Churches with unbiblical doctrines
- Thread starter Ben Collyer
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It must be a sin why else would this verse be in the Bible
Revelation 18:4
And I heard another voice from heaven, saying, Come out of her, my people, that ye be not partakers of her sins, and that ye receive not of her plagues.
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The SDA church is also in error. Did you know that the SDA church does not have a correct teaching on tithing? The Bible does not support the teaching that believers are required by God to give 10% of their gross income to the General Conference. Such a teaching is not compatible with 2Cor. 9:7. Moreover, the Levitical tithe was never given in money but only in food stuff (see Mal. 3:10).
When I studied this out for myself, I was surprised to see how badly church leaders have taken Malachi 3:8 out of context, falsely accusing church members of robbing God for not giving 10% of their gross income to the GC. They are not reading Leviticus 27:30-33 correctly, but are inserting their own rules in the passage, and pushing false guilt on those who don't comply.
Do some deep research on this subject (without the aid of SDA commentaries), and you will see the truth.
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yeshuaslavejeff
simple truth, martyr, disciple of Yahshua
Perhaps our "options" are actually very narrow .... as written ...... in Revelation....
excerpts from Biblegateway.com, EXP, verses from chapters 2 and/or 3:
29 Everyone who has ears should ·listen to [hear; obey] what the Spirit says to the churches.
24 “But ·others [the rest] of you in Thyatira have not followed her teaching and have not learned what some call Satan’s deep secrets. I say to you that I will not put any other ·load [burden] on you. 25 Only ·continue in your loyalty [L hold fast to what you have] until I come.
But you ·are true to me [L hold fast to my name]. You did not ·refuse to tell about [deny] your faith in me even during the time of Antipas, my faithful witness who was killed ·in your city [L among you; C we know nothing further about Antipas], where Satan lives.
14 “But I have a few things against you: You have some there who follow the teaching of Balaam. He taught Balak how to ·cause the people of Israel to sin [L put a stumbling block before the children of Israel] by eating food offered to idols and by taking part in sexual sins [Num. 22—24; 31:8; Deut. 23:4–5; 2 Pet. 2:15; Jude 11]. 15 You also have some who follow the teaching of the Nicolaitans [see 2:6]. 16 So ·change your hearts and lives [repent]. If you do not, I will come to you quickly and ·fight [make war] against them with the sword that comes out of my mouth [C the judgment he enacts by merely speaking; 1:16].
17 “Everyone who has ears should ·listen to [hear; obey] what the Spirit says to the churches.
“I will give some of the hidden manna .....
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Servantleader
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Hi again Ben.
Have you tried asking yourself why you go to church at all. For some, church is an obligation, for some, it is a therapeutic place to be during hard times. But if we are speaking of what is biblical, the early church yearned for a place to talk about God and to hear from God. The communal aspect of church brought people together in one accord to honor God.
It is safe to admit that based on culture, background, and spiritual living, many Christians AND churches practice different ways to honor God. Perhaps it is time to consider that Christians may never unanimously agree on what way is right to honor God. Maybe that is okay. Maybe the differences do not have to divide our hearts concerning God and we continue to be faithful to the church community that He has planted us in. When it is time to leave, I believe God will nudge you.
Concerning women being pastors, as one who is currently in seminary studying in deeper depths the many misconceptions about the bible and what it contains, I can assure you that God does not from on women being pastors. However, I think matters like that are crucial for the one who is seeking the answer to go in the Word and seek the wisdom for themselves. Ask God. Research essays and theological background on why the church is what it is today. I think many of us will be peacefully shocked to find out that many of the decrees we hold on to as biblical truths really have no biblical foundations but traditional and generational practices that we hesitate to question or change.
Have you tried asking yourself why you go to church at all. For some, church is an obligation, for some, it is a therapeutic place to be during hard times. But if we are speaking of what is biblical, the early church yearned for a place to talk about God and to hear from God. The communal aspect of church brought people together in one accord to honor God.
