mental illness and christianity

samir said:

No one feels sad for months for no reason because there is a cause for everything. A person may not realize why they feel depressed but that doesn't mean there isn't a reason for it. Some people with cancer feel depressed for weeks or months due to side-effects of chemotherapy drugs which is a physical, not mental, problem. If someone's depressive feelings truly had a mental cause then they would be able to cure it by simply changing their thinking.

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To say that depression=sad is to miss a large part of the point here.

It's possible to have depression without feeling sad.

Depression can present as Anhedonia, which involves symptoms like:

• exhaustion
• loss of affect (mood)
• inability to feel pleasure
• loss of appetite

rturner76 said:

I understand that you feel the gift of discernment on this matter and there is nothing you need to learn on this topic

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Never said there is nothing I need to learn on this topic. Everyone can always learn more.

however what you are espousing can be dangerous for somebody who is truly suffering and not seeking help because they believe they can't find relief for their symptoms in the medical community.

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I'm advising healthy skepticism. People are free to make their own choice. It can be dangerous for someone to seek help among mental health providers that often harm people more than helping them.

Just to be clear - I'm talking about mild to moderate depression and anxiety issues (the primary "mental illnesses" treated). Millions of people struggle with depression and anxiety for years despite receiving help from the medical community which often does little more than providing a mild placebo effect. If someone is severely depressed and thinking about killing themselves, I'd advise them to consult their doctor. Also, every so-called mental health symptom has known physical causes and I support seeing doctors to treat real medical conditions.

samir said:

Just to be clear - I'm talking about mild to moderate depression and anxiety issues (the primary "mental illnesses" treated). Millions of people struggle with depression and anxiety for years despite receiving help from the medical community which often does little more than providing a mild placebo effect. If someone is severely depressed and thinking about killing themselves, I'd advise them to consult their doctor. Also, every so-called mental health symptom has known physical causes and I support seeing doctors to treat real medical conditions.

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Thank you for your insight. It is nice to know someone has all this figured out

Spirit Reborn said:

Yes. Jesus' sacrifice and blood is powerful enough to save you as a born again person despite any mental illness you may have. He loves and cares for you so much..you have not escaped His sight. You are not insignificant. He hasn't forgotten about you or brushed you to the side because of what you may think about mental illness in general. He calls the sick, the blind, the leper..even the ones with demons in them to come to Him. He can work in your life powerfully little by little, day by day and help you through any struggle you face.

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Hebrews 9.14 is wonderfully reassuring to the believer, because the Lord Jesus 'through the eternal Spirit offered Himself without spot to God..and (shall) purge your conscience from dead works to serve the living God'.

megan_26 said:

Hm. I don't understand how it is beyond possible that the brain could be sick just like any other part of the body. I cannot simply go to a doctor and ask them to remove the physical cause of my disorder (which happens to be a past trauma) because a trauma can't physically be removed. So I am confused. Am I making my disorder up in my head because I want to?

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Hebrews 9.14 is a great verse.

Christians with mental illness can have a deep relationship with the Lord. Jesus came to heal the spiritually sick.

megan_26 said:

Do you believe that someone can be a born again Christian and yet still be mentally ill?

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The mind can be damaged just as the body can. Yes, a Christian can be mentally ill, just as many Christians are physically ill. The issue is though that many Christians do not understand mental illness and often treat those brothers/ sisters with mental illness poorly.

God Bless You

I have Bipolar Disorder. i'm positive it's a curse brought on from sin. I've been "cleaning up my act" to get a grasp on it. I know Yahweh has a plan for us all. I figure it's pre-payment for when I die. atleast I know what to expect.(to some extent)

megan_26 said:

So this is something I've been curious about for a long time. I never would have doubted that you can be a born again Christian and be mentally ill if someone hadn't told me otherwise. I know what I personally but, as a Christian with a mental illness, I'm interested in hearing what others have to say.
Do you believe that someone can be a born again Christian and yet still be mentally ill?

Edit: illnesses like, for example, depression or anxiety or schizophrenia, etc.

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As a nurse we are trained to treat the human as 3 separate entities: Body, mind and soul. A person with mental illness still has the ability to achieve a spiritual belief in something based on whether anyone teaches them. A sad misconception is that they aren't able to understand salvation. This simply is not true. Besides when they were born God breathed the spirit of life in them, His spirit, so it is already in them to believe in a God. We must be willing to teach them about God the same as we teach children. The level of their spiritual growth and understanding scripture may never go beyond "feeding on the milk" but they do understand right and wrong, good and evil, love and hate.

W2L said:

Would you agree that it takes time to heal?

