Jan001

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Sounds like you are firmly believing that you are saved. And no, once you have authentically received Jesus as Savior, you cannot become "unborn." I could fill up this response with scripture in support of that, but these two are for you: Romans 10:8-13, Romans 8:1.

Be blessed!

Regarding Romans 10:8-13:
"But what does it say? The word is near you, on your lips and in your heart (that is, the word of faith which we preach); 9 because, if you confess with your lips that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. 10 For man believes with his heart and so is justified, and he confesses with his lips and so is saved. 11 The scripture says, “No one who believes in him will be put to shame.” 12 For there is no distinction between Jew and Greek; the same Lord is Lord of all and bestows his riches upon all who call upon him. 13 For, “every one who calls upon the name of the Lord will be saved.” rsv​

All people can become saved and Jesus first gives us salvation if and when we call upon the name of the LORD through baptism as He commanded in Matthew 28:18-20. This salvation is His gift to us. We can not become saved by ourselves. However, once we receive salvation, we must continue in our salvation through obedience to God's commandments. There is no continued belief in Jesus Christ unless there is continued obedience to Jesus' commandments.

A born again (baptized) person will lose his salvation if he commits sins such as adultery, fornication, abortion, etc.

A correct understanding of Scripture does not support OSAS. To follow Jesus means to strive to imitate His life of holiness. It means obedience to God's commandments. This obedience to God's commandments must be continued until death if the person desires to be counted worthy to inherit eternal life. If a person falls away from the faith because of his sin, he can become saved again by repenting and confessing his sin.


Baptism as commanded by Jesus in Matthew 28:18-20 is what makes a person spiritually born again into fellowship with God.
A person can fall away from this fellowship with God at any time he chooses. He personally chooses to fall away when he commits sins like the following:

Revelation 21:8
But as for the cowardly, the faithless, the polluted, as for murderers, fornicators, sorcerers, idolaters, and all liars, their lot shall be in the lake that burns with fire and sulphur, which is the second death.” rsv

1 Corinthians 6:8-10
But you yourselves wrong and defraud, and that even your own brethren.
9 Do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither the immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor sexual perverts, 10 nor thieves, nor the greedy, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor robbers will inherit the kingdom of God. rsv

Galatians 5:19-21
Now the works of the flesh are plain: fornication, impurity, licentiousness, 20 idolatry, sorcery, enmity, strife, jealousy, anger, selfishness, dissension, party spirit, 21 envy, drunkenness, carousing, and the like. I warn you, as I warned you before, that those who do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God. rsv

Ephesians 5:5
Be sure of this, that no fornicator or impure man, or one who is covetous (that is, an idolater), has any inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and of God. rsv


Regarding Romans 8:1
"There is therefore now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus." rsv​

2 Corinthians 13:5-6
Examine yourselves, to see whether you are holding to your faith. Test yourselves. Do you not realize that Jesus Christ is in you?—unless indeed you fail to meet the test! 6 I hope you will find out that we have not failed. rsv

1 John 2:4
He who says “I know him” but disobeys his commandments is a liar, and the truth is not in him; rsv
To follow Jesus as our Lord means that we do what He tells us to do. He tells us that we must obey God's commandments until we die in order to inherit eternal life.

Luke 6:46
“Why do you call me ‘Lord, Lord,’ and not do what I tell you? rsv

Matthew 7:21-23
“Not every one who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. 22 On that day many will say to me, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and cast out demons in your name, and do many mighty works in your name?’ 23 And then will I declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from me, you evildoers.’ rsv

Luke 13:23-27
Someone asked him, “Lord, are only a few people going to be saved?”
He said to them, 24 “Make every effort to enter through the narrow door, because many, I tell you, will try to enter and will not be able to. 25 Once the owner of the house gets up and closes the door, you will stand outside knocking and pleading, ‘Sir, open the door for us.’
“But he will answer, ‘I don’t know you or where you come from.’
26 “Then you will say, ‘We ate and drank with you, and you taught in our streets.’
27 “But he will reply, ‘I don’t know you or where you come from. Away from me, all you evildoers!’ niv


 
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Winken

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Regarding Romans 10:8-13:
"But what does it say? The word is near you, on your lips and in your heart (that is, the word of faith which we preach); 9 because, if you confess with your lips that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. 10 For man believes with his heart and so is justified, and he confesses with his lips and so is saved. 11 The scripture says, “No one who believes in him will be put to shame.” 12 For there is no distinction between Jew and Greek; the same Lord is Lord of all and bestows his riches upon all who call upon him. 13 For, “every one who calls upon the name of the Lord will be saved.” rsv​

All people can become saved and Jesus first gives us salvation if and when we call upon the name of the LORD through baptism as He commanded in Matthew 28:18-20. This salvation is His gift to us. We can not become saved by ourselves. However, once we receive salvation, we must continue in our salvation through obedience to God's commandments. There is no continued belief in Jesus Christ unless there is continued obedience to Jesus' commandments.

