Noah's Flood Was Definitely Local, Why?

Aman777 said:

1. The people you are calling Humans are actually the sons of God (prehistoric people) who were NOT Humans (descendants of Adam) meaning they did NOT have Adam's superior intelligence which is like God's. Gen 3:22

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You are using an idiosyncratic definition of "human". It may well be that Adam is not the ancestor of all humans, but all the people I mentioned were, as I said, Homo sapiens or, in common speech, humans. In fact, increasingly, I have seen "human" applied to all members of the genus Homo.

I grant that if you use your definition (human=descendants of Adam =/= all H. sapiens) you can make sense of a global/local flood. But idiosyncratic definitions make for poor communication and understanding. Most people understand "human" as "H. sapiens". Further, there is no evidence that any group of H. sapiens are endowed with intelligence superior to that of other groups.

2. False. It was limited to the largest Lake in Turkey. Adam's world (kosmos) was "totally destroyed" in the Flood and today is at the bottom of the 1500 ft deep Lake.

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Well that would be local and it would not affect humans who were not descendants of Adam unless they lived in the same locality. It certainly would not affect those living on different continents, nor quite some distance removed from Turkey such as those in Central or South Asia, or China.

3. It was a Global flood for the people of Adam's world, but NOT for our Planet.

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That I would agree with. That would be why the literary story of the flood depicts a global flood even though the historical flood was local.

You are using an idiosyncratic definition of "human". It may well be that Adam is not the ancestor of all humans, but all the people I mentioned were, as I said, Homo sapiens or, in common speech, humans. In fact, increasingly, I have seen "human" applied to all members of the genus Homo.

It's because I'm not Homo anything EXCEPT in the world's classification system. God classifies me as a Human, made higher than the Angels and destined to have dominion or rule over His Kingdom and every other living creature. Gen 1:28 Humans were made Billions of years BEFORE any other living creature Gen 2:4-7 making it impossible that Humans could have possibly evolved from the common ancestor of Apes as Godless Evolution falsely teaches.

I grant that if you use your definition (human=descendants of Adam =/= all H. sapiens) you can make sense of a global/local flood. But idiosyncratic definitions make for poor communication and understanding. Most people understand "human" as "H. sapiens". Further, there is no evidence that any group of H. sapiens are endowed with intelligence superior to that of other groups.

How many Cave men have you talked to? My point is that Humans became mixed with the prehistoric people who were already here when the Ark arrived. Today, there are 7 Billion Humans (descendants of Adam) alive on Planet Earth today. It could NOT be slow moving evolution since in the past 1% of time since Homos diverged from Chimps the descendants of Adam (Humans) have SUDDENLY taken mankind to the Moon and back and mindless evolution doesn't do ANYTHING sudden and has NO direction. Amen?

Well that would be local and it would not affect humans who were not descendants of Adam unless they lived in the same locality. It certainly would not affect those living on different continents, nor quite some distance removed from Turkey such as those in Central or South Asia, or China.

It affected every prehistoric person on this Earth some 11k years ago. They began slowly to inherit the superior intelligence of Adam which is like God's. Gen 3:22 Today, Humans, with a free choice to believe in Jesus or not, are getting close to the Judgment of what they really believe.

That I would agree with. That would be why the literary story of the flood depicts a global flood even though the historical flood was local.

It's confined to a single Lake in the mountains of Ararat, while religious zealots look for the 450 ft long covered barge on top of a mountain. Do they really think the Supreme Intelligence of Creation would put the Ark on a mountain instead of in the 1500 ft deep, 75 mile wide Lake? They probably had been following the Theology of ancient men. Amen?

Aman777 said:

How many Cave men have you talked to?

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There is no evidence that cave men were any less intelligent than modern humans. We have more accumulated knowledge, not greater intelligence. Cave men were simply humans who made their homes in caves; they were not a different species than us.

gluadys said:

There is no evidence that cave men were any less intelligent than modern humans. We have more accumulated knowledge, not greater intelligence. Cave men were simply humans who made their homes in caves; they were not a different species than us.

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Cave men never planted a crop, built a house or demonstrated any Human traits, which were first shown by Cain's descendants on Adam's Earth. Adam farmed with NO evolution and Cain built a city and his descendants lived in tents, made musical instruments and had smelting with NO evolution. Gen 4:16-22

Cave men are called the sons of God in the Bible and today's Scientists have falsely assumed that the sons of God (prehistoric people) were Humans, which is impossible since Adam was made Billions of years BEFORE any other living creature. Gen 2:4-7

Aman777 said:

Cave men never planted a crop, built a house or demonstrated any Human traits, which were first shown by Cain's descendants on Adam's Earth. Adam farmed with NO evolution and Cain built a city and his descendants lived in tents, made musical instruments and had smelting with NO evolution. Gen 4:16-22

Cave men are called the sons of God in the Bible and today's Scientists have falsely assumed that the sons of God (prehistoric people) were Humans, which is impossible since Adam was made Billions of years BEFORE any other living creature. Gen 2:4-7

