On Biblical Christian Love

Andrew Jeremiah said:

This isn't controversial, not to Israel who have Covenant with God, but we as Christians grafted in need to learn and be taught of God not only HOW to love, but WHO to love. I post the following here even though it is not controversial to those Biblical Christians that know the truth, but are also obedient to the Lord in the Covenant love God has given them. So, I post here so as not to be seen as a trouble-maker.
There is sufficient Scriptural evidence that Christ does not love anyone but His Church, that He died for no one but His Church. Even as High Priest the time to pray for God's enemies (the world) would be right before as the sacrifice for sin is in preparation - the Lamb of God. But Christ, the High Priest, DOESN'T pray for the world, He even mentions that He doesn't - and this should be significant.
Jn. 17:9.

Ephesians 5:25 (KJV)
25 Husbands, love your wives, even as Christ also loved the church, and gave himself for it;

Christ is Betrothed to His Bride. The Bride is Israel and Church - as one.

What is it called if a husband loves another woman the same as His Marital Bride?

It's called Adultery.

Christ has only ONE LOVE: His Bride. He died FOR HER - He did not die for the world - the world is an enemy of His Father (1 Jn. 2:15).
So, when you, Christian, give Covenant love to unbelievers then you, too, are committing adultery for Christ has commanded that Covenant love be given to Covenant brethren ONLY

Discuss: As Covenant brethren are we commanded to give Covenant love to brethren ONLY?

The Command:

Leviticus 19:17-18 (KJV)
17 Thou shalt not hate thy brother in thine heart: thou shalt in any wise rebuke thy neighbour, and not suffer sin upon him.
18 Thou shalt not avenge, nor bear any grudge against the children of thy people, but thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself: I am the LORD.

This command was given by God to Covenant Israel while placed in encampments by God around the Tabernacle. Identifying brother, neighbor, and children of thy people shouldn't be hard. Applying it in obedience to today's brethren might be. Are you faithful to brethren, or do you love someone ELSE also with brethren- God's enemies, my enemies, Christ's enemies, the Church's enemies and Israel's enemies?

I know the truth and the truth has set me free.

Oh, one more thing...what do we give unbelievers?

RE-spect. That's all. But not love. We are not unfaithful to Christ nor to brethren,
Right?

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I'm not sure you understand what Biblical Love is from this post.

First, covenant Love was extended by God to all men...that is how we are saved...faithfulness is another matter. Maybe you just used a wrong word when talking about marital Love...not really sure from this if it is a word choice error or a misunderstanding.

As to loving everyone else, even an enemy, yes we as believers are called to Love with agape Love even our enemies. But agape Love is not the worldly idea of Love and that might be where the problem is.

Some 'unbelievers' have either no knowledge at all of the Good News, or a very incomplete version, or very often a mistaken version of the gospel or of Christ and what He said. I've found many that have heard ideas that contradict the scriptures in the 4 gospels and think they have heard of Christ, when what they have isn't the true story.

So, unlike unbelievers that do have an accurate and complete version of the Good News, those with a wrong or incomplete version are not in the same situation. They simply lack the Good News. They are among the unreached, even many millions inside predominantly Christian nations like the U.S. It can be hard to reach them unless you are aware of the mistaken notions about Christ that have been widespread, so that you can give the accurate account to help them know.

But to fully read through a couple of more of the 4 gospels yourself is a part of listening and following Christ. So, we need it not only for those we meet, but also for ourselves. From experience I know I need to read through a gospel every year, or 2 at the most.

Andrew Jeremiah said:

There is sufficient Scriptural evidence that Christ does not love anyone but His Church

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Jesus tells us to love our enemies. And Jesus in us is the One who lives to have us loving the way He wants >

"'I have been crucified with Christ; it is no longer I who live, but Christ lives in me; and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me and gave Himself for me.'" (Galatians 2:20)

So, Jesus in us lives to love any and all people, in sharing with us

Andrew Jeremiah said:

This isn't controversial, not to Israel who have Covenant with God, but we as Christians grafted in need to learn and be taught of God not only HOW to love, but WHO to love. I post the following here even though it is not controversial to those Biblical Christians that know the truth, but are also obedient to the Lord in the Covenant love God has given them. So, I post here so as not to be seen as a trouble-maker.
There is sufficient Scriptural evidence that Christ does not love anyone but His Church, that He died for no one but His Church. Even as High Priest the time to pray for God's enemies (the world) would be right before as the sacrifice for sin is in preparation - the Lamb of God. But Christ, the High Priest, DOESN'T pray for the world, He even mentions that He doesn't - and this should be significant.
Jn. 17:9.

