When does the kingdom come

The Times said:

This type of exegesis has an agenda to defend a beastly nation, right?

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The Lord does judge the last Gentile World Ruler as His world says, and then He brings in His rulership as we all well know. And the final Gentile World Rulership is described as `beastly.`

Marilyn.

mark kennedy said:

Well I'm glad you enjoyed it, loved the insight into the splitting of the Mount of Olives. I would really enjoy discussing more eschatology with you.

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Thanks mark kennedy,

Look forward to discussing more of God`s word with you, especially eschatology. It`s good to find others who like to discuss without having to `defend` a position but actually looking at God`s word. We can all learn from each other of what the Holy Spirit has revealed to each of us.

regards, Marilyn.

Marilyn C said:

And how did all those poor people from Adam to Pentecost receive salvation? Or are we the only ones?

Marilyn.

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Please stop deflecting the issue at heart and just take Jesus at his Word.....

“Let anyone who is thirsty come to me and drink. 38Whoever believes in me, as Scripture has said, rivers of living water will flow from within them.” 39By this he meant the Spirit, whom those who believed in him were later to receive. Up to that time the Spirit had not been given, since Jesus had not yet been glorified. (John 7:37-39)

The Old Testament Saints had the Mosaic Law and Zechariah was pointing to a prophetic time in the future, that is from Pentecost and onwards, when the Living Waters will be freely made available to those who flee and join the mountain congregation of Jesus Christ aka His Church. His Church is his beloved spiritual City Jerusalem, symbolizing the Mountain of Olives, that is Peace.

That is why Zechariah makes distinction of the Northern Congregation and the Southern Congregation, by identifying them as the former sea (old testament saints) and the latter sea (new testament saints).

The Living waters were made available to both from Pentecost and onwards.

That is why John makes distinction of these two groups as....

they sing the song of Moses the servant of God, and the song of the Lamb, saying, (Revelations 15:3)

In Revelation the old testament saints are said to be the servants of God who died for the Word of God and the new testament saints are said to be the followers of the Lamb and those who make their robes white by the blood of the lamb, having the testimony of the Lamb.

Marilyn C said:

The Lord does judge the last Gentile World Ruler as His world says, and then He brings in His rulership as we all well know. And the final Gentile World Rulership is described as `beastly.`

Marilyn.

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Why is not the Jewish World Rulership beastly too?

Both the Old Testament saints and the New Testament saints are God's beloved City Jerusalem that descends and originates from Heaven.

Any earthly nation is by definition beastly, whether it be Gentile or Jewish.

The Times said:

Why is not the Jewish World Rulership beastly too?

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Because God has revealed that the World Rulers after Israel rebelled, are Gentile World Rulers till He deals with them. Five gentile World Rulers, 4 have gone and the last one to come, as the Great Image overview of God`s timeline tells us. (Dan. 2)

Marilyn.

The Times said:

Both the Old Testament saints and the New Testament saints are God's beloved City Jerusalem that descends and originates from Heaven.

Any earthly nation is by definition beastly, whether it be Gentile or Jewish.

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The Body of Christ is delineated separately from the Old Testament saints.

`But you have come to Mount Zion,
and to the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem,
to an innumerable company of angels,
to the General Assembly
and church of the first-born who are registered in heaven,
to God the judge of all,
to the spirits of just men made perfect,...` (Heb. 12: 22 & 23)

Mount Zion represents the rulership in heaven where the Body of Christ is enrolled, while the city part comes down to near the earth with the spirits of just men (& women) OT saints.

Note : Jerusalem comprises of two parts, Mount Zion (rulership) & also the city part. Two parts for different groups of rulership in two different realms.

Marilyn.

Marilyn C said:

Because God has revealed that the World Rulers after Israel rebelled, are Gentile World Rulers till He deals with them. Five gentile World Rulers, 4 have gone and the last one to come, as the Great Image overview of God`s timeline tells us. (Dan. 2)

Marilyn.

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I find it challenging to believe you at your word, that God sets up a Spiritual Kingdom (Church) on Earth, a Kingdom that is declared to outlast all earthly kingdoms, dominions, authority and power, according to Daniel 2:44, yet he comes and rules an antithesis earthly kingdom, which is in vast contrast to his already established Church Kingdom Thesis, where he has been The Kingly High Priest for the last 2000 and counting.

