if lucifer was the most beautiful angel jesus is most beautiful human, right

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SkyWriting

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That is a corrupted view of beauty. Often beautiful people take advantage of their physical characteristics and become vain. That does not make beauty to be a bad trait. It is like intelligence, you can do good things with it and bad things with it. We do not say intelligence is bad though.

I imagine Adam and Eve were the most beautiful people to live, where they vain? Further, scripture does speak favorably of beauty. Job was blessed after his testing with the most beautiful daughters in the land, Job 42:15.

Likely the description is regarding their personalities. Beauty pageants are not documented in scripture.
 
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WonderingStranger

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and they both are called morning star in the bible
obviously satan lost that name after his falling

but it's curious how both are called the same way


In regarding the title "Bright Morning Star" I think it is the title given to the "god" of this world, who was Satan before the new covenant, but after death, burial, resurrection Jesus redeemed all things to himself making him the Bright Morning Star. Its a illustration of redemption through Jesus Christ. At least thats my understanding. Its a picture of Jesus who overthrew Satan's reign, Satan no longer rules the earth.
 
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toLiJC

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and they both are called morning star in the bible
obviously satan lost that name after his falling

but it's curious how both are called the same way

actually "lucifer" is one of the words used to indicate the soul, i.e. in principle every soul should be "lucifer" i.e. a holder/bearer of "light", and every soul was a cherub(highest/greatest glorious creature in the "heaven") in previous cycles of the eternity...

Blessings
 
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NW82

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and they both are called morning star in the bible
obviously satan lost that name after his falling

but it's curious how both are called the same way
Christ is not and never has been an Angel. Even now, Lucifer is still an Angel...albeit a fallen one. No comparison is possible.
 
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disciple1

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and they both are called morning star in the bible
obviously satan lost that name after his falling

but it's curious how both are called the same way
Isaiah chapter 53 verse 2
He grew up before him like a tender shoot, and like a root out of dry ground. He had no beauty or majesty to attract us to him, nothing in his appearance that we should desire him.


That's spoken about Jesus.

What bible are you reading for him to be called morning star, I don't think I've ever read that.
 
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MonstersvsMartyrs

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dont twist the things


because i believe what i read and dont try (failing) to go further with other recherche interpretations, but god bless you

What exactly did you read and where did you read it?
 
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Oseas

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Can anybody find any verses in the Bible that explain Lucifer as a fallen angel and his story?
Lucifer - Wikipedia

Ezekiel 28:v.14-15KJV
14 Thou art the anointed cherub that covereth; and I have set thee so: thou wast upon the holy mountain of God; thou hast walked up and down in the midst of the stones of fire.
15 Thou wast perfect in thy ways from the day that thou wast created, till iniquity was found in thee.
Isaiah 14: 12-13KJV
12 How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations!
13 For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north:

Above the stars of God? Who are them? Daniel 12:3 reveals unto us: "And they that be wise shall shine as the brightness of the firmament; and they that turn many to righteousness as the STARS for ever and ever.
He thinks "will exalt his throne upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the NORTH? Why in the sides of the NORTH? Psalms 48:v.2 reveals unto us the way: "Beautiful for situation, the joy of the whole earth, is mount Zion, on the sides of the NORTH, the CITY of the great King.(the great KING is JESUS, KING of the kings and LORD of the lords)

JESUS said to the Jews: (John 5:43) I am come in my Father's name, and ye receive me not: if ANOTHER (an IMPOSTER, an USURPER, the own Satan incarnate, a former Cherub) shall come in his own name, him ye will receive.

The Apostle Paul explains who is Lucifer(KJV) saying to the Church of Thessalonians: (2Th.2:v.3-4&6to12) Here goes his warnings:
3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;
4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.
6 And now ye know what withholdeth that he might be revealed IN HIS TIME. (It is now, in the presente time, time of Apocalypse)
7 For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way.
8 And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming:
9 Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders,
10 And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.
11 And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:
12 That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.
The Apostle Paul also wrote to the Church of Corinthians (and unto us also) saying: 2Cor.11:13-15KJV -
13 For such are false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into the apostles of Christ.
14 And no marvel; for SATAN himself is transformed into an ANGEL of light.
15 Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness; whose end shall be according to their works.

So, take care. What I say, I tell to everyone
 
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want-love

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If Jesus were ugly, I'd expect it would have been mentioned in the Gospels. Isaiah 53 is usually interpreted to mean his appearance during his Passion after he was beaten.
this is for all who mention isaiah 53!
how could you say jesus is ugly in appearance? when we see him in heaven we will know there is nothing more perfect than him! in spirit and appearance!
 
