Does the Bible teach works must follow God's grace as a part of our salvation?

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Tell me how men in Scripture are presented as holy even though they occasionally sin, whether it be a Abraham a David or a Peter?

Well, the 144,000 were found without fault before the throne of God in Revelation 14:3-5.
Enoch was translated because he walked with God in such a way that pleased the Lord.

Anyways, I believe Abraham, David, and Peter are only holy because they overcame their sin in time. They were not saved in the moment they did falter in their sin. They were only saved when they came back to the Lord by His mercy and grace by repenting of their sins. Repenting of sin is asking the Lord for forgiveness of your sin by way of pray (Which is followed by the natural fruits of repentance). Granted, each man's faith and struggle in life is different. Some accept Christ when they die like the thief on the cross. His faithfulness was standing up for Jesus when the other thief reviled our Lord. Samson was also saved in the end. He was a great example of God's mercy and grace; And he did not commit suicide like many think. Anyways, after the New Covenant, God provided a way for us to be perfect through Christ and His teachings. When Jesus said be perfect as the Heavenly Father is perfect he was saying that we need to do things like pray and do good towards our enemies. James essentially says a perfect man controls his tongue. So there are different ways that can add up to a person in being perfect. But I do not believe not having reached a state of "Sinless Perfection" (in this life) does not mean one is not saved. "Sinless Perfection" is dealing with how God wants us to be here in this life so as to glorify Him. "Sinless Perfection" is not exactly talking about keeping God's Eternal Moral Law of Love (that came into existence after the "Fall"). This Eternal Moral Law of Love is: Loving God, and loving your neighbor: which would include preaching the gospel, helping the poor, not murdering, not committing adultery, not stealing, not coveting, and not lying, etc.). Keeping these things are the basics. Sure, will some of us falter? Yes, but to teach that a believer will always sin occasionally and unintentionally is not morally correct because the Scripture clearly teach that we can overcome our sin by the power of the Lord working in us.

Anyways, check out these verses here and this video here at Christian Forums.

I hope this helps;
And may God bless you.
 
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Oh, and speaking of Samson:
Did anyone see this trailer from Pureflix?


I am really excited to see this;
And I am praying it will be biblically accurate and lead more people to Christ because of it.
 
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PeaceByJesus

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HUH? You quote a Scrpture that reveals a TRUTH......
THEN give a comment that SUPERSEDES the TRUTH!...
Why? Why are you teaching, a man born of God, continues to SIN?God Bless,
SBC
Why do you make the same false accusation that has been refuted before over multiple posts showing that contrary to your assertions and isolationist exegesis, men born of God can sin, and do sin, andare called sinners, with John thus exhorting them not to sin, and to confess when they do, and that provision is made for their forgiveness when they do, and with 1 John referring to practice, which all the sarcasm you resort has not been able to counter, though you insolently act as if your fantasy was never countered.

Ever wonder why you become marginalized as unfit for meaningful debate? Don't expect much more here. Those who want to see your nonsense - which goes beyond that of development to not sinning (cannot sin, yet trespassing against others is not a sin against God) dealt with can click on the linked thread.
 
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SBC

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Why do you make the same false accusation that has been refuted before over multiple posts showing that contrary to your assertions and isolationist exegesis,

Actually, I agree with Scripture, and others WILL CLAIM THEY AGREE WITH SCRIPTURE, then immediately DISAGREE WITH Scripture, AS YOU DID.

You simply disagree with ME, who agrees with Scripture.....BUT why don't you EXPLAIN?

YOU DON'T, INSTEAD you simply disparage me, as IF doing so, makes you right.
It doesn't.

Scripture:

1 John 3:9
Whosever is born of God doth not commit sin;
For His Seed remaineith in him:
And he cannot sin
Because he is born of God.

You:

men born of God can sin,

and do sin,

You as well as others CAN TEACH IN AGREEMENT with each other, YOUR COMPLETE OPPOSITION TO Scripture, as BEING THE TRUTH.....It isn't.