A born again (baptized) person will lose his salvation if he commits sins such as adultery, fornication, abortion, etc.

A correct understanding of Scripture does not support OSAS. To follow Jesus means to strive to imitate His life of holiness. It means obedience to God's commandments. This obedience to God's commandments must be continued until death if the person desires to be counted worthy to inherit eternal life. If a person falls away from the faith because of his sin, he can become saved again by repenting and confessing his sin.


Baptism as commanded by Jesus in Matthew 28:18-20 is what makes a person spiritually born again into fellowship with God.
A person can fall away from this fellowship with God at any time he chooses. He personally chooses to fall away when he commits sins like the following:

Revelation 21:8
But as for the cowardly, the faithless, the polluted, as for murderers, fornicators, sorcerers, idolaters, and all liars, their lot shall be in the lake that burns with fire and sulphur, which is the second death.” rsv

1 Corinthians 6:8-10
But you yourselves wrong and defraud, and that even your own brethren.
9 Do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither the immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor sexual perverts, 10 nor thieves, nor the greedy, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor robbers will inherit the kingdom of God. rsv

Galatians 5:19-21
Now the works of the flesh are plain: fornication, impurity, licentiousness, 20 idolatry, sorcery, enmity, strife, jealousy, anger, selfishness, dissension, party spirit, 21 envy, drunkenness, carousing, and the like. I warn you, as I warned you before, that those who do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God. rsv

Ephesians 5:5
Be sure of this, that no fornicator or impure man, or one who is covetous (that is, an idolater), has any inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and of God. rsv


Regarding Romans 8:1
"There is therefore now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus." rsv​
2 Corinthians 13:5-6
Examine yourselves, to see whether you are holding to your faith. Test yourselves. Do you not realize that Jesus Christ is in you?—unless indeed you fail to meet the test! 6 I hope you will find out that we have not failed. rsv

1 John 2:4
He who says “I know him” but disobeys his commandments is a liar, and the truth is not in him; rsv
To follow Jesus as our Lord means that we do what He tells us to do. He tells us that we must obey God's commandments until we die in order to inherit eternal life.

Luke 6:46
“Why do you call me ‘Lord, Lord,’ and not do what I tell you? rsv

Matthew 7:21-23
“Not every one who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. 22 On that day many will say to me, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and cast out demons in your name, and do many mighty works in your name?’ 23 And then will I declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from me, you evildoers.’ rsv

Luke 13:23-27
Someone asked him, “Lord, are only a few people going to be saved?”
He said to them, 24 “Make every effort to enter through the narrow door, because many, I tell you, will try to enter and will not be able to. 25 Once the owner of the house gets up and closes the door, you will stand outside knocking and pleading, ‘Sir, open the door for us.’
“But he will answer, ‘I don’t know you or where you come from.’
26 “Then you will say, ‘We ate and drank with you, and you taught in our streets.’
27 “But he will reply, ‘I don’t know you or where you come from. Away from me, all you evildoers!’ niv


I'm saddened each time this concept is presented --- and it is presented far too often. The inability of some of us to rightly divide Scripture into 1) that which is applicable to eternal security and 2) all else which is non-applicable, re the scriptures quoted in Jan001's post (ripped out of Holy Spirit-provided context, ignoring His Interpretation and Application of God's Precious Word, provided to each of us who embrace the Precious Name of Jesus). I'm convinced that those Scriptural Truths, ripped out of context and used thereafter, in a false context, thereby dividing and deceiving those of us who proclaim eternal security in Christ Jesus, and confusing those who are considering salvation in Him, will be the subject matter of the Judgment Seat of Christ, not for the purpose of removing eternal security but for the purpose of presenting eternal rewards
 
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wayfaring man

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I can hardly bring myself to do anything right now, all I can do is focus on my fears. I want to die but fear death more than I ever have. I just want peace with Christ. I fear that the LORD hates me. Like the passages with Esau, He might hate me and there's nothing I can do. (Like: "Jacob I loved, but Esau I hated." And that Esau could not get his birthright even seeking it WITH TEARS)

I hear so many people bringing up the literal wording of the unpardonable sin passages and saying they hate people twisting blasphemy (which is modernly defined as defiant irreverence or slander) into persistent unbelief. That people do this to deny that some living people have done something to secure their condemnation while they're still alive. This, and Jesus's own words "By your words you will be acquitted, and by your words you will be condemned." Make me fear. So I'll ask, and please refrain from calling me dramatic this is no small business, is there hope? Is it forgivable only in ignorance? Impulsive thoughts? As long as you don't mean it? Once you stop living that way? Can anyone be forgiven as long as they have physical breath?

