Beyond the Gap Theory

Quasar92 · Aug 5, 2017

Rightly-Dividing Geology and the Book of Genesis Beyond the "Gap Theory" of Creationism the face of the waters." (Genesis 1:2 KJV)

If you or someone you know are confused by claims that the earth is only 6,000 years old, then you have come to the right website. Many people think the six creation days in Genesis are a description of the Earth's geologic history. They are not! The geologic record shows that the Earth existed long before the six days and long before Adam. There is a time-gap between the first two verses of Genesis.

On this website you will learn about a controversial, lesser known literal interpretation of the Genesis narrative that does not contradict the scientific evidence for an Old Earth. Commonly called the "Gap Theory" or Ruin-Reconstruction interpretation, it is a theological interpretation much older than Darwin's Theory of Evolution. It is based on the Scriptural fact that in the second verse of Genesis, the Holy Bible simply and clearly states that the planet Earth was already here (but in a ruined state) before the Divine process described in those six days even begins. Understanding this Biblical mystery begins with the precise wording of this New Testament cross-reference:

"For this they willingly are ignorant of, that by the word of God the heavens were of old, and the earth standing out of the water and in the water: Whereby the world that then was, being overflowed with water, perished: But the heavens and the earth, which are now, by the same word are kept in store, reserved unto fire against the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men."
(2 Pet 3:5-7 KJV)

Contrary to popular interpretation, the above passage is NOT a reference to Noah's flood. (See Introduction Pages for specifics.) And the only other place in the Bible where the Earth was covered in waters is Genesis 1:2. The ramifications are obvious: The literal wording suggests that the "heavens and the earth, which are now" (made during the seven days) was not the first-time creation of all things as is traditionally assumed. The Word of God appears to be telling the reader there was a previous populated world on the face of this old Earth before God formed the present world of modern Man.

"And God blessed them, and God said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth, and subdue it: and have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over every living thing that moveth upon the earth."(Genesis 1:28 KJV)

The Bible itself provides insight into a great mystery in Earth's natural history at what is known as the Pleistocene - Holocene boundary. Science remains at a loss to definitively explain the Ice Age and the anomaly of the mysterious mega fauna extinctions across the face of the Earth about 12,000 to 10,000 Radio Carbon years ago. Geologic evidence from that period indicates extraordinary global massive volcanism, gigantic tidal waves, seismic activity on a vast scale, and extreme temperature swings on the Earth over a geologically brief period of time. It is no coincidence that the Bible at Genesis 1:2 describes the Earth as flooded, desolate, and in darkness in the timeframe closely corresponding to these catastrophic events in the Earth's natural history. Clearly, these two mysteries are linked.Why the old "world that then was" ended, and why God made a new world and modern Man, requires a study into the ancient origins of Satan and the Angels. The Earth has an ancient natural history that can be deciphered from the geologic record, but it also has an equally important ancient spiritual history that can only be deciphered from Rightly-Dividing the Holy Bible. Knowledge of both is required to correctly reconcile Geology and the Book of Genesis. We pray you will find this material useful in your study of God's Holy Word.

These are the generations [

] of the heavens and of the earth when they were created, in the day that the LORD God made the earth and the heavens,
(Genesis 2:4 KJV)[/font)

Quasar92

Hal A Peno · Aug 5, 2017

"For this they willingly are ignorant of, that by the word of God the heavens were of old, and the earth standing out of the water and in the water: Whereby the world that then was, being overflowed with water, perished: But the heavens and the earth, which are now, by the same word are kept in store, reserved unto fire against the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men."
(2 Pet 3:5-7 KJV)

Contrary to popular interpretation, the above passage is NOT a reference to Noah's flood. (See Introduction Pages for specifics.) And the only other place in the Bible where the Earth was covered in waters is Genesis 1:2. The ramifications are obvious: The literal wording suggests that the "heavens and the earth, which are now" (made during the seven days) was not the first-time creation of all things as is traditionally assumed. The Word of God appears to be telling the reader there was a previous populated world on the face of this old Earth before God formed the present world of modern Man.

I'd have to look at this, but he may be correct in that the end of the the pre-adamite world is in Gen. 1:2 where the planet is destroyed and re-created.

Symph · Aug 5, 2017

Hahahaha I am a student of Kent Hovind all the way, I'm on the opposing team buddy! No I think the need to reconcile contemporary science with genesis comes from the mistaken idea that the scientists are correct and/or telling the truth. Scientists are fallible people like anyone, and they've got their agendas too, and if you ask me when you have the type of person who wants to "figure everything out" there's danger there, God doesn't seem to want us trying to do that. He likes trust, the kind that doesn't ask too many questions but just says "yes daddy" so when you got a bunch of people thinking they can crack open his creation and "figure it all out" I kinda... don't trust that before it's even begun.

Problems with the gap theory are numerous, if animals and plants existed before man and they are the reason for all the fossils, then there was death on the earth before man sinned, so sin DIDN'T bring death into the world? Are you saying you also believe in evolution? Cause if so that means death brought mankind into existence, many subsequent deaths I should say. What is the purpose of "there was evening, there was morning" in genesis after each day? It's almost like he knew people were gonna create the gap theory so he had to be clear lol

hehehe no but I don't mind if you believe the gap theory, no need for a debate it's a misnomer issue methinks.

Lulav · Aug 5, 2017

It also helps to explain why in Genesis 1 we read

9 And God said, Let the waters under the heaven be gathered together unto one place, and let the dry land appear: and it was so.
10 And God called the dry land Earth; and the gathering together of the waters called he Seas: and God saw that it was good.
11 And God said, Let the earth bring forth grass, the herb yielding seed, and the fruit tree yielding fruit after his kind, whose seed is in itself, upon the earth: and it was so.
12 And the earth brought forth grass, and herb yielding seed after his kind, and the tree yielding fruit, whose seed was in itself, after his kind: and God saw that it was good.