Too Bad you do NOT NOTICE, you are SUPPOSED to BE IN AGREEMENT WITH Gods WORD, regardless if men are in agreement with that which GOES AGAINST GODS WORD!

Why can you not STAND FOR what you believe and teach.....How YOU ARE RIGHT and Scripture is Wrong?

Ever wonder why you become marginalized as unfit for meaningful debate?

Wonder? LOL. No. Not at all. I already KNOW when men cannot PROVE WHY they teach Scripture is Wrong and they Are Right....simply deflect and resort to disparaging anyone who challenges their false testimony, as if they have justified their false testimony.

Read the Scripture - Read what you Teach.
Completely Opposites....

One or the other is NOT TRUE....
Own it. Then maybe you will accept the Truth.

God Bless,
SBC
 
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Blood Bought 1953

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I am not responsible for your inability to see that chastisement of a gross willful impenitent sinner so that he may have Godly salvific repentance and be saved is not the same as giving him an early ticket to Heaven because of gross willful impenitent sinning, which is your gross distortion.


*&$=*)*&#$. I spent an hour typing my response and it vanished...a blessing to many ,I know...I will try again after I cool off..?I am really #&&-$+-......suffice it to say for now,,that I agree with you ,believe it or not
 
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In which interest let me provide some help and tell me how you do:

Traits of the Self-Life
The following are some of the features and manifestations of the self-life. The Spirit alone can interpret and apply this to your individual case. As you read, examine yourself as if in the immediate presence of God. Are you ever conscious of:

Well, to begin with, according to the forum rules, it says this:
  • When you disagree, address the context of the post and not the poster.
Source:
Statement of Purpose - Controversial Christian Theology Statement of Purpose

You said:
A secret spirit of pride, an exalted feeling, in view of your success or position; (Daniel 4:30) because of your good training and appearance; because of your natural gifts and abilities. An important, independent spirit. (1Sam. 2:3; Prov. 16:16; Mk. 14:29-31)Stiffness and preciseness? (Mt. 23:34)

Well, I don't think my own poop does not stink. Why else do you think I am not making excuses that a believer can sin and still be saved on some level? I also do not think I am a great prophet, or anything. I am merely a humble servant of Christ and I realize that to be great in the Kingdom, you have to serve others and have a pure heart. One has to give and pray in secret before the Father if one wants to be rewarded openly.

You said:
Love of human praise; a secret fondness to be noticed; love of supremacy; (Mt. 6:5) drawing attention to self in conversation; a swelling out of self when you have had a free time in speaking or praying? (Lk. 22:24; Acts 8:9-24; 3Jn 1:9)

I actually do not like human praise. I actually prefer working behind the side lines whereby only God sees my works. So you are way off base on your judgment of me. I also do not argue to be the greatest among men, either. So that is also a false judgment on your part.

You said:
The stirrings of anger or impatience, which, worst of all, you call nervousness or holy indignation; a touchy, sensitive spirit; a disposition to resent and
retaliate when reproved or contradicted; a desire to throw sharp, heated flings at another? (1Sam. 8:7-11; Prov. 18:14)

I am quick to forgive. I am also not into attacking others. I strive to attack the belief and not the person. As for anger and impatience: Jesus got angry at the money changers. We are to be slow to anger. It is not that anger is wrong exactly. But yes, we do need to be patient. But is a lack of impatience sometimes proof of a self driven spirit? I would need more of a verse specifically saying that for it to be true. I am sometimes patient and other times I am not. It depends on the situation and what it is. There are many times, I do catch myself being impatient and I then calm myself in the quiteness of the Lord. For I realize that all things happen according to His will and plan. I realize that all things work together for good to those who love God.

