God's Sabbath rest is not a weekly seventh day rest

Doveaman · Jul 10, 2017

Kenny'sID said:
I don't think it represented anything but what the bible clearly states.

We can always find a way and turn whatever were want into whatever we want, but in this case, I have no good reason to believe the Sabbath is now anything more or less than a commandment by God to rest 1 day a week, that came about for reasons you mentioned...God rested after his work and wanted us to as well.

He wanted that because he simply thought it would be good for us to rest from physical labor once a week, as well as dwell on him. Made perfect sense then and still does.

What you are saying here is not an uncommon teaching, but it reminds me of a creed I once heard that goes into a long winded explanation that sounded good to many, but in the end, all it did was turn a simple and obvious truth into something else.

The idea that God commanded us to rest 1 day a week to dwell on Him sounds good too, but it has no biblical basis. It's just your opinion.

God did not rest 1 day a week, and we are commanded to rest just as God did:

There remains, then, a Sabbath-rest for the people of God; for anyone who enters God's rest also rests from his own works, just as God did from His. - Hebrews 4:9-10

yeshuaslavejeff · Jul 10, 2017

Doveaman said:
The idea that God commanded us to rest 1 day a week to dwell on Him sounds good too, but it has no biblical basis. It's just your opinion.

God did not rest 1 day a week, and we are commanded to rest just as God did:

You know you contradict yourself here ?
Scripture was already posted by several that you directly oppose.

mark kennedy · Jul 10, 2017

listed said:
Where is the word "sabbath" in Genesis 2? In fact where is the word "sabbath" found in Genesis? God blessed the 7th day and not the sabbath in Genesis 2. The 7th day isn't the sabbath. The sabbath isn't even mentioned until Exodus 16. Moses gives the reason for the sabbath as remembering creation. Moses doesn't say the sabbath was on the 7th day of creation.

That's just plain wrong:

Six days ye shall gather it; but on the seventh H7637 day, which is the sabbath, in it there shall be none. (Exodus 16:26)
But the seventh H7637 day is the sabbath of the LORD thy God. (Exodus 20:10)

The Sabbath is the seventh day, that's all there is to it.

The words used in both Genesis and Hebrews literally mean to cease. They don't mean to pause and return to something.

They all went back to work the next day, God would go on to create Israel and in Revelations there is a new creation.

Doveaman · Jul 10, 2017

woobadooba said:
You have taken these verses out of context.

Then why don't you help a brother out by putting them in the right context.

You are free to believe what you want, but as for me and anyone else who desires to do what is pleasing to God, we will follow His commandments. Not the opinions of men who do not know how to do proper exegesis.

But I do follow God's commandments, including God's Sabbath rest. You and I simply differ on what God's Sabbath rest is.

woobadooba · Jul 10, 2017

Doveaman said:
Then why don't you help a brother out by putting them in the right context.

Colossians 2:16-17 (KJV) "Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days: Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ."

What does Paul mean by saying, "Let no man therefore judge you," in this context?

Is Paul saying the seventh-day Sabbath has been done away with or changed in this verse?

Doveaman · Jul 10, 2017

mark kennedy said:
You left out a pretty important proof text:

“Remember the Sabbath day by keeping it holy. Six days you shall labor and do all your work, but the seventh day is a sabbath to the Lord your God. On it you shall not do any work, neither you, nor your son or daughter, nor your male or female servant, nor your animals, nor any foreigner residing in your towns. For in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them, but he rested on the seventh day. Therefore the Lord blessed the Sabbath day and made it holy. (Ex. 20:8-11)

God didn't rest from his work because he was tired, but because it was complete in all it's vast array. Not only were you to refrain from work but the entire household, servants and beasts of burden were given a rest. It was a perpetual reminder of God's work during creation week, just as Passover, the feast of unleavened bread and Tabernacles commemorated the Exodus and the wilderness wanderings. Israel went into exile for not obeying one particular Sabbath, the Sabbath rest every 7 years for the land (Jeremiah 25:1-11; 29:1-10).

to fulfill the word of the LORD by the mouth of Jeremiah, until the land had enjoyed its sabbaths. All the days of its desolation it kept sabbath until seventy years were complete. (2 Chronicles 36:21).

The importance of the Sabbath Rest(s) should not be trivialized, even thought they are clearly fulfilled in Christ. Knowing what they mean is vital to sound exegesis of the Old Testament and the fulfillment found in Christ:

The original setting for this prophecy takes place hundreds of years before Daniel is even born. God had commanded Israel to set aside the seventh year of each agricultural cycle in order for the land to receive a Sabbath rest (Leviticus 25:1-7). The same way man was to receive the seventh day as a day off, known as the Sabbath, the land was to receive the seventh year off, known as a Sabbath Year or a Sabbath to the Lord. God warns Israel in general about the punishments that will follow if this commandment is not obeyed (Leviticus 26: 27-46).

Israel's lack of the proper spiritual response was disobedient to God's commandment and as a result for 490 consecutive years Israel never let the land have a Sabbath Year's rest. This came to a total of 70 missed Sabbath Year's of rest for the land. As a punishment to Israel for this specific disobedience, God allowed Israel to be taken captive for a period of 70 years (2 Chronicles 36:21). This was in direct correlation equaling one year of captivity for each of the Sabbath Year's rest the land missed out on. (Jewishroots.net)

Not coincidentally the time of the exile was 70 years, coinciding with the years the Sabbath Rest of the land was not observed. It's also vital to redemptive histories timeline prophesied in Danial, the 70 weeks that come to 490 years from the finishing of the walls to the coming of the Messiah.