Ephesians 5:25 (KJV)
25 Husbands, love your wives, even as Christ also loved the church, and gave himself for it;

Christ is Betrothed to His Bride. The Bride is Israel and Church - as one.

What is it called if a husband loves another woman the same as His Marital Bride?

It's called Adultery.

Christ has only ONE LOVE: His Bride. He died FOR HER - He did not die for the world - the world is an enemy of His Father (1 Jn. 2:15).
So, when you, Christian, give Covenant love to unbelievers then you, too, are committing adultery for Christ has commanded that Covenant love be given to Covenant brethren ONLY

Discuss: As Covenant brethren are we commanded to give Covenant love to brethren ONLY?

The Command:

Leviticus 19:17-18 (KJV)
17 Thou shalt not hate thy brother in thine heart: thou shalt in any wise rebuke thy neighbour, and not suffer sin upon him.
18 Thou shalt not avenge, nor bear any grudge against the children of thy people, but thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself: I am the LORD.

This command was given by God to Covenant Israel while placed in encampments by God around the Tabernacle. Identifying brother, neighbor, and children of thy people shouldn't be hard. Applying it in obedience to today's brethren might be. Are you faithful to brethren, or do you love someone ELSE also with brethren- God's enemies, my enemies, Christ's enemies, the Church's enemies and Israel's enemies?

I know the truth and the truth has set me free.

Oh, one more thing...what do we give unbelievers?

RE-spect. That's all. But not love. We are not unfaithful to Christ nor to brethren,
Right?

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God is love. We are called to love as HE loved us while we were yet sinners.

A new commandment I give you: Love one another. As I have loved you, so also you must love one another.

But I tell you, love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you,

The goal of our instruction is the love that comes from a pure heart, a clear conscience, and a sincere faith.

There is "one God and Father of all, who is over all and through all and in all." (Whether we can 'see' it or not...)
All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.



Whoever does not love does not know God, because God is love.

Andrew Jeremiah said:

In all those things God and His Christ are speaking/writing to BELIEVERS in Covenant. And brethren in Covenant do have enemies, and it takes exceptional significance especially when you look in Israel's history. There was a Northern Kingdom and a Southern Kingdom - Twelve Tribes represented and THEIR Messiah is instructing His People - God's Chosen People to love their brethren who have become their enemy because God is a God of restoration. And the healing of these two enemy kingdoms is first thing Israel's Messiah attempts to do.
And He will succeed.

The Law, the Psalms, and the Prophets were written to the children of Israel, right? This is THEIR Bible we as Christians study. And the New Testament is also written to Covenant Israel represented in twelve tribes SCATTERED THROUGHOUT the then-known Roman world (Mesopotamia, North Africa, Asia Minor, the Orient,) all these places had Jews. Some from the twelve tribes left Israel during their Diaspora and some did not come back. Or when Babylon and the Assyrians took them ALL back to their country and many stayed - Daniel prophesied from here, and he stayed when the Persian king let them all back to their homeland. So, when Jesus sent His twelve and later, eleven apostles to take the gospel - the gospel was only three words. That's all. The Good News of Jesus Christ to His people is ONLY three words: A Promise Kept.

The children of Israel scattered all over received the message that their Messiah had come and gone. God has KEPT HIS PROMISE (Deut. 18:15).
That's the gospel. So, God doesn't change. The command is for brethren to love brethren - even if enemies, He isn't commanding us to love God the Father's enemy - the world.
That would be treason to the King.

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God's word, laws and commands cannot fail. What fails? Man's perception of those words...depending on ones perception, or where someone is seeing from (as in the question in the garden, "Where art thou?" ...as different as flesh is from spirit. The letter of the law kills...the spirit brings LIFE, abundantly.

To love others as your self leads us to the forsaking of our own soul, because it is not about the ability of others to continually accomplish such an impossible feat (with man impossible, with God all things are possible), it is the death of self that it leads one to this love. In Christ there is neither Jew nor Greek, slave nor free, male nor female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus. God is love and the preaching of His kingdom...which is within/inward truth which is HE fills all in all (whether we can 'see' it or not...perception)...