The seeds must have already been in the earth from before the destruction. It doesn't say he created (bara) them, but He commanded that the seeds that were already buried in the earth spring forth, grow.

Also: In the beginning God created (bara) the heaven and the earth.

9 And God said, Let the waters under the heaven be gathered together unto one place, and let the dry land appear:

And God made (asah) two great lights; the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night: he made the stars also.

dysert · Aug 5, 2017

Why is this in the Eschatology subforum?

Lulav · Aug 5, 2017

dysert said:
Why is this in the Eschatology subforum?

I declare the end from the beginning, and from long ago what is not yet done, saying: My plan will take place, and I will do all My will.

Revealing Times · Aug 5, 2017

Quasar92 said:
On this website you will learn about a controversial, lesser known literal interpretation of the Genesis narrative that does not contradict the scientific evidence for an Old Earth. Commonly called the "Gap Theory" or Ruin-Reconstruction interpretation, it is a theological interpretation much older than Darwin's Theory of Evolution.

My answer to this on Quora was:

I as a 30 year Christian try to think outside the box of normality. Is the universe 6000 years old? Is the universe 13.7 billion years old? Do these two questions clash or is there a translation barrier !! This is how I think. I try to bring both poles of thought towards each other starting with the facts. We know the universe has to be over 6000 years old because we see light from stars that are millions of light years away, so we would have to be naive to think the universe is 6000 years old.

Onward to what Genesis says about creation, does it really say the universe or earth is 6000 years old? I don’t think it does, I think its a mistranslation of a primitive language that had only around 4000 words at the time Genesis was written, whereas the English language has 500,000 words. So many of the Hebrew words were used in multiple ways. For instance the original meaning of the Hebrew word YOWM (Day) means “to be hot” and there are at least 50 other meanings listed in strong’s concordance’s lexicon of Hebrew words. A year, a month, a period of time, chronicles, evening and morning (Beginning and end), age, perpetually, long, some time, whole, X required season, continually etc. etc., well you get the point.

YOWM or “To be hot”, what would this mean and why was it used since God is supposed to have given Moses the first five books of the Torah. Well when the universe was spoken into existence by God, it took 400 million years for the first stars to form. So the first Day (to be hot) was the Evening (Darkness, 400 million years of darkness) and the Morning ( The stars started forming) and the first day was a “period of time” and in my opinion it lasted from 13.7 Billion BC until 4.5 Billion BC (9.2 Billion years) when the Sun & Earth were formed. So lets take a second and look at the Bible and the WMAP research and see if this matches.

Genesis 1:1 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.

2 And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.

3 And God said, Let there be light: and there was light.

Now look below at the Wilkinson Microwave Anisotropy Probe (WMAP) which launched in 2001 and won many awards, they mapped the whole universe out. Below as we see, you had Quantum Fluctuations which I contend is God, then you had Inflation, followed by Afterglow, followed by 400 MILLION YEARS of Darkness !! Just like the bible says in verse 2, and there was Darkness on the Face of the Deep !! Gods word is perfect, it is us who are confused. DARK AGES Mapped out by the WMAP, followed by what? The first stars forming at the 400 million year mark. Verse three says what? and God said “Let there be light” God is right again. We are looking at Creation from Gods POV, no man was there of course and with God he is not subject to time, he created time for us via this universe, but He is eternal and thus was never created. Remember the verse, a thousand years is like a day and a day like unto a thousand years unto God. In other words God lives in the past, present and future all at the same time.

So we had the Big Bang, followed by Inflation, followed by Cosmic Microwave background where after 375,000 years loose electrons cool enough to combine with protons. The Universe becomes Transparent to Light. The Microwave background begins to shine. Then the dark ages/clouds of dark hydrogen gas cool and coalesce.

The first stars appear….Gas Clouds collapse, the fusion of Stars begin, the first of which appears at about 400 million years after the big bang. So, when the bible says Darkness was on the face of the deep, God knew exactly what was happening in the very beginning !! The more we look for the answers, the more that science and the bible will converge, if both sides with differing viewpoints would only take their blinders off.

The second day (period of time) of course would be from the Earth & the Suns formation until the grasses and trees came forth on the Third day (period of time) then on the Fourth day it seems God Set the Seasons or placed the Moon in its perfect orbit where our seasons are not strange, but orderly, I know the moon and earth is supposed to have collided. Anyway, that set the seasons, times, years etc. etc. Mind you, all of these ideas are rudimentary observations. A theory of how the things God says in His Holy Word and Science can both be factual. They are not meant to imply everything went down just so and in like manner, the dates of course are guesstimates, I wasn’t there.

On the Fifth day God created the Sea animals/birds and what not, were the Dinos created here or with the land animals? The fifth day lasted 300 million to 400 million years or so. On the Sixth Day around 300–350 Million BC God created the Land Animals. During this period of time the Dinosaurs became extinct about 70 Million years ago. Then during this “TIME PERIOD” (6TH DAY) God decided to create man 6000 or so years ago. Some might protest that men have been around much longer, but I offer this up, where is the data? Men are record keepers and we don’t have proof of men going back further. Now as per “MEN” being observed by scientists to have been around X Number of years, I never said Animal like men weren’t around, I stated Human Beings were created 6000 years ago, when God placed His spirit in us and thus we are immortal in that our souls can not die. We were at that point in time “Created in Gods Image”. The other fossils and bones mean nothing, because Scientists have no way of testing for God imparting His spirit into mankind and creating “Human Beings” with powerful intellects.

On the Seventh Day God rested, which only means He ceased Creating the Heavens/Earth/Mankind/Animals. So when we see stars and galaxies created today, it was ordered forth 13.7 Billion years ago. So its not necessarily either or. We need to start looking at things with an open mind, be we an atheist or a Christian.

