not our doctrines.

John 1 NIV

justbyfaith said:

1 God sees me as perfect and I am growing up into the finished product seen by the Lord—I am growing up into the measure of the stature of the fullness of Christ.

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Well, God does not see His servants in being perfect as you say. The Parable of the Talents says otherwise.

14 "For the kingdom of heaven is as a man travelling into a far country, who called his own servants, and delivered unto them his goods.
15 And unto one he gave five talents, to another two, and to another one; to every man according to his several ability; and straightway took his journey.
16 Then he that had received the five talents went and traded with the same, and made them other five talents.
17 And likewise he that had received two, he also gained other two.
18 But he that had received one went and digged in the earth, and hid his lord's money.
19 After a long time the lord of those servants cometh, and reckoneth with them.
20 And so he that had received five talents came and brought other five talents, saying, Lord, thou deliveredst unto me five talents: behold, I have gained beside them five talents more.
21 His lord said unto him, Well done, thougood and faithful servant: thou hast been faithful over a few things, I will make thee ruler over many things: enter thou into the joy of thy lord.
22 He also that had received two talents came and said, Lord, thou deliveredst unto me two talents: behold, I have gained two other talents beside them.
23 His lord said unto him, Well done, good and faithful servant; thou hast been faithful over a few things, I will make thee ruler over many things: enter thou into the joy of thy lord.
24 Then he which had received the one talent came and said, Lord, I knew thee that thou art an hard man, reaping where thou hast not sown, and gathering where thou hast not strawed:
25 And I was afraid, and went and hid thy talent in the earth: lo, there thou hast that is thine.
26 His lord answered and said unto him, Thou wicked and slothful servant, thou knewest that I reap where I sowed not, and gather where I have not strawed:
27 Thou oughtest therefore to have put my money to the exchangers, and then at my coming I should have received mine own with usury.
28 Take therefore the talent from him, and give it unto him which hath ten talents.
29 For unto every one that hath shall be given, and he shall have abundance: but from him that hath not shall be taken away even that which he hath.
30 And cast ye the unprofitable servant into outer darkness: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth." (Matthew 25:14-30).

Did you see what happened to the last servant who was unprofitable? He was cast into outer darkness where there is weeping and gnashing of teeth.

Gnashing of teeth is what wolves do or those who are angry.
Obviously many believers who thought they were following God (But not according to His Word) are going to be angry and gnash their teeth at Him.

Usually when the Bible talks about "perfection" it relates it to sanctification or in living holy. For example: in Matthew 5, Jesus says be ye perfect as the Heavenly Father is perfect and then Christ tells us the meaning of this by saying we are to pray and do good towards our enemies, etc. Paul says in 2 Corinthians 7:1 that we are to cleanse ourselves from all filthiness of the flesh and spirit perfecting holiness in the fear of God. The Bible speaks nothing about being perfect in the eyes of God by having a mere belief alone on Him as your Savior. We also have to endure or overcome in the faith until the end so as to be saved. Overcoming in the faith includes living holy and being fruitful. For faith without works is dead (James 2:17), and without holiness, no man shall see the Lord (Hebrews 12:14).

You said:

2 And in my heart I am already perfected because there He has placed the fullness of His love.

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Actually the Bible says that those who keep his word is when the love of God is perfected within us.
In fact, keeping His Word is one of the ways we know we are in Him.

5 "But whoso keepeth his word, in him verily is the love of God perfected: hereby know we that we are in him.
6 He that saith he abideth in him ought himself also so to walk, even as he walked."
(1 John 2:5-6).

You said:

3 I am righteous in His sight, even as He is righteous, and therefore I practice righteousness. 1 John 3:7.

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No. That is not what 1 John 3:7 says. You are changing what it says. It does not say you are righteous in his sight (no doubt by your thinking that you have a belief alone in Jesus). 1 John 3:7 says, "Little children, let no man deceive you: he that doeth righteousness is righteous, even as he is righteous." Okay, it says he that DOES righteousness is righteous. So 1 John 3:7 is teaching the exact opposite of what you said here. It says doing righteousness is the equivalent of being righteous just as He (Jesus) is righteous (by His actions).

