The Most Common Theological Error in the Western Church Today

pshun2404

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Quite biblical that one.

Revelation 14:11
And the smoke of their torment goes up forever and ever; they have no rest day and night, those who worship the beast and his image, and whoever receives the mark of his name.”​

Not really the same at all...torment defines a state of existence where torture implicates someone who tortures. One can suffer torment all by themselves.
 
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Shempster

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We are eternal beings, and while the eternal lake of fire was not prepared for us, it is one of our possible destinations.

Jeremiah 1:5
"Before I formed thee in the belly I knew thee; and beforethou camest forth out of the womb I sanctified thee, and I ordained thee a prophet unto the nations."

Matthew 25:46 Jesus Christ speaking.
"And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal."

Not believing it will not help. It is a Christian Truth. To believe otherwise is not Christian.

Forgive me...

I completely agree that it is a Christian teaching. No forgiveness required ;)
 
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lesliedellow

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I've never seen a liberal theologian or a theistic evolutionist ever admit to a miracle. The naturalistic assumptions of our age getting into our theology is the error of our age.

Really? You can't have met too many then. Belief in the Resurrection is pretty much de rigueur for any Christian.

There might be a few people on the fringe, such as John Selby Spong, who scarcely qualify as Christians, but they do not represent people like Francis Collins.
 
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mark kennedy

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Really? You can't have met too many then. Belief in the Resurrection is pretty much de rigueur for any Christian.

There might be a few people on the fringe, such as John Selby Spong, who scarcely qualify as Christians, but they do not represent people like Francis Collins.
Francis Collins is pretty typical and kind of rare, he actually admits to the miracles of the New Testament. Most of the theistic evolutionists I have interacted with don't want to talk about them.
 
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lesliedellow

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pneuma erroneously translated as "Spirit" which is transliterated from the Latin spiritus and given an impossible meaning that has been reinvented for centuries.

Πνευμα - wind, air; breath; life, spirit, mind; inspiration; ghost, spiritual being. (Oxford Classical Greek Dictionary)
 
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cloudlight93

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We are eternal beings, and while the eternal lake of fire was not prepared for us, it is one of our possible destinations.

Jeremiah 1:5
"Before I formed thee in the belly I knew thee; and beforethou camest forth out of the womb I sanctified thee, and I ordained thee a prophet unto the nations."

Matthew 25:46 Jesus Christ speaking.
"And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal."

Not believing it will not help. It is a Christian Truth. To believe otherwise is not Christian.

Forgive me...

He who is blessed and the only Sovereign One, the King of kings and Lord of lords. He alone is immortal and dwells in unapproachable light. No one has ever seen Him, nor can anyone see Him. To Him be honor and eternal dominion! Amen. - 1 Timothy 6:16

I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; no one will snatch them out of my hand. - John 10:28 (how can Jesus give us eternal life if we are already eternal beings?)

That servant who knows his master’s will but does not get ready or follow his instructions will be beaten with many blows. But the one who unknowingly does things worthy of punishment will be beaten with few blows. - Luke 12:47

(interesting! seems like there are degrees of punishment within the body of Christ depending on obedience. This is also confirmed by what he says to Pilate. The Jews who delivered Jesus over were in the "greater condemnation")

For by your words you will be acquitted, and by your words you will be condemned. - Matthew 12:37

*Going by scripture, every one has an impartial trial before God where their words are brought before Him, first the Jew then the Gentile unbelievers, and we are not to even get tied up trying to work out their punishment. Paul said even he could not judge it. Yet millions tell non-believers they're going to burn forever...? Hmm..

Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe stands condemned already because they have not believed in the name of God's one and only Son. - John 3:18

Condemned to what? Not eternal torment. See what Paul says:

God "will repay each person according to what they have done." - Romans 2:6

The judgement is where you must stand before God in trial without the redeeming blood of Jesus.

"Anyone who believes in Him will never be put to shame." - Romans 10:11

Believers have passed from death to life, Jesus took our shame and guilt.

What business of mine is it to judge those outside the church? Are you not to judge those inside? God will judge those outside. “Expel the wicked man from among you.” - 1 Corinthians 5:12

Then Paul and Barnabas answered them boldly: “It was necessary to speak the word of God to you first. But since you reject it and do not consider yourselves worthy of eternal life, we now turn to the Gentiles. - Acts 13:46

Now, on to the famous Lazarus and the Rich Man scene...

