Does God want us to "sin less" in this life or to "stop sinning?"

Bible Highlighter · Oct 9, 2017

Adstar said:
You are a works salvation believer so i doubt any scriptures i provide will move you..

If salvation is secured by us by ceasing to sin then Jesus died for nothing...

If salvation is by ceasing to sin then you are doomed to the eternal lake of fire.. Because one this is for sure.. You shall not be able to live a life without sin.. And no doubt you have already failed many times in the past by sinning..

Peter identifies certain false teachers as having not ceased from sin (2 Peter 2:1, 2 Peter 2:14).
Peter says we are to arm ourselves with the same mind as Christ in suffering as He did, and then says that by suffering we are able to cease from sin. Peter then says we should not live the rest of our time here on this Earth to the lust of the flesh but to the will of God (1 Peter 4:1-2). Paul says we are to cleanse ourselves from all filthiness of the flesh and spirit perfecting holiness in the fear of God (2 Corinthians 7:1). Galatians 5:24 says that they that are Christ's have crucified the affections and lusts.

BetzaidaK · Oct 9, 2017

Jason0047 said:
Does God want us to "sin less" or to "stop sinning?"

Please use Scripture to justify your answer;
Thank you and may God's love shine upon you.

Hello,
Since one is imperfect, it is impossible to not sin. God knows this and so did the Apostles. That is why Jesus Christ offered himself in order to pay the debt of Adam and thus give humanity the chance to acquire eternal life.Even Paul mentioned in Romans 7:20-23 that even though he wanted to do what was right, the flesh always inclined him to what was bad. 2 Chronicles 6:36 also mentions that there is no man that can't sin. So the answer to your question is to have a humble heart and try as best as one can to follow God's norms. God doesn't seek perfection. He seeks sincerity in the heart, Zephaniah 2:3 states:
Seek Jehovah, all you meek ones of the earth, Who observe his righteous decrees. Seek righteousness, seek meekness. Probably you will be concealed on the day of Jehovah’s anger." So if you're doing your best, God is not seeing any sin in you as Christ's blood is paying for it.

1213 · Oct 9, 2017

SkyWriting said:
Yes we can stop doing all sin that we are aware of.
But we are not aware of even the sins we think we are aware of.
If God's word calls on us to "Pray Continuously" (it does) and we don't
do that, even after we read that, then we are sinning even though
we know it is a sin. And we are sinning when we forget as well.

I have understood sin means basically that one rejects God, or lives without God. That one doesn’t do all exactly as it is commanded or asked, doesn’t necessary mean person sins. That I think because it is said:

If anyone listens to my sayings, and doesn't believe, I don't judge him. For I came not to judge the world, but to save the world. He who rejects me, and doesn't receive my sayings, has one who judges him. The word that I spoke, the same will judge him in the last day.
John 12:47-48

"Two men went up into the temple to pray; one was a Pharisee, and the other was a tax collector. The Pharisee stood and prayed to himself like this: 'God, I thank you, that I am not like the rest of men, extortioners, unrighteous, adulterers, or even like this tax collector. I fast twice a week. I give tithes of all that I get.' But the tax collector, standing far away, wouldn't even lift up his eyes to heaven, but beat his breast, saying, 'God, be merciful to me, a sinner!' I tell you, this man went down to his house justified rather than the other; for everyone who exalts himself will be humbled, but he who humbles himself will be exalted."
Luke 18:10-14

"Don't think that I came to destroy the law or the prophets. I didn't come to destroy, but to fulfill. For most assuredly, I tell you, until heaven and earth pass away, not even one smallest letter or one tiny pen stroke shall in any way pass away from the law, until all things are accomplished. Whoever, therefore, shall break one of these least commandments, and teach others to do so, shall be called least in the Kingdom of Heaven; but whoever shall do and teach them shall be called great in the Kingdom of Heaven.
Mat. 5:17-19

This is the judgment, that the light has come into the world, and men loved the darkness rather than the light; for their works were evil. For everyone who does evil hates the light, and doesn't come to the light, lest his works would be exposed. But he who does the truth comes to the light, that his works may be revealed, that they have been done in God."
John 3:19-21

Bible Highlighter · Oct 9, 2017

A_Thinker said:
Jesus' sacrifice made it possible for us to become the CHILDREN of God.