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MonstersvsMartyrs

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Ezekiel 28:v.14-15KJV
14 Thou art the anointed cherub that covereth; and I have set thee so: thou wast upon the holy mountain of God; thou hast walked up and down in the midst of the stones of fire.
15 Thou wast perfect in thy ways from the day that thou wast created, till iniquity was found in thee.
Isaiah 14: 12-13KJV
12 How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations!
13 For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north:

Above the stars of God? Who are them? Daniel 12:3 reveals unto us: "And they that be wise shall shine as the brightness of the firmament; and they that turn many to righteousness as the STARS for ever and ever.
He thinks "will exalt his throne upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the NORTH? Why in the sides of the NORTH? Psalms 48:v.2 reveals unto us the way: "Beautiful for situation, the joy of the whole earth, is mount Zion, on the sides of the NORTH, the CITY of the great King.(the great KING is JESUS, KING of the kings and LORD of the lords)

JESUS said to the Jews: (John 5:43) I am come in my Father's name, and ye receive me not: if ANOTHER (an IMPOSTER, an USURPER, the own Satan incarnate, a former Cherub) shall come in his own name, him ye will receive.

The Apostle Paul explains who is Lucifer(KJV) saying to the Church of Thessalonians: (2Th.2:v.3-4&6to12) Here goes his warnings:
3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;
4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.
6 And now ye know what withholdeth that he might be revealed IN HIS TIME. (It is now, in the presente time, time of Apocalypse)
7 For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way.
8 And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming:
9 Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders,
10 And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.
11 And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:
12 That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.
The Apostle Paul also wrote to the Church of Corinthians (and unto us also) saying: 2Cor.11:13-15KJV -
13 For such are false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into the apostles of Christ.
14 And no marvel; for SATAN himself is transformed into an ANGEL of light.
15 Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness; whose end shall be according to their works.

So, take care. What I say, I tell to everyone

The first passage, in context, is talking about the king of Tyre:
Ezekiel 28
The word of Jehovah came again unto me, saying, 2 Son of man, say unto the prince of Tyre, Thus saith the Lord Jehovah: Because thy heart is lifted up, and thou hast said, I am a god, I sit in the seat of God, in the midst of the seas; yet thou art man, and not God, though thou didst set thy heart as the heart of God;- 3 behold, thou art wiser than Daniel; there is no secret that is hidden from thee; 4 by thy wisdom and by thine understanding thou hast gotten thee riches, and hast gotten gold and silver into thy treasures; 5 by thy great wisdom [and] by thy traffic hast thou increased thy riches, and thy heart is lifted up because of thy riches;- 6 therefore thus saith the Lord Jehovah: Because thou hast set thy heart as the heart of God, 7 therefore, behold, I will bring strangers upon thee, the terrible of the nations; and they shall draw their swords against the beauty of thy wisdom, and they shall defile thy brightness.

8 They shall bring thee down to the pit; and thou shalt die the death of them that are slain, in the heart of the seas.

9 Wilt thou yet say before him that slayeth thee, I am God? but thou art man, and not God, in the hand of him that woundeth thee.

10 Thou shalt die the death of the uncircumcised by the hand of strangers: for I have spoken it, saith the Lord Jehovah.

11 Moreover the word of Jehovah came unto me, saying, 12 Son of man, take up a lamentation over the king of Tyre, and say unto him, Thus saith the Lord Jehovah: Thou sealest up the sum, full of wisdom, and perfect in beauty.

13 Thou wast in Eden, the garden of God; every precious stone was thy covering, the sardius, the topaz, and the diamond, the beryl, the onyx, and the jasper, the sapphire, the emerald, and the carbuncle, and gold: the workmanship of thy tabrets and of thy pipes was in thee; in the day that thou wast created they were prepared.

14 Thou wast the anointed cherub that covereth: and I set thee, [so that] thou wast upon the holy mountain of God; thou hast walked up and down in the midst of the stones of fire.

15 Thou wast perfect in thy ways from the day that thou wast created, till unrighteousness was found in thee.

16 By the abundance of thy traffic they filled the midst of thee with violence, and thou hast sinned: therefore have I cast thee as profane out of the mountain of God; and I have destroyed thee, O covering cherub, from the midst of the stones of fire.

The second passage is talking about the king of Babylon:

Isaiah 14
3 And it shall come to pass in the day that Jehovah shall give thee rest from thy sorrow, and from thy trouble, and from the hard service wherein thou wast made to serve, 4 that thou shalt take up this parable against the king of Babylon, and say, How hath the oppressor ceased! the golden city ceased!

5 Jehovah hath broken the staff of the wicked, the sceptre of the rulers; 6 that smote the peoples in wrath with a continual stroke, that ruled the nations in anger, with a persecution that none restrained.

