Can Christ’s Blood Sacrifice By Itself “really” Save?

Blood Bought 1953 · Nov 18, 2017

I heard an interesting sermon this morning,thought I would share it.This guy says “go get a sheet of paper.Now, write down all the things that God requires for us to do in order to fully saved— be careful ,omit nothing! Your Salvation could be at stake! Now , if it says anything beyond believing the death,burial and resurrection of Jesus, go to the top of the page and put your title on it.The title will be this—”The Reasons I Am Going To Hell”. Any thoughts or comments?

ViaCrucis · Nov 18, 2017

So the preacher was advocating salvation by works then? I notice he didn't say it was the death and resurrection of the Lord that saves, but rather our belief in it. This takes the locus away from God's grace to human effort; instead of God saving us by His grace on Christ's account it becomes our getting our beliefs right, which is salvation by works.

The faith through which we are saved is the gift of God, and it is trust in Jesus who died and rose. By turning faith into a work it is no longer saving faith.

If my salvation is dependent on something I do, rather than on what God has done for me in Jesus, then that's salvation by works.

-CryptoLutheran

Hillsage · Nov 18, 2017

The only problem I see is that he doesn't define "fully saved". So is he talking about my spirit, soul or body being "fully saved"? When 'that' question is answered, then we can "rightly divide" and compartmentalize most of the disagreements concerning the 'whole doctrine' of being 'fully saved'.

bling · Nov 18, 2017

I see it as only accepting God’s charity offered in the form of forgiveness.

It is not us doing anything worthy, righteous or holy, so our humbly accepting pure charity earns us nothing. The prodigal son did not do anything to earn what the Father gave him.

Blood Bought 1953 · Nov 18, 2017

Blood Bought 1953 · Nov 18, 2017

Via...”I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ,for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that BELIEVES......I am as anti-works as you are probably more....I hate religion....I love Christianity.."?Christ provided for our salvation but how are we any different from an atheist if we don’t believe it? God Bless

ViaCrucis · Nov 18, 2017

Yes, the Gospel is what is powerful and efficacious. It is the Gospel that creates faith (Romans 10:17).

Belief and faith certainly go hand-in-hand; but it isn't our beliefs that save us. It is the grace of God which is the cause of our salvation, wrought through the person, life, death, and resurrection of our Lord Jesus Christ, appropriated to us through God's Means of Grace--Word and Sacrament. Salvation is something God does and is doing; which is why the locus must be on these things, not ourselves.

If our salvation is in jeopardy because we don't have our theological t's crossed and i's dotted properly, then salvation is no longer the divine work of God rescuing sinners, but about human beings meriting their salvation through their own efforts. I don't look to my beliefs about Jesus to save me, I look to Jesus Christ to save me, I look to where God acts and has acted, I look to my baptism, I look to the preaching of the word, I look to the Holy Eucharist--I look to those things which are outside of myself to where God graciously condescends to act, to create and sustain faith in me apart from myself. I look to God who graciously, kindly, and lovingly comes down to meet me, a lowly sinner, and who embraces me as a child and wraps me in the robes of His righteousness in Christ, thus justifying me freely by His grace. Because I accomplish nothing, I contribute nothing, I offer nothing--not even my "yes" is anything more than filthy rags. I am saved by God's grace alone, on Christ's account alone, through faith.

-CryptoLutheran

Blood Bought 1953 · Nov 18, 2017

I agree with you on a lot of important things.You seem to see yourself as a bankrupt sinner before God.so vital and so rare......to believe(sorry did not mean to use that word lol) otherwise is to live in a “fools paradise”. I think we could agree on that. God Bless

Hethatreadethit · Nov 18, 2017

Howdy neighbor:
He didn't mention anything about Christ dying because of our sins, according to the scriptures, and He didn't mention the scriptures that were used to prove the death, burial, and resurrection. The Gospel is to kickstart the faith of a believer. It doesn't really stop there, because, if you believe, you speak and do the works associated with spreading the Gospel:

2Co 4:13 We having the same spirit of faith, according as it is written, I believed, and therefore have I spoken; we also believe, and therefore speak;

Faith should spread like a vine.