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Heal? Hmmm...that isn't the word I would use for what God did for me. He lifted my mind and heart out of its pathological fixation with myself so that I could properly orient fully upon Him. I was reclusive, and deeply anxious, and joyless. I knew about God but I didn't have anything but the most superficial relationship with Him. If you'd asked me at that time, though, if I knew God and was walking with Him, I would have given you a resounding "Of course!" The truth, however, was that I had no experience of the abundant spiritual life God promised. I was not bearing the fruit of joy, and peace, and love in my life. I did not have the "sound mind" that God's Spirit imparts to all of His children. Certainly, I had no idea what it was like to live in the peace that passes all understanding. And yet, I would have told you I was walking quite well with God. How deluded I was! You'd have thought my deep anxiety and depression would have clued me in to the true state of affairs between me and God. But God is faithful. He did not let me go on in my false thinking. He showed me just how severely Self-focused I was and how impossible it is to enter into the life He had for me so long as I was. It wasn't, then, that God healed me. It was more that He showed me the destructive grip of Selfishness and helped me to win free of it.

rturner76 said:

I never said depression can't be rooted out through prayer and meditation.

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This isn't how the Bible tells us these things are rooted out.

rturner76 said:

Surrounding yourself with people who care about you and not isolating is also absolutely essential to recovery along with the emotional uplifting, moral guidance and freedom from feelings of guilt and shame that many depression sufferers feel as they allow God to take their burden and provide them with a new life of discipleship.

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These things are certainly very helpful. But they aren't essential. God alone is quite sufficient to bring us into healthy, rich, loving fellowship with Himself. It is only in this fellowship that full freedom from fear and depression can be remedied. About this the Bible is very clear.

rturner76 said:

What I am stating is that is does not happen to or for everyone that way.

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How do you know? Is this what Scripture says? Does it tell us that there is no certain way to entering into the abundant life God holds out to us in Christ? This isn't what I read in my Bible. God's word is very direct and explicit about the life of joy, peace and love God offers to His children and how to obtain it.

rturner76 said:

Some of these people even think about suicide because it is another symptom of depression.

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Yes, been there, done that.

rturner76 said:

they were told that's just the devil or they need to spend more time looking up Bible passages and if they just doA B and C God will take all of those bad feelings away.

Someof that may be true but they may also need to see a doctor about depression.

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I never needed a doctor, or drugs, or therapy. I suppose, if your sort had surrounded me when I was struggling in the darkness, I'd have gone in that direction. Instead, I took a spiritual route to freedom. And now, some thirty years later, I am still free, not mired in an endless and ultimately unhelpful circuit of therapists and drugs. Doctors and drugs are a stop-gap measure at best. True, enduring freedom from anxiety and depression will never be found but in fellowship with God.

Romans 14:17
17 for the kingdom of God is not eating and drinking, but righteousness and peace and joy in the Holy Spirit.

Matthew 11:28
28 Come to Me, all you who labor and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.

2 Timothy 1:7
7 For God has not given us a spirit of fear, but of power and of love and of a sound mind.

megan_26 said:

Hm. I don't understand how it is beyond possible that the brain could be sick just like any other part of the body.

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If there is something wrong with the brain then it is considered neurological. Examples would be brain trauma, dementia, Parkinson's, and MS.

I cannot simply go to a doctor and ask them to remove the physical cause of my disorder (which happens to be a past trauma) because a trauma can't physically be removed. So I am confused. Am I making my disorder up in my head because I want to?

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Looks like you didn't read my posts from the beginning. Mental health "experts" used to tell people with carpal tunnel, IBS, Parkinson's, Alzheimer's and many other conditions that they were mentally ill which is incredibly insulting since they blamed them for causing their symptoms instead of considering there may actually be something physically wrong with them. Many other diseases falsely labeled "mental illnesses" will probably eventually be reclassified as real medical conditions.

If a past trauma is causing you symptoms and those symptoms are a normal reaction to what you experienced then you are not mentally ill and should not tolerate psychobabblers disrespecting and insulting you.

A mental problem is when someone has symptoms due to their own disordered thinking and those symptoms can be cured by correcting their thinking.

aiki said:

This isn't how the Bible tells us these things are rooted out.



These things are certainly very helpful. But they aren't essential. God alone is quite sufficient to bring us into healthy, rich, loving fellowship with Himself. It is only in this fellowship that full freedom from fear and depression can be remedied. About this the Bible is very clear.



How do you know? Is this what Scripture says? Does it tell us that there is no certain way to entering into the abundant life God holds out to us in Christ? This isn't what I read in my Bible. God's word is very direct and explicit about the life of joy, peace and love God offers to His children and how to obtain it.



Yes, been there, done that.



I never needed a doctor, or drugs, or therapy. I suppose, if your sort had surrounded me when I was struggling in the darkness, I'd have gone in that direction. Instead, I took a spiritual route to freedom. And now, some thirty years later, I am still free, not mired in an endless and ultimately unhelpful circuit of therapists and drugs. Doctors and drugs are a stop-gap measure at best. True, enduring freedom from anxiety and depression will never be found but in fellowship with God.

Romans 14:17
17 for the kingdom of God is not eating and drinking, but righteousness and peace and joy in the Holy Spirit.

Matthew 11:28
28 Come to Me, all you who labor and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.

2 Timothy 1:7
7 For God has not given us a spirit of fear, but of power and of love and of a sound mind.

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You are stating what worked for you and that is awesome. I am glad you found freedom from depression without medication and doctors. However I believe it is irresponsible to tell people that what you are doing is the only way to find relief.