P.S. Just something to think about. Einstein’s theory of relativity is in the very first verse of the bible, relatively speaking…LOL.

Genesis 1:1 In the beginning (TIME) God created the heaven(SPACE) and the earth(MATTER).

Quasar92 · Aug 5, 2017

Revealing Times said:
My answer to this on Quora was:

I as a 30 year Christian try to think outside the box of normality. Is the universe 6000 years old? Is the universe 13.7 billion years old? Do these two questions clash or is there a translation barrier !! This is how I think. I try to bring both poles of thought towards each other starting with the facts. We know the universe has to be over 6000 years old because we see light from stars that are millions of light years away, so we would have to be naive to think the universe is 6000 years old.

Onward to what Genesis says about creation, does it really say the universe or earth is 6000 years old? I don’t think it does, I think its a mistranslation of a primitive language that had only around 4000 words at the time Genesis was written, whereas the English language has 500,000 words. So many of the Hebrew words were used in multiple ways. For instance the original meaning of the Hebrew word YOWM (Day) means “to be hot” and there are at least 50 other meanings listed in strong’s concordance’s lexicon of Hebrew words. A year, a month, a period of time, chronicles, evening and morning (Beginning and end), age, perpetually, long, some time, whole, X required season, continually etc. etc., well you get the point.

YOWM or “To be hot”, what would this mean and why was it used since God is supposed to have given Moses the first five books of the Torah. Well when the universe was spoken into existence by God, it took 400 million years for the first stars to form. So the first Day (to be hot) was the Evening (Darkness, 400 million years of darkness) and the Morning ( The stars started forming) and the first day was a “period of time” and in my opinion it lasted from 13.7 Billion BC until 4.5 Billion BC (9.2 Billion years) when the Sun & Earth were formed. So lets take a second and look at the Bible and the WMAP research and see if this matches.

Genesis 1:1 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.

2 And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.

3 And God said, Let there be light: and there was light.

Now look below at the Wilkinson Microwave Anisotropy Probe (WMAP) which launched in 2001 and won many awards, they mapped the whole universe out. Below as we see, you had Quantum Fluctuations which I contend is God, then you had Inflation, followed by Afterglow, followed by 400 MILLION YEARS of Darkness !! Just like the bible says in verse 2, and there was Darkness on the Face of the Deep !! Gods word is perfect, it is us who are confused. DARK AGES Mapped out by the WMAP, followed by what? The first stars forming at the 400 million year mark. Verse three says what? and God said “Let there be light” God is right again. We are looking at Creation from Gods POV, no man was there of course and with God he is not subject to time, he created time for us via this universe, but He is eternal and thus was never created. Remember the verse, a thousand years is like a day and a day like unto a thousand years unto God. In other words God lives in the past, present and future all at the same time.

So we had the Big Bang, followed by Inflation, followed by Cosmic Microwave background where after 375,000 years loose electrons cool enough to combine with protons. The Universe becomes Transparent to Light. The Microwave background begins to shine. Then the dark ages/clouds of dark hydrogen gas cool and coalesce.

The first stars appear….Gas Clouds collapse, the fusion of Stars begin, the first of which appears at about 400 million years after the big bang. So, when the bible says Darkness was on the face of the deep, God knew exactly what was happening in the very beginning !! The more we look for the answers, the more that science and the bible will converge, if both sides with differing viewpoints would only take their blinders off.

The second day (period of time) of course would be from the Earth & the Suns formation until the grasses and trees came forth on the Third day (period of time) then on the Fourth day it seems God Set the Seasons or placed the Moon in its perfect orbit where our seasons are not strange, but orderly, I know the moon and earth is supposed to have collided. Anyway, that set the seasons, times, years etc. etc. Mind you, all of these ideas are rudimentary observations. A theory of how the things God says in His Holy Word and Science can both be factual. They are not meant to imply everything went down just so and in like manner, the dates of course are guesstimates, I wasn’t there.

On the Fifth day God created the Sea animals/birds and what not, were the Dinos created here or with the land animals? The fifth day lasted 300 million to 400 million years or so. On the Sixth Day around 300–350 Million BC God created the Land Animals. During this period of time the Dinosaurs became extinct about 70 Million years ago. Then during this “TIME PERIOD” (6TH DAY) God decided to create man 6000 or so years ago. Some might protest that men have been around much longer, but I offer this up, where is the data? Men are record keepers and we don’t have proof of men going back further. Now as per “MEN” being observed by scientists to have been around X Number of years, I never said Animal like men weren’t around, I stated Human Beings were created 6000 years ago, when God placed His spirit in us and thus we are immortal in that our souls can not die. We were at that point in time “Created in Gods Image”. The other fossils and bones mean nothing, because Scientists have no way of testing for God imparting His spirit into mankind and creating “Human Beings” with powerful intellects.

On the Seventh Day God rested, which only means He ceased Creating the Heavens/Earth/Mankind/Animals. So when we see stars and galaxies created today, it was ordered forth 13.7 Billion years ago. So its not necessarily either or. We need to start looking at things with an open mind, be we an atheist or a Christian.

P.S. Just something to think about. Einstein’s theory of relativity is in the very first verse of the bible, relatively speaking…LOL.

Genesis 1:1 In the beginning (TIME) God created the heaven(SPACE) and the earth(MATTER).

Consider the following:

The Hebrew word for day, is yom, not yowm.

Between Gen.1 and 2, before you go to any of the following verses, there was a huge time span took place as has been clearly documented by scientific field as well s from that of the astronomy field.

The belief this cataclysm was caused through the rift between God and Satan, is an accepted theory by mny expositors. As you too, will lern as you study this issue further.