1. There was a certain rich man who was splendidly clothed in purple and fine linen and who lived each day in luxury.

2. At his gate lay a poor man named Lazarus who was covered with sores.

3. There, in torment, he saw Abraham in the far distance with Lazarus at his side.

The rich man was an offspring of Abraham, knew the will of God (invoke that earlier quote I made before about knowing the will of God and not doing it), and he did not keep the royal law of loving your neighbour as yourself. In fact, he mercilessly didn't consider a man right at his hand, a neighbour so close to him, he did not help. Now he is suffering the just recompense for his evil, merciless deeds he committed against his neighbour.

Now, consider this:

Because judgment without mercy will be shown to anyone who has not been merciful. Mercy triumphs over judgment. - James 2:13

You will be sons of the Most High; for He is kind to the ungrateful and wicked. Be merciful, just as your Father is merciful. - Luke 6:36

Please brothers, time to read the entire Bible not pull 2 quotes out from Revelation and the Lazarus-Rich Man example every single time to make a case. Consider also that the eternal torment scene refers to smoke going up forever AND even if it does give a glimpse of endless torture for some, it's for the sons of disobedience who saw all the trumpets blow and heard all the testimonies, and STILL worshiped the beast.

Please make a case against what I've written here, interested to see.
 
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LittleLambofJesus

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We are eternal beings, and while the eternal lake of fire was not prepared for us, it is one of our possible destinations.

Jeremiah 1:5
"Before I formed thee in the belly I knew thee; and before thou camest forth out of the womb I sanctified thee, and I ordained thee a prophet unto the nations."

Matthew 25:46 Jesus Christ speaking.
"And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal."

Not believing it will not help. It is a Christian Truth. To believe otherwise is not Christian.

Forgive me...
Now, on to the famous Lazarus and the Rich Man scene...

1. There was a certain rich man who was splendidly clothed in purple and fine linen and who lived each day in luxury.
2. At his gate lay a poor man named Lazarus who was covered with sores.
3. There, in torment, he saw Abraham in the far distance with Lazarus at his side.

The rich man was an offspring of Abraham, knew the will of God (invoke that earlier quote I made before about knowing the will of God and not doing it), and he did not keep the royal law of loving your neighbour as yourself. In fact, he mercilessly didn't consider a man right at his hand, a neighbour so close to him, he did not help.

Please brothers, time to read the entire Bible not pull 2 quotes out from Revelation and the Lazarus-Rich Man example every single time to make a case. Consider also that the eternal torment scene refers to smoke going up forever AND even if it does give a glimpse of endless torture for some, it's for the sons of disobedience who saw all the trumpets blow and heard all the testimonies, and STILL worshiped the beast.
.
I wish the Jews would read it, since it shows both their forefather, and their deliverer out of Egypt, another words, both Abraham and Moses in it:

I view it as simply covenanantle, [like I do Revelation],the rich man is representing the OC Levitical Priesthood given thru Moses, and Abraham representing the NC under the faith thru Abraham/Jesus.
In my opinion, it is one of the most awesome powerful parables in the NT...

Rich Man and Lazarus most misunderstood parable in NT?

The parable of Lazarus and the rich man has been the foundation for many of the erroneous beliefs about "hell" within traditional Christianity. Some have viewed it not as a parable, but as a true story Yeshua told to give details about the punishment of sinners in hell.............

LUKE 16:29 "Abraham said to him, 'They have Moses and the prophets; let them hear them.' "

John 5:45 "Do not think that I shall accuse you to the Father;
there is one who accuses youMoses, in whom you trust.......


LUKE 16:30 "And he said, 'Nay! father Abraham;
but if one goes to them from the dead, they will repent.'


Luk 3:8
Bear fruits in keeping with repentance.
And do not begin to say to yourselves, ‘We have Abraham as our father.'
For I tell you, God is able from these stones to raise up children for Abraham.


.................................
upload_2017-10-7_13-4-49.jpeg
 
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yeshuaslavejeff

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Same as it always was:

John 5:37-47
37 And the Father who sent me has himself testified concerning me. You have never heard his voice nor seen his form, 38 nor does his word dwell in you, for you do not believe the one he sent. 39 You studya]">[a] the Scriptures diligently because you think that in them you have eternal life. These are the very Scriptures that testify about me, 40 yet you refuse to come to me to have life.

41 “I do not accept glory from human beings, 42 but I know you. I know that you do not have the love of God in your hearts. 43 I have come in my Father’s name, and you do not accept me; but if someone else comes in his own name, you will accept him. 44 How can you believe since you accept glory from one another but do not seek the glory that comes from the only Godb]">[b]?

45 “But do not think I will accuse you before the Father. Your accuser is Moses, on whom your hopes are set. 46 If you believed Moses, you would believe me, for he wrote about me. 47 But since you do not believe what he wrote, how are you going to believe what I say?”
 
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yeshuaslavejeff

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