ViaCrucis · Nov 18, 2017

I think it's important to understand that I'm approaching these things from a rather emphatically Lutheran position. That is probably, in part, why I'm making a distinction between faith and belief; the two are in a sense often used mutually interchangeably, but I think it is critical to make some kind of distinction here. "Faith" bears the connotation and emphasis of "trust", "I have faith in that person" isn't a statement of "I believe that person exists" but "I have trust in that person". Belief, on the other hand, tends to carry the connotation of certain propositions, "I believe that the earth is round", "I believe that Abraham Lincoln was an historical person". The way faith is used in Scripture, that is saving faith, is trust in Jesus; Luther I believe offers two good descriptions of faith, in his introduction to St. Paul's Epistle to the Romans he writes, "Faith is a radical, bold trust in God's grace", elsewhere he describes faith as the upward cupped hands of a beggar. For Luther the idea that we are all beggars was important, we come before God with nothing, our faith is not something we bring ourselves to contribute to our salvation, but rather it is the empty hands of a beggar who has nothing to offer.

When Scripture speaks of saving faith, it doesn't mean adhering to certain beliefs, that is, holding certain propositions as true; after all St. James writes, "You believe there is only one God, good for you! Even the devils believe, and tremble" (James 2:19) That the devils believe--even know--the objective truth of there being only one God, that Jesus Christ is His only-begotten Son, etc doesn't afford them anything. Which is why belief doesn't save us. Salvation comes from God alone, by His own gracious and loving disposition toward us, who in Jesus offers Himself freely to us, forgiving us all our sins, suffering death and the grave, and defeating these same things in order to rescue us--we who are even the very enemies of God (Romans 5:10) by which He demonstrates His great love for us (Romans 5:8).

And there is a fundamental danger in confusing salvation by grace alone through faith and salvation by believing the right things alone. The first one is the Gospel, the second one is not. No one is saved because they have the right religion, the right theology, or have the right beliefs about God; our salvation is found solely in the person, life, death, and resurrection of Jesus Christ our Lord. For Lutherans the chief "sola" of the Reformation is Christ Alone.

It must be about Jesus, it must always be about Jesus, it can never be about ourselves.

-CryptoLutheran

Hillsage · Nov 18, 2017

Acts 2:40 And he testified with many other words and exhorted them, saying, "Save yourselves from this crooked generation."

And if you don't, 'save yourself from this crooked generation' do you go to hell forever?

NO, you just don't get 'fully saved' from the hell fire that exists upon this earth til the day you die.

JAM 3:6 And the tongue is a fire. The tongue is an unrighteous world among our members, staining the whole body, setting on fire the cycle of nature, and set on fire by hell.

What does this hell fire do? Tests your faith to 'walk the walk' after you've accepted His works by 'talking the talk'. Spirit saved first, soul being saved or lost by walking forward as a sheep or backsliding like an unsaved saint.

1PE 1:7 so that the genuineness of your faith, more precious than gold which though perishable is tested by fire, may redound to praise and glory and honor at the revelation of Jesus Christ. 8 Without having seen him you love him; though you do not now see him you believe in him and rejoice with unutterable and exalted joy. 9 As the outcome of your faith you obtain the salvation of your souls.

The shortcoming of most salvations, as taught, believe your soul got saved when you accepted Jesus. Strange though, there is nary a verse anywhere saying Jesus saves souls. :idea:

SBC · Nov 18, 2017

Can Christ’s Blood Sacrifice By Itself “really” Save?

Save? Save what?

Saving is an act of God "saving" one thing, "unto Himself".

