we have no proofs about the existence of god

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i am stating that even if we know, we can't prove it

While there is a measure of faith that will always be involved, that does not mean our faith is blind. The faith in GOD and the Bible is based upon many logical proofs or evidences. If not, then there would be no difference between GOD and the Bible and other religions.

You said:
you are saying thing i already believe and know

So you knew about how there is a genealogy in Genesis 38 from Boaz to David counting a 49 letter sequence within the Hebrew?

A short genealogy of David in Genesis 38:





Source:
http://www.khouse.org/articles/2004/569

http://www.khouse.org/articles/2004/522/
 
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i believe the same that you believe and as you wrote this entire post that i agree totally i understand you don't understand my statement in the first post

I know you said spiritual proofs, but this changes a person in the physical world (i.e. physical proof). Outward changes. Fruits in a person's life. But there is even more proofs than that. Your case sounds like it is trying to discount all kinds of proofs that back up God's Word. That to me is not right. We are to contend for the faith and not tear it down.
 
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there are evidences
jesus lord had spoken to me!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
but i have no the way to make a non believer to believe me

Ultimately evidences that back up God's Word are not going to convince people. I only use evidence if somebody is seeking GOD and they are looking for evidences.

Our job is not to convince anyone.
Only God can do that (if the person is open to GOD).

"So then neither is he that planteth any thing, neither he that watereth; but God that giveth the increase." (1 Corinthians 3:7).

We are merely to preach the good news and to love GOD and to love others (including the poor, and our enemies).

Side Note:

Oh, and I would be careful about personal spiritual experiences. They are not as reliable as the Word of God. Granted, I am not saying that what you heard or seen was not true, but our trust should be more in the Word and not in any personal experience alone. Spiritual experiences should uplift and glorify God's Word. If it seems to conflict with the Word, then it is not something from GOD.
 
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Vicomte13

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No. It's quite real. Ask any parent of a teenager. No, I'm not joking.
I’m the parent of a teenager myself. I think I see what you’re getting at. Ok. Yeah. That makes sense.
 
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dhh712

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maybe spiritual proofs but not material proofs that unbelievers want
That's what faith is. So that it is known that God alone does it. If there were to objective, empirical evidence that can be shown in repeated experiments that God exists (which there isn't right now, and probably will never be unless God chooses otherwise), then people will believe because of the evidence shown, not because God gives them the gift of faith.

This is a struggle many intellectual Christians have to deal with. Some provide "evidence" by logic. But I believe if I'm remembering correctly, that just proves that a God exists. But it doesn't prove the Christian God of Scriptures.

I have told many a non-believer this: All I have is subjective evidence. I have reasons for believing in God. But I don't have objective evidence. From my understanding of God, I believe that he gave me the ability to believe in him by the gift of faith. From an unbeliever's perspective, I am choosing to believe in the Christian God of Scripture because that is what I want to do.

Hey, you can put your faith in the physical world and all that scientific stuff, lots of people do. I put my faith in the Bible. It's two sides of the same coin (Apologists call both things "circular reasoning". The unbeliever reasons circularly based on things from the world, what the world tells them. The believer reasons circularly from the Bible. Then the unbeliever says that the Bible is part of the world so it doesn't count. That is where we have the disagreement that not everything is from the world: the non-believer thinks everything is and the believer sees that Bible as outside the world, as a revelation of God from the spiritual realm).
 
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want-love

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That's what faith is. So that it is known that God alone does it. If there were to objective, empirical evidence that can be shown in repeated experiments that God exists (which there isn't right now, and probably will never be unless God chooses otherwise), then people will believe because of the evidence shown, not because God gives them the gift of faith.

This is a struggle many intellectual Christians have to deal with. Some provide "evidence" by logic. But I believe if I'm remembering correctly, that just proves that a God exists. But it doesn't prove the Christian God of Scriptures.

I have told many a non-believer this: All I have is subjective evidence. I have reasons for believing in God. But I don't have objective evidence. From my understanding of God, I believe that he gave me the ability to believe in him by the gift of faith. From an unbeliever's perspective, I am choosing to believe in the Christian God of Scripture because that is what I want to do.

Hey, you can put your faith in the physical world and all that scientific stuff, lots of people do. I put my faith in the Bible. It's two sides of the same coin (Apologists call both things "circular reasoning". The unbeliever reasons circularly based on things from the world, what the world tells them. The believer reasons circularly from the Bible. Then the unbeliever says that the Bible is part of the world so it doesn't count. That is where we have the disagreement that not everything is from the world: the non-believer thinks everything is and the believer sees that Bible as outside the world, as a revelation of God from the spiritual realm).
it's the holy spirit brother, for me is real, people of the world will say i am raving, but i have spiritual proofs that holy spirit exists
 
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No, I bring the truth. You are simply stubborn and blind to it.
Your post reminded me of a line in the original Indiana Jones movie. While teaching his class he said: "Archaeology is the search for fact... not truth. If it's truth you're looking for, Dr. Tyree's philosophy class is right down the hall.":D

BTW, I'm making no statement for or against what you said. It just made that quote come to mind. :)
 
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Trying to prove God exists by examining creation is like trying to prove an architect exists by walking through one of his buildings.

You don't find him in the closet, or in the elevator shaft. You don't find him in a drawer or hiding behind the ceiling tiles.

No, the proof of an architect is in the design. And the earth and creation SCREAM of a creator, and a mind mindbogglingly creative one.

Just as the building is the proof of the architect, Creation is the proof of a creator.

But... I can't automatically assume it was one particular architect. And then I look up the records and hundreds of different architects claim they designed the building.
 
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But... I can't automatically assume it was one particular architect. And then I look up the records and hundreds of different architects claim they designed the building.
I agree. You go by which architect's work it matches. And if you apply his instructions, what you come up with.

For those of us who have experienced actual miraculous answer to prayer, it's pretty iron clad and an easy choice.
 
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I agree. You go by which architect's work it matches. And if you apply his instructions, what you come up with.

In this analogy it would be multiple architects claiming the same style (or more accurately, other non-architects telling you that style X is characteristic of architect A or B). And for all I know, it could have been architect C, who I've never heard of.

For those of us who have experienced actual miraculous answer to prayer, it's pretty iron clad and an easy choice.

Sure, but I've met people who believe in healing crystals because they feel better when they wear them. The first thing we were taught in statistics 401 is that correlation does not imply causation. I hate bringing this up because I know it comes across as rude and a wet blanket (or prideful and rebellius, as my family has told me), but this is something that has always bothered me, and I feel like I'm not allowed to ever bring it up with anyone
 
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In this analogy it would be multiple architects claiming the same style (or more accurately, other non-architects telling you that style X is characteristic of architect A or B). And for all I know, it could have been architect C, who I've never heard of.



Sure, but I've met people who believe in healing crystals because they feel better when they wear them. The first thing we were taught in statistics 401 is that correlation does not imply causation. I hate bringing this up because I know it comes across as rude and a wet blanket (or prideful and rebellius, as my family has told me), but this is something that has always bothered me, and I feel like I'm not allowed to ever bring it up with anyone
You're overthinking the analogy. I used it to make one point. If you want to argue that many architects claim credit for the design, fine. That's a different subject. My point is that the design SCREAMS that there was an architect.
 
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You're overthinking the analogy. I used it to make one point. If you want to argue that many architects claim credit for the design, fine. That's a different subject. My point is that the design SCREAMS that there was an architect.

Sure, but it just kind of underlines why it's not a good argument for any one belief. Also, it's kind of self-defeating, since God himself was clearly not designed, therefore intelligence does not inherently imply design
 
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