Galatians 5:14 For all the law is fulfilled in one word, even in this; Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. Jesus narrowed the law down to love...Living the life of love (spirit, endless, not seeking its own), to all...which is the spirit of the law from the beginning. To have the law of our mother without the command of our father brings confusion of face...perceiving the spirit of Christ as something outside our very being/separate...brings a measuring and dividing of 'self' and others, until it narrows down to the truth there has only ever been One from the beginning.



Speaking in the confines of soul ... those who are forgiven little love little; (though the one's who love much have not been forgiven any more-so) than the ones who love little. (Which is a conclusion according to the measure they have perceived they have been forgiven)...God's people do not perish for the lack of love but a lack of the knowledge of God/Love. God is love...One who loves much has no (perception of) lack...for God fills all in all.

God is reconciling the world unto Himself...which has everything to do with love...HE loves all, impartially. We can enter into HIS love as far as we are willing to go...

Jesus declared, Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind. This is the first and greatest commandment. And the second is like it: 'Love your neighbor as yourself. All the Law and the Prophets depend on these two commandments.


I have found that keeping the first of these, the second comes without thought or effort...being written upon the heart (innermost truth) by the same spirit that raised Jesus from the grave.

If you only love those who love you, what have you done? God is love and and His spirit alive within brings a living the life of love (spirit, endless, not seeking its own), to all.

Romans 8:4 so that the requirement of the Law might be fulfilled in us, who do not walk according to the flesh but according to the Spirit. 5 For those who are according to the flesh set their minds on the things of the flesh, but those who are according to the Spirit, the things of the Spirit. 6 For the mind set on the flesh is death, but the mind set on the Spirit is life and peace, 7 because the mind set on the flesh is hostile toward God; for it does not subject itself to the law of God, for it is not even able to do so, 8 and those who are in the flesh cannot please God.

God and Love are one and the same truth...God being an absolute that cannot be measured or confined, being infinite...For me, God's love is for all, impartially, is never in question.

Love is not a command in the form of the law found in the wilderness. Jesus broke the law to keep it, which has everything to do with where it comes forth from...Which is greater? To love your friends or to love your enemies?

Andrew Jeremiah said:

Did you read the instruction and command in Scripture, Leviticus specifically.
Brethren means someone of the same tribe.
Neighbor means someone of one of the other eleven tribes.
Children of thy people means anyone of all the twelve tribes.

There's no mention for Israel to love the non-Covenant. God does not change. He either loves or He hates.

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here in is your problem...Love (Biblical, agape Love) and hate are NOT opposites as you presume. Not to mention scripture tells us to Love our enemies. As to the Leviticus passage, some of their neighbors were enemies...[/quote] And He loves His people but He hates those not His people. When you read and study God's Word read it its correct context.[/quote] I got no problem with context, I think it is vital to rightly dividing the word and I wish more people would use it, but you missed two important things, 1. who their enemies were and how that is consistent with NT teaching to Love our enemies and 2. as I previously suggested, you don't really understand what Biblical, agape Love is for the opposite of Love IS NOT hate but pride.

The Scripture - the Word of God - is written by God and sent/given TO and FOR God's Covenant people ONLY.
When you make distinction then hopefully things will come in focus and your instruction and command be more distinct. Like God.

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The believing Gentile's were grafted in, making the word for them as well....

Andrew Jeremiah said:

...What is it called if a husband loves another woman the same as His Marital Bride?

It's called Adultery....

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No. having or wanting sex with neighbor’s wife is adultery. Love is not adultery.

Try for a sec to forget about "biblical principles" and listen to Jesus:
Matthew 5:43-48 New International Version (NIV)
Love for Enemies
43 “You have heard that it was said, ‘Love your neighbor and hate your enemy.’ 44 But I tell you, love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you, 45 that you may be children of your Father in heaven. He causes his sun to rise on the evil and the good, and sends rain on the righteous and the unrighteous. 46 If you love those who love you, what reward will you get? Are not even the tax collectors doing that? 47 And if you greet only your own people, what are you doing more than others? Do not even pagans do that? 48 Be perfect, therefore, as your heavenly Father is perfect.

So does this mean that we should only love enemies who are Christians? Or should we assume enemies are likely non-Christians?

Andrew Jeremiah said:

And He loves His people but He hates those not His people. When you read and study God's Word read it its correct context.