Is the sin WILLING or WILLFUL? Speaking certain words or deliberate disbelief?

I fear I will never have peace again. I miss the days where I could lay in the sunshine and appreciate God's love and His amazing creations but now I can mainly just fear.

Sounds like you're experiencing 'living in defeat', which is not a pleasant thing. But it doesn't have to stay that way.

The devil wants to say we've gone too far, we've past the point of no return...but if that were true, why would he still be trying to convince us that it is so ?!!

He wouldn't. He'd already have moved on to his next potential victim.

However, a breakthrough is still needed.

Prayer and fasting is often an effective means of enabling us to humble ourselves and repent beyond what we are normally capable of....

Think of how Peter must have felt when he denied The Lord 3 times in front of witnesses, after he had been so close to Him and had adamantly declared that he was ready to die before he'd distance himself from The Lord. See Mark 14

And yet by God's grace and Christ's mercy Peter went on to serve as one of the chief apostles, and in his later writings there is a godly humility, which testifies that even though he failed miserable as The Lord had warned him he would - even that bitter experience worked a good thing within his heart, mind, soul, and spirit.


The elders which are among you I exhort, who am also an elder, and a witness of the sufferings of Christ, and also a partaker of the glory that shall be revealed:
Feed the flock of God which is among you, taking the oversight thereof, not by constraint, but willingly; not for filthy lucre, but of a ready mind;
Neither as being lords over God's heritage, but being ensamples to the flock.
And when the chief Shepherd shall appear, ye shall receive a crown of glory that fadeth not away.
Likewise, ye younger, submit yourselves unto the elder. Yea, all of you be subject one to another, and be clothed with humility: for God resisteth the proud, and giveth grace to the humble.
Humble yourselves therefore under the mighty hand of God, that he may exalt you in due time:
Casting all your care upon him; for he careth for you. <---> 1st Peter 5:1-7

May The Lord Be Pleased to Bless & Keep. Amen.
 
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Jan001

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I'm saddened each time this concept is presented --- and it is presented far too often. The inability of some of us to rightly divide Scripture into 1) that which is applicable to eternal security and 2) all else which is non-applicable, re the scriptures quoted in Jan001's post (ripped out of Holy Spirit-provided context, ignoring His Interpretation and Application of God's Precious Word, provided to each of us who embrace the Precious Name of Jesus). I'm convinced that those Scriptural Truths, ripped out of context and used thereafter, in a false context, thereby dividing and deceiving those of us who proclaim eternal security in Christ Jesus, and confusing those who are considering salvation in Him, will be the subject matter of the Judgment Seat of Christ, not for the purpose of removing eternal security but for the purpose of presenting eternal rewards

Jesus Christ's words are straight-forward about the reality that many people fall away from the faith.
A person falls away from the faith when he chooses to sin the types of sins that Paul warns about (some I listed in my previous post).

You do not understand that when a person falls away from the faith, he loses his salvation.

Jesus Christ's Words:
Luke 8:13
And the ones on the rock are those who, when they hear the word, receive it with joy; but these have no root, they believe
for a while and in time of temptation fall away. rsv
Here is another type of sin that causes a Christian to lose his salvation:

1 Timothy 5:8
If any one does not provide for his relatives, and especially for his own family, he has disowned the faith and is
worse than an unbeliever. rsv
Paul states that a Christian who disowns his faith through his sin of neglect of his family's needs is even worse than being an unbeliever!

Do you believe that a Christian who neglects his relatives will still inherit eternal life if he does not repent and confess this grievous sin before he dies? I certainly do not!
 
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Winken

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Jesus Christ's words are straight-forward about the reality that many people fall away from the faith. A person falls away from the faith when he chooses to sin the types of sins that Paul warns about (some I listed in my previous post).

You do not understand that when a person falls away from the faith, he loses his salvation.

Jesus Christ's Words:
Luke 8:13
And the ones on the rock are those who, when they hear the word, receive it with joy; but these have no root, they believe
for a while and in time of temptation fall away. rsv
Here is another type of sin that causes a Christian to lose his salvation:

1 Timothy 5:8
If any one does not provide for his relatives, and especially for his own family, he has disowned the faith and is
worse than an unbeliever. rsv
Paul states that a Christian who disowns his faith through his sin of neglect of his family's needs is even worse than being an unbeliever!

Do you believe that a Christian who neglects his relatives will still inherit eternal life if he does not repent and confess this grievous sin before he dies? I certainly do not!
I believe God's Word. Salvation is by Grace through Faith, the Amazing Gift of God, never of works, lest we should get carried away with that. At the time of the Gift of Salvation the Holy Spirit enters in to each Believer. I'm reminded of the words in a song.......