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I wouldn't say they showed no human traits. They were hunter-gatherers. They were skilled craftsmen, makers of new hunting weapons, such as the spear thrower and many other tools. They made clothing and jewelry for themselves, used fire, and they were artists (they produced the famous cave painting of France and Spain) and made musical instruments. They buried their dead with reverence and ceremony. There are some indications they understood the cycle of the seasons and kept calendars. All sounds pretty human to me.

gluadys said:

I wouldn't say they showed no human traits. They were hunter-gatherers. They were skilled craftsmen, makers of new hunting weapons, such as the spear thrower and many other tools. They made clothing and jewelry for themselves, used fire, and they were artists (they produced the famous cave painting of France and Spain) and made musical instruments. They buried their dead with reverence and ceremony. There are some indications they understood the cycle of the seasons and kept calendars. All sounds pretty human to me.

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It does until you realize that most of those things are also animal traits. Compare the technology of Adam's descendants on the first Earth, with NO evolution. Gen 4. Adam farmed and Cain built a city with NO evolution. Art is not mentioned in the traits of Adam's descendants on the first Earth.

The SAME modern human traits are demonstrated FIRST on our Planet AND recorded by secular HISTORY exactly as God told us, beginning in the mountains or Ararat with the arrival of the first humans (descendants of Adam) on our Earth. http://www.fsmitha.com/h1/map00-fc.html Amen?

Aman777 said:

It does until you realize that most of those things are also animal traits.

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Oh? What animals other than humans use fire, wear clothing, make tools for hunting, cooking, sewing, etc. bury their dead, decorate their possessions and their bodies and create art and music?

gluadys said:

Oh? What animals other than humans use fire, wear clothing, make tools for hunting, cooking, sewing, etc. bury their dead, decorate their possessions and their bodies and create art and music?

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Prehistoric animals who evolved from the common ancestor of Apes is what Science calls them. God calls them the sons of God Gen 6:2 because, like Christians, they are innocent in His eyes. We know this because God calls born again Christians the sons of God in the New Testament AFTER they are born Spiritually.

Rom 8:14 For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.

Amen?

gluadys said:

Archeological studies place human settlements on all continents other than Antarctica over 10,000 years ago, possibly as much as 20,000 years ago, with the Americas the last to be penetrated by humans. Humanity had colonized Europe, Central Asia, South Asia and Australia as much as 40,000 years ago. And the whole continent of Africa at least 60,000 years ago.

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Other fun facts:

• Agriculture and animal domestication began no sooner than 10,000 B.C. (Adam did both).
  
• The first modern humans were 200,000 years ago in Ethiopia (long before Adam).

Therefore, Adam appeared after humans had settled every continent and there was no global flood.

Job8 said:

Nothing you have said disproves a global flood. And what exactly is your point? "I don't believe the Bible"?

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I believe the Bible and I believe there was no global flood. Did the writers of the various flood accounts intend to present a historically accurate account of events having no living witnesses and no written documents of? The only way to believe this is something like the dictation theory in which God places the information in their minds supernaturally.

Aman777 said:

Cave men never planted a crop, built a house or demonstrated any Human traits, which were first shown by Cain's descendants on Adam's Earth. Adam farmed with NO evolution and Cain built a city and his descendants lived in tents, made musical instruments and had smelting with NO evolution. Gen 4:16-22

Cave men are called the sons of God in the Bible and today's Scientists have falsely assumed that the sons of God (prehistoric people) were Humans, which is impossible since Adam was made Billions of years BEFORE any other living creature. Gen 2:4-7

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Early humans were hunter-gathers for the first 190,000 years. (I am referring to modern humans, the same species as me and you.)
There were Neanderthal's in Europe maybe 60,000 years and some interbreeding probably occurred since we all have some Neanderthal genes.

Theories about humans and evolution should be grounded in modern science rather than mere speculation unless you have some reason to distrust the science.

Adam was a farmer and used domesticated animals, therefore, he appeared no sooner than 10,000 B.C. since that's when these began.

jesus316 said:

Early humans were hunter-gathers for the first 190,000 years. (I am referring to modern humans, the same species as me and you.)
There were Neanderthal's in Europe maybe 60,000 years and some interbreeding probably occurred since we all have some Neanderthal genes.

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You have confused the sons of God (prehistoric people) with Humans (descendants of Adam). Adam was made with a mind like God's Gen 3:22 while prehistoric people were made with a mind like Apes. Noah, a direct descendant of Adam, brought Adam's superior intelligence to this world of prehistoric people.

jesus316 said:

Theories about humans and evolution should be grounded in modern science rather than mere speculation unless you have some reason to distrust the science.

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Then tell the bumpkins to get busy and read Genesis chapter one so that they can tell us of TRUE Human origins, which were NOT on planet Earth..but on Adam's Earth which was clean dissolved in the flood. Isa 24:19

jesus316 said:

Adam was a farmer and used domesticated animals, therefore, he appeared no sooner than 10,000 B.C. since that's when these began.

