Do Liberals Make it Hard for Blacks to Succeed?

Wolfe

Pack Leader
Aug 24, 2016
1,345
1,115
United states
✟59,662.00
Country
United States
Faith
Anabaptist
Marital Status
Single
Politics
US-Others
You have a nonsensical view of liberalism
I have a no more nonsensical view of liberals, than you have of conservatives.
I never said ALL liberals, I said most. Or implied most, if that's nonsensical, then I'm sorry but you're quite illogical, and you cannot be reasoned with.
 
Upvote 0

jimmyjimmy

Pardoned Rebel
Site Supporter
Jan 2, 2015
11,556
5,728
USA
✟234,973.00
Country
United States
Faith
Presbyterian
Marital Status
Married
You have a nonsensical view of liberalism. And, I never claimed to be the "poster boy." My point is that there is no poster boy. Liberals, like conservatives, are a diverse bunch.



Yes, thanks for asking.

Which ones?
 
Upvote 0

EpiscipalMe

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Jul 1, 2017
1,763
1,299
USA
✟171,590.00
Country
United States
Faith
Episcopalian
Marital Status
Married
I have a no more nonsensical view of liberals, than you have of conservatives.
I never said ALL liberals, I said most. Or implied most, if that's nonsensical, then I'm sorry but you're quite illogical, and you cannot be reasoned with.

Your entire last post was nonsensical, stating with the claim that liberalism is necessarily anti-Christian.

Which ones?

Usually I do topical searches and read numerous new outlets. I regularly look at the WSJ, including the comments which are quite conservative. If you have other suggestions of things I should be reading on a regular basis, ima, happy to start doing that.

I used to listen to conservative talk radio regularly. This includes the nationally syndicated folks such as Limbaugh and Levin and the local talent. However, they got too crazy.
 
Upvote 0

Wolfe

Pack Leader
Aug 24, 2016
1,345
1,115
United states
✟59,662.00
Country
United States
Faith
Anabaptist
Marital Status
Single
Politics
US-Others
Your entire last post was nonsensical, stating with the claim that liberalism is necessarily anti-Christian.
It is, explain how it's not. And then you're allowed to say it's nonsensical.

You see, with you being a liberal, you wouldn't understand this, but you've gotta back your claim, before you're allowed to say it.
 
Upvote 0

jimmyjimmy

Pardoned Rebel
Site Supporter
Jan 2, 2015
11,556
5,728
USA
✟234,973.00
Country
United States
Faith
Presbyterian
Marital Status
Married
Your entire last post was nonsensical, stating with the claim that liberalism is necessarily anti-Christian.



Usually I do topical searches and read numerous new outlets. I regularly look at the WSJ, including the comments which are quite conservative. If you have other suggestions of things I should be reading on a regular basis, ima, happy to start doing that.

I used to listen to conservative talk radio regularly. This includes the nationally syndicated folks such as Limbaugh and Levin and the local talent. However, they got too crazy.

Here are a couple of sources of highly educated Christian Conservatives, who don't "get too crazy".

Hillsdale Dialogues Podcast

Hillsdale Dialogues Podcast by Hillsdale College on Apple Podcasts

Albert Mohler (Daily - The Briefing)

Friday, August 4, 2017 — The Briefing
 
  • Informative
Reactions: EpiscipalMe
Upvote 0

EpiscipalMe

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Jul 1, 2017
1,763
1,299
USA
✟171,590.00
Country
United States
Faith
Episcopalian
Marital Status
Married
It is, explain how it's not. And then you're allowed to say it's nonsensical.

You see, with you being a liberal, you wouldn't understand this, but you've gotta back your claim, before you're allowed to say it.

Have you backed your claims?

Tell me how being a liberal is unChristian and I will tell you how you are wrong.

Let's start with abortion - It is true that liberals tend to be pro-choice (not pro-abortion or anti-life). I am pro-life for my own family, but also recognize that not everyone is Christian and shares the same views I do as to when life starts. I also, think the best way to end abortion is through education, not legislation. Look at what happened in Texas - abortion rates went up after defunding Planned Parenthood.

Gay marriage - Due to site restrictions, I cannot explain my full views here. However, let's just say that, again, not everyone is Christian. Christians have no business legislating positions that are purely based on their faith. I am against legal action toward private business who do not want to participate in gay weddings, but I am not opposed to the state recognizing the legality of a gay marriage.

Health care - I believe we have a Christian duty to provide for the health of all. I also do not believe that this is something that can be left to charities or local governments. The issue is to big and too expensive. There needs to be massive overhaul.