You said:
Self-will; a stubborn unteachable spirit; (Prov. 29:1; 2Chrn. 36:16; Jer. 44:16-19) an arguing, talkative spirit; (Prov. 21:19; 26:2; Rm. 2:8) harsh, sarcastic expressions; (Ps. 94:4; Col. 4:6) and unyielding, headstrong disposition; (2Chrn. 10:10) a driving, commanding spirit; a disposition to criticize and pick flaws when set aside and unnoticed; a peevish, fretful spirit; a disposition that loves to [or must] be coaxed and humoured? (1Sam. 18:8; 20:29-34)

Again, this is a false accusation. I know that I cannot do anything without God's consent. I go out today and do this or that only by the Lord's power and will and might. I also ask God many times what His Word is saying. I really want to know. Many times the Lord has corrected me on what a verse or passage says. I am married and I do not seek to pick out flaws in my wife. I just love her. If she sees something wrong in me, I seek to change it and be better. But I do not make demands of my wife and seek to change her. Only God can make changes in our lives. I merely love her. I also seek to love all people; Even those who are hard to love. I pray for those who have done evil towards me.

You said:
Carnal fear; a man-fearing spirit; (Mt. 10:28; Rv. 21:8) a shrinking from reproach and duty; (Heb. 10:38,39) reasoning around your cross; (Lk. 14:33) a shrinking from doing your whole duty by those of wealth or position; a fearfulness that someone will get out of the spirit and thus offend and drive some prominent person away; a compromising spirit?(James 2:1-4; Gal. 2:11-13)

I have stood up to a person at work who mocks Jesus Christ. He raised his voice with me that Jesus is not God and he was being highly insulting to my Lord. I had then felt guided by God to close my eyes and pray openly for God to bind the demons that were blinding him in that moment (for him to see). Others at work were watching me. Did they think I was crazy? Maybe. But I did not care about that. For I was not afraid to stand up for Jesus and say what I felt was the right thing for my Lord at that time.

You said:
A resentful jealous disposition; a secret spirit of envy shut up in your heart; an unpleasant sensation in view of the great prosperity and success of another; (1 Samuel 18:6-9) a disposition to speak of the faults and failings, rather than the gifts and virtues of those more talented and appreciated than yourself? (2 Samuel 16:5-8; Ps. 109:17,18)

I am not interested in what another does. I would like to be great spiritually like Abraham, or Job, etc. but I know that only the Lord my God is the One who can do any kind of good in me. I am nothing by myself. It is only by the power of God can I do anything. So again. You are falsely judging me.

You said:
Lustful stirrings; unholy actions; undue inclinations and unholy familiarity towards those of the opposite sex; wandering eyes? (Prov. 6:25; Colossians 3:5)

I don't see how this sin has anything to do with a self driven spirit exclusively. I think it is safe to say that all Christian men have battled in trying to control their eyes to stay focused on the Lord and or their wife. I go out of my way to have only eyes for my wife; Not only because it is the right thing to do but because I honestly do love my wife. But I think it is important that we pray as believers that the Lord leads us away from temptation in this area and that we quote Scripture (under our breath or out loud) to defeat such a thing.

You said:
A dishonest, deceitful disposition; the evading and covering of the truth; the covering up of your real faults; (Prov. 12:20; 26:26; 28:13) the leaving of a better impression of yourself than is strictly true; false humility; exaggeration; straining the truth?(Mt. 7:15; Lk. 11:39)

I always seek to be honest in what I do. But you do have to realize that the Lord Jesus Himself did not exactly disclose all of the truth fully to everyone during His Earthly ministry. In fact, when people were healed by His miracles, He told people not to say anything to anyone. Jesus also deflected that He was God almighty to the Pharisees so as to protect His mission in going to the cross. He said, to them, ye are gods (i.e. kings).

You said:
Unbelief; a spirit of discouragement in times of pressure and opposition; lack of quietness and confidence in God; lack of faith and trust in God; (Heb. 3:12) a disposition to worry and complain in the midst of pain, poverty, or at the dispensations of Divine Providence; (Job 31) an over-anxious feeling whether everything will come out all right? (Job 3)

I always trust in the Lord whatever challenge I am faced with. I have ringing in the ears. I believe it is my thorn in the flesh as a part of glorifying God. I know God has a plan in it. If I ever lose my hearing completely, glory to my Lord even more. He would have a plan for that, as well. Of course, I would pray against losing what little hearing I have left. But whatever the Lord chooses to do in my life; That is up to Him. For the Lord gives and the Lord takes away. Blessed be the name of the Lord.