John 1

12 But as many as received Him, to them He gave the right to become children of God, to those who believe in His name: 13 who were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.

But like the Parable of the Sower, some only believed for a while and fell away due to riches or being unwilling to be persecuted.

You said:
1 John 3

1 Behold what manner of love the Father has bestowed on us, that we should be called children of God!

As CHILDREN of God, we experience all that that entails.

We have been adopted into the family of God, ... and so, receive His guidance, provision, sustainment, comfort, peace, chastisement, ... and FORGIVENESS for our sins. As God's spiritual CHILDREN, we will SIN (i.e. miss the mark, as CHILDREN do). But we should be growing in our Godliness (i.e. the character of God), and so, should SIN LESS as we progress on the path on which God leads us.

AS a loving Father, God commands us NOT TO SIN, as we command our children also, but He is also ready and anxious to forgive the repentant heart for sins committed.

You started off the right verse (i.e. 1 John 3:1), but then you started adding your own opinion.

Let's see two key verses have to say (within that chapter) that refutes your belief.

1 John 3:8 says, "He that committeth sin is of the devil;"
1 John 3:10 says, "In this the children of God are manifest, and the children of the devil: whosoever doeth not righteousness is not of God, neither he that loveth not his brother." (1 John 3:10).

Bible Highlighter · Oct 9, 2017

BetzaidaK said:
Hello,
Since one is imperfect, it is impossible to not sin. God knows this and so did the Apostles. That is why Jesus Christ offered himself in order to pay the debt of Adam and thus give humanity the chance to acquire eternal life.

No. You have things backwards. Jesus did not die so you that you could still sin or not worry about sin. Ephesians 5:25-27 and Titus 2:14 both say that Jesus gave Himself for the purpose to make us holy, without blemish, and to be zealous of good works. In fact, the grace of God teaches us to deny ungodliness and to live righteously in this present world (Titus 2:11-12). 2 Corinthians 7:1 says, "we are to cleanse ourselves from ALL filthiness of the flesh and spirit perfecting holiness in the fear of God." I really do not see how this verse fits with your belief, unless of course you change it to mean something else.

You said:
Paul mentioned in Romans 7:20-23 that even though he wanted to do what was right, the flesh always inclined him to what was bad.

In Defending of what Romans 7 really says:
(Click on the following spoiler button):

Peter says this about Paul's writings,
"As also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction." (2 Peter 3:16).

In Romans 7:1-6, Paul is telling Messianic Christians (i.e. those brethren who know Old Testament Law - Romans 7:1) that the Old Law is dead and that they should serve in newness of Spirit (i.e. the New Testament Scriptures that were still being formed) and not in oldness of the letter (i.e. the Torah, etc.). This makes sense because Hebrews 7:12 says the Law has changed. This lines up with the temple veil being torn from top to bottom when Christ died (Which started the New Covenant officially). The Old Testament Laws on animal sacrifices was no longer in effect anymore and Jesus Christ was now our passover Lamb or perfect sacrifice. Hence, why Romans 7:2 says, "if the husband [i.e. Jesus] be dead, she [i.e. the body of believers] is loosed from the law [i.e. the Old Law] of her husband."

In Romans 7:7-13, Paul is recounting Israelite history and speaking as a Jew throughout time with the coming in of the Law of Moses and what that was like.

In Romans 7:14-24, Paul is recounting his experience as a Pharisee before he became a Christian. Paul (Saul) is describing his experience of what it is like to struggle in keeping the Old Covenant Law that did not include Jesus Christ.

