Are poor Christians lacking in faith?

W2L · Sep 9, 2017

Are poor Christians lacking in faith? Or perhaps do they just not give money to God? The bible says if we give then it will be given to us.

So why are there so many Christians who are poor, and why are so many unbelievers so rich?

ViaCrucis · Sep 9, 2017

W2L said:
Are poor Christians lacking in faith? Or perhaps do they just not give money to God? The bible says if we give then it will be given to us.

So why are there so many Christians who are poor, and why are so many unbelievers so rich?

The Bible doesn't say that if we give that we'll have material wealth in return. And if we're giving in order to get a material benefit then we're giving for the wrong reasons and thus sinning. Christ teaches us to give and expect nothing in return; and very likely we will get nothing in return--and we ought to be happy and joyful and cheerful, because "it is more blessed to give than to receive" (Acts 20:35).

The riches we should seek are not material riches, but riches in the Spirit--humility, kindness, love, mercy, justice, compassion, sober-mindedness, generosity. What does it profit a person if they gain the whole world but forfeit their soul? Whoever seeks to gain their life shall lose it, but whoever gives it away shall find it.

The Christian is not promised a "good" life, as measured by the goodness of the world--prosperity, wealth, comfort, health, etc. On the contrary the Lord teaches us that while in this world we will face trouble and tribulation, and calls us to carry our cross, and to die. We are taught that blessed are the poor, and blessed are the meek, and blessed are the hungry; and conversely, woe to those who are rich, woe to those who are full already.

If we have, then we should be generous and give freely.
If we have not, then we should thank the Lord for the riches of His grace, which are true riches, not the false riches of this world which are nothing but moth and rust.

Those who teach that Christian faith leads to a bountiful, happy, and "best" life in this world are false teachers and liars, wolves in sheep's clothing.

-CryptoLutheran

W2L · Sep 9, 2017

ViaCrucis said:
The Bible doesn't say that if we give that we'll have material wealth in return. And if we're giving in order to get a material benefit then we're giving for the wrong reasons and thus sinning. Christ teaches us to give and expect nothing in return; and very likely we will get nothing in return--and we ought to be happy and joyful and cheerful, because "it is more blessed to give than to receive" (Acts 20:35).

-CryptoLutheran

Thank you ViaCrucis

woobadooba · Sep 9, 2017

"Do not lay up for yourselves treasures on earth, where moth and rust destroy and where thieves break in and steal; but lay up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where neither moth nor rust destroys and where thieves do not break in and steal. For where your treasure is, there your heart will be also."
— Matthew 6:19-21 (NKJV)

W2L · Sep 9, 2017

woobadooba said:
"Do not lay up for yourselves treasures on earth, where moth and rust destroy and where thieves break in and steal; but lay up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where neither moth nor rust destroys and where thieves do not break in and steal. For where your treasure is, there your heart will be also."
— Matthew 6:19-21 (NKJV)

thanks for the scripture woobadooba

Hammster · Sep 9, 2017

Define poor.

OldWiseGuy · Sep 9, 2017

Here is a brief progression that deals with material things and the Christian's responsibility.

Ephesians 4:28

"Let him that stole steal no more: but rather let him labour, working with his hands the thing which is good, that he may... have... to... give... to him that needeth."

While the widow's 'mites' shows a laudable spirit of sacrifice it is the more bountiful giving that gets the job done.

brinny · Sep 9, 2017

i've been what many would consider poor, yet i was mightily blessed, in that me nor my children nor our pets went hungry. God supplied our needs, sometimes in surprising ways.

It was a time when God's presence and provision were so very evident and His grace was pouring forth like a river. Being poor is very humbling, and tends to prompt one to be very thankful, and this may sound strange, but to also be very generous with what one has. It seemed for me that my compassion for others' suffering, grew in leaps and bounds when i was struggling myself. It was also a time when the faith i had in God, my Provider, was growing, maybe as it would not have, if i didn't struggle, even desperately, and not have an overabundance of things to distract me from focusing on God and being continually thankful to Him.

W2L · Sep 9, 2017

Hammster said:
Define poor.

Poor to me is not having food, clothing, transportation, or housing.

W2L · Sep 9, 2017

OldWiseGuy said:
Here is a brief progression that deals with material things and the Christian's responsibility.

Ephesians 4:28

"Let him that stole steal no more: but rather let him labour, working with his hands the thing which is good, that he may... have... to... give... to him that needeth."

While the widow's 'mites' shows a laudable spirit of sacrifice it is the more bountiful giving that gets the job done.

Thank you.

W2L · Sep 9, 2017

brinny said:
i've been what many would consider poor, yet i was mightily blessed, in that me nor my children nor our pets went hungry. God supplied our needs, sometimes in surprising ways.