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I got no problem with context, I think it is vital to rightly dividing the word and I wish more people would use it, but you missed two important things, 1. who their enemies were and how that is consistent with NT teaching to Love our enemies and 2. as I previously suggested, you don't really understand what Biblical, agape Love is for the opposite of Love IS NOT hate but pride. The believing Gentile's were grafted in, making the word for them as well....[/QUOTE]
here in is your problem...Love (Biblical, agape Love) and hate are NOT opposites as you presume. Not to mention scripture tells us to Love our enemies. As to the Leviticus passage, some of their neighbors were enemies...[/quote] And He loves His people but He hates those not His people. When you read and study God's Word read it its correct context.[/quote] I got no problem with context, I think it is vital to rightly dividing the word and I wish more people would use it, but you missed two important things, 1. who their enemies were and how that is consistent with NT teaching to Love our enemies and 2. as I previously suggested, you don't really understand what Biblical, agape Love is for the opposite of Love IS NOT hate but pride.

The believing Gentile's were grafted in, making the word for them as well....

I never presumed that love and hate are opposites. Love and indifference are.[/quote] no, Love and pride are opposites...Love according to scripture is putting another above ourselves in an act of humility...pride is putting ourselves above others.

Yes, some of Israel's eemies that Christ commanded to love were brethren. Ten Tribes to the North (Northern Kingdom), and two tribes to the south (Southern Kingdom), Israel and Judah, respectively. Enemies to their last dying breath. And here comes some Rabbi telling them to love their enemy - Israel. At least you have both groups - Israel and Church to love their enemy and sadly that is Israel and Church. And sometimes the way I read and hear so-called Christians "speak" you'd think Israel was the Church's enemy today - according to the heresy of Replacement Theology - they are. But are they really the Church (called-out [ones]), and are they really called-out [ones]? Or are they self-invited? You know the crowd....millions in this crowd....millions who have become an erroneous majority in our fellowships...the "I-had-the-faith-to-believe-and-so-I-said-the-sinner's-prayer-and-accepted-Jesus-into-my-heart" error in doctrine step-of-faithless-ness. But that's another post.

The Gentiles weren't grafted in...

The Church is (but not yet - Christ is still building). And the Church of God's Elect is still in TIME a separate entity from Israel. And vice-versa. But we'll be in the same fruit-cake basket with Israel when we go through the Time of Jacob's Trouble with Israel - psst. funny name. we call it the Tribulation. Ooooo...but don't worry. I hear it's only going to be seven years this TIME.

So, if you get who were Israel's neighbors were when Brother Mo instructed and commanded the children of Israel to love only their brethren in Leviticus 19:17-18 then you'll be fine. And to be consistent and faithful to the Command in the Old Testament you MUST have the same command to love brethren-in-Christ ONLY in the New Testament. And we do. Christ didn't change the Law. Admit that. NOTHING supersedes God's Word. Not even His Own Commands. Not even His Name. The Command in Matthew 5 is completely consistent with the original Command in Leviticus 19, Completely consistent with the Word given Moses on the Mount.

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I really can't follow your point through most of this...I'm sure it is me and learning the wordage you are using but I want to be upfront about the difficulties I am having so that if I misunderstand something you know that it is not on purpose. That being said three things....the Gentiles being grafted in was always the plan from the standpoint of scripture and if you need me to I will present the scripture (since I am not sure what you are saying I don't want to be cumbersome by providing passages we already agree on) 2. the command to Love our enemies is not only a command in the OT but in the NT and extends to all enemies but the icing on the cake is God's example of the Love He calls us to in that while we were still enemies, Christ died for us. 3. Christ fulfilled the Law He did not do away with it. But that Law and the prophets are summed up by the Law of Love so understanding Love gives us a better understanding of the law and what it is trying to tell us. As such, scripture is the only place we can go to gain knowledge of this Love as the HS witnesses to us through that word.

Andrew Jeremiah said:

So, if you get who were Israel's neighbors were when Brother Mo instructed and commanded the children of Israel to love only their brethren in Leviticus 19:17-18 then you'll be fine. And to be consistent and faithful to the Command in the Old Testament you MUST have the same command to love brethren-in-Christ ONLY in the New Testament. And we do. Christ didn't change the Law. Admit that. NOTHING supersedes God's Word. Not even His Own Commands. Not even His Name. The Command in Matthew 5 is completely consistent with the original Command in Leviticus 19, Completely consistent with the Word given Moses on the Mount.