Quasar92

Revealing Times · Aug 5, 2017

Quasar92 said:
Consider the following:

The Hebrew word for day, is yom, not yowm.

I use actual Hebrew bibles and translations.

#3117 יוֹם yowm {yome}

from an unused root meaning to be hot; TWOT - 852; n m
—Hebrew Word Study (Transliteration-Pronunciation Etymology & Grammar)

Its actually YOWM...........and is also known as YOM, not that it matters that much.

Genesis 2 is only a retelling of Mans Creation. Genesis one is telling of creation from Gods POV.

There is no Gap per se between Gen. 1 and 2, they both tell of Mans Creation.

Quasar92 · Aug 5, 2017

Revealing Times said:
I use actual Hebrew bibles and translations.

#3117 יוֹם yowm {yome}

from an unused root meaning to be hot; TWOT - 852; n m
—Hebrew Word Study (Transliteration-Pronunciation Etymology & Grammar)

Its actually YOWM...........and is also known as YOM, not that it matters that much.

Genesis 2 is only a retelling of Mans Creation. Genesis one is telling of creation from Gods POV.

There is no Gap per se between Gen. 1 and 2, they both tell of Mans Creation.

Review the following:

Strong's Hebrew: 3117. יוֹם (yom) -- day

There are many more just like it if you need more.

I can also provide you with a great deal more evidence that refutes any ideas of a ,000 year old earth, if the OP is not enough for you.

Quasar92

nonaeroterraqueous · Aug 6, 2017

Oh, well, if you want to read between two verses in the Bible to find what isn't there, then I'm not going to stop you. I think you deserve to find it. No, I don't want to share in your discovery.

BABerean2 · Aug 6, 2017

Quasar92 said:
Consider the following:

The Hebrew word for day, is yom, not yowm.

Between Gen.1 and 2, before you go to any of the following verses, there was a huge time span took place as has been clearly documented by scientific field as well s from that of the astronomy field.

The belief this cataclysm was caused through the rift between God and Satan, is an accepted theory by mny expositors. As you too, will lern as you study this issue further.

Quasar92

I am going to agree with you to some extent, here.

We have absolutely no idea how long Adam and Eve lived in the garden before the fall.

Time is not a constant. It's rate changes with ones velocity. This fact has been proven by thousands of experiments. The rate of time for two different people traveling at different velocities will not be the same. In extreme cases one of us could end up 18 years older in an elapsed time span of only 3 days, based on the other persons hypervelocity. This means, with the right equipment, I could end up being older than you.

There is also a tremendous amount of geological evidence that reveals the surface of the earth has been destroyed several times in the past by large asteroid impacts.

.

Revealing Times · Aug 6, 2017

Quasar92 said:
Review the following:

Strong's Hebrew: 3117. יוֹם (yom) -- day

There are many more just like it if you need more.

I can also provide you with a great deal more evidence that refutes any ideas of a ,000 year old earth, if the OP is not enough for you.

Quasar92

I gave you you the evidence from a Hebrew site, why would you hink Strong iverules them? That's weird man.

I use the Massoretic site....
Genesis 1 - Hebrew English Translation Massoretic Text MT Interlinear Holy Name King James Version KJV Strong's Concordance Online Parallel Bible Study

Prefix - 9007
וְ or 1961
הָיָה
hayah
{haw-yaw'}A primitive root (compare H1933); to exist, that is, be or become, come to pass (always emphatic, and not a mere copula or auxiliary)." style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: pink; font-family: "Ezra SIL", "Ezra SIL SR", "SBL Hebrew", David, "David Transparent", FrankRuehl, Narkisim, Aharoni, Miriam, "Miriam Fixed", "Miriam Transparent", "Fixed Miriam Transparent", Rod, "Rod Transparent", Gisha, "Levenim MT", "Times New Roman"; font-size: 24px; text-align: justify;">יְהִי־1242
בֹּקֶר
boqer
{bo'-ker}From H1239; properly dawn (as the break of day); generally morning." style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: pink; font-family: "Ezra SIL", "Ezra SIL SR", "SBL Hebrew", David, "David Transparent", FrankRuehl, Narkisim, Aharoni, Miriam, "Miriam Fixed", "Miriam Transparent", "Fixed Miriam Transparent", Rod, "Rod Transparent", Gisha, "Levenim MT", "Times New Roman"; font-size: 24px; text-align: justify;">בֹקֶר 3117
יוֹם
yowm
{yome}

You are using the later form of the Word where the W was dropped because the sound is YOM, but YOWM and YOM is the same thing, it means to be hot.

Its no big deal. But I am correct.

Quasar92 · Aug 6, 2017

nonaeroterraqueous said:
Oh, well, if you want to read between two verses in the Bible to find what isn't there, then I'm not going to stop you. I think you deserve to find it. No, I don't want to share in your discovery.

FYI, I am by far, not the only one who hold to a very old earth. You need only to open your eyes and your mind to proven facts presented to you.

GEOLOGY REVEALS: One Creation, One Restoration and Two Global Floods

[Or one creation; destruction and restoration for days 1-4 and new creation for days 5-6] Here is startling proof -- from the Bible and geology -- demonstrating not only two widely separated creations, but two world-wide destructions! Few have understood this astonishing truth! Now, it stands revealed for all to see!

Now for the first time, one of history's most fascinating stories can be told. The KEY to understanding the amazing history of the earth has been discovered. Contrary to what millions have been led to believe -- the true facts of science and the truth of your Bible agree! Theologians have long kept hidden this surprising truth. It conflicts with their theology. Atheistic professors have suppressed it. Science has refused to believe it. Only a few understand where the key which unlocks the amazing geologic history of the earth is. It has been in the FIRST TWO VERSES OF YOUR BIBLE all these years -- and you probably never noticed it.....