It is true that the use of first-person present verbs in the passage (“I am” “I practice” “I want” “I hate” “I do”) sounds like Paul is talking about his present experience. But Paul sometimes uses “I” in a rhetorical sense to describe generic experience rather than his own present experience (1 Corinthians 10:30; 1 Corinthians 13:2-3, 1 Corinthians 13:11). In at least one other place, Paul uses a first-person present verb to describe his opponents’ experience (Galatians 2:18).

Romans 7:25 is a verse that transitions back to the present day reality as Paul being a Christian. He is thankful that he now has victory in Jesus Christ His Lord who can deliver him from his body of death (Which was a problem before). Otherwise why is Paul thanking Jesus?

Paul asks the question in verse 24.

Who shall deliver me from this body of death?

I like how the Good News Translation answers this question. It says,

"Thanks be to God, who does this through our Lord Jesus Christ! This, then, is my condition: on my own I can serve God's law only with my mind, while my human nature serves the law of sin." (Romans 7:25 GNT).

The NTE says,

"...So then, left to my own self I am enslaved to God’s law with my mind, but to sin’s law with my human flesh." (Romans 7:25 NTE).

But Romans 13:14 says,
"But put ye on the Lord Jesus Christ, and make not provision for the flesh, to fulfil the lusts thereof."

However, if you are still in doubt, there are 8 reasons in Scripture that show us that Paul is indeed talking as a Pharisee (recounting his past experience) and he is not talking in the present tense as a Christian in Romans 7:14-24.

#1. In Romans 7:6, Paul says we should serve in newness of the spirit and not the oldness of the letter (Which is the Old Law and not the New Testament Scriptures that were still being formed). We are told to SERVE. How do we serve? Do we just do our own thing? No. We follow God's commands in the New Testament. This talk of the Old Law is the context of verses 14-24.

#2. We are dead to the Law by the body of Jesus Christ (Romans 7:4). Would this be the Old Law or ALL law? 1 John 3:23 is a commandment that says we are to believe on the Lord Jesus Christ. This is a New Covenant Law. So obviously we are not dead to this Law or Command. The Scriptures also say, "but now commandeth all men everywhere to repent." (Acts of the Apostles 17:30). Are we dead to this Law? Surely not. Jesus said "repent or perish." (Luke 13:3). Peter told Simon to repent (by way of prayer to God) of his wickedness of trying to pay for the gifts of the Holy Spirit so that he may be forgiven (Acts of the Apostles 8:22). Sin is merely transgression of the Law (1 John 3:4). All this lets us know that men of God can break God's laws and they can be separated from GOD because of it. So surely some kind of Law of God is still in effect and has dire consequences for any person's soul who commits them. For Jesus said that if we do not forgive, we will not be forgiven by the Father (Matthew 6:15). If Jesus was talking to unbelievers, this would not make any sense. They would first need to accept Christ. So the only logical conclusion is that Jesus is talking to believers in Matthew 6:15. You do not forgive (i.e. you sin or break this law of God) and you will not be forgiven or saved. 1 John 3:15 says if you hate your brother you are like a murderer and no murderer has eternal life abiding in them. Again, you hate your brother (which can be a one time act) and you do not have eternal life. It's that simple. Also, Paul condemns circumcision several times. Galatians 5:2 is the biggest verse that condemns circumcision salvationism. Circumcision is an Old Covenant Law and it is not a New Covenant Law. Paul uses the word "law" when he speaks against circumcision. So we have to conclude that Paul is saying we are dead to the Old Covenant Law and not all Law. So again, this talk of the Old Law plays into verses 14-24.