The soul, which is in man, becomes corrupt, belongs to God, becomes restored, avoids destruction, maintains life from God in it forever, still belongs to God.

Our body's are sentenced to death. They are not "saved". They die. They they rot.
They become raised and "changed".

Our spirits are natural (simply our truth in our hearts). They are not "saved". They die.
UNLESS, they become "born again", from Gods Seed, "changed" from a natural spirit to a spiritual spirit, then as a New spirit, they live forever.

The SAVING of a SOUL, follows AFTER, a man confesses belief, and IS FORGIVEN.

It is Jesus' BLOOD, that provides FORGIVENESS, His pure blood, (which is the required payment for sin against God), given for forgiveness of our sins. (since impure blood, can not provide forgiveness of impure acts ie sin) .

Matt 16
[26] For what is a man profited, if he shall gain the whole world, and lose his own soul? or what shall a man give in exchange for his soul?

Heb 10
[39] But we are not of them who draw back unto perdition; but of them that believe to the saving of the soul.

I think what you heard is the effect of a man becoming WHOLE, body, soul, spirit.
WHOLLY WHOLE and HOLY, which is the totality of becoming transformed from Against God to becoming With God forever.

1 Thes 5

[23] And the very God of peace sanctify you wholly; and I pray God your whole spirit and soul and body be preserved blameless unto the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ.

Eph 1
[4] According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:

Mark 10
[52] And Jesus said unto him, Go thy way; thy faith hath made thee whole.

God Bless,
SBC

DreamerOfTheHeart · Nov 18, 2017

We know we are saved if we keep the Message, the Good News, which is only possible by the Spirit.

Those who do not keep the message are those who say "Lord, Lord", but the Lord never knew.

As the parable of the sower explains. And as is recounted in the Gospel of John and a letter of John, but also testified in our hearts by the Spirit.

1213 · Nov 19, 2017

I agree, there is nothing person can do to gain salvation, if it means, sins are forgiven. Sins are forgiven by the word Jesus said, his word is what saves from the judgment that would come because of sin.

The scribes and the Pharisees began to reason, saying, "Who is this that speaks blasphemies? Who can forgive sins, but God alone?" But Jesus, perceiving their thoughts, answered them, "Why are you reasoning so in your hearts? Which is easier to say, 'Your sins are forgiven you;' or to say, 'Arise and walk?' But that you may know that the Son of Man has authority on earth to forgive sins" (he said to the paralyzed man), "I tell you, arise, and take up your cot, and go to your house." Immediately he rose up before them, and took up that which he was laying on, and departed to his house, glorifying God.
Luke 5:21-25

"If you remain in my word, then you are truly my disciples. You will know the truth, and the truth will make you free."
John 8:31-32

It is the spirit who gives life. The flesh profits nothing. The words that I speak to you are spirit, and are life.
John 6:63

But it is not that simple, after all, Jesus said also:

"Neither do I condemn you. Go your way. From now on, sin no more."
John 8:11

These will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.
Mat. 25:46

Person must be righteous, to get into eternal life.

…Whoever is born of God doesn't commit sin, because his seed remains in him; and he can't sin, because he is born of God. In this the children of God are revealed, and the children of the devil. Whoever doesn't do righteousness is not of God, neither is he who doesn't love his brother.
1 John 3:7-10

Ron Gurley · Nov 26, 2017

OP: " Can Christ’s Blood Sacrifice By Itself “really” Save?"

AKA

Christ’s Voluntary Blood Sacrifice for ALL Men is offered as the ONLY way to salvation from eternal spiritual separation from God...WHEN ACCEPTED!