Proof of Pre-Adamic Flood

Notice the true facts of geology. The pre-Adamic catastrophe involved water. Laid down first by the swirling waters were the smaller sea creatures. They appear in the deepest sedimentary layers. The larger creatures of the land, by comparison, were able to flee to the higher hills. They were not drowned until the rising floodwaters spread over, then covered, the entire earth. Evolutionary geologists have discerned proof of this pre-Adamic flood. They know that rising floodwaters first swept up the ocean-bottom dwellers, the trilobites and the brachiopods, and other shell creatures of the sea. These ocean-bottom dwellers were scattered over wide areas. Later other sedimentary rocks with land life were laid down on top of them. That is exactly why fossils of sea creatures, such as the trilobite, SUDDENLY APPEAR as fossils in the DEEPEST sedimentary rocks.

Not knowing the Bible reveals a pre-Adamic catastrophe destroyed all life, an amazed evolutionary geologist exclaimed, "... the SUDDEN APPEARANCE of ABUNDANT FOSSILS in the Cambrian {lowest rocks in which life is found} is remarkable" (Dunbar, "Historical Geology", p. 125). {Emphasis ours in entire article.}
Why were these evolutionary geologists astounded to discover that complex fossils appear suddenly in the deepest sedimentary rocks?

The theory of evolution has led the geologists to assume the older and deeper rocks were laid down over many millions of years. They assumed that in the deepest rocks they would find very simple fossil remains of evolving forms. Obviously, because of the theory of evolution they expected to find simple fossil forms that clearly showed the steps of evolution taking place. Because evolution has never taken place, they failed to find simple pre-trilobite forms!
As the well-known evolutionary geologist Stokes said, "... we do not understand why fossils of marine invertebrates (without backbones) suddenly became plentiful ..." (Stokes, "Essentials of Earth History", p. 186)

By L. E. Torrance.

[Edit by Quasar92: Scriptural facts supporting the above: Gen.1:2; 7:20; 8:3-5; Psalms 24:2; 2 Pet.3:5-6 and Proverbs 8:24].

"But they deliberately forget that long ago by God's word the heavens existed and the earth was formed out of water and by water. By these waters also the world of that time was deluged and destroyed." 2 Pet.3:5-6 NIV.

Quasar92

Quasar92 · Aug 6, 2017

Revealing Times said:
I gave you you the evidence from a Hebrew site, why would you hink Strong iverules them? That's weird man.

I use the Massoretic site....
Genesis 1 - Hebrew English Translation Massoretic Text MT Interlinear Holy Name King James Version KJV Strong's Concordance Online Parallel Bible Study

Prefix - 9007
וְ or 1961
הָיָה
hayah
{haw-yaw'}A primitive root (compare H1933); to exist, that is, be or become, come to pass (always emphatic, and not a mere copula or auxiliary)." style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: pink; font-family: "Ezra SIL", "Ezra SIL SR", "SBL Hebrew", David, "David Transparent", FrankRuehl, Narkisim, Aharoni, Miriam, "Miriam Fixed", "Miriam Transparent", "Fixed Miriam Transparent", Rod, "Rod Transparent", Gisha, "Levenim MT", "Times New Roman"; font-size: 24px; text-align: justify;">יְהִי־1242
בֹּקֶר
boqer
{bo'-ker}From H1239; properly dawn (as the break of day); generally morning." style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: pink; font-family: "Ezra SIL", "Ezra SIL SR", "SBL Hebrew", David, "David Transparent", FrankRuehl, Narkisim, Aharoni, Miriam, "Miriam Fixed", "Miriam Transparent", "Fixed Miriam Transparent", Rod, "Rod Transparent", Gisha, "Levenim MT", "Times New Roman"; font-size: 24px; text-align: justify;">בֹקֶר 3117
יוֹם
yowm
{yome}

You are using the later form of the Word where the W was dropped because the sound is YOM, but YOWM and YOM is the same thing, it means to be hot.

Its no big deal. But I am correct.

For your edification:

19. The yom problem
— Yom; The Biggest Biblical Creation Theory Obstacle —
The word yom

The Hebrew word for day is yom and this word appears in Scriptures over 1400 times. And without exception this word, when written in the singular sense, means day. And that's it. Never anything else. Eons are indicated with the plural form: days, as in the days of such and such. The most popular counter argument is that the meaning of our word is fiercely restricted to 'day' for about a thousand times in the sequential Scriptures, but in the secluded chapter of Genesis 1 means something completely different! But honestly, if in Genesis 1 our word should have meant 'long time' it would have said 'long time'. There are words available in Hebrew that mean just that. None of which occur in Genesis 1.

The word as used in Genesis 1 means day and day alone. There's no way around it, and every serious theory to make (systematic, not theological) sense out of Genesis 1 should first and foremost address the yom-problem.

The solution lies in the rule we've established four chapters ago:

Hold that thought (11)
In Hebrew Scriptures, and all models derived thereof, entities are reckoned solely after their behavior and not after their appearance. An entity is a behavior, not that which executes the behavior.

To define something, the Hebrew language does not look at outer parameters but always at the action that needs to be named. The time-length of a yom is an outer parameter and not regarded in Hebrew. Since time and space are the four dimensions of space-time, and we measure sizes in the spatial dimensions with a ruler, a clock is a ruler for time. An hour is a 'distance' just like a mile.

A yom is not defined as something that is 24 hours long, but something that executes the action that defines a yom. Strictly spoken, a yom does not even have to have a length, as long as it executes the typical behavior that defines it. Forcing a static 24-hour mold upon the word yom may appear quite pious but flies flat in the face of the Second Commandment.

