Scriptural Verification of the Pre-trib Rapture of the Church

Douggg · Jan 13, 2018

Davy said:
Furthermore, "the day of the Lord" is about a culmination of events that actually END this present world all on the LAST DAY. It is NOT about the latter half of Daniel's symbolic "one week" (i.e., tribulation time).

The destruction of this present heaven and earth is part of the Day of the Lord - but not all of the Day of the Lord.

In 1Thessalonians5, the world will be saying peace and safety, when sudden destruction shall come upon them, as associated with the day of the Lord.

2 For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night.
3 For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not escape.

.....so we know that the Day of the Lord is not just limited to at the end of the thousand years the destruction of this current heaven and earth.

We also know that the Day of the Lord cannot begin after the great tribulation begins... because the world cannot be in tribulation, but in
an illusion of peace and safety.

The Day of the Lord is triggered when unexpectedly the Antichrist, the person in whom the Jews will have pinned their thinking that the are living in the messianic age of peace and safety, without warning or expectation, goes into the temple sits and claims to be God.

Douggg · Jan 13, 2018

Jason0047 said:
The Marriage Supper of the Lamb is not a feast in heaven. It is the battle of Armageddon where Christ destroys those nations that come up against Him; And the Eagles are believers. Granted, we will not literally eat flesh of kings, captains, etc. It is metaphorical.

That's a good point. But I think the marriage supper of the Lamb is in heaven. The marriage for certain takes place in heaven. A person could say the marriage supper is the 1000 years reign with Jesus.

What takes place in heaven is followed by "the supper of the great God" (in Revelation 19:17). Which it will be a literal feast to the birds and beasts.

I would suggest taking a look at Ezekiel 39:17-20.... Gog/Magog - then the 7 years - then Armageddon.

This part is the Armageddon feast....

17 And, thou son of man, thus saith the Lord GOD; Speak unto every feathered fowl, and to every beast of the field, Assemble yourselves, and come; gather yourselves on every side to my sacrifice that I do sacrifice for you, even a great sacrifice upon the mountains of Israel, that ye may eat flesh, and drink blood.

18 Ye shall eat the flesh of the mighty, and drink the blood of the princes of the earth, of rams, of lambs, and of goats, of bullocks, all of them fatlings of Bashan.

19 And ye shall eat fat till ye be full, and drink blood till ye be drunken, of my sacrifice which I have sacrificed for you.

20 Thus ye shall be filled at my table with horses and chariots, with mighty men, and with all men of war, saith the Lord GOD.

pshun2404 · Jan 13, 2018

Quasar92 said:
The Scriptures are crystal clear where Jesus will meet His Church, in 1 Thess.4:17: "After that, we who are still alive and are left, WILL BE CAUGHT UP TOGETHER with them in the clouds TO MEET THE LORD IN THE AIR. And so we will be with the Lord forever." In the FIRST of His TWO comings, recorded in 1 Thess.4:16, yet to take place, confirming Jn.14:2-3, 28! From where the Church is seen in heaven BEFORE the tribulation begins, in Rev.4:1-2. Where Jesus used John to symbolically represent the Church. Confirming 2 Thess.2:3 and 7-8! Where the Church is seen in heaven later, at the marriage of the Bride/Church to the Lamb/Jesus. While the tribulation is taking place on earth, recorded in Rev.19:7-8. From where Jesus will return to the earth in the SECOND, of His TWO comings, yet to take place, WITH HIS CHURCH, riding white horses, dressed in fine linen, white and clean, in His armies from heaven, recorded in 19:14, confirming Zech.14:4-5 and Acts 1:6; 1:11; 2:29-30 and 15:16! From which the above Scriptures leave no other options!

The difference between the pre-trib rapture of the Church, as delineated above, and the SECOND coming of Jesus are the following facts:

1. Jesus returns to the earth in His second coming, recorded in Zech.14:4-5 and in Acts 1:11.

2. No one meets Jesus in the sky when He returns in His second coming, recorded in Rev.19:14, as they will when He returns for the first time, recorded in 1 Thess.4:16!.

