Divorce and remarriage

Jeremiah 3:8 ~ JPS Tanakh 1917 edition
And I saw, when, forasmuch as backsliding Israel had committed adultery, I had put her away and given her a bill of divorcement, that yet treacherous Judah her sister feared not; but she also went and played the harlot;
Jeremiah 3:8 ~ JPS Tanakh 1985 edition
I noted: Because Rebel Israel had committed adultery, I cast her off and handed her a bill of divorce; yet her sister, Faithless Judah, was not afraid-she too went and whored.

The Son of YHVH provided the Way for a Faithless wife to be cleansed and reunited (reestablishment of the Homeland of Israel in 1948). Thus, it's now possible for YHVHs bill of separation/divorce to be annulled.

N/C

r4.h said:

Once the Israelites had crossed the Jordan, and began to settle here in there miles apart in their own territories, it was impossible that Moses be in any position to punish divorce.

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Moses never entered the promised land. Those who sat in judgment were the judges (elders) and the levites. You had the central core of seventy judges (sanhedrin) but you also had outlying judges. You had levites in every city.

Divorce isn't something you did on the sly. It was either granted or it wasn't. A woman who had not been granted a divorce and cohabited with another man was considered to be committing adultery. A man who had not been granted a divorce but who cohabited with another woman was considered to have more than one wife.

Open Heart said:

Moses never entered the promised land. Those who sat in judgment were the judges (elders) and the levites. You had the central core of seventy judges (sanhedrin) but you also had outlying judges. You had levites in every city.

Divorce isn't something you did on the sly. It was either granted or it wasn't. A woman who had not been granted a divorce and cohabited with another man was considered to be committing adultery. A man who had not been granted a divorce but who cohabited with another woman was considered to have more than one wife.

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My mistake your right about Moses. However my point stands why Moses didnt give or forbid divorce, if you read Duet 24 1-4 carefully, you will see Moses was only warning of impending wrath of God should they turn the land into abomination before the Lord by remarrying woman they had accused of some uncleaness.

Please show me any specific verse on divorce being discussed as allowed. The examples of Gods use of the word in Jeremiah is not sufficent as it is only analogy.

r4.h said:

My mistake your right about Moses. However my point stands why Moses didnt give or forbid divorce, if you read Duet 24 1-4 carefully, you will see Moses was only warning of impending wrath of God should they turn the land into abomination before the Lord by remarrying woman they had accused of some uncleaness.

Please show me any specific verse on divorce being discussed as allowed. The examples of Gods use of the word in Jeremiah is not sufficent as it is only analogy.

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What do you mean Moses didn't give divorce? Moses allowed divorce if a bill of divorce (a "get") was given. This was a legal document, which meant it stood up when reviewed by Moses or a Jewish court (judges or Levites).

r4.h said:

My mistake your right about Moses. However my point stands why Moses didnt give or forbid divorce, if you read Duet 24 1-4 carefully, you will see Moses was only warning of impending wrath of God should they turn the land into abomination before the Lord by remarrying woman they had accused of some uncleaness.

Please show me any specific verse on divorce being discussed as allowed. The examples of Gods use of the word in Jeremiah is not sufficent as it is only analogy.

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Did you do as suggested and read the Mishnah in relation to divorce, adultery etc., etc.,?

Open Heart said:

What do you mean Moses didn't give divorce? Moses allowed divorce if a bill of divorce (a "get") was given. This was a legal document, which meant it stood up when reviewed by Moses or a Jewish court (judges or Levites).

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Sorry but it is not allowance, it is regulation that a husband who "rejects" his wife saying she has "something unclean" must show she has been divorced so she can remarry, but more than that it is regulation of that divorce that he cannot turn around later and have her as his wife.

The reason is that they "shall not cause the land to sin"

If it was allowance to divorce it would address that specifically. It starts off saying "when a man...."
It is citing a case scenario about when a man divorces, not that man can or should divorce.

That is why when Jesus asked the pharisee` MK 10:3 "What did Moses command you"? they did not use the word "command" but the word "permitted". They knew if they said "command" they would be lying.
Then Jesus tells them Moses allowed them this "precept" because they would not listen to reason. A precept is really guideline or rule. In this case it is clear i think, or else Jesus is doing away with a jot of the law. Where something is moral law, it
cannot be set aside in this life, but where it is temporary concession or shadow of the thing that has now come, it most certainly will be revoked/removed.

Divorce was concession for the hardness of heart of men under law, but now "A husband must not divorce his wife" and vice versa. 1 Cor 7:10+11 And the "whosoever divorces" will be the held accountable for the ensuing adultery if the
rejected one remarries, and (i suppose) guilty of the adultery of the one who marries the rejected one, as this too would not happen if divorce was not enacted.
MK 10:10-12 Lk 16:18

Jesus can heal every marriage no matter how abusive or broken.
Corrie ten Boom, lost her sister in Nazi death camp, and suffered horrendous abuse by her captors, yet she had to forgive or lose heaven. After the war, she was further challenged upon see her abuser in church, now born again and praising God. Tell her your spouse is too wicked to forgive or believe for salvation.