You said:
Formality and deadness; lack of concern for lost souls; dryness and indifference; lack of power with God? (Rv. 3:17)

I am concerned for the lost. I strive to do better in trying to reach them.

You said:
Selfishness; love of ease; love of money? (Ezek. 16:49)

Chasing after riches leads a believer to be pierced through with many sorrows.
The poor of this world are the ones who are rich in faith. As for self: We should be concerned with our own soul and physical well being but that should not be at the expense of loving God and loving others. God knows my heart and that I seek Him every day and to do what is good and pleasing in His sight. I do not see that as selfishness. But could I be more self sacrificing? Yes. But is that a salvation issue or a self serving spirit alone? No. I don't believe it is. We are told to love our neighbor as we would love ourselves. But loving ourselves should not be a sense of pride or self importance. We care for our soul and temple because God created these things. Any or all good is by the hand of God. So all praise goes to Him for any goodness in my life. For without God, I am nothing. So again, you are seeking to judge me falsely (When you do not know me).
 
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Flatly wrong, and fallacious reasoning due to your fallen nature. For in no way am i justifying sin, and am saying just the opposite of a lot of evil being even tolerated. for instead i am justifying how God can refer to a person or people as holy based upon their overall life while not having attained to the level of never occasionally sinning, so their grief, in thought word or deed, by commission or omission. That you cannot call just holy is your problem, not God's.

Well, I never said you personally were justifying sin. I said the kind of belief that you describe appears to be doing that. For while you say that a believer may not practice sin, you are also appearing to say that a believer can never overcome sin. You are also giving me the impression that a believer could be saved in certain cases while they commit sin (on some small level as long as they generally live a holy life). Also, while certain men of God in Scripture have appeared to sin, we cannot say what their entire lives were like because we do not have a second by second play of their entire lives. You also have to understand that things are different in the New Testament, as well.

"God having provided some better thing for us, that they without us should not be made perfect." (Hebrews 11:40).
 
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First, God is not a human, and even called adulterous Israel to return after Him after she had become adulterous, (Jeremiah 3:14) and which was not even because they really did not intend to cheat on Him.

Not true. Jesus is God and He is very much also human or a flesh and blood man.
Also, Jesus made many real world examples that illustrated or paralleled spiritual truth.
In fact, Jesus commended the Canaanite woman in her faith for expounding upon Christ's parable with a continued parable of her own. This means that the real world example that I had shown you is true.

You said:
There you go again with our "no sin or you are out" kingdom, in which it is only when a person stops sinning that they are a servant of the King in His kingdom, and which standard you must presume you have attained to. And "with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged: and with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again." (Matthew 7:2) Hope you make it.

I don't make the rules.

The Bible teaches that serious sin is separation from GOD:

[God said to Adam,]
"But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die." (Genesis 2:17).

[Eve said to the serpent,]
"But of the fruit of the tree which is in the midst of the garden, God hath said, Ye shall not eat of it, neither shall ye touch it, lest ye die. (Genesis 3:3).

And the serpent said unto the woman,
"Ye shall not surely die." (Genesis 3:4).

"...she took of the fruit thereof, and did eat, and gave also unto her husband with her; and he did eat. And the eyes of them both were opened, and they knew that they were naked..." (Genesis 3:6-7).

"Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned." (Romans 5:12).

"For the wages of sin is death..." (Romans 6:23).

"But your iniquities have separated between you and your God, and your sins have hid his face from you, that he will not hear." (Isaiah 59:2).

“...whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of hell fire.”
(Matthew 5:22).