Immigration - We have a civic duty to protect our borders. However, we have a Christian duty to help those in need. One of my favorite passages on this topic is Exodus 22:21 (repeated in Deuteronomy 10:19).

Mainly, though, I am not a one or two issue voter. Neither party/ideology fits with my views perfectly. I used to lean more conservative, but the Republican part went way to far right for my tastes. That's why I'm a registered independent.
 
Upvote 0

EpiscipalMe

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Jul 1, 2017
1,763
1,299
USA
✟171,590.00
Country
United States
Faith
Episcopalian
Marital Status
Married
Upvote 0

Yarddog

Senior Contributor
Site Supporter
Jun 25, 2008
15,280
3,553
Louisville, Ky
✟820,148.00
Faith
Catholic
Marital Status
Married
If you subscribe to a political ideology, you can be judged based on that ideology because it is an absolute.
Most liberals, most, of course I'm not an idiot, and I wouldn't like to think you are either, nothing is 100% when it comes to opinions.
Which is it? First you it is an absolute and then nothing is 100%.

Within politics, idealogy varies within parties or political identities. There are more than a dozen types of Liberalism so when a person says that they are a Liberal you can't judge which they are without either asking them to identify which or by asking a lot of questions to help you pin point it.

If you throw all people who call themselves Liberals into the same idealogy grouping and judge them based on your misunderstanding of political ideologies then you would be showing an extreme prejudicial bias toward these people.

[/Quote]
But most liberals, think they're special, or a certain racial identity is special. Who is it treating everybody differently based on class, or race? [/Quote]
Most blacks are Liberals according to every survey I have seen over the years, are you judging these black liberals by the same method by which you have stated in several posts?
 
  • Agree
Reactions: EpiscipalMe
Upvote 0

Wolfe

Pack Leader
Aug 24, 2016
1,345
1,115
United states
✟59,662.00
Country
United States
Faith
Anabaptist
Marital Status
Single
Politics
US-Others
Have you backed your claims?

Tell me how being a liberal is unChristian and I will tell you how you are wrong.

Let's start with abortion - It is true that liberals tend to be pro-choice (not pro-abortion or anti-life). I am pro-life for my own family, but also recognize that not everyone is Christian and shares the same views I do as to when life starts. I also, think the best way to end abortion is through education, not legislation. Look at what happened in Texas - abortion rates went up after defunding Planned Parenthood.

Gay marriage - Due to site restrictions, I cannot explain my full views here. However, let's just say that, again, not everyone is Christian. Christians have no business legislating positions that are purely based on their faith. I am against legal action toward private business who do not want to participate in gay weddings, but I am not opposed to the state recognizing the legality of a gay marriage.

Health care - I believe we have a Christian duty to provide for the health of all. I also do not believe that this is something that can be left to charities or local governments. The issue is to big and too expensive. There needs to be massive overhaul.

Immigration - We have a civic duty to protect our borders. However, we have a Christian duty to help those in need. One of my favorite passages on this topic is Exodus 22:21 (repeated in Deuteronomy 10:19).

Mainly, though, I am not a one or two issue voter. Neither party/ideology fits with my views perfectly. I used to lean more conservative, but the Republican part went way to far right for my tastes. That's why I'm a registered independent.
Well at least you're not a complete idiot.

I disagree, it is pro abortion. It's pro death, how could it not be? Even if you're recognizing the option to not abort, you still advocate for the "right" to kill an unborn child. No matter how people view it, if Christianity is the one truth, then it doesn't matter what anybody else says.
The, "Not every is a Christian, so why impose my value?" Bit, is overplayed. The bible says it's a life, so it is a life. You stand up for it, in no way should you ever, in any circumstance be alright with anybody saying otherwise, because it's advocating murder.

Being a liberal is Anti Christian, because it tells you it's okay to do practically anything you want.
or that you're okay with people desecrating the very values Christianity stands for, and that's not right. The abortion fact alone, proves my point. "pro choice", to you, a Christian, it should be no different than someone saying they're okay with murdering people.
The very principle of liberalism states that if it doesn't harm anyone, and it's your choice, or between 2 consenting adults, it's okay to do and/or none of our business.

And it is very much our business, as Christians, are we just gonna let people sin, and go to Hell? Say nothing about it to no one? Is that okay?
If you're a Christian, then you know Gods values to be right, and true, and you stand up for those values in any case because it is right, and true.

You don't lay down arms, and surrender because not every ones Christians.
In life, you've gotta always act like you're in a witness, when you're a Christian.

And I know I've been pretty vile here, and unChristian, and quite mean, and so have you, don't be koi.
But I will concede that I have been worse with it, it's a struggle of mine, but anyway my point is, if anything, anything at all, has one facet of itself that does not align with the bible, it is false, and decidedly anti Christian.