3. Jesus will return from the marriage of the Bride/Church to the Lamb/Jesus, in heaven, in His second coming, to the earth, with His Church, recorded in Rev.19:14, He came for in His first coming, in the clouds of the sky, seven years before, recorded in Jn.14:2-3, 28, 1 Thess.4:16-17 and 2 Thess.2:3 and 7-8.

4. No one returns to the present heaven at Jesus second coming to the earth, because He has come to establish His 1,000 year reign on the throne of David, in the restored kingdom of Israel, as recorded in Acts 1:6; 2:29-30; 15:16; Zech.6:12-13 described in Ez.40-47 and Rev.20:6. In addition to the present heaven and earth being destroyed and will pass away, as recorded in 2 Pet.3:7 and in Rev.21:1.

Quasar92

please google and read "The Parousia" which means "coming" and refers to the 2nd coming.

"For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord (which we find in Matthew 24), that we which are alive and remain unto the coming (the parousia) of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.

16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout (this is at the COMING), with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:

17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord."

Bible Highlighter · Jan 13, 2018

Douggg said:
That's a good point. But I think the marriage supper of the Lamb is in heaven. The marriage for certain takes place in heaven. A person could say the marriage supper is the 1000 years reign with Jesus.

What takes place in heaven is followed by "the supper of the great God" (in Revelation 19:17). Which it will be a literal feast to the birds and beasts.

I would suggest taking a look at Ezekiel 39:17-20.... Gog/Magog - then the 7 years - then Armageddon.

This part is the Armageddon feast....

17 And, thou son of man, thus saith the Lord GOD; Speak unto every feathered fowl, and to every beast of the field, Assemble yourselves, and come; gather yourselves on every side to my sacrifice that I do sacrifice for you, even a great sacrifice upon the mountains of Israel, that ye may eat flesh, and drink blood.

18 Ye shall eat the flesh of the mighty, and drink the blood of the princes of the earth, of rams, of lambs, and of goats, of bullocks, all of them fatlings of Bashan.

19 And ye shall eat fat till ye be full, and drink blood till ye be drunken, of my sacrifice which I have sacrificed for you.

20 Thus ye shall be filled at my table with horses and chariots, with mighty men, and with all men of war, saith the Lord GOD.

No. I don't believe that is true. First, Revelation speaks in imagery so as to conceal things. Second, there is no indication there is a Heavenly supper taking place in Revelation. Verse 17 follows verse 9 and there is no mention of this Heavenly feast you speak of in-between these verses or anywhere else in Revelation. Three, Scripture says that Jesus opens the door for the call of the wedding and then after the wedding, Jesus calls more believers for the wedding feast. Four, Scriptures says in...

• Luke 17:34-37

"I tell you, in that night there shall be two men in one bed; the one shall be taken, and the other shall be left. Two women shall be grinding together; the one shall be taken, and the other left. Two men shall be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left."

And they answered and said unto him,

"Where, Lord?"

And he said unto them,

"Wheresoever the body is, thither will the eagles be gathered together."

The eagles are believers. "But they that wait upon the LORD shall renew their strength; they shall mount up with wings as eagles;" (Isaiah 40:31).

Five, we know according to OT Scripture that eating the flesh of kings and captains merely means to conquer one's enemies. It is the code key so as to interpret the imagery in Revelation. For the Bible is not just an account of literal events and things that are true but it also uses many metaphors to convey truth, as well.

Quasar92 · Jan 13, 2018

Davy said:
I have no need to read some treatise by man on a false doctrine. God's Word as written is good enough.

2 Thess.2 is not difficult at all, because Paul was exact with the timing he was speaking about, i.e., the coming Antichrist ("man of sin") MUST come FIRST... prior to our Lord Jesus' coming to gather His Church. That means the tribulation must occur FIRST before our gathering by Jesus.

Now you can either listen to Apostle Paul's warning there, or you can listen to men's doctrines. But you might want to think hard about heeding men's traditions, because our Lord Jesus warned us about that.

The OP and seventh post beyond the OP, on page one of this thread refute you. The seventh post of this thread contain the teachings of Jesus, Matthew, Luke, John and Paul, about the coming pre-trib rapture of the Church, you dogmatically call a "treatise." Where did you obtain your qualifications to teach eschatology? Either prove your claims the Scriptural facts posted on the OP or the seventh post on this thread are false by Scriptures, or your views are those that are false.