Voluntary Blood Sacrifice FOR ALL Men = "SUBSTITUTIONARY ATONEMENT"

Hebrews 10...One voluntary blood Sacrifice by Jesus the Christ, The Divine Messiah Is Sufficient for the sinner
(Under the OT Mosaic "Law" of blood sacrifice to cover the sins of Israel)...
....For it is impossible for the blood of bulls and goats to take away sins...("the old Covenant")
...(where) Every priest stands daily ministering and offering time after time the same sacrifices,
which can never take away sins;
12 but He, (Jesus the Christ) having offered ONE sacrifice FOR sins FOR ALL time, (FOR all mankind!) SAT DOWN AT THE RIGHT HAND OF GOD,
waiting from that time onward
UNTIL HIS ENEMIES BE MADE A FOOTSTOOL FOR HIS FEET.
For by ONE offering He has perfected FOR all time those who are sanctified. (saved and set apart)
...Now where there is FORGIVNESS of these things (sins),
there is no longer any (blood) offering for sin....(necessary!)

Ron Gurley · Nov 26, 2017

" Substitutionary Atonement "...a preamble!

1. The TRI-UNE God created Mankind in THEIR own spritual image.

2. "Natural Man", beginning with A&E, has an innate "sin nature"...to be disobedient, self / world centered, and with a tendancy to turn from God.

3. God has given Man (and angels) the spiritual gift of "Free Will" to spiritually accept or reject Him
and His gracious provisions for salvation when called / drawn by the Spirit.

4. God is perfectly Loving/Merciful/full of Grace. AND He is also perfectly JUST.
He loves all sinners. AND He hates all sin.

5. Sinful Man on his own cannot work his way to heaven and be acceptable to a perfect sinless God.
A sin barrier exists. Man needs a Savior to act on his behalf to reconcile himself to God

6. Jesus the God-Man had a DUAL NATURE:
True Man: the sinless New Adam.
True Deity: Divinity poured out into a miraculous Body without loss or change of Deity.

7. Jesus the Divine Messiah voluntarily bled to death on a cruel, unjust Cross.
Jesus the God-Man voluntarily substituted Himself FOR all sins FOR all Men FOR all time.
His miraculous birth, ministry, death, resurrection, appearances, and ascension
RECONCILED Man to God. (at-one-ment)

8. The New Covenant: The blood of Jesus covers the sin of man.
We believers are longer under condemnation.
We are FORGIVEN of our SINS.

" Substitutionary Atonement "

Substitution = e.g. "huper" / ...Jesus died FOR you...in your place...on your behalf

2 Corinthians 5:21, ...IMPUTED RIGHTEOUSNESS
"He made Him who knew no sin to be sin "on our behalf", that we might become the righteousness of God IN Him."

Romans 6:10
For the death that He died, He died to sin once FOR all; but the life that He lives, He lives to God.

1 Peter 3:18 -
"For Christ also died FOR sins once FOR all,
the righteous (Jesus) FOR the unrighteous (Man),
that he might bring us to God" (reconciliation)

1 Peter 2 (NASB)
21 For you have been called for this purpose, since Christ also suffered FOR you,
leaving you an example FOR you to follow in His steps,
22 (Jesus

who committed no sin, nor was any deceit found in His mouth;
23 and while being reviled, He did not revile in return;
while suffering, He uttered no threats,
but kept entrusting Himself to Him who judges righteously;
24 and He Himself bore our sins in His body on the cross, so that we might die to sin and live to righteousness;
FOR by His wounds you were healed.
25 For you were continually straying like sheep,
but now you have returned to the Shepherd and Guardian of your souls.

Atonement = basic meaning of RECONCILIATION....work of redemption on behalf of ...

"Atonement" = at-ONE-ment = spiritual reconciliation and other benefits of salvation...
...some spiritual act that "pays for" / redeems Man from his sin nature / sin / sin(s)
...the penalty due to Man's sins are avoided
...action decreed by God for the re-establishment of a positive relationship between Man (the sinner) and Himself (the holy God).

The OT is replete with a myriad of ritual laws to cover the sins of Israel.
The word is used ONCE in the KJV of the NT.