It is safe to admit that based on culture, background, and spiritual living, many Christians AND churches practice different ways to honor God. Perhaps it is time to consider that Christians may never unanimously agree on what way is right to honor God. Maybe that is okay. Maybe the differences do not have to divide our hearts concerning God and we continue to be faithful to the church community that He has planted us in. When it is time to leave, I believe God will nudge you.
Concerning women being pastors, as one who is currently in seminary studying in deeper depths the many misconceptions about the bible and what it contains, I can assure you that God does not from on women being pastors. However, I think matters like that are crucial for the one who is seeking the answer to go in the Word and seek the wisdom for themselves. Ask God. Research essays and theological background on why the church is what it is today. I think many of us will be peacefully shocked to find out that many of the decrees we hold on to as biblical truths really have no biblical foundations but traditional and generational practices that we hesitate to question or change.
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Open Heart
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I don't think it means you are sinning if you continue to attend. However, I do think that when you choose a church, you should seek a denomination that is doctrinally pure. Yeah, I know it means getting into the heavy stuff that people hate. It means going to churches that maybe you think are wrong, and talking to the pastor, maybe even taking classes, and finding out WHY they teach what they do.
At the same time, don't be so picky about churches that you stop going. You don't want to start your own religion.
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St. Vincent of Lerins 434ad (speaking of the whole Church when he says Catholic, not The Church of Rome)
(1) I have continually given the greatest pains and diligence to inquiring, from the greatest possible number of men outstanding in holiness and in doctrine, how I can secure a kind of fixed and, as it were, general and guiding principle for distinguishing the true Catholic Faith from the degraded falsehoods of heresy. And the answer that I receive is always to this effect; that if I wish, or indeed if anyone wishes, to detect the deceits of heretics that arise and to avoid their snares and to keep healthy and sound in a healthy faith, we ought, with the Lord's help, to fortify our faith in a twofold manner, firstly, that is, by the authority of God's Law, then by the tradition of the Catholic Church.
(2) Here, it may be, someone will ask, Since the canon of Scripture is complete, and is in itself abundantly sufficient, what need is there to join to it the interpretation of the Church? The answer is that because of the very depth of Scripture all men do not place one identical interpretation upon it. The statements of the same writer are explained by different men in different ways, so much so that it seems almost possible to extract from it as many opinions as there are men. Novatian expounds in one way, Sabellius in another, Donatus in another, Arius, Eunomius and Macedonius in another, Photinus, Apollinaris and Priscillian in another, Jovinian, Pelagius and Caelestius in another, and latterly Nestorius in another. Therefore, because of the intricacies of error, which is so multiform, there is great need for the laying down of a rule for the exposition of Prophets and Apostles in accordance with the standard of the interpretation of the Church Catholic.
(3) Now in the Catholic Church itself we take the greatest care to hold that which has been believed everywhere, always and by all. That is truly and properly 'Catholic,' as is shown by the very force and meaning of the word, which comprehends everything almost universally. We shall hold to this rule if we follow universality [i.e. oecumenicity], antiquity, and consent. We shall follow universality if we acknowledge that one Faith to be true which the whole Church throughout the world confesses; antiquity if we in no wise depart from those interpretations which it is clear that our ancestors and fathers proclaimed; consent, if in antiquity itself we keep following the definitions and opinions of all, or certainly nearly all, bishops and doctors alike.
(4) What then will the Catholic Christian do, if a small part of the Church has cut itself off from the communion of the universal Faith? The answer is sure. He will prefer the healthiness of the whole body to the morbid and corrupt limb. But what if some novel contagion try to infect the whole Church, and not merely a tiny part of it? Then he will take care to cleave to antiquity, which cannot now be led astray by any deceit of novelty. What if in antiquity itself two or three men, or it may be a city, or even a whole province be detected in error? Then he will take the greatest care to prefer the decrees of the ancient General Councils, if there are such, to the irresponsible ignorance of a few men. But what if some error arises regarding which nothing of this sort is to be found? Then he must do his best to compare the opinions of the Fathers and inquire their meaning, provided always that, though they belonged to diverse times and places, they yet continued in the faith and communion of the one Catholic Church; and let them be teachers approved and outstanding. And whatever he shall find to have been held, approved and taught, not by one or two only but by all equally and with one consent, openly, frequently, and persistently, let him take this as to be held by him without the slightest hesitation.
