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And this just shows even more how uneducated you are about Reformed Theology. It did not start with Calvin. At best, he systematized it.
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How Do Calvinists Explain These Verses in the Story of Jonah?
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Not at all. There are tons of verses that support "free will" in the BIble.
But in Calvinism, you have only a few verses taken out of context. Romans 9, John 6:44, 2 Timothy 2:25, etc. Anyways, the Story of Jonah is still a huge testimony against Calvinism. For we clearly see that God changed His mind based on what the Ninevites did. There is no mention of how God forced saved them.
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Not true. There may have been people who might have thought similar before him, but Calvin put all these false ideas together into one neat wrong package.
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Lol. I say you are guilty of reading select few verses. You respond by saying no you don't, but then say there are verses that support your view.
Too funny.
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Not true. Free will is a choice that leads you down a path that determines which road you want to take. If you choose the red pill, it will lead you into seeking the truth. If you choose the blue pill, you can believe, whatever you want to believe.
Free Will in the Bible:
#1. Joshua 24:15 KJV -
"Choose for yourselves this day whom you will serve"
#2. Matthew 11:28 KJV -
"Come to Me, all you who labor and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest."
#3. John 7:17 KJV -
"If anyone wills to do His will, he shall know concerning the doctrine, whether it is from God."
#4. John 7:37 KJV -
"If anyone thirsts, let him come to Me and drink."
#5. Acts 2:38 KJV -
"Repent, and let everyone of you be baptized"
#6. Acts 3:19 KJV -
"Repent therefore and be converted"
#7. Acts 16:31 KJV -
"Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and you will be saved"
#8. Acts 17:30 KJV -
"but now commands all men everywhere to repent"
#9. Revelation 22:17 KJV -
"Whoever wills, let him take the water of life freely."
#10. Genesis 4:7 KJV -
"If thou doest well, shalt thou not be accepted? and if thou doest not well, sin lieth at the door. And unto thee shall be his desire, and thou shalt rule over him."
#11. Revelation 22:17 KJ2
"And the Spirit and the bride say, Come. And let him that hears say, Come. And let him that is thirsty come. And whosoever will, let him take the water of life freely."
#12. Luke 13:34 NLT -
"O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, the city that kills the prophets and stones God's messengers! How often I have wanted to gather your children together as a hen protects her chicks beneath her wings, but you wouldn't let me.
And there are more verses like these.
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I don't see how those verses I posted helps you. If you think they do, then you would have explained them by now. Anyways, I think it is best we agree to disagree. You are not addressing the actual verses I posted but you are merely providing one liners as if that proves something. Truth is determined by God's Word, so we should use God's Word to contend for the faith.
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lesliedellow
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Maybe you missed what I posted earlier:
Acts 4:27-28 For of a truth against thy holy child Jesus, whom thou hast anointed, both Herod, and Pontius Pilate, with the Gentiles, and the people of Israel, were gathered together, For to do whatsoever thy hand and thy counsel determined before to be done.
Acts 2:46-47 And they, continuing daily with one accord in the temple, and breaking bread from house to house, did eat their meat with gladness and singleness of heart, Praising God, and having favour with all the people. And the Lord added to the church daily such as should be saved.
John 6:64-65 But there are some of you that believe not. For Jesus knew from the beginning who they were that believed not, and who should betray him. And he said, Therefore said I unto you, that no man can come unto me, except it were given unto him of my Father.
To take just three of the many many examples. I am not mistaken, you are.
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Address what? You take verses and post with no context, but expect me to counter them with context? That's lazy.
Plus, it proves what I said. You read verses. Your theology is based on verses. You've shown that you ignore context. That's been my point, and you've only bolstered my argument.
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You can provide the context if you like so as to disprove what you think they plainly say.
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Or you could attempt to put them in context and explain why you think they say what you think they say.
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Nothing here about God force saving people here and force damning others. One has to read that into this verse in order for that to be true. God can predict the future and God can provide counsel beforehand because He has infinite knowledge.
You said:
Salvation is a Synergistic. God provides salvation openly to people freely so as to accept. When they accept the Lord of their own free will choice, the Lord then transforms the heart and includes them into the body of Christ. This is not Calvinism but Synergism at work here. We are seeing language of God at work in the salvation process. For nowhere does this passage say that God added to the church daily beyond man's free will choice.
Foreknowledge is not the same thing as Limited Atonement. Also, who comes to the Father? We learn in verse 45 that it is those who have learned of the Father (or taught by God) comes to the Father. So the coming to the Father is not in reference to the lost but to those believers who are taught by the Father. So you are misquoting the Bible.
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Not sure how that is going to help you. I have shown you verses already and you see something completely different each time. I think it is best we agree to disagree and move on, my friend.
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lesliedellow
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And who will choose God? Precisely those who have been given the heart to do so. The rest will choose to follow their various idols.
All the others could be similarly dealt with, because EVERYTHING in creation is under God's sovereign control.
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lesliedellow
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DETERMINED before to be done. Not foresaw - determined.
Added to the church daily such as should be saved. Nothing there about issuing an invitation to people who might be saved. It says he added to the church daily those who would be saved.
Last edited:
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No. This makes no sense to say "choose this day in whom ye will serve" if you cannot actually choose and you are already a slave at choosing God as your only option. That would be like telling a robot to do something that it is already programmed to do. It makes no sense.
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Let's get back to the topic of the thread. You know, the Story of Jonah and how you think that works in the world of Calvinism.
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That's fine. You've made my point that you have no argument using scripture in context.
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And if we look at the choice Joshua gives them, it's not between God and idols. It's between two different idols. Joshua never admonished them to choose God.
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lesliedellow
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It makes perfect sense. They would have been conscious of making their choice. But those whom God wished to save would have been given a heart to choose him.
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