Romans 5:11
And not only so, but we also joy in God through our Lord Jesus Christ,
by whom we have now received the atonement.

the atonement. ...Greek 2643....katallage....adjustment of a difference, RECONCILIATION, restoration to favour

Romans 5: 6-11 (NASB)
For while we were still helpless, at the right time Christ died FOR the ungodly.
For one will hardly die for a righteous man;
though perhaps for the good man someone would dare even to die.
But God demonstrates His own love toward us, in that while we were yet sinners, Christ died FOR us.
Much more then, having now been justified by His blood, we shall be saved from the wrath of God through Him.
For if while we were enemies we were reconciled to God through the death of His Son,
much more, having been reconciled, we shall be saved by His life.
And not only this, but we also exult in God through our Lord Jesus Christ,
through whom we have now received the reconciliation.

Leviticus 16:34
Now you shall have this as a permanent statute,
to make atonement for the sons of Israel for all their sins once every year.” (YOM KIPPUR)
And just as the Lord had commanded Moses, so he did.

Hebrews 7:27
who does not need daily, like those high priests, to offer up sacrifices,
first for His own sins and then for the sins of the people,
because this He did once FOR all when He offered up Himself.

Hebrews 9:12
and not through the blood of goats and calves, but THROUGH His own blood,
He entered the holy place once FOR all, having obtained eternal redemption.

Hebrews 10:10
By this will we have been sanctified
through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once FOR all.

See also: PROPITIATION ...

New Testament Greek:
G2435 hilasterion =~ propitiation, "mercy seat"

...“The word propitiation carries the basic idea of appeasement, or satisfaction, specifically towards God.
Propitiation is a two-part act that involves
appeasing the wrath of an offended person and
being reconciled to them.”
Propitiation is that:
“by which it becomes consistent with his character and government to pardon and bless the sinner.
The propitiation does not procure his love or make him loving; (God is ALSO perfectly LOVING and MERCIFUL!)
it only renders it consistent for him to exercise his love towards sinners...

1 John 4:10
In this is love, not that we loved God,
but that He loved us and
sent His Son to be the propitiation FOR our sins.

Hebrews 2:17
Therefore, He had to be made like His brethren in all things, so that He might become a merciful and faithful high priest in things pertaining to God,
to make propitiation FOR the sins of the people.

The BLOOD of Jesus:

Ephesians 2:13
But now in Christ Jesus
you who formerly were far off have been brought near by the blood of Christ.

Hebrews 10:19
Therefore, brethren, since we have confidence
to enter the holy place (presence of God) by the blood of Jesus,

Hebrews 12:24
and to Jesus, the mediator of a new covenant,
and to the (His) sprinkled blood, which speaks better than the blood of Abel.

Hebrews 13:20
Now the God of peace, who brought up from the dead
the great Shepherd of the sheep
through the blood of the eternal covenant,
even Jesus our Lord,

1 Peter 1:2 ...a peek a the TRI-UNE GOD?
according to the foreknowledge of God the Father,
by the sanctifying work of (God) the (Holy) Spirit,
to obey (God the Son) Jesus Christ
and be sprinkled with His blood:
May grace and peace be yours in the fullest measure.

1 John 1:7
but if we (believers) walk in the Light as He Himself is in the Light,
we have fellowship with one another, and
the blood of Jesus His Son CLEANSES (washes away) us from all sin.

Revelation 1:5
and from Jesus Christ,
the faithful witness, the firstborn of the dead, and the ruler of the kings of the earth.
To Him who loves us and released us from our sins by His blood—

Blood Bought 1953 · Nov 27, 2017

Hethatreadethit · Dec 2, 2017

Christ said :

Joh 6:53 Then Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except ye eat the flesh of the Son of man, and drink his blood, ye have no life in you.
Joh 6:54 Whoso eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, hath eternal life; and I will raise him up at the last day.
Joh 6:55 For my flesh is meat indeed, and my blood is drink indeed.
Joh 6:56 He that eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, dwelleth in me, and I in him.
Joh 6:57 As the living Father hath sent me, and I live by the Father: so he that eateth me, even he shall live by me.
Joh 6:58 This is that bread which came down from heaven: not as your fathers did eat manna, and are dead: he that eateth of this bread shall live for ever.