Forgive me...
(1) I have continually given the greatest pains and diligence to inquiring, from the greatest possible number of men outstanding in holiness and in doctrine, how I can secure a kind of fixed and, as it were, general and guiding principle for distinguishing the true Catholic Faith from the degraded falsehoods of heresy. And the answer that I receive is always to this effect; that if I wish, or indeed if anyone wishes, to detect the deceits of heretics that arise and to avoid their snares and to keep healthy and sound in a healthy faith, we ought, with the Lord's help, to fortify our faith in a twofold manner, firstly, that is, by the authority of God's Law, then by the tradition of the Catholic Church.
(2) Here, it may be, someone will ask, Since the canon of Scripture is complete, and is in itself abundantly sufficient, what need is there to join to it the interpretation of the Church? The answer is that because of the very depth of Scripture all men do not place one identical interpretation upon it. The statements of the same writer are explained by different men in different ways, so much so that it seems almost possible to extract from it as many opinions as there are men. Novatian expounds in one way, Sabellius in another, Donatus in another, Arius, Eunomius and Macedonius in another, Photinus, Apollinaris and Priscillian in another, Jovinian, Pelagius and Caelestius in another, and latterly Nestorius in another. Therefore, because of the intricacies of error, which is so multiform, there is great need for the laying down of a rule for the exposition of Prophets and Apostles in accordance with the standard of the interpretation of the Church Catholic.
(3) Now in the Catholic Church itself we take the greatest care to hold that which has been believed everywhere, always and by all. That is truly and properly 'Catholic,' as is shown by the very force and meaning of the word, which comprehends everything almost universally. We shall hold to this rule if we follow universality [i.e. oecumenicity], antiquity, and consent. We shall follow universality if we acknowledge that one Faith to be true which the whole Church throughout the world confesses; antiquity if we in no wise depart from those interpretations which it is clear that our ancestors and fathers proclaimed; consent, if in antiquity itself we keep following the definitions and opinions of all, or certainly nearly all, bishops and doctors alike.
(4) What then will the Catholic Christian do, if a small part of the Church has cut itself off from the communion of the universal Faith? The answer is sure. He will prefer the healthiness of the whole body to the morbid and corrupt limb. But what if some novel contagion try to infect the whole Church, and not merely a tiny part of it? Then he will take care to cleave to antiquity, which cannot now be led astray by any deceit of novelty. What if in antiquity itself two or three men, or it may be a city, or even a whole province be detected in error? Then he will take the greatest care to prefer the decrees of the ancient General Councils, if there are such, to the irresponsible ignorance of a few men. But what if some error arises regarding which nothing of this sort is to be found? Then he must do his best to compare the opinions of the Fathers and inquire their meaning, provided always that, though they belonged to diverse times and places, they yet continued in the faith and communion of the one Catholic Church; and let them be teachers approved and outstanding. And whatever he shall find to have been held, approved and taught, not by one or two only but by all equally and with one consent, openly, frequently, and persistently, let him take this as to be held by him without the slightest hesitation.
Forgive me...
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Open Heart
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It's ridiculous to start another church with so many already available. It's better to go to an existing church and let your light shine. Find a small church that is closest to your beliefs and be of influence there. IOW, be a part of the solution. Try to avoid a church that is authoritarian as those are disinclined to be flexible.
May I ask what views you have that are so difficult to find?
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That's your opinion. You are free to share it, but it doesn't make you right. And you should be more careful how you address others. You may not be aware of it, but you aren't showing kindness towards me; rather, you are being condescending.
As for my beliefs, I won't go there, because it will take this thread way off topic. And frankly, I don't think it would be helpful.
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Open Heart
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