#3. Paul says, "For without the law sin was dead." (Romans 7:8). He also says, "I was alive without the law once: but when the commandment came, sin revived, and I died." (Romans 7:9). This type of saying is nonsensical from a present tense reading as an adult Christian. The only way it sort of works is if Paul is referring to himself as a baby who had no knowledge of God's laws yet. But there are two problem with even that interpretation. One, this view does not seem as consistent with the phrase, "For without the law sin was dead" because even though Paul as a baby did not have any knowledge of the Law yet, the rest of the adult world would have the Law and sin would still be alive to them. Second, Paul says, "And the commandment, which was ordained to life, I found to be unto death. For sin, taking occasion by the commandment, deceived me, and by it slew me." (Romans 7:10-11). Okay, so if Paul grew up and became aware of the Law one day, how could the commandment be ordained to life at this point in his life? The commandment was ordained for life back in the time of the Law of Moses. Also, Paul found that "the commandment" was death unto him and that it slew him. There are no death penalties attached to the commands given to us under the New Testament. Death penalties are only associated with the Laws given to us in the Old Covenant. This is how the Law slew him. For breaking the Old Law could be a loss of his own physical life. So this is talking about the Old Law (and not all Law). So again, this talk of the Old Law plays into verses 14-24.

#4. Paul says, "But sin, that it might appear sin, working death in me by that which is good; that sin by the commandment might become exceeding sinful." (Romans 7:13). Okay. Let's break this down. Paul says, "But sin, that it MIGHT APPEAR SIN, works death in me." (Romans 7:13). Now, how can sin make it appear like it may not be sin? Well, if Jesus was raised and Saul (Paul) was still a Pharisee striving to obey the Old Law when the New Covenant Law was still in effect, the sin that Saul (Paul) was struggling with as a pharisee during that time would not really technically be sin in every case. For if Paul disobeyed certain Old Covenant laws while the New Covenant and it's laws were in effect, then Saul (Paul) is not really breaking any real commandments from God in every case. Hence, why Paul said, "...sin, that it MIGHT APPEAR (as) SIN." (Romans 7:13). The beginning of verse 13 is a foreshadow of what is to come in verses 14-24. Paul is stepping out for a brief moment as speaking as an Israelite living throughout history to speak of his condition as a Pharisee when he says, "...sin, that it might appear sin." In the second half of verse 13, Paul says, that sin by the commandment might become exceeding sinful." (Romans 7:13). This is saying that when God provided the written Law of Moses to his people, there would be a double accountability to keeping God's laws because they are written for all to see now. So an Old Testament saint would feel exceedingly sinful or guilty for breaking God's law back in the Old Testament times because he had in his possession a written down visual law clearly telling him what is right and wrong. So again, Paul is referring to the Old Law here and not all law. This talk of the Old Law plays into verses 14-24.

#5. Paul says in Romans 7:14 that he is carnal and is sold under sin; And yet in Romans 8:2, Pauls says he is free from sin. So unless Paul is contradicting himself, he is talking from two different perspectives.

#6. In Romans 7:25, Paul asks the question: "O wretched man that I am! who shall deliver me from the body of this death?" Asking this kind of question as a Christian does not seem consistent with Paul's following statement if he is already delivered thru Jesus Christ as a Christian. If a believer is delivered by Jesus, and is thankful of that fact, there would be no cry to ask any question that says, "Who shall deliver me from this body of death?"

#7. Here is the final nail in the coffin for this argument. Romans 8:3-4 says,
3 "For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:
4 That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit." (Romans 8:3-4).

So which Law did God send His Son for so as to condemn sin in the flesh?
It was the Old Covenant Law.
For when Jesus died on the cross, the temple veil was ripped from top to bottom letting us know that the Old Testament laws were no longer valid because the Old Laws on the animal sacrifices and the priesthood were no longer acceptable.
Jesus Christ was now our Passover Lamb.
Jesus Christ was soon be our Heavenly High Priest (after He ascended to His father after His resurrection 3 days later) so He can be our mediator between God the Father and man.

Romans 8:4 says, "That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit."

This is saying that the righteous part or aspect of the Old Law can be fulfilled in us.

Paul says elsewhere,
8 "Owe no man any thing, but to love one another: for he that loveth another hath fulfilled the law.
9 For this, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not kill, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, Thou shalt not covet; and if there be any other commandment, it is briefly comprehended in this saying, namely, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
10 Love worketh no ill to his neighbour: therefore love is the fulfilling of the law."

(Romans 13:8-10).

So loving your neighbor is the righteousness of the Old Law!
We fulfill this law by walking after the Spirit and not after the flesh (i.e. sin).

