Why Did God Hate Esau?

brinny

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Why Did God Hate Esau?

I would put forth the notion that it is the other way around.

Esau didn't much like God, regard Him, fear Him, nor love Him. I'll take it a little further. He had a contempt for God and everything of God. He regarded his birth right as something to be tossed aside and disregarded.

What a slap in not only his father's face, but in God's face, eh?
 
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Wordkeeper

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Thank you for the prompt reply. We see here that there is not a shred of evidence that Noah had repented prior to God showing favor (grace) to him.

You can't become clean unless you are first dirtied:

Romans 7:9I was once alive apart from the Law; but when the commandment came, sin became alive and I died; 10and this commandment, which was to result in life, proved to result in death for me; 11for sin, taking an opportunity through the commandment, deceived me and through it killed me.
 
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bbbbbbb

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You can't become clean unless you are first dirtied:

Romans 7:9I was once alive apart from the Law; but when the commandment came, sin became alive and I died; 10and this commandment, which was to result in life, proved to result in death for me; 11for sin, taking an opportunity through the commandment, deceived me and through it killed me.

So, are you saying that Noah was sinless and perfect, unlike everyone else in the world and, as a result, God had to show favor toward him? If so, where is your scriptural proof?
 
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Wordkeeper

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So, are you saying that Noah was sinless and perfect, unlike everyone else in the world and, as a result, God had to show favor toward him? If so, where is your scriptural proof?

Genesis 6:8But Noah found favor in the eyes of the LORD.

9These are the records of the generations of Noah. Noah was a righteous man, blameless in his time; Noah walked with God.
 
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bbbbbbb

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Genesis 6:8But Noah found favor in the eyes of the LORD.

9These are the records of the generations of Noah. Noah was a righteous man, blameless in his time; Noah walked with God.

So, did Noah find favor in the sight of the Lord because he was a righteous man, blameless in his time or was he a righteous man, blameless in his time because he had found favor with God?
 
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Wordkeeper

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So, did Noah find favor in the sight of the Lord because he was a righteous man, blameless in his time or was he a righteous man, blameless in his time because he had found favor with God?

I could play with you and ask why God liked Noah, because only the pure can see God, forcing you to concede that Noah was pure, but I'm here to help, not mock.

Everyone knows God is good and requires one to be loyal to Him and His principles.

However, some people water down the CLEAR understanding about this message that their God given conscience conveys to them. They say it's not true. They substitute it with pragmatic, worldly, compromises. They claim their interpretation is true, that it is what the instruction means. Remember, it's not only the Pharisees who substituted the words of God with man-made traditions. Every religious system has done this.

What differentiates righteous people is that they did NOT dilute conscience or Torah. They accepted the instructions (Torah means instructions, but you knew that, Moody, right? )
They humbled themselves. That's why the publican was found righteous, justified, and the Pharisee was not.

Ditto Noah.
 
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klutedavid

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Why Did God Hate Esau?

I would put forth the notion that it is the other way around.

Esau didn't much like God, regard Him, fear Him, nor love Him. I'll take it a little further. He had a contempt for God and everything of God. He regarded his birth right as something to be tossed aside and disregarded.

What a slap in not only his father's face, but in God's face, eh?
Hello brinny.

Are you saying that Esau was a sinner?
 
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brinny

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Hello brinny.

Are you saying that Esau was a sinner?

I was not specifying that he was, since so was everyone else. The differentiation i was pointing out is why it is written that God "hated" Esau.

See post #121 for clarification.
 
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klutedavid

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I was not specifying that he was, since so was everyone else. The differentiation i was pointing out is why it is written that God "hated" Esau.

See post #121 for clarification.
Hello brinny.

The behavior of anyone including Esau is irrelevant.

11 for though the twins were not yet born and had not done anything good or bad, so that God’s purpose according to His choice would stand. (Romans 9)
 
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jimmyjimmy

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Hello brinny.

The behavior of anyone including Esau is irrelevant.

11 for though the twins were not yet born and had not done anything good or bad, so that God’s purpose according to His choice would stand. (Romans 9)

Yes. That is correct. That's the precisely the point that Paul was trying to make. God chose prior to their birth and not based upon their future actions.
 
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brinny

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Hello brinny.

The behavior of anyone including Esau is irrelevant.

11 for though the twins were not yet born and had not done anything good or bad, so that God’s purpose according to His choice would stand. (Romans 9)

I was not referring to Esau's "behavior".

I was referring to his "heart" condition regarding God.
 
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pshun2404

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Aside from the apparent idiomatic usage of the concept ‘to hate’ as used in other places, coupled with the fact that God uses human writers to convey what He has said (ancient Hebrews always seemingly writing in almost hyperbole as they contrast extremes to make a more common truth not specific to either extreme), why should it be inconceivable that in some cases God (for His own reasons not clarified to us) would choose to do just such a thing?

Having said that one should be careful not to take such an example and then generalize a doctrine applying this example to all people or cases. In doing so, historically speaking, looking back, one could mistakenly assume that God made such a choice between Abel and Cain and thus CAUSED Cain to choose the choice he made to kill Abel (do you see the error in such thinking?) when the scriptures are clear that in this case God speaking audibly to Cain not only offers him grace so it may go well also with him, but forewarns Cain that if he refuses this offer of grace (which apparently he has the power to do) then sin lays at the door to rule over him.

The same can be said for the rise and fall of nations. YES! God causes the rise and fall of many nations just not every rise and every fall of every nation every time!
 
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Revealing Times

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Romans 9:13 says, "As it is written, “Jacob I loved, but Esau I hated.”.

I have two questions regarding this text in the book of Romans. Please answer both questions, and provide a brief explanation of your answers if you wish.