"Take Thou my heart, cleanse every part, Holy Spirit, breathe on me."

Taking every part of my heart, which is sickened by sin, cleansing it, resulting in a "new me." I am now the Righteousness of God in Christ; old mind-sets, foggy thoughts, grievous sin, intellectualism, opinions, anger, distress, hopelessness, mis-understanding of His Word (there's a much longer list) instantly fade away. There is joy in knowing that my heart has been replaced by His abundant and sufficient Spiritual Nature. I can speak to family, friends, church (small c) members, those basking in sin, walking in all the darkness I have listed, above, with a smile on my face and joy erupting, Spiritually.

One simply cannot, must not, use a single verse of scripture to nullify many others, and vice-versa.

There are times when I "lose the handle" in these forums; Thank God not that often. When it happens, I repent. I turn to 1 John 1:9. He and I meet, and there I hear Him say, "Go in Peace."
 
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As much as we are willing to repent for our sins, God will forgive us, because the Bible tells us, that God desires mercy and not sacrifice!

It is possible (but not necessarily true) that the unforgivable sin for which the Bible talks, is about people, who do not wish to repent ever, regardless of what happens with them! For some reason, they do not want to repent ever! That puts them in a situation where they can not be forgiven and the blood of Jesus can not clean them from sin, if they are unwilling to accept Jesus as Lord and Saviour!
 
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Jan001

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I believe God's Word. Salvation is by Grace through Faith, the Amazing Gift of God, never of works, lest we should get carried away with that. At the time of the Gift of Salvation the Holy Spirit enters in to each Believer. I'm reminded of the words in a song.......

"Take Thou my heart, cleanse every part, Holy Spirit, breathe on me."

Taking every part of my heart, which is sickened by sin, cleansing it, resulting in a "new me." I am now the Righteousness of God in Christ; old mind-sets, foggy thoughts, grievous sin, intellectualism, opinions, anger, distress, hopelessness, mis-understanding of His Word (there's a much longer list) instantly fade away. There is joy in knowing that my heart has been replaced by His abundant and sufficient Spiritual Nature. I can speak to family, friends, church (small c) members, those basking in sin, walking in all the darkness I have listed, above, with a smile on my face and joy erupting, Spiritually.

One simply cannot, must not, use a single verse of scripture to nullify many others, and vice-versa.

There are times when I "lose the handle" in these forums; Thank God not that often. When it happens, I repent. I turn to 1 John 1:9. He and I meet, and there I hear Him say, "Go in Peace."

So, since you believe that "one simply cannot, must not, use a single verse of scripture to nullify many others, and vice-versa," how do you reconcile the following statements:

Acts 2:21
And it shall be that whoever calls on the name of the Lord shall be saved.’ rsv

Matthew 7:21
Not every one who says to me (Jesus), ‘Lord, Lord,’ shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. rsv

It is my opinion that every Scripture is true when properly understood in its intended context.

Do you think Jesus was lying when He stated that some people (Christians) do believe in Him for a while but, when they are tempted to sin, they choose to sin, and thereby they fall away/lose their faith/salvation?

Luke 8:13
And the ones on the rock are those who, when they hear the word, receive it with joy; but these have no root, they believe for a while and in time of temptation fall away. rsv

I believe Jesus' words. It is very possible for a Christian to lose his salvation. And, if he does not repent of his sins before he dies, he will not be approved to inherit/enter eternal life.

 
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Aldebaran

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So, since you believe that "one simply cannot, must not, use a single verse of scripture to nullify many others, and vice-versa," how do you reconcile the following statements:

Acts 2:21
And it shall be that whoever calls on the name of the Lord shall be saved.’ rsv

Matthew 7:21
Not every one who says to me (Jesus), ‘Lord, Lord,’ shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. rsv

It is my opinion that every Scripture is true when properly understood in its intended context.

Do you think Jesus was lying when He stated that some people (Christians) do believe in Him for a while but, when they are tempted to sin, they choose to sin, and thereby they fall away/lose their faith/salvation?

Luke 8:13
And the ones on the rock are those who, when they hear the word, receive it with joy; but these have no root, they believe for a while and in time of temptation fall away. rsv

I believe Jesus' words. It is very possible for a Christian to lose his salvation. And, if he does not repent of his sins before he dies, he will not be approved to inherit/enter eternal life.

It's difficult to. I think that's why there will always be questions. In one verse, we read that if we call on His name, we'll be saved. We also read from Paul that it's not a result of works, but simply grace itself. Then we hear that we have to do the will of the Father, or we'll lose our salvation. It does get confusing.
 
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Winken

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The confusion results from failing to rightly divide the Truth of scripture (2 Timothy 2:15, KJV). We cannot, must not, pluck one verse out of context, then glue it to another. "Rightly Dividing" is an utterly Spiritual matter, the Holy Spirit providing the interpretation and application.