His flesh and blood are representative or symbols of spiritual things:

Joh 6:61 When Jesus knew in himself that his disciples murmured at it, he said unto them, Doth this offend you?
Joh 6:62 What and if ye shall see the Son of man ascend up where he was before?
Joh 6:63 It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.

The food that really has cleansing and life or Spirit in it is His Word and the doing of His Will:

Psa 119:9 BETH. Wherewithal shall a young man cleanse his way? by taking heed thereto according to thy word.

Christ is the Word of God and what gives this real living substance is the Spirit through faith when one hears and believes on it.

Christ said His food was to do the Will of God:

Joh 4:34 Jesus saith unto them, My meat is to do the will of him that sent me, and to finish his work.

Doing the will of God and obeying His Word is sanctification and life to the body of Christ:

Heb 10:7 Then said I, Lo, I come (in the volume of the book it is written of me,) to do thy will, O God.
Heb 10:8 Above when he said, Sacrifice and offering and burnt offerings and offering for sin thou wouldest not, neither hadst pleasure therein; which are offered by the law;
Heb 10:9 Then said he, Lo, I come to do thy will, O God. He taketh away the first, that he may establish the second.
Heb 10:10 By the which will we are sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all.

The Church is part of that body for which it is sanctified by doing the will of God.

Rom 12:1 I beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that ye present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, which is your reasonable service.
Rom 12:2 And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God.
Rom 12:3 For I say, through the grace given unto me, to every man that is among you, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think; but to think soberly, according as God hath dealt to every man the measure of faith.
Rom 12:4 For as we have many members in one body, and all members have not the same office:
Rom 12:5 So we, being many, are one body in Christ, and every one members one of another.

Atonement is a cleansing and by following Christ, the word of God, and by doing the will of God does one really find salvation. No hocus pocus to it.

1Pe 1:19 But with the precious blood of Christ, as of a lamb without blemish and without spot:
1Pe 1:20 Who verily was foreordained before the foundation of the world, but was manifest in these last times for you,
1Pe 1:21 Who by him do believe in God, that raised him up from the dead, and gave him glory; that your faith and hope might be in God.
1Pe 1:22 Seeing ye have purified your souls in obeying the truth through the Spirit unto unfeigned love of the brethren, see that ye love one another with a pure heart fervently:
1Pe 1:23 Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.

Christ is the name for He who is named "The Word of God". The Life is in the blood:

Deu 12:23 Only be sure that thou eat not the blood: for the blood is the life; and thou mayest not eat the life with the flesh.

Then there is the Word of Life:

Php 2:16 Holding forth the word of life; that I may rejoice in the day of Christ, that I have not run in vain, neither laboured in vain.

And as I said, the Word of God has Spirit in it to those who believe and follow it, in the body of Christ.

yeshuaslavejeff · Dec 2, 2017

That's a good idea.
Yes, Salvation is at stake.

Dan Brooks · Dec 3, 2017

How did Paul and Silas respond when the Philippian jailer asked them what he must do to be saved?
Acts 16:29-31
29 "Then he called for a light, and sprang in, and came trembling, and fell down before Paul and Silas,

30 And brought them out, and said, Sirs, what must I do to be saved?

31 And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house."

There is nothing we can do to earn our salvation. All we can do is believe on the Lord Jesus Christ. And even that can't be done but by the grace of God, which is itself a gift.
So, I would agree with him. Anything you add to the blood of Jesus Christ takes away from the blood of Jesus Christ.

Can Christ’s Blood Sacrifice By Itself “really” Save?

Ned Flander’s Buddy

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What U See is What U Get!

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