Separation is allowed and even absolutley required, but reconciliation/salvation is always the end goal.


Are we to think a hard heart can enter heaven ?

r4.h said:

The examples of Gods use of the word in Jeremiah is not sufficent as it is only analogy.

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Messiah Yeshua (Bridegroom) provided the Way for a Faithless wife (Israel) to be cleansed and reunited (reestablishment of the Homeland of Israel in 1948/49). Thus, YHVHs bill of separation/divorce (Jeremiah 3:8) is in the process of being annulled

r4.h said:

Sorry but it is not allowance, it is regulation that a husband who "rejects" his wife saying she has "something unclean" must show she has been divorced so she can remarry, but more than that it is regulation of that divorce that he cannot turn around later and have her as his wife.

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That IS allowance. It simply specifies the reasons for it.

r4.h said:

Jesus can heal every marriage no matter how abusive or broken.

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If you believe that, I have a bridge in Brooklyn to sell you. It takes two willing people to save a marriage. One person alone can't do it. So often, one abusive person is just fine with how the abusive marriage is and is completely unmotivated to change -- why should they change when they have things exactly the way they want them?

Open Heart said:

If you believe that, I have a bridge in Brooklyn to sell you. It takes two willing people to save a marriage. One person alone can't do it. So often, one abusive person is just fine with how the abusive marriage is and is completely unmotivated to change -- why should they change when they have things exactly the way they want them?

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It doesn't have to be abuse, it might be abandonment - one leaving the other, and not bothering to get a divorce, while they live with another person and raise a family, or one has been unfaithful and will not return to the marriage, or one has decided they are attracted to the same sex, and so leaves the marriage, or one commits bigamy etc etc. It is rarely a clean cut situation - all sorts of variations might be involved on either side.

But you are perfectly correct - both have to want to carry on.

AbbaLove said:

Thus, YHVHs bill of separation/divorce (Jeremiah 3:8) is in the process of being annulled

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HE never divorced Judah. He divorced the 10 northern tribes.

r4.h said:

Jesus can heal every marriage no matter how abusive or broken.

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"Can" being the operative word. But in order to do that it takes a lot of repentance and humility on both people.

Dave-W said:

"Can" being the operative word. But in order to do that it takes a lot of repentance and humility on both people.

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Yes and Jesus told has told us that we must forgive 70 x 7, which is to say no unforgiveness will enter into heaven. We cant stop a spouse from walking out, but whoever marries them is committing adultery.

Jesus was not discussing who can divorce, he was pointing out who God would hold accountable for the ensuing adultery, and therefore will not enter heaven.

Think about it ? Two Christians divorce, will Christ pick favorites or have separate places in heaven for them? Whoever cannot love their neighbor, let alone their spouse, shouldnt think God will somehow reconcile them in heaven. No we only have this life for that.

r4.h said:

Yes and Jesus told has told us that we must forgive 70 x 7, which is to say no unforgiveness will enter into heaven. We cant stop a spouse from walking out, but whoever marries them is committing adultery.

Jesus was not discussing who can divorce, he was pointing out who God would hold accountable for the ensuing adultery, and therefore will not enter heaven.

Think about it ? Two Christians divorce, will Christ pick favorites or have separate places in heaven for them? Whoever cannot love their neighbor, let alone their spouse, shouldnt think God will somehow reconcile them in heaven. No we only have this life for that.

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Both parties cannot sue for divorce - divorce is by one party only, against the other

Dave-W said:

HE never divorced Judah. He divorced the 10 northern tribes.

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Notwithstanding the law of divorce in Deut. 24:1-4, God shows mercy by calling upon Israel and Judah to return (cf. Hos. chs 2-3:14). Israel's experience of destruction, exile, and potential restoration to Zion or Jerusalem is a model for the experience of Judah. Tum back is a technical term meaning "to repent." In the Torah, it is first found in Deut. 4-10, and elsewhere in Deuteronomy. This thus represents one of the many connections between Jeremiah and Deuteronomy.
https://clb2rosta.files.wordpress.com/2015/04/youblisher-com-759762-jewish_study_bible.pdf

It would seem that repentance is key to the LORD annulling a separation/divorce.

Heber Book List said:

It doesn't have to be abuse, it might be abandonment - one leaving the other, and not bothering to get a divorce, while they live with another person and raise a family, or one has been unfaithful and will not return to the marriage, or one has decided they are attracted to the same sex, and so leaves the marriage, or one commits bigamy etc etc. It is rarely a clean cut situation - all sorts of variations might be involved on either side.

But you are perfectly correct - both have to want to carry on.

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I agree. There are all sorts of things that are evidence of a marriage being invalid.