Why would God have a vested interest in both a Heavenly Kingdom and an earthly kingdom?

It makes no sense. Once Jesus was made Kingly Chief Priest of the Commonwealth of Israel, his Jewish and Gentile Church, then Daniel 2:44 has been fulfilled. So why would God revert back to the nationalistic Israelite kingdom owing to the Old Testament period of Judges and kings. It seems a complete reversal or undoing of what God did through his Christ.

Daniel 2:44-45
44“In the time of those kings, the God of heaven will set up a kingdom that will never be destroyed, nor will it be left to another people. It will crush all those kingdoms and bring them to an end, but it will itself endure forever.45This is the meaning of the vision of the rock cut out of a mountain, but not by human hands—a rock that broke the iron, the bronze, the clay, the silver and the gold to pieces.

The Rock is the Cornerstone Jesus Christ. Notice it is not a literal rock and not a literal mountain. It is Jesus Christ the Kingly High Priest of his mountain congregation, that is his Church. Christ's Church is that Kingdom established 2000 years ago.

Marilyn C said:

The Body of Christ is delineated separately from the Old Testament saints.

`But you have come to Mount Zion,
and to the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem,
to an innumerable company of angels,
to the General Assembly
and church of the first-born who are registered in heaven,
to God the judge of all,
to the spirits of just men made perfect,...` (Heb. 12: 22 & 23)

Mount Zion represents the rulership in heaven where the Body of Christ is enrolled, while the city part comes down to near the earth with the spirits of just men (& women) OT saints.

Note : Jerusalem comprises of two parts, Mount Zion (rulership) & also the city part. Two parts for different groups of rulership in two different realms.

Marilyn.

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But you can not harmonise Pentecost Living Waters, because according to your exegesis the Living Waters have not yet been made available. This would be contrary to the words of Jesus declared in (John 7:37-39)

The Times said:

I'm sorry, no!
The whole of scripture points to our Lord and saviour Jesus Christ.

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Yes, indeed it does. Is it not a spiritual journey to redeem our soul, reconcile it back to the Father?
"For everything that was written in the past was written for our instruction, so that through endurance and the encouragement of the Scriptures, we might have hope."

PeaceJoyLove said:

Yes, indeed it does. Is it not a spiritual journey to redeem our soul, reconcile it back to the Father?
"For everything that was written in the past was written for our instruction, so that through endurance and the encouragement of the Scriptures, we might have hope."

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Are we doing that or is He doing it through us?

Marilyn C said:

The Body of Christ is delineated separately from the Old Testament saints.

`But you have come to Mount Zion,
and to the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem,
to an innumerable company of angels,
to the General Assembly
and church of the first-born who are registered in heaven,
to God the judge of all,
to the spirits of just men made perfect,...` (Heb. 12: 22 & 23)

Mount Zion represents the rulership in heaven where the Body of Christ is enrolled, while the city part comes down to near the earth with the spirits of just men (& women) OT saints.

Note : Jerusalem comprises of two parts, Mount Zion (rulership) & also the city part. Two parts for different groups of rulership in two different realms.

Marilyn.

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More than one is not seeing with singleness of eye...Christ has been since the before the beginning...

"Now, Father, glorify Me together with Yourself, with the glory which I had with You before the world was."

Behold, the Lamb of God, who takes away the sin of the world ... 'slain before the foundation of the world was laid'

God's plan is all about being ONE...kingdom, spirit, nation, Truth...seeing by 'eye' not hearing of the ear...

The Times said:

Are we doing that or is He doing it through us?

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Of course it is Him.

The Times said:

I find it challenging to believe you at your word, that God sets up a Spiritual Kingdom (Church) on Earth, a Kingdom that is declared to outlast all earthly kingdoms, dominions, authority and power, according to Daniel 2:44, yet he comes and rules an antithesis earthly kingdom, which is in vast contrast to his already established Church Kingdom Thesis, where he has been The Kingly High Priest for the last 2000 and counting.

.

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The Times, I don`t believe that the Lord will set up a spiritual kingdom rule here on earth through the Body of Christ. Not sure where you got that idea.

Marilyn.

PeaceJoyLove said:

More than one is not seeing with singleness of eye...Christ has been since the before the beginning...

"Now, Father, glorify Me together with Yourself, with the glory which I had with You before the world was."