28 “But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart.
29 And if thy right eye offend thee, pluck it out, and cast it from thee: for it is profitable for thee that one of thy members should perish, and not that thy whole body should be cast into hell.
30 And if thy right hand offend thee, cut it off, and cast it from thee: for it is profitable for thee that one of thy members should perish, and not that thy whole body should be cast into hell.” (Matthew 5:28-30).

“But if ye forgive not men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.” (Matthew 6:15).

“Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.” (Matthew 7:21)

Important Note: If you were to look at 1 Thessalonians 4:3 you would learn that the will of God (i.e. the Father) is to be holy or it is our sanctification; And Hebrews 12:14 says, without holiness no man shall see the Lord.

“22 On that day many will say to me, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and cast out demons in your name, and do many mighty works in your name?’
23 And then will I declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from me, you workers of lawlessness.’” (Matthew 7:22-23 ESV).

“26 And every one that heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them not, shall be likened unto a foolish man, which built his house upon the sand:
27 And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell: and great was the fall of it.”
(Matthew 7:26-27).

“15 Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.
16 Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles?
17 Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit.
18 A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit.
19 Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire.
20 Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.” (Matthew 7:15-20).

"For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins." (Hebrews 10:26).

"he that commits sin is of the devil." (1 John 3:8).

"everyone who does evil hates the light." (John 3:20).

"Repent therefore of this thy wickedness, and pray God, if perhaps the thought of thine heart may be forgiven thee." (Acts 8:22).

6 "If we say that we have fellowship with him, and walk in darkness, we lie, and do not the truth.
7 But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin." (1 John 1:6-7).

"He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him." (1 John 2:4).

"Whosoever hateth his brother is a murderer: and ye know that no murderer hath eternal life abiding in him." (1 John 3:15).

"He that saith he is in the light, and hateth his brother, is in darkness even until now." (1 John 2:9).

"In this the children of God are manifest, and the children of the devil: whosoever doeth not righteousness is not of God, neither he that loveth not his brother." (1 John 3:10).

41 "The Son of Man will send his angels, and they will gather out of his kingdom all causes of sin and all law-breakers,
42 and throw them into the fiery furnace. In that place there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.
43 Then the righteous will shine like the sun in the kingdom of their Father. He who has ears, let him hear." (Matthew 13:41-43 ESV).

"They profess that they know God; but in works they deny him, being abominable, and disobedient, and unto every good work reprobate." (Titus 1:16).

3 "If any man teach otherwise, and consent not to wholesome words, even the words of our Lord Jesus Christ, and to the doctrine which is according to godliness;
4 He is proud, knowing nothing,..." (1 Timothy 6:3-4).

"...God resisteth the proud, but giveth grace unto the humble."
(James 4:6).

21 For if God spared not the natural branches, take heed lest he also spare not thee.
22 Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them which fell, severity; but toward thee, goodness, if thou continue in his goodness: otherwise thou also shalt be cut off." (Romans 11:21-22).

16 "There is a sin unto death..."
17 "...and there is a sin not unto death." (1 John 5:16-17).

"But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death." (Revelation 21:8).

19 "Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness,
20 Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies,
21 Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God." (Galatians 5:19-21).

5 "Mortify therefore your members which are upon the earth; fornication, uncleanness, inordinate affection, evil concupiscence, and covetousness, which is idolatry:
6 For which things' sake the wrath of God cometh on the children of disobedience:
7 In the which ye also walked some time, when ye lived in them." (Colossians 3:5-7).
 
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Blood Bought 1953

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*&$=*)*&#$. I spent an hour typing my response and it vanished...a blessing to many ,I know...I will try again after I cool off..?I am really #&&-$+-......suffice it to say for now,,that I agree with you ,believe it or not


This is a much shorter version than my original masterpiece. Lol.....such a pain to have to redo this but here I go..
Thankfully, this sinning , stubborn man came to his senses and was welcomed back into the fold.If an unrepentant ,sinning Christian still persists in his foolishness after having been warned by the local congregation,after having been ejected from the church,after being attacked by Satan which could involve a serious illness—- God will finally take him home with a
Premature death.
This does not make sense to me.it appears that this man is rewarded by going to paradise for his stubbornness.