A yom therefore is a phase of a continuum (whether space-time, complexity or something else) that consists of two periods: a 'dark' part and a 'light' part. During the dark part of a regular day people sleep and are disconnected. During the light part they communicate and work together. Any other manifestation of yom should display the same kind of darkness (elements not connected) and lightness (elements connected).

Hebrew
(action) Western
(appearance)

horse ≈ swallow
= swift

horse ≈ cow
= between 1 & 2 meters high; 4 legs

cow ≠ horse ≠ swallow

swallow = 25 cm long; 2 legs, 2 wings ≠ horse or cow

yom = a phase of a continuum that consists of two periods; dark and light.
During the dark part the elements are not connected.
During the light part the elements are connected.

day = 24 hours long

Examples of he yom-phenomenon other than a civil (24-hour) day

The birth and getting connected of neurons in a baby's brain.
The emergence of like-minded people, who find each other and form a society or congregation.
The emergence of quantum particles that coalize at the moment of hydrogen formation.
The invention of the electronic computer during WWII; the emergence of the Internet during 80's and 90's.
Every period of the Household Set (atoms coalize and make cells; cells coalize and make minds).
When many observations turn into one unified understanding of the universe (faith).
Even more abstract but certainly valid: herd without shepherd (night) herd with shepherd (day). Same with a nation and king. Same with house and abba.

If you are interested in a lengthy look at Scriptural use of the word yom, check out the below supplement.

Else, step up to the next page:
A close look at Genesis 1 →

On Yom - Keywords

yom:
Day; as in our modern language, the word yom denotes both the entire cycle of one day and the light segment of it. Many wonder if in the Bible a day consists of a dark part first and then the light, or vice versa. But that's typical calendar-thinking. Look at waves on the ocean. Does the wave-peak precede the wave-trough or vice versa?

Activities were conducted on the light part of the day, but in case of special days (Sabbath and feasts) the jurisdiction of rules and regulations pertaining to that day commenced at the closure of the previous light part.

lylh:
Night; period of darkness.

ur:
Light; applied to the full array of electromagnetic functions, as well as instructions, wisdom, grace, blessing, etc. Light brings people together. Since the self-similar applications of the word ur (blessing, grace, etc) may stretch for any length of period, the corresponding yom does so too.

hoshek:
Darkness; absence of light, not the absence of God. This word is most often used to indicate curse or judgment, even to describe the darkness of the grave. Lack of light causes people to break apart. (The Second Law of thermo-dynamics dictates that in a system to which no energy (=light) is added the degree of chaos must increase).

boqer:
Morning. From the verb baqar, meaning to seek/ inquire. It's suggested that the most rudimental meaning of the root is 'to split', hence the breakingof dawn. But frankly, nothing is broken. In stead the root seems to denote the closing in on something, approaching something (to check it out or to simply bond). Another derivation of this root is 'herd', which is a collection of animals that are loosely bonded. Morning is the time of day when objects become visible and begin to relate, and people begin to connect.

ereb:
Evening. Derivation ma'arab is contrasted by mizrah where zarah means 'to rise'. Mizrah means 'place of rising, or the east'. Ma'arab means 'place of setting, or the west'. Hence the root ereb denotes a going down, as opposed to the 'rising' of the word dawn. In the evening all things begin to dissolve against the backdrop of the night.

shahar:
Dawn. Comes from a verb meaning both 'be black' and 'seek earnestly'. Black and white are both dark ( Explain) but black is the color of receptivity for light, while white is the color of light-rejection. As with the word for 'morning', the word shahar denotes the quest for relationship.
Most often this word is used in concert with the verb ala, to rise. In Hebrew dawn does not break but rise.

neshep:
Twilight (both in the evening as in the morning). From the verb nashap, 'to blow': "But He merely blows on them and they whither" - Isaiah 40:24. "You blew with your wind, the sea covered them - Ex 15:10.

Usages of the word yom that may help explain its meaning.

Ge 2:17
...but of the Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil you may not eat, for in the day that you eat of it, you shall surely die.

Immediately after the fall, both physical and spiritual death are introduced (Ephesians 2:1). Yet at the expulsion, Seth still had to be born and Adam lives another 800 years after the birth of Seth. This very difficult passage warrants a much more exhaustive treatment, but for now it suffices to say that if indeed this story reports the lethal consumption of a certain fruit, the death of Adam did not occur on the same civil day as when he ate the fruit. In this particular text, the word yom denotes something else than a civil day.

A civil day follows the setting and rising of the sun. But during a year the sun 'moves' up and down as well, from maximal northern declination on the first day of summer, to maximal southern declination on the first day of winter. The obvious self-similarity of year and day did not go unnoticed by the Bible writers:

Isaiah 34:8
For the day of vengeance is to Yahweh, the year of repayments for Zion's cause.

Isaiah 63:4
For the day of vengeance is in My heart, and the year of My redeemed has come.

We stress that the word yom to the Hebrews did not put in mind a simple nudge on a calendar but much rather a period of indefinite length and most definite theme, arguing the theme to set the day's boundaries and not the clock, most often not localizing the expressed sentiment to one specific duration of 24 hours at all:

De 32:35 Vengeance and retribution belong to Me; in due time their foot will slip; for the day of their calamity is near, and the things prepared are hurrying for them.

2 Samuel 22:19 They confronted me in the day of my calamity, and Yahweh was my support.
Job 15:23 He is wandering, for he seeks for bread. Where is it? He knows that the day of darkness is at his hand.

Job 20:28 The increase of his house shall depart, flowing away in the day of His wrath.
Job 21:30 For the wicked is kept for the day of calamity; they shall be brought to the day of wrath.
Job 38:23 which I have reserved for the time of distress for the day of battle and war?

Psalm 18:18 They went before my face in my day of calamity, but Yahweh was my support.