For example, one is not going to take up snakes or do battle with scorpions as a Christian mandate today. We rightly divide what? The audience in that day, the Speaker, the message, its intent and purpose, from scripture intended for Christians today.
 
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Breckmin

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Perfect LOVE casts out fear.

Read Romans 8 at least 3x's and it will begin to help you.

Satan wants to rob us of our joy in Christ.

God loves those who come to Him on their knees. Believe that the Sacrifice of Jesus on the Cross is great enough to apply to you personally... and that it can pay for any of our sin.
 
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Jan001

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It's difficult to. I think that's why there will always be questions. In one verse, we read that if we call on His name, we'll be saved. We also read from Paul that it's not a result of works, but simply grace itself. Then we hear that we have to do the will of the Father, or we'll lose our salvation. It does get confusing.

There are two parts to salvation.

First, Jesus gives us salvation as his gift to us when we repent, believe, and receive baptism as He commanded in Matthew 28:18-20.

And Jesus came and said to them, “All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me. 19 Go therefore and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, 20 teaching them to observe all that I have commanded you; and lo, I am with you always, to the close of the age.” rsv​

The following Scriptures refer to Jesus' command in Matthew 28:19.

Acts 2:21
And it shall be that whoever calls on the name of the Lord shall be saved.’ rsv

Mark 16:16
He who believes and is baptized will be saved; but he who does not believe will be condemned. rsv
It is actually baptism which first washes away all our sins and so it is baptism that first saves us.

Acts 22:16
And now why do you wait? Rise and be baptized, and wash away your sins, calling on his name.’

The second part of salvation refers to remaining faithful in obedience to God's commandments until we die so that we will then be approved worthy to inherit eternal life.

Revelation 2:10
Do not fear what you are about to suffer. Behold, the devil is about to throw some of you into prison, that you may be tested, and for ten days you will have tribulation. Be faithful unto death, and I will give you the crown of life. rsv

Matthew 7:21-23
Not every one who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of my Father who is in heaven.
22 On that day many will say to me, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and cast out demons in your name, and do many mighty works in your name?’ 23 And then will I declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from me, you evildoers.’
So, after we receive baptism and are thereby saved, we must then remain faithful to Jesus by obeying (observing) God's commandments (the Father's will) until we die if we desire to inherit eternal life. Matthew 28:20 refers to this command of Jesus.

20 teaching them to observe all that I have commanded you; and lo, I am with you always, to the close of the age rsv

Jude 1:20-23
But you, beloved, build yourselves up on your most holy faith; pray in the Holy Spirit; 21 keep yourselves in the love of God; wait for the mercy of our Lord Jesus Christ unto eternal life. 22 And convince some, who doubt; 23 save some, by snatching them out of the fire; on some have mercy with fear, hating even the garment spotted by the flesh. rsv

Acts 14:21-22
When they had preached the gospel to that city and had made many disciples, they returned to Lystra and to Ico′nium and to Antioch, 22 strengthening the souls of the disciples, exhorting them to continue in the faith, and saying that through many tribulations we must enter the kingdom of God. rsv
A Christian who returns to his old way of sin loses his salvation and he will not inherit eternal life unless he repents of his sins before he dies.

Hebrews 10:26-27
For if we sin deliberately after receiving the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins, 27 but a fearful prospect of judgment, and a fury of fire which will consume the adversaries. rsv

Salvation is a life-long process, not a one-time event.





 
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masmpg

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I can hardly bring myself to do anything right now, all I can do is focus on my fears. I want to die but fear death more than I ever have. I just want peace with Christ. I fear that the LORD hates me. Like the passages with Esau, He might hate me and there's nothing I can do. (Like: "Jacob I loved, but Esau I hated." And that Esau could not get his birthright even seeking it WITH TEARS)

I hear so many people bringing up the literal wording of the unpardonable sin passages and saying they hate people twisting blasphemy (which is modernly defined as defiant irreverence or slander) into persistent unbelief. That people do this to deny that some living people have done something to secure their condemnation while they're still alive. This, and Jesus's own words "By your words you will be acquitted, and by your words you will be condemned." Make me fear. So I'll ask, and please refrain from calling me dramatic this is no small business, is there hope? Is it forgivable only in ignorance? Impulsive thoughts? As long as you don't mean it? Once you stop living that way? Can anyone be forgiven as long as they have physical breath?

Is the sin WILLING or WILLFUL? Speaking certain words or deliberate disbelief?

I fear I will never have peace again. I miss the days where I could lay in the sunshine and appreciate God's love and His amazing creations but now I can mainly just fear.