Because if you're against one Christian value, you may as well be against them all, because you've gotta accept them all.
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

EpiscipalMe

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Jul 1, 2017
1,763
1,299
USA
✟171,590.00
Country
United States
Faith
Episcopalian
Marital Status
Married
Well at least you're not a complete idiot.

I disagree, it is pro abortion. It's pro death, how could it not be? Even if you're recognizing the option to not abort, you still advocate for the "right" to kill an unborn child. No matter how people view it, if Christianity is the one truth, then it doesn't matter what anybody else says.
The, "Not every is a Christian, so why impose my value?" Bit, is overplayed. The bible says it's a life, so it is a life. You stand up for it, in no way should you ever, in any circumstance be alright with anybody saying otherwise, because it's advocating murder.

Being a liberal is Anti Christian, because it tells you it's okay to do practically anything you want.
or that you're okay with people desecrating the very values Christianity stands for, and that's not right. The abortion fact alone, proves my point. "pro choice", to you, a Christian, it should be no different than someone saying they're okay with murdering people.
The very principle of liberalism states that if it doesn't harm anyone, and it's your choice, or between 2 consenting adults, it's okay to do and/or none of our business.

And it is very much our business, as Christians, are we just gonna let people sin, and go to Hell? Say nothing about it to no one? Is that okay?
If you're a Christian, then you know Gods values to be right, and true, and you stand up for those values in any case because it is right, and true.

You don't lay down arms, and surrender because not every ones Christians.
In life, you've gotta always act like you're in a witness, when you're a Christian.

And I know I've been pretty vile here, and unChristian, and quite mean, and so have you, don't be koi.
But I will concede that I have been worse with it, it's a struggle of mine, but anyway my point is, if anything, anything at all, has one facet of itself that does not align with the bible, it is false, and decidedly anti Christian.

Because if you're against one Christian value, you may as well be against them all, because you've gotta accept them all.

I agree we need to be for Christian values. The question is, how do we get others to be for those values - legislation or education?

I disagree that liberalism is about "do what you want." It more about following your own conscience rather than relying on the government to tell you right from wrong. Again, I prefer education over legislation.

Neither party is really "Christian" so we all need to just pick the candidates that align best with our ideals.
 
Upvote 0

Wolfe

Pack Leader
Aug 24, 2016
1,345
1,115
United states
✟59,662.00
Country
United States
Faith
Anabaptist
Marital Status
Single
Politics
US-Others
Within politics, idealogy varies within parties or political identities. There are more than a dozen types of Liberalism so when a person says that they are a Liberal you can't judge which they are without either asking them to identify which or by asking a lot of questions to help you pin point it.
Then isn't it stupid to have a blanket term?

Within politics, if someone subscribes to an ideology, that ideology is an absolute. The person, is not. If you read my post, you'd understand that.
With that ideology, you have a clear idea of what that person believes, and how that person thinks, if they subscribe to it.
If they call themselves democrat, but recite only republican rhetoric, then they're obviously not democratic are they?

If you throw all people who call themselves Liberals into the same idealogy grouping and judge them based on your misunderstanding of political ideologies then you would be showing an extreme prejudicial bias toward these people.
Again... do I need to explain this? Do I REALLY need to explain this again?
Someone subscribes to a certain ideology, that ideology has certain typical principles, you now have an idea of that persons principles and how they think....

Is that so hard to grasp? Or do you need to do some more dodging?
If it's prejudiced to have a concise idea of a persons political beliefs based on their own self proclaimed political affiliation, then why have the affiliation at all? It's all BS.
Most blacks are Liberals according to every survey I have seen over the years, are you judging these black liberals by the same method by which you have stated in several posts?
I treat everyone the same, you see, I'm not a racist liberal. I have no need to call them a black liberal, they're simply a liberal. There is absolutely no positive gain to specifying the race, except to differentiate them from the others, and why else would you need to do that? It's racist.

And what do blacks being liberals prove? What are you hoping to accomplish by telling me this, why is this some big crux to your argument? It means absolutely nothing what race the person is, an idiot is an idiot, and I will treat said idiot the same as I do every idiot, disregarding color, creed, backround, gender, anything.
Anything less would be prejudiced, if you don't give everybody the same treatment, as you would anybody else, you treat them less, and you don't give them your respect.

Let's say you say the N word to your white friends, no problem, they joke and laugh with you, now, would you say it to an equal friend, that is black? Probably not, why? Because he's black? of course because he's black, you've done recognized his race, and you've decided to treat him differently than you would your white friends. Unless he has already stated that he does not like the word, then it would be cruel to joke with him about it.