Psalm 20:1 To the chief musician. A Psalm of David. May Yahweh answer you in the day of distress; the name of the God of Jacob set you on high.
Psalm 20:9 Save, O Yahweh! The King will answer us in the day of our calling.
P
salm 27:5 For in the day of evil He shall hide me in His shelter; in the secrecy of His tabernacle, He shall hide me; He shall set me up on a rock.

Psalm 41:1 To the Chief Musician. A Psalm of David. Blessed is he who acts wisely toward the poor; Yahweh will deliver him in the day of evil.

Psalm 50:15 And call on Me in the day of distress; and I will save you; and you shall glorify Me.

Psalm 59:16 But I will sing of Your power; yes, I will sing of Your mercy in the morning. For You have been my strong tower, and my hiding place in the day of my trouble.

Psalm 77:2 In the day of my distress I sought the Lord; my hand was open in the night and did not grow numb; my soul refused to be comforted.

Psalm 86:7 I will call on You in the day of my trouble, for You will answer me.

Psalm 102:2 Do not hide Your face from me in the day of my trouble; bow down Your ear to me in the day I call; answer me quickly.

Psalm 110:3 Your people shall be willing in the day of Your power; in holy adornment from the womb of the dawn, to You is the dew of Your youth.
Psalm 110:5 The Lord at Your right hand shatters kings in the day of His anger.

Psalm 137:7 O Yahweh, remember for the sons of Edom the day of Jerusalem; who said, Make it bare! Make it bare even to its foundation!

Psalm 140:7 O Yahweh the Lord, the strength of my salvation, You have covered my head in the day of armor.

Pr 6:34 For jealousy is the rage of a man, and he will not spare in the day of vengeance,
Pr 11:4 Riches do not profit in the day of wrath, but righteousness delivers from death.
Pr 16:4 Yahweh has made all for His purpose, yea, even the wicked for the day of evil.
Isaiah 2:12 For the day of Yahweh of Hosts shall be on all the proud and lofty ones, and on all that is lifted up; and it will be abased;
Isaiah 13:13 So I will shake the heavens, and the earth shall move out of its place, in the wrath of Yahweh of Hosts, and in the day of His fierce anger.
Isaiah 17:11 In the day of your planting you fence it in; in the morning you make your seed sprout; the harvest is a heap in the day of sickness and incurable pain.
Isaiah 27:8 You will contend with her by driving her away, by sending her away. He shall take away by His harsh wind, in the day of the east wind.
Jeremiah 16:19 O Yahweh, my strength and my fortress, and my refuge in the day of affliction, the nations shall come to You from the ends of the earth and say, Our fathers have inherited only lies, vanity, and there is no profit in them.
Jeremiah 17:17 Do not be a terror to me; You are my refuge in the day of evil.
Lamentations 1:12 Is it nothing to you, all you who pass by? Behold, and see if there is any sorrow like my sorrow which is done to me, with which Yahweh has afflicted me in the day of His burning anger.
Ezekiel 7:7 The encirclement has come to you, O dwellers of the land. The time has come, the day of tumult is near, and not a shout of the hills.
Ezekiel 16:56 For your sister Sodom was not to be heard from your mouth in the day of your pride,
Ezekiel 22:24 Son of man, speak to her: You are a land, she is not being cleansed, you are not rained on in the day of disgust.
Ezekiel 33:12 And you, son of man, say to the sons of your people, The righteousness of the righteous shall not deliver him in the day of his trespass. And the evil of the evil, in the day he turns from his wickedness, he shall not fall by it. And the righteous shall not be able to live by it in the day he sins.

Source: The yom problem in addressing Genesis 1

Quasar92

Douggg · Aug 6, 2017

Quasar92 said:
Rightly-Dividing Geology and the Book of Genesis Beyond the "Gap Theory" of Creationism the face of the waters." (Genesis 1:2 KJV)

If you or someone you know are confused by claims that the earth is only 6,000 years old, then you have come to the right website. Many people think the six creation days in Genesis are a description of the Earth's geologic history. They are not! The geologic record shows that the Earth existed long before the six days and long before Adam. There is a time-gap between the first two verses of Genesis.

On this website you will learn about a controversial, lesser known literal interpretation of the Genesis narrative that does not contradict the scientific evidence for an Old Earth. Commonly called the "Gap Theory" or Ruin-Reconstruction interpretation, it is a theological interpretation much older than Darwin's Theory of Evolution. It is based on the Scriptural fact that in the second verse of Genesis, the Holy Bible simply and clearly states that the planet Earth was already here (but in a ruined state) before the Divine process described in those six days even begins. Understanding this Biblical mystery begins with the precise wording of this New Testament cross-reference:

"For this they willingly are ignorant of, that by the word of God the heavens were of old, and the earth standing out of the water and in the water: Whereby the world that then was, being overflowed with water, perished: But the heavens and the earth, which are now, by the same word are kept in store, reserved unto fire against the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men."
(2 Pet 3:5-7 KJV)

Contrary to popular interpretation, the above passage is NOT a reference to Noah's flood. (See Introduction Pages for specifics.) And the only other place in the Bible where the Earth was covered in waters is Genesis 1:2. The ramifications are obvious: The literal wording suggests that the "heavens and the earth, which are now" (made during the seven days) was not the first-time creation of all things as is traditionally assumed. The Word of God appears to be telling the reader there was a previous populated world on the face of this old Earth before God formed the present world of modern Man.