7 The whole earth is at rest, [and] is quiet: they break forth into singing.

8 Yea, the fir-trees rejoice at thee, [and] the cedars of Lebanon, [saying], Since thou art laid low, no hewer is come up against us.

9 Sheol from beneath is moved for thee to meet thee at thy coming; it stirreth up the dead for thee, even all the chief ones of the earth; it hath raised up from their thrones all the kings of the nations.

10 All they shall answer and say unto thee, Art thou also become weak as we? art thou become like unto us?

11 Thy pomp is brought down to Sheol, [and] the noise of thy viols: the worm is spread under thee, and worms cover thee.

12 How art thou fallen from heaven, O day-star, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, that didst lay low the nations!

13 And thou saidst in thy heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God; and I will sit upon the mount of congregation, in the uttermost parts of the north; 14 I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will make myself like the Most High.

15 Yet thou shalt be brought down to Sheol, to the uttermost parts of the pit.

16 They that see thee shall gaze at thee, they shall consider thee, [saying], Is this the man that made the earth to tremble, that did shake kingdoms; 17 that made the world as a wilderness, and overthrew the cities thereof; that let not loose his prisoners to their home?

Here, "Lucifer' is properly translated as "day-star", what the word "Lucifer" actually means, as it's a word, not actually a proper name.

The third passage is talking about the Antichrist, and as it clearly points out he is a man, not an angel:

3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;

Is this all that's in the Bible about Lucifer? Where do we get the whole Lucifer and his fallen angels story? There doesn't seem to be any explanation of a character named Lucifer in the Bible, and no evidence that these passages are alluding to anybody else than who they are addressed to.
 
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Norbert L

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what are your arguments to say his body and face is not the most beautiful of the children of god? you only say that without arguments. i have no arguments too, but i believe it
I think 1 Samuel 16:7 reveals how God distinguishes between the outward and inner parts. It could just very well be what is being found handsome is the grace that is coming from the lips in Psalm 45.
 
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RDKirk

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I found it Psalm 45:2, This is talking about Jesus Christ spirit or character not his looks. As you can read later in the verse it says he is anointed with grace, so the context of that verse is that Jesus is beautiful in spirit more so than any man.

Something to note is that the mind of the Middle Eastern person seldom defined "beauty" by physical terms, but as a matter of how appearance made one feel.

This is an old way of thinking, but not exclusive to the Middle East. Maybe some of you are old enough to remember the old "Beverly Hillbillies" television show, where one of the mountain men would describe a woman as, "pretty as a mess of greens and hog maws after a hard day at work." In other words, her beauty caused the same feeling of giddiness as a scrumptious meal when one is very hungry.

That's why in Song of Songs, there is verse after verse after verse of comparisons of appearance to things that exemplified internal characteristics but very little actual physical description.
 
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RDKirk

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Is this all that's in the Bible about Lucifer? Where do we get the whole Lucifer and his fallen angels story? There doesn't seem to be any explanation of a character named Lucifer in the Bible, and no evidence that these passages are alluding to anybody else than who they are addressed to.

They conflate the verses you cited with Revelation 12.

However, IMO Revelation 12 takes place in the Church Age.
 
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CrystalDragon

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and they both are called morning star in the bible
obviously satan lost that name after his falling

but it's curious how both are called the same way

Lucifer was a Babylonian king and nothing related to Satan at all.

When will people actually read ALL of Isaiah 14 in its full context and realize that? Lucifer has absolutely nothing to do with Satan in any way shape or form.
 
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want-love

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Lucifer was a Babylonian king and nothing related to Satan at all.

When will people actually read ALL of Isaiah 14 in its full context and realize that? Lucifer has absolutely nothing to do with Satan in any way shape or form.

Who and why?

ppl who say jesus is not the most handsome and beautiful in spirit at the same time
 
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MonstersvsMartyrs

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If you would like to know where the story of Lucifer is actually from, it's a tradition referenced in extrabiblical texts such as the books of Enoch.

2 Enoch 29
1 And for all the heavenly troops I imaged the image and essence of fire, and my eye looked at the very hard, firm rock, and from the gleam of my eye the lightning received its wonderful nature, (which) is both fire in water and water in fire, and one does not put out the other, nor does the one dry up the other, therefore the lightning is brighter than the sun, softer than water and firmer than hard rock.

2 And from the rock I cut off a great fire, and from the fire I created the orders of the incorporeal ten troops of angels, and their weapons are fiery and their raiment a burning flame, and I commanded that each one should stand in his order.

3 And one from out the order of angels, having turned away with the order that was under him, conceived an impossible thought, to place his throne higher than the clouds above the earth, that he might become equal in rank to my power.

4 And I threw him out from the height with his angels, and he was flying in the air continuously above the bottomless.
 
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