Quasar92

Quasar92 · Jan 13, 2018

Jason0047 said:
I believe in the Pre-Trib Rapture but I do not believe Matthew 24:31 speaks about the Pre-Trib Rapture.
I believe it is talking about a 2nd Rapture that takes place shortly before Christ's 2nd Coming.

The Lord Gathers His Elect For the Upcoming Battle:
(The Call to the Marriage Supper of the Lamb):
(The 2nd Rapture or Translation of the Saints):
(And The End of the Surviving Tribulation Saint's 1,335 Day of Testing):

• Luke 12:36

And ye yourselves like unto men that wait for their lord, when he will return from the wedding; that when he cometh and knocketh, they may open unto him immediately.

Daniel 12:12 ISV and Daniel 12:12 NIV

Blessed is the one who perseveres...and reaches the end of the 1,335 days.

• Revelation 14:16

And he that sat on the cloud thrust in his sickle on the earth; and the earth was reaped.

• Matthew 24:31

And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

• Mark 13:27

And then shall he send his angels, and shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from the uttermost part of the earth to the uttermost part of heaven.

• Luke 17:34-37

"I tell you, in that night there shall be two men in one bed; the one shall be taken, and the other shall be left. Two women shall be grinding together; the one shall be taken, and the other left. Two men shall be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left."

And they answered and said unto him,

"Where, Lord?"

And he said unto them,

"Wheresoever the body is, thither will the eagles be gathered together."

• Matthew 24:28

For wheresoever the carcase is, there will the eagles be gathered together.

• Revelation 19:17-18 and Revelation 19:14

And I saw an angel standing in the sun; and he cried with a loud voice, saying

"To all the fowls that fly in the midst of heaven, Come and gather yourselves together unto the supper of the great God; That ye may eat the flesh of kings, and the flesh of captains, and the flesh of mighty men, and the flesh of horses, and of them that sit on them, and the flesh of all men, both free and bond, both small and great."

And the armies which were in heaven followed him upon white horses, clothed in fine linen, white and clean.

• Jude 1:14

Behold, the Lord cometh with ten thousands of his saints,

• Isaiah 31:4 NLT

The LORD of Heaven’s Armies will come down

• Isaiah 26:21b NLT

The earth will no longer hide those who have been killed. They will be brought out for all to see.

How did the elect get into heaven, the angels will gather from one end of heaven to the other? No one from the OT ever went to heaven until after Jesus shed His blood and died on a cross. [Enoch and Elijah are the only exceptions] Jesus parable in Lk.16:19-31 is a perfect profile of OT Sheol, where both the wicked as well as the righteous saints went during OT times.

Mt.24:31 "And he will send out his angels with a loud trumpet call, and they will gather his elect from the four winds [Israel], from one end of heaven to the other." [Church]. Mt.24:30-31 are about the second coming of Jesus, to the earth, WITH His Church. who will get into heaven as recorded in 2 Cor.5:6-8; Jn.14:2-3, 28; 1 Thess.4:16-17; 2 Thes.2:3 and 7-8; returning with Him in Zech.14:4; Jude 14 and Rev.19:14. [Parenthesis mine]

Jesus mission in His first advent was exclusively to Israel, He made abundantly clear in Mt.15:24 and in Mt.10:5-6. The Church did not exist then, because the Holy Spirit had not yet arrived, accordeing to Jn.7:39, until at Pentecost, ten days after Jesus ascended into heaven, according to Acts 1:9 and 2:1-3.

Quasar92

Quasar92 · Jan 13, 2018

Douggg said:
Q, you will have inquiry about my appointment to teach eschatology with Jesus.

Ephesians4:
10 He that descended is the same also that ascended up far above all heavens, that he might fill all things.)

11 And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers;

12 For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ:

There are those of us who have earned our qualifications to teach the Bible as well as eschatology. Who are not in the need of being taught views of lay Christians who dogmatically hold to non-Scriptural views, or misinterpret the meaning of the Scriptures they quote. Those are our differences.

Quasar92

Davy · Jan 13, 2018

Douggg said:
At the core, the only real problem is Q's conclusion - that the rapture MUST happen pre-trib (pre-70th week). The problem is with the "MUST". And being adamant about it.