Here is comfort for your heart NOW! David wrote in
Psalms:34:18: "The LORD is nigh unto them that are of a broken heart; and saveth such as be of a contrite spirit."
Psalms:51:17: "The sacrifices of God are a broken spirit: a broken and a contrite heart, O God, thou wilt not despise." God uses these "tool" to bring us to Him.

My life has been one of trials, huge trials one right after the other. From being poisoned with roundup and my health has been up and down for over 30 years, to being nicknamed Jeff Jinx through my school years and been in many accidents including going through the windshield of a pickup truck at 14, to watching my mom die and my son died six months later. I have stood in the middle of a field while hearing lightening when it happened as I was holding my arms outstretched yelling to God take me, I do not want to live any more! This is not fear. Paul said in Philippians:1:21: "For to me to live is Christ, and to die is gain." This verse has given me much comfort. I know he is referring to spiritual death of the old man, I still look at it as physical death as long as I do not do it myself. I lay my life before the throne every morning asking God to take it and do His will with it as He sees fit. Never fear death. I crave it because it will mean I no longer have to live in this sinful dreadful world, but will be laid to rest until Jesus comes to wake me up. The Lord has been showing me recently more about why my life has been one long train wreck. Testimonies can be a blessing to many, and someone like you I can relate to. My prayer is that you desire to communicate and I will share some awesome things from God's word that will thrill your heart, namely the real definition of the "unpardonable sin".
 
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Kelly McArthur

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I can hardly bring myself to do anything right now, all I can do is focus on my fears. I want to die but fear death more than I ever have. I just want peace with Christ. I fear that the LORD hates me. Like the passages with Esau, He might hate me and there's nothing I can do. (Like: "Jacob I loved, but Esau I hated." And that Esau could not get his birthright even seeking it WITH TEARS)

I hear so many people bringing up the literal wording of the unpardonable sin passages and saying they hate people twisting blasphemy (which is modernly defined as defiant irreverence or slander) into persistent unbelief. That people do this to deny that some living people have done something to secure their condemnation while they're still alive. This, and Jesus's own words "By your words you will be acquitted, and by your words you will be condemned." Make me fear. So I'll ask, and please refrain from calling me dramatic this is no small business, is there hope? Is it forgivable only in ignorance? Impulsive thoughts? As long as you don't mean it? Once you stop living that way? Can anyone be forgiven as long as they have physical breath?

Is the sin WILLING or WILLFUL? Speaking certain words or deliberate disbelief?

I fear I will never have peace again. I miss the days where I could lay in the sunshine and appreciate God's love and His amazing creations but now I can mainly just fear.


Everything's going to be okay, Jesus didn't make promises to you to break them, when he say's you're forgiven you are, you're to walk in his promises without guilt and shame. You know he's not from here, this world is not his home, this world is called earth where the little seeds grow up. He loves you and gave you this little story about seeds for you to imagine:

Hearken; Behold, there went out a sower to sow: And it came to pass, as he sowed, some fell by the way side, and the fowls of the air came and devoured it up. And some fell on stony ground, where it had not much earth; and immediately it sprang up, because it had no depth of earth: But when the sun was up, it was scorched; and because it had no root, it withered away. And some fell among thorns, and the thorns grew up, and choked it, and it yielded no fruit. And other fell on good ground, and did yield fruit that sprang up and increased; and brought forth, some thirty, and some sixty, and some an hundred. And he said unto them, He that hath ears to hear, let him hear.

— Mark, 4:3-9, KJV

The earth is where we are and good ground is where we want to be and in darkness is where we put down good roots in him. In this world we will have many trials and temptations, he told us before hand. He promised to never leave us or forsake us and he never breaks his promises and he loves you with an everlasting love. The seed in the good ground is our earthly bodies and inside is life and our soul is called innocent lamb, pure virginal light, and when the seed opens up in the darkness our light joins with his and he becomes our life and no matter where we go or who we're with, there he is with us always.

These are the best times when we grow when it darkness, when we can actually have a relationship with him one on one. You ask him a question and he hears you always and you'll hear him softly speaking with few words with love and the HS is with you to help understand. Lord Jesus loves you, yes he does, no matter what you've done or how you think and he never works with guilt or shame and Satan cannot accuse you with him, you're forgiven always, Jesus just tells him to get behind you, and he does.