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The whole book is the narrative of our soul's journey coming to know God as fully as we have always been known...with faith that works by love...Galatians 5:6... These verses below speak the same truth Jesus preached...love your neighbour as yourself...even the stranger/foreigner were/are to be loved with equal measure as "the native among you..."

Leviticus 19:33 When a stranger resides with you in your land, you shall not do him wrong. 34 The stranger who resides with you shall be to you as the native among you, and you shall love him as yourself, for you were aliens in the land of Egypt; I am the LORD your God.


Matthew 5:43 You have heard that it was said, ‘Love your neighbor and hate your enemy. 44 But I tell you, love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you, 45 that you may be sons of your Father in heaven. He causes His sun to rise on the evil and the good, and sends rain on the righteous and the unrighteous. 46 If you love those who love you, what reward will you get? Do not even tax collectors do the same? 47 And if you greet only your brothers, what are you doing more than others? Do not even Gentiles do the same? 48 Be perfect, therefore, as your Heavenly Father is perfect.

...as you did it to one of the least of these my brothers, you did it to me.

Andrew Jeremiah said:

So Jesus is commanding us to love the Father's enemies?

Did you read and understand Lev. 19:17-18?

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Jesus Himself has said > "'You have heard that it was said, 'You shall love your neighbor and hate your enemy.' But I say to you, love your enemies, bless those who curse you, do good to those who hate you, and pray for those who spitefully use you and persecute you,'" (Matthew 5:43) And what Jesus says does not contradict the earlier scriptures, as >

You yourself have said:

We do not live by anything BUT every word that proceeds out the mouth of God (and that presently is the Old Testament and the New Testament which doesn't contradict each other.

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So, the way Jesus means this, yes Jesus means for us to love our enemy. And God's enemy is our enemy; so loving our enemies includes loving God's enemies, since His enemies are our enemies.

And, by the way, God loves enemies by giving them food and rain, among other things.

And Jesus on the cross loved Saul while he was an enemy; but then Jesus saved Saul to become known as our Apostle Paul. Paul says that while he was God's enemy, Jesus "loved" Paul and "gave Himself for" Paul >

"'I have been crucified with Christ; it is no longer I who live, but Christ lives in me; and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me and gave Himself for me.'" (Galatians 2:20)

So, yes Jesus loved Paul and gave Himself for him . . . while Paul was an enemy of God.

And our Father, as Jesus Himself does say, "so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life." (in John 3:16)

Now, of course, where God is loving "the world", this is not the same as how He loves His own Son Jesus. So, you are welcome to explain what you mean when you say "God does not love enemies." Because God in the meaning of Jesus does love enemies. What you mean could be something else.

Ones understand that when it says God hates evil people, this means He is opposed to how they are > He detests how they are. But, even though He hates them, with this meaning, God loves wrong people . . . meaning He cares about people who are wrong. And He saves people who have been His "enemies" >

"For if when we were enemies we were reconciled to God through the death of His Son, much more, having been reconciled, we shall be saved by His life." (Romans 5:10)

So, even though God hates enemies, meaning how He is displeased with them, still God loves them, meaning He cares about them and desires what is good for them, as God through Ezekiel makes Himself very clear >

"I have no pleasure in the death of the wicked, but that the wicked turn from his way and live."

This is in Ezekiel 33:11.

So, yes there are different meanings for a same word.

Also, there are people who are hostile to loving and forgiving evil people; so they will understand God's word in their way which is hostile to how He loves enemies.

But Jesus even prayed forgiveness to evil people, right while they were still hating and torturing and murdering Jesus >

"Father, forgive them, for they do not know what they do." (in Luke 23:34)

Jesus loved enemies, by praying our Father's forgiveness to them. So, the glory is to You, God our Father; please honor Your Son, by changing us to be more and more loving like Jesus in us has us becoming, more and more.

"And walk in love, as Christ also has loved us and given Himself for us, an offering and a sacrifice to God for a sweet-smelling aroma." (Ephesians 5:2)

So, Jesus even was sweet about so loving us and giving Himself for us > "when we were enemies", our Apostle Paul does say in Romans 5:10. So, may we be sweet and kind and caring toward those who are hostile to this. God bless you

It means the way Jesus means for us to love enemies.