Going to post this first part before I possibly lose it
 
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Blood Bought 1953

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This is a much shorter version than my original masterpiece. Lol.....such a pain to have to redo this but here I go..
Thankfully, this sinning , stubborn man came to his senses and was welcomed back into the fold.If an unrepentant ,sinning Christian still persists in his foolishness after having been warned by the local congregation,after having been ejected from the church,after being attacked by Satan which could involve a serious illness—- God will finally take him home with a
Premature death.
This does not make sense to me.it appears that this man is rewarded by going to paradise for his stubbornness.



Going to post this first part before I possibly lose it[/QUO

Pt 2

Over the last 40 years , I have listened to hundreds of preachers,,but for what that is worth,if have never heard any of them deny this premature death...some say they have seen it happen many times.Paul spoke of those who would make it by the skin of their teeth—- like a man barely escaping a house fire.The man would make it but he would “suffer loss”. Perhaps this type of Believer will be very regretful at the Bema seat when Jesus passes out rewards for the faithful and he sees how he blew it when he thought he was getting away with something.To “suffer loss” may be worse than we ever imagined—- even though th3 jack-ass was saved.It’ s just my take—- please feel free to disagree. God bless.
 
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redleghunter

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This is a much shorter version than my original masterpiece. Lol.....such a pain to have to redo this but here I go..
Thankfully, this sinning , stubborn man came to his senses and was welcomed back into the fold.If an unrepentant ,sinning Christian still persists in his foolishness after having been warned by the local congregation,after having been ejected from the church,after being attacked by Satan which could involve a serious illness—- God will finally take him home with a
Premature death.
This does not make sense to me.it appears that this man is rewarded by going to paradise for his stubbornness.



Going to post this first part before I possibly lose it
I think the point was such a one was turned over so they would be chastised leading to sorrowful repentance.
 
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SBC

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*&$=*)*&#$. I spent an hour typing my response and it vanished...a blessing to many ,I know...I will try again after I cool off..?I am really #&&-$+-......suffice it to say for now,,that I agree with you ,believe it or not

Perhaps you can explain How it works for you, being forgiven your sins, receiving the Holy Spirit, and still sinning.

Acts 2: 38
Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins: and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

Scripture is quite clear, that the Holy Ghost is received AFTER repentance, and AFTER sins are FORGIVEN.

So HOW does it Work for you?

You Repent. Your Sins are Forgiven. You receive the Holy Spirit.

Now the monkey wrench.
You claim YOU STILL SIN.

Where IS THE Holy Spirit WHILE you are SINNING?

God Bless,
SBC
 
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Blood Bought 1953

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Perhaps you can explain How it works for you, being forgiven your sins, receiving the Holy Spirit, and still sinning.

Acts 2: 38
Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins: and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

Scripture is quite clear, that the Holy Ghost is received AFTER repentance, and AFTER sins are FORGIVEN.

So HOW does it Work for you?

You Repent. Your Sins are Forgiven. You receive the Holy Spirit.

Now the monkey wrench.
You claim YOU STILL SIN.

Where IS THE Holy Spirit WHILE you are SINNING?

God Bless,
SBC



Gotta go for about an hour ....be back....the Holy Spirit is still in me when I sin —Warring with my old nature,as Paul said.sometimes the old nature wins the battle....guess who pays the price when this happens ? Me. Next time I may realize it is more wise to let my new nature have its way.bye for now.God bless
 
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SBC

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Why do you make the same false accusation that has been refuted.

You are the one who says a man born of God God, SINS.

I agree YOU claim that is your TRUTH.

How is that a FALSE ACCUSATION?

I disagree with YOUR TRUTH.
Scripture DISAGREES with YOUR TRUTH.

Ever wonder why you become marginalized as unfit for meaningful debate?

There is no DEBATE.

You simply Claim what is in opposition to Scripture, AS YOUR TRUTH.