Behold, the Lamb of God, who takes away the sin of the world ... 'slain before the foundation of the world was laid'

God's plan is all about being ONE...kingdom, spirit, nation, Truth...seeing by 'eye' not hearing of the ear...

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Hi PeaceJoyLove,

Remember that Israel is called the ekklesia of God - meaning called out. called out of the nations.
Then the Body of Christ is also called the ekklesia of God - meaning called out of Israel and the nations. We are a heavenly nation which is part of God`s over all kingdom rule through out the universe, earth and angelic realm.

regards, Marilyn.

The Times said:

Why would God have a vested interest in both a Heavenly Kingdom and an earthly kingdom?

It makes no sense. Once Jesus was made Kingly Chief Priest of the Commonwealth of Israel, his Jewish and Gentile Church, then Daniel 2:44 has been fulfilled. So why would God revert back to the nationalistic Israelite kingdom owing to the Old Testament period of Judges and kings. It seems a complete reversal or undoing of what God did through his Christ.

Daniel 2:44-45
44“In the time of those kings, the God of heaven will set up a kingdom that will never be destroyed, nor will it be left to another people. It will crush all those kingdoms and bring them to an end, but it will itself endure forever.45This is the meaning of the vision of the rock cut out of a mountain, but not by human hands—a rock that broke the iron, the bronze, the clay, the silver and the gold to pieces.

The Rock is the Cornerstone Jesus Christ. Notice it is not a literal rock and not a literal mountain. It is Jesus Christ the Kingly High Priest of his mountain congregation, that is his Church. Christ's Church is that Kingdom established 2000 years ago.

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Hi The times,

It seems to me you have forgotten that God is Omniscient - all knowing.

So it seems to me you think that God planned and created a special nation - Israel, worked with them for centuries and then when they rebelled He thought "well....I better move on to plan B, the Body of Christ." That is what you are saying - replacing Israel.

When in actual fact, God planned it all, His earthly rulership through Israel when He again connects with them, forgives them and they receive Him as their Messiah and King.

Then we, the Body of Christ are the part of the plan that was hidden until God revealed it to the Apostle Paul. We were rebellious people, He forgave us and we receive Him as Head of the Body.

regards, Marilyn.

The Times said:

But you can not harmonise Pentecost Living Waters, because according to your exegesis the Living Waters have not yet been made available. This would be contrary to the words of Jesus declared in (John 7:37-39)

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Now Times, we know that the Holy Spirit was active in people in the Old Testament. How could they write God`s word? How could David say `Take not thy Holy Spirit from me?`

In John 7: 37 - 39 the `giving of the Holy Spirit` after Christ ascended was to bring the very life of Christ, His divine nature into our spirits. This obviously was not possible till after Christ died, rose from the dead and ascended to the Father.

`The last Adam became a life-giving spirit.` (1 Cor. 15: 45)
`...that through these you may be partakers of the divine nature,...` (2 peter 1: 4)

Marilyn.

Marilyn C said:

The Times, I don`t believe that the Lord will set up a spiritual kingdom rule here on earth through the Body of Christ. Not sure where you got that idea.

Marilyn.

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God is not into half and half measures or half glass full and half glass empty scenario as far as the establishing of his Kingdom.

Luke 17:20–21, is a clear statement that Christ's own coming is the coming of the kingdom.

Being asked by the Pharisees when the kingdom of God was coming, he answered them, "The kingdom of God is not coming with signs to be observed; nor will they say, 'Lo, here it is!' or 'There! for behold, the kingdom of God is in the midst of you.'"

First, Jesus begins to correct a misunderstanding of the kingdom—namely, that it would come with such observable signs that it would be unmistakable: Rome would be overturned, Israel would be vindicated, and an earthly kingdom would be established. Jesus said, "No, it is not coming in a way that can be observed like that. There is a mystery about the coming of the kingdom. It is here in your midst without those kinds of observable signs. It is here because I am here. I am the arrival of the kingdom, even though I will not overturn the Romans or set up an earthly kingdom"

Another clear statement about the presence of the kingdom is Matthew 12:28 (cf. Luke 11:20). The Pharisees accuse Jesus of casting out demons by the power of Beelzebub (v. 24). But Jesus has a very different interpretation of what's happening. He says in verse 28, "If it is by the power of the Spirit of God that I cast out demons, then the kingdom of God has come upon you." When Jesus does battle with Satan by the Spirit of God, and begins to plunder the strong man's house (v. 29), freeing people from his bondage, the powers of the kingdom are at work and the kingdom is already present.