So we see a consistent theme here. The word "law" used in general (with no actual description attached to it) is in reference to the Old Law in Romans 7 and Romans 8. This helps us to understand that Paul is telling us his past experience or life as a Pharisee in struggling to keep the Old Law unsuccessfully because he did not have Jesus Christ yet (in verses 14-24).

#8. In addition, in Romans 8:2, we see the mention of how there are TWO laws. We also learn from this verse that keeping one of these Laws helps us to be set FREE from the other one.

In Romans 8:2, we see:

Law #1. - Law of the Spirit of Life in Christ Jesus.
This is a New Covenant Law that we are still under. What is this Law?
It is fulfilling the righteousness of the Law (i.e. to love your neighbor - Romans 13:8-10) by walking after the Spirit (See Romans 8:3-4).

Law #2. Sin and Death.
This is in reference to the Old Covenant Law as a whole (i.e. the 613 Old Testament Commands within the Torah). It is called the Law of Sin and Death because you could physically be put to death by not obeying this Law.

What is the relationship of these two laws in Romans 8:2?

Keeping the New Law helps us to be free of the Old Law.
For there is no condemnation to those who are in Christ Jesus who WALK not after the flesh, but after the Spirit. (Romans 8:1).

Source used for a for only a few words within this post:
Paul is not Talking about Himself: Why I take the "pre-Christian" Reading of Romans 7:14-25
(Note: The majority of the content of this post on Romans 7 through Romans 8 was written by me).

You said:
2 Chronicles 6:36 also mentions that there is no man that can't sin.

You cannot just rip a verse out of it's context to fit your belief. Did you also read the chapter recently? The context is saying if the Israelites return to the Lord with all their heart, and with all their soul, then He will forgive His people which have sinned against Him.

38 "If they return to thee with all their heart and with all their soul in the land of their captivity, whither they have carried them captives, and pray toward their land, which thou gavest unto their fathers, and toward the city which thou hast chosen, and toward the house which I have built for thy name:
39 Then hear thou from the heavens, even from thy dwelling place, their prayer and their supplications, and maintain their cause, and forgive thy people which have sinned against thee." (2 Chronicles 6:38-39).

2 Chronicles 6:36 is saying there is not a person who has not sinned in the respect of their entire lives. Meaning, even faithful believers used to be sinners before they came to the Lord and started to walk in God's good ways. It is not talking about a believer's life in the present tense. If it was the case, you would have to conclude that you are sinning right now and or that people sin every second of every hour. For if you can be faithful for 5 minutes, logic dictates that you can be faithful for a longer amount of time. Try retreating into a forest for a month and just read the Word of God and pray to the Lord. How are you going to sin then?

You said:
So the answer to your question is to have a humble heart and try as best as one can to follow God's norms. God doesn't seek perfection.

That is a lie.

"Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect." (Matthew 5:48).

"The disciple is not above his master: but every one that is perfect shall be as his master." (Luke 6:40).

Don't believe the word "perfect" means "perfect"?

Here is another related word saying the same thing.

"That ye may be blameless and harmless, the sons of God, without rebuke, in the midst of a crooked and perverse nation, among whom ye shine as lights in the world." (Philippians 2:15).

You said:
He seeks sincerity in the heart, Zephaniah 2:3 states:
Seek Jehovah, all you meek ones of the earth, Who observe his righteous decrees. Seek righteousness, seek meekness. Probably you will be concealed on the day of Jehovah’s anger." So if you're doing your best, God is not seeing any sin in you as Christ's blood is paying for it.

No. Zephaniah 2:3 in the KJV says,
"Seek you the LORD, all you meek of the earth, who have kept his commands; seek righteousness, seek meekness: it may be you shall be hidden in the day of the LORD'S anger."

You can't be keeping His commandments if you are also breaking them, too.
Read 1 John 2:3-4.

salt-n-light · Oct 9, 2017

Jason0047 said:
Does God want us to "sin less" or to "stop sinning?"