1) Why did God hate Esau?

2) What was the consequence of God’'s hate for Esau?
Of course this is a bad translation, just as Luke 14:26 does not mean we should hate our parents.

Luke 14:26 If any man come to me, and hate not his father, and mother, and wife, and children, and brethren, and sisters, yea, and his own life also, he cannot be my disciple.

I have studied this in depth, but I will just give a modest overview of why this is a bad translation.

Basically this doesn't mean hate (of course) it means LOVED LESS, so rethinking it that would seem a fair point by Jesus, you must love Me more than your father, mother, sisters and brothers, and yea, you must love me more than yourself also.

Likewise God did not hate Esau per se, he just CHOOSE Jacob just like he choose the Gentile church over Israel at such and such a time. Paul explains in Romans chapters 9-11 why God has chosen the Gentile Church over Israel by using the example of Esau vs. Jacob.

Romans 9:11 { For the children being not yet born, neither having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works, but of him that calleth }12 It was said unto her, The elder shall serve the younger.
(Israel = Elder and the Church = Younger)

13 As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated (Loved less/Chose the other).

14 What shall we say then? Is there unrighteousness with God? God forbid.

Its more about Gods FAVOR...........Its never about hate.
 
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pshun2404

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Of course this is a bad translation, just as Luke 14:26 does not mean we should hate our parents.

Luke 14:26 If any man come to me, and hate not his father, and mother, and wife, and children, and brethren, and sisters, yea, and his own life also, he cannot be my disciple.

I have studied this in depth, but I will just give a modest overview of why this is a bad translation.

Basically this doesn't mean hate (of course) it means LOVED LESS, so rethinking it that would seem a fair point by Jesus, you must love Me more than your father, mother, sisters and brothers, and yea, you must love me more than yourself also.

Likewise God did not hate Esau per se, he just CHOOSE Jacob just like he choose the Gentile church over Israel at such and such a time. Paul explains in Romans chapters 9-11 why God has chosen the Gentile Church over Israel by using the example of Esau vs. Jacob.

Romans 9:11 { For the children being not yet born, neither having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works, but of him that calleth }12 It was said unto her, The elder shall serve the younger.
(Israel = Elder and the Church = Younger)

13 As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated (Loved less/Chose the other).

14 What shall we say then? Is there unrighteousness with God? God forbid.

Its more about Gods FAVOR...........Its never about hate.

Exactly! Thanks
 
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LittleLambofJesus

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Romans 9:13 says, "As it is written, “Jacob I loved, but Esau I hated.”.

I have two questions regarding this text in the book of Romans. Please answer both questions, and provide a brief explanation of your answers if you wish.

1) Why did God hate Esau?

2) What was the consequence of God’'s hate for Esau?
From what I gather in Heb 12, he probably suffered the same fate as Judas, the traitor?

Heb 12:16
lest there be any fornicator or profane person like Esau,
who for one morsel of food sold his birthright.

Mat 27:3
Then Judas[Judah], His betrayer, seeing that He had been condemned, was remorseful
and brought back the thirty pieces of silver to the chief priests and elders,


Oba 1:21
Then saviors[fn] shall come to Mount Zion To judge the mountains of Esau,
And the kingdom shall be the LORD's.

Jer 49:10
But I have made Esau bare;
I have uncovered his secret places,[fn] And he shall not be able to hide himself.
His descendants are plundered, His brethren and his neighbors,
And he is no more.

 
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Mark51

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Esau proved himself unworthy of Jehovah’s love by despising his birthright and selling it for a simple meal; and, hence also the divine promises and blessings. He lacked of appreciation for spiritual things, coupled with his strong tendency toward satisfying fleshly desires, made Esau unfit to be in the direct line of the promised Seed. Moreover, he purposed to kill his brother Jacob.-Genesis 25:32-34; 27:41-43; Hebrews 12:14-16.
 
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bbbbbbb

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Esau proved himself unworthy of Jehovah’s love by despising his birthright and selling it for a simple meal; and, hence also the divine promises and blessings. He lacked of appreciation for spiritual things, coupled with his strong tendency toward satisfying fleshly desires, made Esau unfit to be in the direct line of the promised Seed. Moreover, he purposed to kill his brother Jacob.-Genesis 25:32-34; 27:41-43; Hebrews 12:14-16.

While all this is true, God nevertheless hated Esau from the moment he was conceived. Esau, at birth, had done nothing to merit God's contempt. All of these things came later.

That said, was Jacob more righteous than Esau? He, whose very name means deceiver, proved himself to be a liar and deceiver. He cheated Esau from his birthright and the blessing which rightly belonged to Esau. He deceived his father-in-law. What made him worthy of God's love?
 
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RDKirk

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While all this is true, God nevertheless hated Esau from the moment he was conceived. Esau, at birth, had done nothing to merit God's contempt. All of these things came later.

That said, was Jacob more righteous than Esau? He, whose very name means deceiver, proved himself to be a liar and deceiver. He cheated Esau from his birthright and the blessing which rightly belonged to Esau. He deceived his father-in-law. What made him worthy of God's love?

And so, we see that all the Esau vs Jacob drama--in which neither's actions made them either worthy or unworthy of God's choice--was really just to provide Paul with example by which to point out that it's all about faith, not about earning God's favor.
 
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bbbbbbb

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And so, we see that all the Esau vs Jacob drama--in which neither's actions made them either worthy or unworthy of God's choice--was really just to provide Paul with example by which to point out that it's all about faith, not about earning God's favor.

Did either Jacob or Esau possess faith when God determined to love Jacob and hate Esau? I think not. Paul's point is that it is all about God's sovereign decision.
 
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