You said:

4 All things are naked and opened and laid bare before the eyes of Him with whom we have to do. Hebrews 4:13.

5 Therefore if I am righteous in His sight, I am truly righteous—and this will bear itself out in the way that I behave.

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This is not what Hebrews 4:13 is saying. If you were to look at the previous chapter it warns the reader (i.e. the believer) to not depart from the living God by having an evil heart of unbelief (Hebrews 3:12) and to not harden their heart by the deceitfulness of sin (Hebrews 3:13).

Also, when you read, Hebrews 4:13 that says,
"Neither is there any creature that is not manifest in his sight: but all things are naked and opened unto the eyes of him with whom we have to do."

You also have to read Hebrews 3:14 that says,

"For we are made partakers of Christ, if we hold the beginning of our confidence stedfast unto the end;" (Hebrews 3:14).

And Hebrews 4:11 that says,

"Let us labour therefore to enter into that rest, lest any man fall after the same example of unbelief." (Hebrews 4:11).

But this doesn't sound anything like what you said.

You said:

6 He has given me the free gift of righteousness which I receive through faith in His shed blood upon the Cross. Romans 5:9, 5:17

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This would also include 1 John 1:7. It not only includes having faith or belief in the Savior, but it also includes walking in the light as He [Christ] is in the light within the faith whereby the blood of Jesus will then cleanse us from all sin.

"But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin." (1 John 1:7).

Besides, Romans 6:1 says, shall we continue in sin so that grace may abound? God forbid. Meaning we cannot do so. Grace cannot abound if we continue in sin. Paul does not say that grace abounds if we sin. On the contrary, Paul says that we are servants to whom we obey. So if we obey sin, then we are in service to sin and it is our master. If we obey righteousness, then we are in service to God and He is our master. Jesus says you will know a tree by it's fruit. He says a good tree cannot bring forth bad fruit and a bad tree cannot bring forth good fruit.

Romans 5 is talking about Justification by faith in the Savior. It is not talking about Sanctfication by the Spirit (Which is the next step in the salvation process). Scripture says, God has chosen us unto salvation through Sanctification by the Spirit and belief of the truth (See 2 Thessalonians 2:13). Belief of the truth is having faith in Jesus and Sanctification by the Spirit is exactly what it means it says.

You said:

7 As through the disobedience of Adam many were made sinners, so through the obedience of Jesus Christ many are made righteous—and this is the free gift of God received by faith in what Christ did for us on the Cross. Romans 5:19, 5:15-16.

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But you also have to read Romans 8 that says,

3 "For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:
4 That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.
5 For they that are after the flesh do mind the things of the flesh; but they that are after the Spirit the things of the Spirit.
6 For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace.
7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.
8 So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God."
(Romans 8:3-8).

Did you catch what it said?

It says that the RIGHTEOUSNESS of the LAW might be FULFILLED in US who WALK NOT AFTER the FLESH, but AFTER the SPIRIT.

You believe righteousness is yours by having a belief alone, but Romans 8:4 says that the righteousness of the law is fulfilled in us if we walk after the Spirit (and not after the flesh).

They that are in the flesh are carnal minded. They think of the things of this world and sin. 2 Corinthians 7:1 says we are to cleanse ourselves from all filthiness (sin) of the flesh and spirit perfecting holiness in the fear of God.

Romans 8:13 says if you live after the flesh, you will die, but if you through the Holy Spirit do put to death the deeds of the body (i.e. sin), you shall live.

"For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live." (Romans 8:13).

Halbhh said:

We all need to humbly listen to Christ our savior, all He said. No doctrines are good enough to replace His words. Be the listener, don't talk over Him as you listen and hear. He saves, not our doctrines.

John 1 NIV

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I agree. We have to listen to what God's Word says and we should not talk over what Christ and His followers said within the Scriptures (if that is what you meant).

May God bless you.