You have the Holy Spirit as your comforter and teacher, I know her as wisdom and she loves you very very much, so you're never alone and you always have someone to talk to in there, that's the kingdom that belongs to the little children that no man can take away. And remember both darkness and light work together to help us grow; without the darkness we wouldn't know him, that's the secret, everyone wants to shine in the light they don't know about the darkness, that's where he is to help you grow up good and strong in him. We find him at our lowest and feel him at our worst, how many tears we cry, and he wipes them all away and that's when you know he loves you and he's not worried one iota and you're not making anything up in your mind, when you hear him you'll know him. :purpleheart: M
 
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marineimaging

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I can hardly bring myself to do anything right now, all I can do is focus on my fears. I want to die but fear death more than I ever have. I just want peace with Christ. I fear that the LORD hates me. Like the passages with Esau, He might hate me and there's nothing I can do. (Like: "Jacob I loved, but Esau I hated." And that Esau could not get his birthright even seeking it WITH TEARS)

I hear so many people bringing up the literal wording of the unpardonable sin passages and saying they hate people twisting blasphemy (which is modernly defined as defiant irreverence or slander) into persistent unbelief. That people do this to deny that some living people have done something to secure their condemnation while they're still alive. This, and Jesus's own words "By your words you will be acquitted, and by your words you will be condemned." Make me fear. So I'll ask, and please refrain from calling me dramatic this is no small business, is there hope? Is it forgivable only in ignorance? Impulsive thoughts? As long as you don't mean it? Once you stop living that way? Can anyone be forgiven as long as they have physical breath?

Is the sin WILLING or WILLFUL? Speaking certain words or deliberate disbelief?

I fear I will never have peace again. I miss the days where I could lay in the sunshine and appreciate God's love and His amazing creations but now I can mainly just fear.

I hope this helps because I was just like you. Then, one day I heard a voice say that if I had committed the unpardonable sin then I would not be worried about it. It is the nature of one who commits that final and lasting sin to have NEVER sought Gods forgiveness or love or caring hand. The people in the time of Noah had reached a point where they were not just sinning but they, every one, had a hard heart against God and were lost in their own wretchedness. The people of Sodom and Gomorrah had reached a point where there was not one worthy of saving. Not a one of them sought God or cared or desired God or wanted God to lead them or wanted salvation and Grace..., not a one. God did not make Lot's wife turn to look back at the cities. She did it longing for their wretched lifestyle and God turned her into a pillar of salt for it. But she had a lot more understanding of what she was doing than you do today. Again, it is not the nature of those who are guilty of blaspheme of the Holy Spirit to ever, ever turn toward God. They were lost and eternally dead before their blasphemy. You, on the other hand, seek Gods love and forgiveness. My suggestion to you is to get up, get out and do things IN THE NAME OF CHRIST. Your deeds won't save you but they will embrace you and when you see the Love of Christ in your behavior, you will know and not fear. A 90 year old pastor friend said that, "worry is the devils delight." Just remember this. In Matthew 4 when Satan tempted Jesus during His 40 days and nights in the wilderness, Jesus responded each time with "It is written..." The Lord wants us to find our answers in the Bible. The church is to reinforce, not belittle or badger us into submission. If that church is not teaching the Bible as Gods Word, it might be time to find another Bible Teaching, Bible Believing home. How do you know? When the pastor says, "What I believe is..." It is not what the pastor believes. It is what God says in his eternal living Word. Get up, go out, and do and teach others Gods Word.
 
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Jan001

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I believe God's Word. Salvation is by Grace through Faith, the Amazing Gift of God, never of works, lest we should get carried away with that. At the time of the Gift of Salvation the Holy Spirit enters in to each Believer. I'm reminded of the words in a song.......

"Take Thou my heart, cleanse every part, Holy Spirit, breathe on me."

Taking every part of my heart, which is sickened by sin, cleansing it, resulting in a "new me." I am now the Righteousness of God in Christ; old mind-sets, foggy thoughts, grievous sin, intellectualism, opinions, anger, distress, hopelessness, mis-understanding of His Word (there's a much longer list) instantly fade away. There is joy in knowing that my heart has been replaced by His abundant and sufficient Spiritual Nature. I can speak to family, friends, church (small c) members, those basking in sin, walking in all the darkness I have listed, above, with a smile on my face and joy erupting, Spiritually.

One simply cannot, must not, use a single verse of scripture to nullify many others, and vice-versa.

There are times when I "lose the handle" in these forums; Thank God not that often. When it happens, I repent. I turn to 1 John 1:9. He and I meet, and there I hear Him say, "Go in Peace."

RE: One simply cannot, must not, use a single verse of scripture to nullify many others, and vice-versa.

REPLY: I agree.

At the Last Judgment (AKA Sheep and Goats Judgment and White Throne Judgment), how are people judged? Are they judged by their faith alone or are they judged by their good/evil works which are the manifestation of their faith or their lack of faith? After this Final/Last judgment, where do all the obedient righteous sheep go to spend eternity? After this Final/Last judgment, where do all the disobedient unrighteous goats go to spend eternity? Jesus explains this very clearly:


Matthew 25:31-46
The Sheep and the Goats
31 “When the Son of Man comes in his glory, and all the angels with him, he will sit on his glorious throne. 32 All the nations will be gathered before him, and he will separate the people one from another as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats. 33 He will put the sheep on his right and the goats on his left.