Are not the powers of the Kingdom at work for the last 2000 years and counting?

Very truly I tell you, whoever believes in me will do the works I have been doing, and they will do even greater things than these, because I am going to the Father. (John 14:12)

If he did not establish a physical kingdom on earth the 1st time, then what makes you sure that he will establish it the 2nd time he comes?

It is not as if he is making a 2nd go or attempt at it, is he?

His Kingdom is one that he established according to the prophesy of Daniel 2:44-45. This Kingdom is directly connected to the Kingdom in Heaven that awaits the resurrected believers, in his Father's house (John 14:2-3)

So as the Lord's prayer goes thy Kingdom come, thy will be done on earth as it is in Heaven.

Therefore the Cornerstone Christ Jesus established this Kingdom Church as a portal to the Heavenly Kingdom. It is a migration process from this temporal life, death, then leading to resurrection to eternal life, to be forever with the Lord. We are reigning with him now and will endure God willing, even unto death and leading to resurrection to eternal life.

Treasures in Heaven

19“Do not store up for yourselves treasures on earth, where moths and vermin destroy, and where thieves break in and steal. 20But store up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where moths and vermin do not destroy, and where thieves do not break in and steal. 21For where your treasure is, there your heart will be also.

It would be a contradiction if Jesus setup a physical kingdom on earth.

Marilyn C said:

So it seems to me you think that God planned and created a special nation - Israel, worked with them for centuries and then when they rebelled He thought "well....I better move on to plan B, the Body of Christ." That is what you are saying - replacing Israel.

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His plan was always plan A all the way and his Kingdom manifested and was established the 1st time and on time as prophesied by Daniel 2:44-45.

Marilyn C said:

When in actual fact, God planned it all, His earthly rulership through Israel when He again connects with them, forgives them and they receive Him as their Messiah and King.

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So according to you, God wanted to rule from Israel all along and he had failed the 1st time, because he was unable to convince the Jews, so the 2nd time around he will have better luck, is that right?

What you speak of is the plan B, when plan A failed, right?

Marilyn C said:

Then we, the Body of Christ are the part of the plan that was hidden until God revealed it to the Apostle Paul. We were rebellious people, He forgave us and we receive Him as Head of the Body.

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It was first the faithful Jewish Apostles who accepted him and then later the Gentiles, so the Church is Jew and Gentile.

Does it matter if Jesus was politically not accepted by the nation itself?

Absolutely not!

God carried on with his plan A.

Marilyn C said:

Now Times, we know that the Holy Spirit was active in people in the Old Testament. How could they write God`s word? How could David say `Take not thy Holy Spirit from me?`

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The Living Waters would be given, after the Kingly High Priest was glorified.

This fulfilled the prophesy of "Anointing the Most Holly" mentioned in....

Daniel 9:24.

The glorified Anointed/Christ was given power in Heaven and on earth and along with this decree, Daniel 2:44 was fulfilled when he recieved the Kingdom from God the Father.

What purpose and function does an anointed King have without an established Kingdom that he reigns from?

It would be a joke if a King is anointed as the Messiah/Christ, only to have to wait 2000 years before he can reign, due to the people who he would be King over reject him to this very day.

What a cruel joke indeed?

It would imply God resorted to plan B because plan A failed. Notwithstanding the excuses that you would make!

Marilyn C said:

In John 7: 37 - 39 the `giving of the Holy Spirit` after Christ ascended was to bring the very life of Christ, His divine nature into our spirits. This obviously was not possible till after Christ died, rose from the dead and ascended to the Father.

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Oh please, It was always about the Kingdom he established the 1st time. His Church is the portal, the very Minorah of God that calls many to the commonwealth of Heavenly Israel.

The anointed King is with his Church Kingdom on earth.

Jesus said.....

And I also say to you that you are Peter, and on this rock I will build My church, and the gates of Hades not will prevail against it.

Mark my words, Israel and any other earthly nation for that matter will cease to exist and the Church Kingdom of Jesus will continue even forever, after it migrates from this temporal realm to the eternal realm in Christ's Father's house. This would culminate at the consecration of the Bride at Christ's second coming, where the earthly kingdoms are no more and death is no more.