How to you convince someone who believes God hates them to live in the way you describe? They will not even approach a church many times. I personally was in a group with a woman who's mother was a Pastor, whe was in the choir and had completely given herself to her relationship with God but secretly cut herself when she was alone because she said it made her feel better.

In my own situation, I am a believer who goes to Mass, I pray, and I thank God every day for who and what I have. I am not lacking in gratitude, I have been given every good thing one needs or could want in life. I have a family and friends who love me, a comfortable place to live, all the food I need, and I feel a Good relationship with God. I study the word, talk about it with others, pray for guidance and discernment and like I said give thanks. I talk with a spiritual advisor ad my Priest in order to stay in missions.

I could always be doing more but I try to live my faith and having said that, people exhaust me, I would prefer to stay in the house and do nothing that go out and be with people so I have to make a huge effort not to isolate. I don't get much sleep, I do not get enjoyment out of much at all besides my spiritual activities and computer time, I could keep going but you get the picture. I am grateful for my life but God has not removed my depression. Perhaps itis a trial I am meant to go through but I don't think it is because I am lacking in my effort to seek a relationship with him and have this taken away.

The way you describe depression it is more of a character defect and it is not, it is a medical condition.

megan_26 said:

So this is something I've been curious about for a long time. I never would have doubted that you can be a born again Christian and be mentally ill if someone hadn't told me otherwise. I know what I personally but, as a Christian with a mental illness, I'm interested in hearing what others have to say.
Do you believe that someone can be a born again Christian and yet still be mentally ill?

Edit: illnesses like, for example, depression or anxiety or schizophrenia, etc.

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Christians still get ill and still believe and speak lies after they get saved. Mental illness can be because of physical damage / chemical imbalance OR faulty and entrenched thinking. As long as Christians remain vulnerable to both they can be mentally ill. Our hope is in the fact that we believe in a God who heals and in whose light no lies survive.

samir said:

Also, every so-called mental health symptom has known physical causes and I support seeing doctors to treat real medical conditions.

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Clinical depression IS a real medical condition. It's caused by chemical imbalances in the brain and is just as much an illness as measles.
Bi polar, schizophrenia etc are real medical conditions too.

David Watson - an evangelist - was badly affected by depression; I'm sure others are/have been too.

Prabhanjan Bag said:

Mental illness does not necessarily caused by demonic forces.

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Good grief.

Let's try the replacement test to see how ridiculous this statement is. 'Heart disease is not necessarily caused by demonic forces.'

Complete nonsense, in both cases.

I also believe that those who are born again Christians could be touched by the demonic forces until they are under the shelter of Jesus Christ. Jesus himself promised to keep them safe from the devil. Let the Holy Spirit empower every born again christian to over come all sorts of depression and mental illness.

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That makes no sense, unless the 'shelter of Jesus Christ' is about as efficacious as a broken umbrella in a hurricane.

On the contrary 'demonic forces' are totally and completely powerless when Christ is present. There is no need for us to pay them any attention whatever.

GUANO said:

Of course a Christian can suffer what is commonly called a mental illness but I wish the subject wasn't taboo among Christians. There is still not a single blood or urine test in this world that can identify a mental illness. It is not an illness or disease in any standard and the only way to identify one is to compare symptoms (thoughts and behaviors which are not symptoms) to a manual. New illnesses are added to the list by vote and also removed by vote. They are not things that can be measured using any scientific device and there is no reason that Christians should jump on the propaganda bandwagon and not join the debate and treatment as Christians have led in the treatment of such illnesses for over a thousand years until they rolled over like they have done on every other issue. Christians support chemical lobotomy using drugs over cognitive therapy which is valid treatment based on Christian values.

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I am not sure any of that makes sense.

toLiJC said:

the primary(elemental) cause of all evil things is spirits and forces of the "darkness", while elementary particles/units such as atoms, molecules, vitamins, biological cells, biological/body organs, brain, body systems, nervous system, etc. are physical creations of the true God as well as harmless structural particals/units, and fundamentally shouldn't, or to be more precise and direct, don't cause problems (by themselves), for example, John the Baptist had not eaten anything for most of the time (He only ate wild honey and locusts from time to time very rarely - only when he found some in the wilderness where he lived), but didn't suffer from any nutritional deficiency such as avitaminosis or hypovitaminosis

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Nonsense.

Not least because insects are full of protein - locusts are up to 75% protein - and honey has superb antibacterial qualities.

Honey: Health Benefits and Uses In Medicine

http://www.precisionnutrition.com/eating-bugs

"sin"(a.k.a. "satan", "beast(666)", etc.) causes delusion(s), while "death" causes deterioration(s) such as vulnerability to things (such as high temperature, burning, freezing temperatures, injury, infection, trauma, etc.), diseases, illnesses, syndromes, mental disorders/deviations, depression, desolation, poverty, unfavorable rot/decay, unfavorable aging, etc. - if all such spirits are removed from the world, then there will no longer be any evil (thing) with any person in the world

Blessings

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What utter tosh.