To say that the rapture CAN'T happen pre-trib (pre-70th week) is just as bad as saying it MUST happen pre-trib (pre-70th week).

The main idea is to be anticipating the rapture - because it may happen at anytime between now - and when it actually takes place.

The "any moment" concept doesn't work either. Reason is because our Lord Jesus gave us specific signs to occur for the end before His coming and gathering of the Church, like God's two witnesses showing up in Jerusalem to prophesy for 1260 days, and the coming of the Antichrist.

When our Lord Jesus warned us that He comes "as a thief", and commanded us to be watching like the goodman of the house, that idea is about staying spiritually "a chaste virgin" waiting for His coming, because the pseudo-Christ is to come first and play the "another Jesus". Like Jesus showed in Matt.24:23-26, that coming false one will work great signs and wonders that if possible, even deceive Christ's own very elect. That means that false one is going to 'play' our Lord Jesus Christ in Jerusalem. Deceived pastors will be leading whole Churches to that false one thinking he is our Lord Jesus.

That is why... watching the signs of the end Jesus gave us was commanded, and why knowing the events to occur up to His return, is so important. He doesn't want us to be deceived.

Choose Wisely · Jan 13, 2018

Davy said:
So there it is. The 1 Thess.4 gathering aligns perfectly with the gathering Jesus taught in His Olivet Discourse. And the order of His 2nd coming in His Olivet Discourse was the very final sign or event He gave there to occur. Further Scripture proof is given in Revelation 16:15 where He is still warning His Church on earth on the 6th Vial, saying that He comes "as a thief", which links with the timing Paul taught for the "day of the Lord" in 1 Thess.5, and Peter in 2 Peter 3:10 about God's consuming fire burning man's works off this earth on the last day of this world.

All this Biblically proves the Pre-trib Rapture theory to be false.

So there it is. The 1 Thes 4 gathering aligns perfectly with the pretribulation rapture. The 1 Cor 15 aligns perfectly with the gathering Jesus taught in His Olivet Discourse. Further scriptural proof is given in Revelation 16:15 where He is still warning the 12 tribes, which we see in Rev 14, that he comes as a thief.

All this Biblically proves the pretribulation rapture, 1thes 4 and a prewrath rapture for the 12 tribes just like the scripture says when they are regrafted.

We can further prove this by the feasts.....Passover - The dead in Christ rise, Pentecost - The pretribulation rapture at the trump of God and The Feast of Trumpts where the 12 tribes are raptured at the last trump.
Get ready for the coming pretribulation rapture.

Quasar92 · Jan 13, 2018

Douggg said:
Building the Roman Coliseum - that is why Titus (according to your understanding) was ranked in importance to be in the same verse with Jesus? Really Q? .....it's not referring to Titus, Q.

That the person, who confirms the covenant with many in verse 27, will be from the people who destroyed the temple and city in verse 26 - corresponds to that person emerging from the Kingdom of the ten kings, in Daniel 7 and Daniel 2 - i.e. the fourth kingdom, the Roman Empire.

The construct of that kingdom in the end times is the EU - the elephant in the room, Q. In the latter time of the EU, the kingdom of the transgressors in Daniel 8:23, the stern faced king will "stand up".

Your assumptive attempt to put words in my mouth, won't fly! History clearly reveals who the prince was of the people who destroyed Jerusalem and the temple in 70 A.D. It was the Roman army under general Titus! Not the "he" of verse 27, who is the Antichrist. That Titus later became the Roman Emperor, is sufficient reason for his being referred to as a prince, in the Bible. Whether you accept those historic fulfillment's of history or not!

Quasar92

Davy · Jan 13, 2018

Jason0047 said:
The Marriage Supper of the Lamb is not a feast in heaven. It is the battle of Armageddon where Christ destroys those nations that come up against Him; And the Eagles are believers. Granted, we will not literally eat flesh of kings, captains, etc. It is metaphorical.

The marriage supper of The Lamb actually does include a feast, on earth, in Jerusalem in Christ's Kingdom after His return. That is what the Rev.19:1-9 verses are showing.

Choose Wisely · Jan 13, 2018

BABerean2 said:
All of the above falls apart once a person comes to understand that the New Covenant promised to Israel and Judah in Jeremiah 31:31-34 is found fulfilled by Christ during the first century in Hebrews 8:6-13, and is specifically applied to the Church in Hebrews 12:22-24, and 2 Corinthians 3:6-8.