I used the N word because it's a nice, easily recognizable racial epitaph. You can use anything.
I would find it incredibly disrespectful if I found out I was getting special treatment, above someone else. For anything, let alone my color. I would feel like a low down punk, and like I was being treated like a child.
 
Upvote 0

Wolfe

Pack Leader
Aug 24, 2016
1,345
1,115
United states
✟59,662.00
Country
United States
Faith
Anabaptist
Marital Status
Single
Politics
US-Others
I agree we need to be for Christian values. The question is, how do we get others to be for those values - legislation or education?

I disagree that liberalism is about "do what you want." It more about following your own conscience rather than relying on the government to tell you right from wrong. Again, I prefer education over legislation.

Neither party is really "Christian" so we all need to just pick the candidates that align best with our ideals.
I never said make it a law to be Christian, what I'm saying is you've gotta preach when these issues come up. If you have a gay friend, don't support him, as many do. Talk to him, voice your concerns for his salvation, same as if you have an atheist friend. Like I said, act like you're in a constant witness when talking with these people, anybody really.
 
Upvote 0

Wolfe

Pack Leader
Aug 24, 2016
1,345
1,115
United states
✟59,662.00
Country
United States
Faith
Anabaptist
Marital Status
Single
Politics
US-Others
Neither party is really "Christian" so we all need to just pick the candidates that align best with our ideals.
I don't affiliate with either, I simply say Biblical, even though it says republican on my profile, I think I already explained this, but I can't quite figure out how to change/remove that.
I've since grown past the need for a political affiliation. Instead I say anything that goes outside biblical boundaries is false. And my political ideology certainly is bible inspired.
 
Upvote 0

EpiscipalMe

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Jul 1, 2017
1,763
1,299
USA
✟171,590.00
Country
United States
Faith
Episcopalian
Marital Status
Married
I never said make it a law to be Christian, what I'm saying is you've gotta preach when these issues come up. If you have a gay friend, don't support him, as many do. Talk to him, voice your concerns for his salvation, same as if you have an atheist friend. Like I said, act like you're in a constant witness when talking with these people, anybody really.

Right - educate, not legislate. On this we agree.

I don't affiliate with either, I simply say Biblical, even though it says republican on my profile, I think I already explained this, but I can't quite figure out how to change/remove that.
I've since grown past the need for a political affiliation. Instead I say anything that goes outside biblical boundaries is false. And my political ideology certainly is bible inspired.

I agree here too. I'm also saying that neither liberal/conservative nor Democrat/Republican really espouse all Christian values. We all need to pick where we stand on the issues and this will likely not sync completely with one established political ideology or party.

This is why I object to putting all liberals or all conservatives in a box. This is the point I started my whole argument with.
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

Yarddog

Senior Contributor
Site Supporter
Jun 25, 2008
15,280
3,553
Louisville, Ky
✟820,148.00
Faith
Catholic
Marital Status
Married
Actually, most "Kluckers" are Nazis.
Well, in recent years there has been some events where the two groups have joined together in their protests but to say most are Nazis wouldn't be correct. They share in a hatred of some of the same ethnic groups.
Which is not conservatism.
Both groups are recognized as an extreme right wing form of conservatism an support the Republican Party.
Geez, your liberalism really has brainwashed you..
And you claim educated opinion. Lol
But good on you, obviously vilifying a certain set of ideas,
I vilify prejudicial thinking. Whether that is directed at Liberals, Conservatives, races, etc...
while uplifting an unrelated racial political affiliation, ALL at the same time vilifying us for criticizing liberals harshly.
I'm simply showing how illogical your views are.
Did you think about your post before you posted it?
Yes, one of us needed to think about it with an educated opinion. :) Just kidding.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

Wolfe

Pack Leader
Aug 24, 2016
1,345
1,115
United states
✟59,662.00
Country
United States
Faith
Anabaptist
Marital Status
Single
Politics
US-Others
I'm simply showing how illogical your views are.
You've done nothing of the sort, you've done the typical liberal tactic of stating without reasoning.

Please try before you try.
Read a book or something, come back when you've learned to debate.
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

Yarddog

Senior Contributor
Site Supporter
Jun 25, 2008
15,280
3,553
Louisville, Ky
✟820,148.00
Faith
Catholic
Marital Status
Married
Again... do I need to explain this? Do I REALLY need to explain this again?
Evidently you don't read well enough or comprehend what was written, Liberalism has no set terms of idealogy. There are many forms within that term. The same goes for Conservatism. Don't use these as a blanket term.
 
  • Agree
Reactions: EpiscipalMe
Upvote 0