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Adam was made the 3rd Day Gen 2:4-7 BEFORE plants, herbs, rain and Trees, which Grew AFTER Adam was made. Gen 2:8-9 Adam died some 700 years BEFORE Noah came to our Earth in the Ark. God Bless you

Aman777 said:

You have confused the sons of God (prehistoric people) with Humans (descendants of Adam). Adam was made with a mind like God's Gen 3:22 while prehistoric people were made with a mind like Apes. Noah, a direct descendant of Adam, brought Adam's superior intelligence to this world of prehistoric people.



Then tell the bumpkins to get busy and read Genesis chapter one so that they can tell us of TRUE Human origins, which were NOT on planet Earth..but on Adam's Earth which was clean dissolved in the flood. Isa 24:19



Adam was made the 3rd Day Gen 2:4-7 BEFORE plants, herbs, rain and Trees, which Grew AFTER Adam was made. Gen 2:8-9 Adam died some 700 years BEFORE Noah came to our Earth in the Ark. God Bless you

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Noah, that is the one that is 8th from Adam is a Son of God. See the last verse in Luke three.

What you are calling prehistoric people are the sons of men. See Ecclesiastes 13: (18-21), and Psalms 54:4. Notice Elihu in Job 33: (3-7) is made from the earth, has the breath of life in him, and also notice he is terror.

This is consistent with the sons of men described in Psalms and Ecclesiastes.

The son of men are created in Genesis 2:4 to Genesis 4:31. We see this creation is from the dust off the earth. The Sons of God are made in Genesis 1:2 to Genesis 2:3. These are made in God's likeness.

We see in Genesis 6:2 when both come together and have a offspring. Giants are formed and get there strange appearance from the ones from the dust.

I have a book on this topic and other pieces of it. Its packed with a lot of useful information on the subject.

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B075BN72GX

You should check it out. It will fill in many gaps.

pshun2404 said:

Bishop Usher for example dates the flood to around 2004 B.C. with 2000 years to Christ (but was Jesus born in 4 B.C., 6 B.C. and not 4 A.D. which would then be the case?...) and now it is 2015...so if he was correct Christ has come and we are in the Millennial Sabbath (which he believed in)...but we are not, so he was incorrect (though literally counted all years of every generation recorded) and then there is the Jewish Rabbis who say this is the year 5774 since Adam (when men began counting years) and others who say 5774 since Day One....

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We do not count from the birth of Jesus, we count from the birth of the Church on the day of Pentecost when Peter was preaching in the upper room.

The Apophis Comet is suppose to be here in the year 2029 (April friday the 13). I believe that will be the 2,000 year anniversary of the Church or the age of Grace. This would make the 4BC date for the birth of Jesus accurate.

Aman777 said:

Noah, a direct descendant of Adam, brought Adam's superior intelligence to this world of prehistoric people.

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According to Wiki there is controversy if they really do have a higher intelligence.

Ashkenazi Jewish intelligence - Wikipedia

joshua 1 9 said:

According to Wiki there is controversy if they really do have a higher intelligence.

Ashkenazi Jewish intelligence - Wikipedia

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According to God, only Humans (descendants of Adam) and prehistoric people (sons of God) Gen 6:4 can inherit the intelligence of God. Gen 3:22 Otherwise, one must believe the Lie of godless ToE, which has NO evidence to support it. Amen?

Aman777 said:

According to God, only Humans (descendants of Adam) and prehistoric people (sons of God) Gen 6:4 can inherit the intelligence of God. Gen 3:22 Otherwise, one must believe the Lie of godless ToE, which has NO evidence to support it. Amen?

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Are you referring in the Adam in the last sentence of Luke 3? Adam was a son of God.

jhwatts said:

Are you referring in the Adam in the last sentence of Luke 3? Adam was a son of God.

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Same Adam since ALL Humans are the descendants of Adam, who was the ONLY man made by the Hands of the Lord God/Jesus, before the plants, herbs and rain of the 3rd Day. Gen 2:4-7

Adam was NOT a son of God until much later after the fall and after Cain killed Abel. Then, he and Eve were "created" by God (The Trinity). Gen 5:1-2 Only immortal creatures have been "created" eternally by the agreement of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. Adam and Eve became eternal when they were born again Spiritually in Christ. All Christians are immortal, according to Jesus. Jhn 11:26

Aman777 said:

The flood which totally destroyed Adam's world was confined to Lake Van, Turkey, in the mountains of Ararat. Adam's firmament sank in the Lake releasing the Ark into our Biosphere on the 150th day after the flood began. Adam's world was totally destroyed and the First Human to step foot on our Earth was Noah. Amen?

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Two major problems.

1) Why spend a hundred years building an ark, preaching
and collecting animals to save when they could spend
six months walking to another country?

2) Genesis 9:9-17 (EDIT: Sorry, had wrong chapter)
A local flood would make God a liar because floods happen
around the world quite regularly, killing people and animals.

gluadys said:

There is no evidence that cave men were any less intelligent than modern humans. We have more accumulated knowledge, not greater intelligence. Cave men were simply humans who made their homes in caves; they were not a different species than us.

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If you had giants and dinosaurs running around, would
you build straw and wood houses?