It was a time when God's presence and provision were so very evident and His grace was pouring forth like a river. Being poor is very humbling, and tends to prompt one to be very thankful, and this may sound strange, but to also be very generous with what one has. It seemed for me that my compassion for others' suffering, grew in leaps and bounds when i was struggling myself. It was also a time when the faith i had in God, my Provider, was growing, maybe as it would not have, if i didn't struggle, even desperately, and not have an overabundance of things to distract me from focusing on God and being continually thankful to Him.

Thank you brinny. I agree.

OldWiseGuy · Sep 9, 2017

I grew up poor as did many in my generation, and it wasn't the boogie man that it is today. It was just a fact of life.

Me, age 10, 1950. We had good school clothes but in the summer we wore hand-me-downs.

W2L · Sep 9, 2017

OldWiseGuy said:
I grew up poor as did many in my generation, so it wasn't the boogie man that it is today. It was just a fact of life.

Thanks for the Re OWG

friend of · Sep 9, 2017

No. James 2:5

Listen, my dear brothers and sisters: Has not God chosen those who are poor in the eyes of the world to be rich in faith and to inherit the kingdom he promised those who love him?

W2L · Sep 9, 2017

friend of said:
No. James 2:5

Listen, my dear brothers and sisters: Has not God chosen those who are poor in the eyes of the world to be rich in faith and to inherit the kingdom he promised those who love him?

Thank you.

Theadorus · Sep 9, 2017

W2L said:
Are poor Christians lacking in faith? Or perhaps do they just not give money to God? The bible says if we give then it will be given to us.

So why are there so many Christians who are poor, and why are so many unbelievers so rich?

It's isn't because they lack faith,it's because they lack understanding.

Some are taught that we have to give because it's owned to God. Some just give because it's the what they were taught to do, with no idea or reason why they are doing it. Some give thinking that God is like a slot machine, and that you put money in, and riches come out. There are many reason why believer don't see those verses come to pass in their lives. But this was something I needed to change.

But what it all comes down to the heart. In the O.T, or motivation for giving was that you had to (the famous verse in Malachi), or you'd be curse with a curse. Our motivation today is out of love. We give because we want to be a blessing. We give because we want to see the kingdom of God advance. We give so that others can reach the world. If we give for selfish reason, we are giving with the wrong motives, and therefore will not have it "given back unto you." Again, another area I really had to grow in.

There is a lot more to this, but I'm trying to remember and cover as many points as I can.

Someone posted this, but I want to add more to it,

Ephesians 4:28

"Let him that stole steal no more: but rather let him labour, working with his hands the thing which is good, that he may... have... to... give... to him that needeth."

And another verse that goes great with this is, 2 Corinthians 9:6-13,

The point is this: whoever sows sparingly will also reap sparingly, and whoever sows bountifully will also reap bountifully. 7 Each one must give as he has decided in his heart, not reluctantly or under compulsion, for God loves a cheerful giver. 8 And God is able to make all grace abound to you, so that having all sufficiency in all things at all times, you may abound in every good work. 9 As it is written,

“He has distributed freely, he has given to the poor;
his righteousness endures forever.”

10 He who supplies seed to the sower and bread for food will supply and multiply your seed for sowing and increase the harvest of your righteousness. 11 You will be enriched in every way to be generous in every way, which through us will produce thanksgiving to God. 12 For the ministry of this service is not only supplying the needs of the saints but is also overflowing in many thanksgivings to God. 13 By their approval of this service, they will glorify God because of your submission that comes from your confession of the gospel of Christ, and the generosity of your contribution for them and for all others.

My personal motivation to give is because I want to Bless and sow seed into the ministry that has taught me so much, and in order for them to keep growing and in order for them to reach more people. I am a cheerful giver, I love to give because I know what a blessing it is. And I want to be able to grow in my giving, and be able to help out more ministries, and so I stand in the promises of these verses. I know that when I give (sow seeds) I will receive a harvest, and that harvest will enable me to give more, therefore blessing more people. Also my trust is not in my finances, my trust is in the Lord to be my provider. But I see this promise work in my life all of the time. Since I moved to Colorado 3 years ago, my family and I has seen God's supernatural provision over our lives. We came moved here with nothing, and we have gone many months eating only potatoes and spaghetti, so I now what it is to lack. But for me, God's abundance,provision,increase or however you want to put it works in my life, and if it isn't supposed to, then don't wake me up. I refuse to be a "poor" Christian. Not because I want to sit on my butt and do nothing all day, but so that I can help reach the world. But in order to do that it takes money. There no way around it. We live in an economical world, and therefore we need finances to get things done.