.

I'm not quite sure why you keep saying this. Israel is blinded. Once they see the church raptured ......pretribulation.......on the day of Pentecost............the wheat harvest feast they will begin to understand that Jesus is the Messiah and at that point they will understand that they are under the covenant. Just because the covenant is there means nothing until you accept it. The 144000 will be witnesses to the Messiah.

Quasar92 · Jan 13, 2018

pshun2404 said:
please google and read "The Parousia" which means "coming" and refers to the 2nd coming.

"For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord (which we find in Matthew 24), that we which are alive and remain unto the coming (the parousia) of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.

16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout (this is at the COMING), with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:

17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord."

1 Thess.4:16-17 and 2 Thess.2:3 and 7-8 is the teaching by Paul of the rapture of the Church, seven years before His second coming WITH HIS CHURCH in Zech.4-5; Jude 14 and Rev.19:14. Review the OP that refute your views.

Quasar92

Quasar92 · Jan 13, 2018

Davy said:
The "any moment" concept doesn't work either. Reason is because our Lord Jesus gave us specific signs to occur for the end before His coming and gathering of the Church, like God's two witnesses showing up in Jerusalem to prophesy for 1260 days, and the coming of the Antichrist.

When our Lord Jesus warned us that He comes "as a thief", and commanded us to be watching like the goodman of the house, that idea is about staying spiritually "a chaste virgin" waiting for His coming, because the pseudo-Christ is to come first and play the "another Jesus". Like Jesus showed in Matt.24:23-26, that coming false one will work great signs and wonders that if possible, even deceive Christ's own very elect. That means that false one is going to 'play' our Lord Jesus Christ in Jerusalem. Deceived pastors will be leading whole Churches to that false one thinking he is our Lord Jesus.

That is why... watching the signs of the end Jesus gave us was commanded, and why knowing the events to occur up to His return, is so important. He doesn't want us to be deceived.

FYI, reference to Jesus "coming as a thief" is to non-believers, in 1 Thess.5, in contrast to the believer, that Paul was explaining, after teaching the rapture of the Church, in 1 Thess.4:16-17.

Quasar92

Davy · Jan 13, 2018

Douggg said:
Anticipating the rapture is part of God's Word, Davy.

Luke 21:
34 And take heed to yourselves, lest at any time your hearts be overcharged with surfeiting, and drunkenness, and cares of this life, and so that day come upon you unawares.

35 For as a snare shall it come on all them that dwell on the face of the whole earth.

36 Watch ye therefore, and pray always, that ye may be accounted worthy to escape all these things that shall come to pass, and to stand before the Son of man.

Matthew 24:
42 Watch therefore: for ye know not what hour your Lord doth come.

Our Lord Jesus was commanding us to 'watch' the signs He gave when He said that in Matt.24, and He included more info with HOW to watch.

So picking up where you left off...

Matt 24:42-47
42 Watch therefore: for ye know not what hour your Lord doth come.

43 But know this, that if the goodman of the house had known in what watch the thief would come, he would have watched, and would not have suffered his house to be broken up.

Jesus said by that we are supposed have an idea of what "watch" the thief comes. There were 3 watches in His day, sunset to ten was the first, ten to two was the middle watch, and two to sunrise was the morning watch. He just gave the 7 main signs of the end leading up to His return there in that Matthew 24 Chapter, and that's how we are to be watching per His command.

So watching is not simply about saying to oneself, "I'm saved, so I'm ready to go". It's about being 'on guard' watching the events of the end so as to not be deceived, and thus... being found still faithful when He comes.

44 Therefore be ye also ready: for in such an hour as ye think not the Son of man cometh.

45 Who then is a faithful and wise servant, whom his lord hath made ruler over his household, to give them meat in due season?

46 Blessed is that servant, whom his lord when he cometh shall find so doing.

47 Verily I say unto you, That he shall make him ruler over all his goods.
KJV

There it is. Being found still faithful and not deceived when He comes. That's what it's about, not just believing one is ready to fly away.

TribulationSigns · Jan 13, 2018

Quasar92 said:
There are those of us who have earned our qualifications to teach the Bible as well as eschatology.