Please use Scripture to justify your answer;
Thank you and may God's love shine upon you.

To "sin less" and to "stop sinning" inclines that we by ourselves have the power to control sin.God knows that we can't really do it without him, hence Jesus, and the fact that we have to kill our flesh daily, means that we're basically dealing with sin til the day we die. There will never be a day where we will "sin less" or "stop sinning". (Romans 3:9-20)

He wants us to be in right standing. Right standing isn't void of sin, but it presents us as such through grace and in accordance to the law (Romans 3:21-31). Its like being a citizen. Not every citizen is perfect and sometimes not even worthy, but they are in right standing in accordance to the law. God desires us to be made perfect so that we are presented faultless (Jude 24-25), but not be perfect as to brag about ones flawlessness, for we are all naturally born in sin. Being perfect is flesh-wise and work-wise, being made perfect is soul and spirit wise.

Scripture that came to mind is Titus 2:11-14.

A_Thinker · Oct 9, 2017

Jason0047 said:
Try retreating into a forest for a month and just read the Word of God and pray to the Lord. How are you going to sin then?

By not fellowshipping with the saints ???

"And forsake not the assembling of the saints, as the manner of some is." - Hebrews 10:25

SkyWriting · Oct 9, 2017

1213 said:
I have understood sin means basically that one rejects God, or lives without God. That one doesn’t do all exactly as it is commanded or asked, doesn’t necessary mean person sins.

We live without God as our "Spouse" in this life. So we live in a state of sin.
Being ignorant, we don't know how to do the best for others. As we figure that
out we decide what is right. If we do what is "Right" we never sin. When we do
other than what we think is "right" we are sinning. But without God in our hearts
at every moment, we continue to do wrong. If we ask for forgiveness, God grants it.

Neogaia777 · Oct 9, 2017

How do we stop sinning completely in this life and never make any mistakes ever...? Basically, never be wrong...?

Neogaia777 · Oct 9, 2017

Neogaia777 said:
How do we stop sinning completely in this life and never make any mistakes ever...? Basically, never be wrong...?

I want to not sin, but, if i am honest, i do daily... But I want to not to, just don't know how, I don't think...? And I am asked "Why", I want to or feel I need to do more (not sin, or do away with certain sins) more than I already have, as well...?

I think the why is key or is connected to the how of truly doing it, truly, and not falsely...

God Bless!

Bible Highlighter · Oct 9, 2017

A_Thinker said:
By not fellowshipping with the saints ???

"And forsake not the assembling of the saints, as the manner of some is." - Hebrews 10:25

I think this command has to do with completely forsaking any kind of fellowship (even when the opportunity arises by God). I do not believe this as a 24/7 command or even a weekly command for all believers through out history after Christ's death and resurrection. Did not Paul and other apostles go on long journeys to preach the gospel in a new city or town? What was Philip doing by himself when he ran into the Ethiopian Enuch? But you also have to realize that we are also living in the last days; So this command is not always applicable in the way that you suggest it. Many are living unrighteously in these last days (and have a form of Godliness) (See 2 Timothy 3:1-9).

Jesus says,
"...when the Son of man comes, shall he find faith on the earth?"

In other words, some commands are applicable for the situation or it's own time. Unless of course you cast out devils, and carry a shepherd's staff, etc. (as a part of the commands given to us by Jesus).

Neogaia777 · Oct 9, 2017

Jason0047 said:
I think this command has to do with completely forsaking any kind of fellowship (even when the opportunity arises by God). I do not believe this as a 24/7 command or even a weekly command for all believers through out history after Christ's death and resurrection. Did not Paul and other apostles go on long journeys to preach the gospel in a new city or town? What was Philip doing by himself when he ran into the Ethiopian Enuch? But you also have to realize that we are also living in the last days; So this command is not always applicable in the way that you suggest it. Many are living unrighteously in these last days (and have a form of Godliness) (See 2 Timothy 3:1-9). Some commands are applicable for the situation or the time. Unless of course you cast out devils, and carry a shepherd's staff, etc. (as a part of the commands given to us by Jesus).