YOUR TRUTH is simply backed up BY snide personal comments toward me.

WHERE is your SCRIPTURAL validation FOR YOUR TRUTH?

What is the HOLY SPIRIT WITHIN YOU doing WHILE you are SINNING?

Sleeping? Leaves you? What?

Teach me, Show me, how YOUR TRUTH IS CORRECT and Scripture is WRONG.

Surely you have SOME SCRIPTURAL VALIDATION, that Agrees with YOUR TRUTH....that men Born of God, SIN.

Jesus was Born of God....perhaps you could use Him as your Example.....!!

1 John 3:9
WHOSOEVER is BORN OF GOD doth NOT COMMIT SIN,
For his seed remaineth in him,
And HE CANNOT SIN,
BECAUSE, he IS, BORN OF GOD.

TEACH US....How does it work FOR YOU, ACCORDING TO YOUR TRUTH....

Does the SEED OF GOD, NOT REMAIN IN YOU, SO YOU CAN CONTINUE TO SIN. AS YOU CLAIM?

Why CAN'T YOU VALIDATE your claims WITH SCRIPTURE?

God Bless,
SBC
 
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Blood Bought 1953

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I think the point was such a one was turned over so they would be chastised leading to sorrowful repentance.


That is the goal....but if the offender refuses to repent of the sin bringing shame to the body of Christ,that fool could be killed
 
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SBC

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Gotta go for about an hour ....be back....the Holy Spirit is still in me when I sin —Warring with my old nature,as Paul said.sometimes the old nature wins the battle....guess who pays the price when this happens ? Me. Next time I may realize it is more wise to let my new nature have its way.bye for now.God bless

So ~ The Holy Spirit IS dwelling IN You...
And it is the Holy Spirit that wars Against your sin nature, and YOUR SIN Nature overcomes the Holy Spirit and WINS the battle, so you can Continue to Sin?

So YOUR "power" to SIN, is greater than the "power" (ie Holy Spirit), Within you?

1 John 1:9
Says a man Born of God, CANNOT SIN.
(So that must be wrong, IF you claim, you are Born of God, and Still sin.)

And now: 1 John 4: 4 must ALSO be wrong,
BECAUSE your "power" TO SIN, is greater, and wins the battle, OVER the POWER of God IN YOU.

1 John 4 :
4 Ye are OF God, little children, and have overcome them;
BECAUSE greater is he that IS IN YOU, than he that is IN the world.

Seems, you are on a journey, that must DISCARD Scriptures for YOUR TRUTH to be Valid.

BTW ~ Paul is not teaching ABOUT a WARRING between the Holy Spirit and YOUR SIN NATURE.

Rom 7:23
But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity of the law of sin which is in my members.

Paul is speaking about the LAW.
The LAW OF God, which is spiritual.
And ANOTHER LAW, which is carnal.

The battle IS WITHIN AS MAN....
BETWEEN...
A MANS thoughts IN HIS MIND
AND
A MANS thoughts IN HIS HEART.

Paul IS TEACHING....EXPECT to experience, what he experienced....and you as well, as you claim that applies to you.

The CARNAL MIND IS enmity Against God.
Rom 8:7

The CARNAL MIND IS NOT Subject TO the Law of God.
Rom 8:7

God Forgives and CHANGES a mans HEART.
God DOES NOT CHANGE a MANS MIND.
God FILLS a MANS HEART WITH HIS TRUTH.
It is YOUR JOB to LISTEN TO YOUR HEART,
INSTEAD OF YOUR MIND.

You are simply telling me, YOU elect to listen to YOUR MIND, and the POWER of God within YOU, IS NOT strong enough to EMPOWER YOU to Listen to your Heart, OVER your mind.

You are telling me, the Holy Spirit DWELLS IN YOU, WHILE your MIND continues to DIRECT you to SIN.

Isn't that WHAT THE OLD MAN DID?
How is the NEW MAN Different, IF he is still DOING what the OLD MAN did?

So, please do tell;
TWO Commandments Given By Jesus....