"And God blessed them, and God said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth, and subdue it: and have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over every living thing that moveth upon the earth."(Genesis 1:28 KJV)

The Bible itself provides insight into a great mystery in Earth's natural history at what is known as the Pleistocene - Holocene boundary. Science remains at a loss to definitively explain the Ice Age and the anomaly of the mysterious mega fauna extinctions across the face of the Earth about 12,000 to 10,000 Radio Carbon years ago. Geologic evidence from that period indicates extraordinary global massive volcanism, gigantic tidal waves, seismic activity on a vast scale, and extreme temperature swings on the Earth over a geologically brief period of time. It is no coincidence that the Bible at Genesis 1:2 describes the Earth as flooded, desolate, and in darkness in the timeframe closely corresponding to these catastrophic events in the Earth's natural history. Clearly, these two mysteries are linked.Why the old "world that then was" ended, and why God made a new world and modern Man, requires a study into the ancient origins of Satan and the Angels. The Earth has an ancient natural history that can be deciphered from the geologic record, but it also has an equally important ancient spiritual history that can only be deciphered from Rightly-Dividing the Holy Bible. Knowledge of both is required to correctly reconcile Geology and the Book of Genesis. We pray you will find this material useful in your study of God's Holy Word.

These are the generations [

] of the heavens and of the earth when they were created, in the day that the LORD God made the earth and the heavens,
(Genesis 2:4 KJV)[/font)

Quasar92

A primordial world, which Satan and his angels corrupted the creatures thereof, by altering DNA to created dinosaurs such as T-Rex. Destroyed by flood covering the entire earth of such magnitude it rendered the planet featureless - no landmass, i.e. without form. The water covered world being called the deep. Also there would have had to been something that destroyed all the creatures in the sea as well.

Postvieww · Aug 7, 2017

To anyone who owns a Dake’s Annotated Reference Bible his notes are very good on this topic

Jeremiah 4:23 I beheld the earth, and, lo, it was without form, and void; and the heavens, and they had no light.

24 I beheld the mountains, and, lo, they trembled, and all the hills moved lightly.

25 I beheld, and, lo, there was no man, and all the birds of the heavens were fled.

26 I beheld, and, lo, the fruitful place was a wilderness, and all the cities thereof were broken down at the presence of the Lord, and by his fierce anger.

27 For thus hath the Lord said, The whole land shall be desolate; yet will I not make a full end.

28 For this shall the earth mourn, and the heavens above be black; because I have spoken it, I have purposed it, and will not repent, neither will I turn back from it.

Psalm 104:1 Bless the Lord, O my soul. O Lord my God, thou art very great; thou art clothed with honour and majesty.

2 Who coverest thyself with light as with a garment: who stretchest out the heavens like a curtain:

3 Who layeth the beams of his chambers in the waters: who maketh the clouds his chariot: who walketh upon the wings of the wind:

4 Who maketh his angels spirits; his ministers a flaming fire:

5 Who laid the foundations of the earth, that it should not be removed for ever.

6 Thou coveredst it with the deep as with a garment: the waters stood above the mountains.

7 At thy rebuke they fled; at the voice of thy thunder they hasted away.

8 They go up by the mountains; they go down by the valleys unto the place which thou hast founded for them.

9 Thou hast set a bound that they may not pass over; that they turn not again to cover the earth.

10 He sendeth the springs into the valleys, which run among the hills.

11 They give drink to every beast of the field: the wild asses quench their thirst.

12 By them shall the fowls of the heaven have their habitation, which sing among the branches.

13 He watereth the hills from his chambers: the earth is satisfied with the fruit of thy works.

14 He causeth the grass to grow for the cattle, and herb for the service of man: that he may bring forth food out of the earth;

15 And wine that maketh glad the heart of man, and oil to make his face to shine, and bread which strengtheneth man's heart.

16 The trees of the Lord are full of sap; the cedars of Lebanon, which he hath planted;

17 Where the birds make their nests: as for the stork, the fir trees are her house.

18 The high hills are a refuge for the wild goats; and the rocks for the conies.

19 He appointed the moon for seasons: the sun knoweth his going down.

20 Thou makest darkness, and it is night: wherein all the beasts of the forest do creep forth.

21 The young lions roar after their prey, and seek their meat from God.

22 The sun ariseth, they gather themselves together, and lay them down in their dens.

23 Man goeth forth unto his work and to his labour until the evening.

24 O Lord, how manifold are thy works! in wisdom hast thou made them all: the earth is full of thy riches.

25 So is this great and wide sea, wherein are things creeping innumerable, both small and great beasts.

26 There go the ships: there is that leviathan, whom thou hast made to play therein.

27 These wait all upon thee; that thou mayest give them their meat in due season.

28 That thou givest them they gather: thou openest thine hand, they are filled with good.

29 Thou hidest thy face, they are troubled: thou takest away their breath, they die, and return to their dust.

30 Thou sendest forth thy spirit, they are created: and thou renewest the face of the earth.

31 The glory of the Lord shall endure for ever: the Lord shall rejoice in his works.

32 He looketh on the earth, and it trembleth: he toucheth the hills, and they smoke.

33 I will sing unto the Lord as long as I live: I will sing praise to my God while I have my being.

34 My meditation of him shall be sweet: I will be glad in the Lord.

35 Let the sinners be consumed out of the earth, and let the wicked be no more. Bless thou the Lord, O my soul. Praise ye the Lord.

2 Peter 3:5 For this they willingly are ignorant of, that by the word of God the heavens were of old, and the earth standing out of the water and in the water:

6 Whereby the world that then was, being overflowed with water, perished:

7 But the heavens and the earth, which are now, by the same word are kept in store, reserved unto fire against the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men.

8 But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.

Handmaid for Jesus · Aug 7, 2017

Ecc. 3: 11 He has made everything beautiful in its time. Also He has put eternity in their hearts, except that no one can find out the work that God does from beginning to end.(NKJV)

jhwatts · Aug 12, 2017

Postvieww said:
6 Thou coveredst it with the deep as with a garment: the waters stood above the mountains.

Notice the deep (Genesis 1:2) was placed over the mountains and therefore wasn't formed that way. Also the mountains must have existed before the deep.

Beyond the Gap Theory

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