34 “Then the King will say to those (SHEEP) on his right, ‘Come, you who are blessed by my Father; take your inheritance, the kingdom prepared for you since the creation of the world. 35 For I was hungry and you gave me something to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me something to drink, I was a stranger and you invited me in, 36 I needed clothes and you clothed me, I was sick and you looked after me, I was in prison and you came to visit me.

37 “Then the righteous will answer him, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry and feed you, or thirsty and give you something to drink? 38 When did we see you a stranger and invite you in, or needing clothes and clothe you? 39 When did we see you sick or in prison and go to visit you?’

40 “The King will reply, ‘Truly I tell you, whatever you did for one of the least of these brothers and sisters of mine, you did for me.’

41 “Then he will say to those (GOATS) on his left, ‘Depart from me, you who are cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels. 42 For I was hungry and you gave me nothing to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me nothing to drink, 43 I was a stranger and you did not invite me in, I needed clothes and you did not clothe me, I was sick and in prison and you did not look after me.
44 “They also will answer, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry or thirsty or a stranger or needing clothes or sick or in prison, and did not help you?’
45 “He will reply, ‘Truly I tell you, whatever you did not do for one of the least of these, you did not do for me.’
46 “Then they (GOATS) will go away to eternal punishment, but the righteous (SHEEP) to eternal life.”niv


"Faith" without "doing the good works to accompany this "faith" will not save anyone.

James 2:24
You see that a person is considered righteous by what they do and not by faith alone. niv



Even the demons believe in God, but none of them are saved because they did evil works.



James 2:18-20
18 But someone will say, “You have faith; I have deeds.”
Show me your faith without deeds, and I will show you my faith by my deeds. 19 You believe that there is one God. Good! Even the demons believe that—and shudder.
20 You foolish person, do you want evidence that faith without deeds is useless? 21 Was not our father Abraham considered righteous for what he did when he offered his son Isaac on the altar? 22 You see that his faith and his actions were working together, and his faith was made complete by what he did. niv
See also: Matthew 7:20-23, Luke 13:23-27

In other words:
"Faith alone" does not make a person worthy to inherit eternal life. Jesus judges us by our works and not by our faith only.
 
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Jan001

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It's difficult to. I think that's why there will always be questions. In one verse, we read that if we call on His name, we'll be saved. We also read from Paul that it's not a result of works, but simply grace itself. Then we hear that we have to do the will of the Father, or we'll lose our salvation. It does get confusing.

Yes, there will always be questions. :)
But, there are usually answers to these questions.

To come to Jesus and be saved, we first need to repent and then "call on His name" which is an idiom for the water baptism which is commanded by Jesus in Matthew 28:18-20. It is this baptism which washes away our sins and thereby makes us His disciples.

Acts 22:16
And now what are you waiting for? Get up, be baptized and wash your sins away, calling on his name.’ niv
It is by grace that we are saved. Only Jesus has the power to save us. We cannot save ourselves. Adam by his sin lost all possibility for us to enter into eternal life with God in heaven and then Jesus redeemed us from Adam's sin and thereby restored the possibility for us to enter into eternal life with God in heaven. What we do and don't do on earth determines where we spend eternity.

Once saved by God's grace, we must continue in this salvation/grace until we die in order to then be approved worthy by Jesus' judgment to enter into eternal life with God. How do we continue in this salvation/grace until we die? We continue in this grace by obedience to God's commandments/by doing the will of the Father in heaven until we die which is to love our neighbors as ourselves. Unrepented sinners/Christians who call on Jesus' name to save them after they die will not be saved and Jesus explains why in Matthew 7:20-23 and also in Luke 13:23-27. A person can commit sin either by disobedience to God's commandments as shown in the Scriptures I just posted or also by omission and Matthew 25:31-46 shows examples of sins of omission.

Paul was teaching the Romans that none of the works of the Law of Moses will/can save them. Only Jesus' sacrifice on the cross saves them and this is through the water of Baptism that is commanded by Jesus Christ in Matthew 28:18-20. After we are saved through the baptism of Jesus (Mark 16:16) we must continue in our salvation/grace until we die. We continue in this grace by obeying God's commandments and doing His will until we die. Paul was not writing about the righteous works that are commanded of every Christian to do if they desire to be approved worthy to inherit eternal life. Jesus explains in Matthew 25:31-46 how He will judge all of us in this teaching about the Sheep and Goats Judgment/White Throne Judgment.



 
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FredVB

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There needs to be repentance to sin that is realized in one's life, with this trusting Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior that he is for salvation in him so then to live for him. With this we love Yahweh God, and are sealed with the Spirit of God, that God always will work with us, that we endure.
 
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