Matt 22;
37) Love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, with all they soul and with all thy mind.
38) Love thy neighbor as thyself.

Are you saying, you can not achieve this with the Power of God IN YOU?

God Bless,
SBC
 
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Blood Bought 1953

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So ~ The Holy Spirit IS dwelling IN You...
And it is the Holy Spirit that wars Against your sin nature, and YOUR SIN Nature overcomes the Holy Spirit and WINS the battle, so you can Continue to Sin?

So YOUR "power" to SIN, is greater than the "power" (ie Holy Spirit), Within you?

1 John 1:9
Says a man Born of God, CANNOT SIN.
(So that must be wrong, IF you claim, you are Born of God, and Still sin.)

And now: 1 John 4: 4 must ALSO be wrong,
BECAUSE your "power" TO SIN, is greater, and wins the battle, OVER the POWER of God IN YOU.

1 John 4 :
4 Ye are OF God, little children, and have overcome them;
BECAUSE greater is he that IS IN YOU, than he that is IN the world.

Seems, you are on a journey, that must DISCARD Scriptures for YOUR TRUTH to be Valid.

BTW ~ Paul is not teaching ABOUT a WARRING between the Holy Spirit and YOUR SIN NATURE.

Rom 7:23
But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity of the law of sin which is in my members.

Paul is speaking about the LAW.
The LAW OF God, which is spiritual.
And ANOTHER LAW, which is carnal.

The battle IS WITHIN AS MAN....
BETWEEN...
A MANS thoughts IN HIS MIND
AND
A MANS thoughts IN HIS HEART.

Paul IS TEACHING....EXPECT to experience, what he experienced....and you as well, as you claim that applies to you.

The CARNAL MIND IS enmity Against God.
Rom 8:7

The CARNAL MIND IS NOT Subject TO the Law of God.
Rom 8:7

God Forgives and CHANGES a mans HEART.
God DOES NOT CHANGE a MANS MIND.
God FILLS a MANS HEART WITH HIS TRUTH.
It is YOUR JOB to LISTEN TO YOUR HEART,
INSTEAD OF YOUR MIND.

You are simply telling me, YOU elect to listen to YOUR MIND, and the POWER of God within YOU, IS NOT strong enough to EMPOWER YOU to Listen to your Heart, OVER your mind.

You are telling me, the Holy Spirit DWELLS IN YOU, WHILE your MIND continues to DIRECT you to SIN.

Isn't that WHAT THE OLD MAN DID?
How is the NEW MAN Different, IF he is still DOING what the OLD MAN did?

So, please do tell;
TWO Commandments Given By Jesus....

Matt 22;
37) Love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, with all they soul and with all thy mind.
38) Love thy neighbor as thyself.

Are you saying, you can not achieve this with the Power of God IN YOU?

God Bless,
SBC



You don’t love your neighbor as you love yourself.....if I slap you,will you offer me the other cheek. If I drive my car through your front yard ,will you offer me the back yard?
 
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SBC

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That is the goal....but if the offender refuses to repent of the sin bringing shame to the body of Christ,that fool could be killed

Can you clarify...?

Is this a man WHO has the Spirit of God, that IS "SHAMMING Christ" ?

Or IS THIS, a man WHO HAS NOT been Forgiven His Sins, and is therefore SHAMMING Christ?

God Bless,
SBC
 
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Blood Bought 1953

Ned Flander’s Buddy
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You don’t love your neighbor as you love yourself.....if I slap you,will you offer me the other cheek. If I drive my car through your front yard ,will you offer me the back yard?



Your post covers too much ground.....one accusation at a time please!
 
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Can you clarify...?

Is this a man WHO has the Spirit of God, that IS "SHAMMING Christ" ?

Or IS THIS, a man WHO HAS NOT been Forgiven His Sins, and is therefore SHAMMING Christ?

God Bless,
SBC



It is the born again Believer that was sleeping with his Mother or maybe Stepmother that was a member of Paul’s Corinthian Church
 
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