2 Timothy 3:5, and or but, "denying it's power", could this be it's power and authority over sin...?

And are therefore acting the way they are...? described in 2 Timothy 3:1-5...

Bible Highlighter · Oct 9, 2017

Mskriskris said:
To "sin less" and to "stop sinning" inclines that we by ourselves have the power to control sin.God knows that we can't really do it without him, hence Jesus, and the fact that we have to kill our flesh daily, means that we're basically dealing with sin til the day we die. There will never be a day where we will "sin less" or "stop sinning". (Romans 3:9-20)

If you believe Romans 3:10 and Romans 3:23 is talking about how the believer will always sin or be under sin, then you must also conclude that no believer has any understanding and does not seek after God, too (Read Romans 3:11). So yeah. Your reading Romans 3 correctly. Paul is quoting from the Psalms.

You said:
He wants us to be in right standing. Right standing isn't void of sin, but it presents us as such through grace and in accordance to the law (Romans 3:21-31).

"Even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ..." (Romans 3:22).

What does the faith the righteousness of God by the faith of Jesus Christ look like?

Jesus said to His disciples,
19 "Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:
20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen." (Matthew 28:19-20).

This is what the righteousness of God by faith in Jesus Christ looks like. We are to teach others to observe everything Christ commanded us (Which would be within the pages of your New Testament).

Jesus says, why do you call me Lord, Lord if you do not do what I say? (Luke 6:46).

You said:
Its like being a citizen. Not every citizen is perfect and sometimes not even worthy, but they are in right standing in accordance to the law.

You are undermining sin. If a person commits grevious sin (like abusing a child, or hating their brother, or committing adultery, etc.) that does not mean they are imperfect. It means they are disloyal to God. It would be like committing treason against your country. Paul says be not deceived. The unrighteous will not inherit the Kingdom of God.

You said:
God desires us to be made perfect so that we are presented faultless (Jude 24-25),

You need to read 1 Peter 4:1-2. We are told that we can cease from sin by suffering as Christ had suffered. Verse 2 says we are to live the rest of our time here not to the lusts of the flesh, but to the will of God. 2 Corinthians 7:1 says we are to cleanse ourselves from ALL filthiness of the flesh and spirit perfecting holiness in the fear of God.

As for Jude:

Jude 1:4 (NIV) says,
"For certain individuals whose condemnation was written about long ago have secretly slipped in among you. They are ungodly people, who pervert the grace of our God into a license for immorality and deny Jesus Christ our only Sovereign and Lord."

You said:
but not be perfect as to brag about ones flawlessness,

There is no such thing for the true and faithful believer. They realize all good comes from the Lord Jesus Christ. All good that they do is Christ (God) working in them.

You said:
for we are all naturally born in sin. Being perfect is flesh-wise and work-wise, being made perfect is soul and spirit wise.

No such Scripture teaches such a false thing.

You said:
Scripture that came to mind is Titus 2:11-14.

Actually, Titus 2:11-14 refutes what you believe. Verse 11-12 says that the grace of God teaches us to deny ungodliness and that we should live righteously in this present world. But you really don't believe we can live righteously in this present world as this text says. Verse 14 says that Jesus gave Himself for us so that He could redeem us from all iniquity and that we should be zealous of good works.

Bible Highlighter · Oct 9, 2017

Neogaia777 said:
2 Timothy 3:5, and or but, "denying it's power", could this be it's power and authority over sin...?

And are therefore acting the way they are...? described in 2 Timothy 3:1-5...

Please clarify. Your not making any sense.

Bible Highlighter · Oct 9, 2017

Neogaia777 said:
How do we stop sinning completely in this life and never make any mistakes ever...? Basically, never be wrong...?

I replied to your post before that gave you an answer for this.

Bible Highlighter · Oct 9, 2017

Neogaia777 said:
I want to not sin, but, if i am honest, i do daily... But I want to not to, just don't know how, I don't think...? And I am asked "Why", I want to or feel I need to do more (not sin, or do away with certain sins) more than I already have, as well...?