God Bless

W2L · Sep 9, 2017

Theadorus said:
It's isn't because they lack faith,it's because they lack understanding.

Some are taught that we have to give because it's owned to God. Some just give because it's the what they were taught to do, with no idea or reason why they are doing it. Some give thinking that God is like a slot machine, and that you put money in, and riches come out. There are many reason why believer don't see those verses come to pass in their lives. But this was something I needed to change.

But what it all comes down to the heart. In the O.T, or motivation for giving was that you had to (the famous verse in Malachi), or you'd be curse with a curse. Our motivation today is out of love. We give because we want to be a blessing. We give because we want to see the kingdom of God advance. We give so that others can reach the world. If we give for selfish reason, we are giving with the wrong motives, and therefore will not have it "given back unto you." Again, another area I really had to grow in.

There is a lot more to this, but I'm trying to remember and cover as many points as I can.

Someone posted this, but I want to add more to it,

Ephesians 4:28

"Let him that stole steal no more: but rather let him labour, working with his hands the thing which is good, that he may... have... to... give... to him that needeth."

And another verse that goes great with this is, 2 Corinthians 9:6-13,

The point is this: whoever sows sparingly will also reap sparingly, and whoever sows bountifully will also reap bountifully. 7 Each one must give as he has decided in his heart, not reluctantly or under compulsion, for God loves a cheerful giver. 8 And God is able to make all grace abound to you, so that having all sufficiency in all things at all times, you may abound in every good work. 9 As it is written,

“He has distributed freely, he has given to the poor;
his righteousness endures forever.”

10 He who supplies seed to the sower and bread for food will supply and multiply your seed for sowing and increase the harvest of your righteousness. 11 You will be enriched in every way to be generous in every way, which through us will produce thanksgiving to God. 12 For the ministry of this service is not only supplying the needs of the saints but is also overflowing in many thanksgivings to God. 13 By their approval of this service, they will glorify God because of your submission that comes from your confession of the gospel of Christ, and the generosity of your contribution for them and for all others.

My personal motivation to give is because I want to Bless and sow seed into the ministry that has taught me so much, and in order for them to keep growing and in order for them to reach more people. I am a cheerful giver, I love to give because I know what a blessing it is. And I want to be able to grow in my giving, and be able to help out more ministries, and so I stand in the promises of these verses. I know that when I give (sow seeds) I will receive a harvest, and that harvest will enable me to give more, therefore blessing more people. Also my trust is not in my finances, my trust is in the Lord to be my provider. But I see this promise work in my life all of the time. So for me, it works, and if it isn't supposed to, then don't wake me up. I refuse to be a "poor" Christian. Not because I want to sit on my butt and do nothing all day, but so that I can help reach the world. But in order to do that it takes money. There no way around it. We live in an economical world, and therefore we need finances to get things done.

God Bless

Thank you for your thoughts. So you are saying people are poor because they dont give to the poor?

friend of · Sep 9, 2017

@Theadorus

It sounds like you're saying people are poor because they aren't giving in a joyful spirit. This isn't necessarily the case with most poor people. I'm also reminded of the poor widow who gave all she had. If they who are poor give what little they can to others, consequently becoming poorer still, their hearts are in the right place or they would hold on to what little they had for comfort.

Tolworth John · Sep 9, 2017

W2L said:
Are poor Christians lacking in faith? Or perhaps do they just not give money to God? The bible says if we give then it will be given to us.

So why are there so many Christians who are poor, and why are so many unbelievers so rich?

Where does it say that Christians will be financially rich?
Jesus did say that those who follow him can expect to be treated like him!

Try studing famous Christians who actively sort to follow Jesus. You will find that many lived a life style that was lower than if they hadn't followed Jesus. Working in third world countries or with inner city poor or with rural poor meant they were not earning a salary that would compare with what they could have earnt in buisness etc
You will also discover that many died violent deaths because of their following Jesus.
Try Nate Saint, see what you can learn.

W2L · Sep 9, 2017

friend of said:
@Theadorus

It sounds like you're saying people are poor because they aren't giving in a joyful spirit. This isn't necessarily the case with most poor people. I'm also reminded of the poor widow who gave all she had. If they who are poor give what little they can to others, consequently becoming poorer still, their hearts are in the right place or they would hold on to what little they had for comfort.

We are taught to take care of widows and orphans. In america we give welfare to the poor, but in other nations they are digging in trash dumps and living in poorly constructed shacks. Some dont have clean drinking water. I dont believe God gave us wealth in order to live the lifestyle of the rich and famous, but instead to help the widows and orphans who live in poverty. I believe living in a mansion is a slap in the face to the poor of this world.

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