Ha... you think you are all about "qualifications." (Chuckle). Even the Scribes and Pharisees thought they had the qualifications too.

Davy · Jan 13, 2018

Douggg said:
The destruction of this present heaven and earth is part of the Day of the Lord - but not all of the Day of the Lord.

In 1Thessalonians5, the world will be saying peace and safety, when sudden destruction shall come upon them, as associated with the day of the Lord.

2 For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night.
3 For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not escape.

.....so we know that the Day of the Lord is not just limited to at the end of the thousand years the destruction of this current heaven and earth.

The "day of the Lord" event will occur at an instant, suddenly, per the OT prophets like Isaiah. That is why Apostle Paul used the expression "sudden destruction" upon the wicked for that day. But the Pre-trib Rapture doctrine of man is trying to stretch... that day out, which is un-Biblical.

The 2 Peter 3:10 event of God's consuming fire burning man's works off this earth on that "day of the Lord" is not about God's later setting up of the new heavens and a new earth. The wicked will still exist after Christ's return, but they will never see God's future new heavens and a new earth which is after the future "lake of fire" event. And Peter also said that "day of the Lord" will occur very quickly, "as a thief in the night" like Paul did in 1 Thess.5.

At the end of Hebrews 12 we are also shown God's destruction of man's works off this earth on the last day of this world when Jesus comes to gather the Church, which will all happen on that same "day of the Lord" event.

Don't let men's traditions get in the way.

TribulationSigns · Jan 14, 2018

Quasar92 said:
1 Thess.4:16-17 and 2 Thess.2:3 and 7-8 is the teaching by Paul of the rapture of the Church, seven years before His second coming

Really? Let examine the verses you mentioned:

1Th 4:16-17
[16] For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
[17] Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

Paul did NOT say meeting in the air to take place 7 years before Second Coming here. The Truth is this "IS" the Second Coming where all Saints shall meet with Him in the air!

2Th 2:3
[3] Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;

Paul did NOT specifically say the rapture of the church takes place 7 years before Second Coming here. Even Thomas Ice's noxious mistranslation of the Greek noun apostasia which he contends indicates the pre-tribulation rapture. You, my old friend, are deceived by him. The Truth is that day is our gathering together with Christ will not occur until these two things must take place first before the rapture can take place. Not applying the rapture to one of two things.

2Th 2:7-8
[7] For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way.
[8] And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming:

Paul did NOT talk about the rapture of the church nor the 7 years before Second Coming here. He talked about the Spirit of God taken out of the midst (of the congregation) so the Wicked can be revealed.

You just forced these verses to say something that you claimed it supports you. This is a poor Biblical exegesis on your part which is strange from someone who keeps making claims that he has a "qualification to teach", "having college degrees," and support by "the history of teachers before him", etc.

Davy · Jan 14, 2018

Quasar92 said:
The OP and seventh post beyond the OP, on page one of this thread refute you. The seventh post of this thread contain the teachings of Jesus, Matthew, Luke, John and Paul, about the coming pre-trib rapture of the Church, you dogmatically call a "treatise." Where did you obtain your qualifications to teach eschatology? Either prove your claims the Scriptural facts posted on the OP or the seventh post on this thread are false by Scriptures, or your views are those that are false.

Quasar92

I got my qualifications by STUDY in all of God's Word by The Holy Spirit and common sense, and NOT by men's traditions like a Pre-trib Rapture 'theory' that only began in the 1800's, meaning around 1,800 years after true Christian doctrine had already been established!

And I have already given the SCRIPTURE PROOF FROM GOD'S WORD that your doctrine does not align with His Holy Writ. So you can make false affirmations and attacks on my credibility all you want, but God sees it.

Davy · Jan 14, 2018

Choose Wisely said:
So there it is. The 1 Thes 4 gathering aligns perfectly with the pretribulation rapture. The 1 Cor 15 aligns perfectly with the gathering Jesus taught in His Olivet Discourse. Further scriptural proof is given in Revelation 16:15 where He is still warning the 12 tribes, which we see in Rev 14, that he comes as a thief.

That shows the charlatan like nature of some on the false Pre-tribulational rapture theory. They're used to twisting what they read.

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