I think the why is key or is connected to the how of truly doing it, truly, and not falsely...

God Bless!

You first have to believe the Scriptures that talk about overcoming sin in order for them to work.
Note: Also, believing in a gospel that allows one to think they can sin and still be saved will also work against a person trying to overcome sin, as well. Scripture teaches that we have to repent of our sins.

Neogaia777 · Oct 9, 2017

Jason0047 said:
Please clarify. Your not making any sense.

2 Timothy 2:5, holding a form of godliness, but having denied the power therefore. From these also turn away.

I was wondering what kind of "power" or what "power" could it be talking about, and I thought maybe power of or in overcoming sin in their lives in their person...? The ones that just can't seem to do away with sin or stop sinning... With Pharasitical ones, Those who do not practice what they preach, Pharisees, Ones insisting on O.C. Law alone nowadays... Do as they say, not as they do... Also, People who are unable to repent fully and know it also, denying the power of, by a lack of faith or believing maybe, or other reasons, unable to do away with sinning completely...

What should they do now, how should they proceed....?

Neogaia777 · Oct 9, 2017

Jason0047 said:
I replied to your post before that gave you an answer for this.

So you think it's possible...? Interesting...?

Can I ask are, or do you...?

Bible Highlighter · Oct 9, 2017

disciple1 said:
But if you try to obey those laws you will fail, and have to keep trying.

What verse says that?

You said:
How can you say you love your neighbor as yourself, when there's a billion people in the world without clean water, do you buy anything other than food.

Matthew chapter 25 verses 31-46
When the Son of Man comes" in his glory, and all the angels with him, he will sit on his throne in heavenly glory. All the nations will be gathered before him, and he will separate the people one from another as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats. he will put the sheep on his right and the goats on his left. Then the King will say to those on his right, Come, you who are blessed by my Father; take your inheritance, the kingdom prepared for you since the creation of the world. For I was hungry and you gave me something to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me something to drink, I was a stranger and you invited me in, I needed clothes and you clothed me, I was sick and you looked after me, I was in prison and you came to visit me. then the righteous will answer him, Lord, when did we see you hungry and feed you, or thirsty and give you something to drink? When did we see you a stranger and invite you in, or needing clothes and clothe you? When did we see you sick or in prison and got visit you? The King will reply, I tell you the truth, whatever you did for one of the least of these brothers of mine, you did for me. Then he will say to those on his left, Depart from me, you who are cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels. For I was hungry and you gave me nothing to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me nothing to drink, I was a stranger and you did not invite me in, I needed clothes and you did not clothe me, I was sick and in prison and you did not look after me.They also will answer, Lord, when did we see you hungry or thirsty or a stranger or needing clothes or sick or in prison, and did not help you? He will reply, I tell you the truth, whatever you did not do for one of the least of these, you did not do for me. Then they will go away to eternal punishment, but the righteous to eternal life.

You are only one person and you can only do so much being a limited human being. You make the best of your situation by praying and asking God to help you to acheive the goal in helping the poor. Also, nowhere does God want us to just help the poor alone 24/7 the whole time. There has to be a balance between worshiping God, loving the brethren, helping the poor, preaching the gospel, teaching, reading God's Word, praying, etc.. How so? Remember Judas's words to Jesus involving Mary and the ointment she used on Him? (See John 12).

Neogaia777 · Oct 9, 2017

Jason0047 said:
What verse says that?

You are only one person and you can only do so much being a limited human being. You make the best of your situation by praying and asking God to help you to acheive the goal in helping the poor. Also, nowhere does God want us to just help the poor alone 24/7 the whole time. There has to be a balance between worshiping God, loving the brethren, helping the poor, preaching the gospel, teaching, reading God's Word, praying, etc.. How so? Remember Judas's words to Jesus involving Mary and the ointment she used on Him? (See John 12).

Balance is very important for a lot of reasons...

God Bless!

Does God want us to "sin less" in this life or to "stop sinning?"

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