I wouldn't dismiss the Jewish Sabbath quite so easily, it's a huge Hermeneutics challenge with regards to the Old Testament, the New Testament witness and even our Eschatology.

Grace and peace,
Mark

I do agree there is much we can learn from the Jewish Sabbaths. There is much spiritual meaning behind them, and we do still benefit from their spiritual meaning.

But we do not have to observe the Jewish Sabbaths to obtain their spiritual meaning. We can obtain their spiritual meaning and apply them without observing the Jewish Sabbaths. The same is true of Jewish circumcision and Jewish animal sacrifice.

I don't think many farmers would survive today if they allowed their land to rest for a whole year every seven years.

Doveaman · Jul 10, 2017

mark kennedy said:
My interest here was an exegesis of the Jewish Sabbath(s), these observances are non-binding for Gentile believers except with regards to faith in the completed work of Christ.

Faith in the completed work of Christ reminds us of faith in the completed work of God at creation. We now find rest in Christ through faith because of His completed work.

Doveaman · Jul 10, 2017

listed said:
God ceased from His work. God didn't rest from His work. Resting from implies a return to. God didn't return to creating. The word used for rest means cease.

I agree. Good post. :oldthumbsup:

God did rest, or cease, from the work of creating, but He did not cease from all work.

Jesus, on the Sabbath day, said: "My Father is always at His work to this very day, and I, too, am working." -- (John 5:16-17).

When God ceased from the work of His physical creation, His attention was then focused on the work of Man's salvation, a work which Christ continues to do to this very day.

I tend to think of God's Sabbath rest as a transition from one form of work to another form of work. From physical work to spiritual work. From the work of physical creation to the work of Man’s salvation. God ceased from the physical but continued to work in the spiritual.

Likewise, when we enter God’s Sabbath rest we also make this same transition from physical work to spiritual work, just as God did. We permanently cease from the physical work of our human nature (the fleshly works of sin) while focusing our attention on the spiritual work of our salvation, where we work with God in working out our salvation:

Continue to work out your salvation with fear and trembling, for it is God who works in you both to will and to do according to His good purpose. -- (Philippians 2:12-13).

When we enter God's Sabbath rest we permanently cease from the physical so that we may permanently work in the spiritual:

For when we were controlled by the sinful nature, the sinful passions which were aroused by the law were at work in our bodies to bear fruit to death. But now we have been delivered from the law, having died to what we were held by, so that we should serve in the new way of the Spirit and not in the old way of the letter. -- (Romans 7:5-6).

Doveaman · Jul 10, 2017

yeshuaslavejeff said:
You know you contradict yourself here ?
Scripture was already posted by several that you directly oppose.

No contradiction. God did not rest 1 day a week, or 1 day each week.

God rested from His work of original creation on the seventh day of creation week, and He continues to rest from His work of original creation every day of every week.

Likewise, the Christian Sabbath is to rest from the fleshly works of human nature every day of every week, just as God is resting from the physical works of His original creation every day of every week:

There remains, then, a Sabbath-rest for the people of God; for anyone who enters God's rest also rests from his own works, just as God did from His. -- (Hebrews 4:9-10).

God did not only rest on the seventh day of creation week from His work of original creation, because He still continues to rest from His work of original creation every day of every week.

woobadooba · Jul 10, 2017

Doveaman said:
No contradiction. God did not rest 1 day a week, or 1 day each week.

God rested from His work of original creation on the seventh day of creation week, and He continues to rest from His work of original creation every day of every week.

Likewise, the Christian Sabbath is to rest from the fleshly works of human nature every day of every week, just as God is resting from the physical works of His creation every day of every week:

There remains, then, a Sabbath-rest for the people of God; for anyone who enters God's rest also rests from his own works, just as God did from His. -- (Hebrews 4:9-10).

Did you see this post?

Care to respond?

Doveaman · Jul 10, 2017

woobadooba said:
Colossians 2:16-17 (KJV) "Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days: Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ."

What does Paul mean by saying, "Let no man therefore judge you," in this context?

Romans 14 explains:

Who are you to judge another's servant? To his own master he stands or falls. Indeed, he will be made to stand, for God is able to make him stand. One person esteems one day above another; another esteems every day alike. Let each be fully convinced in his own mind. He who observes the day, observes it to the Lord; and he who does not observe the day, to the Lord he does not observe it. He who eats, eats to the Lord, for he gives God thanks; and he who does not eat, to the Lord he does not eat, and gives God thanks. -- (Romans 14:4-6).

Paul is saying that the Sabbath day, as well as food, festivals, or religious celebrations are not standards by which we judge whether a person is right or wrong, good or evil, righteous or unrighteous, sinner or saint

Therefore do not let anyone judge you by what you eat or drink, or with regard to a religious festival, a New Moon celebration or a Sabbath day. These are a shadow of the things that were to come; the reality, however, is found in Christ. -- Colossians 2:16-17

Paul is saying that these religious practices only served as religious symbols pointing forward to the true reality, the true righteousness, that would come to us through faith alone in Christ alone, who alone is our standard.

Before this faith came, we were kept under guard by the law, kept until faith should be revealed. The law was put in charge to lead us to Christ that we might be justified by faith. Now that faith has come, we are no longer under the supervision of the law. You are all sons of God through faith in Christ Jesus -- (Galatians 3:23-26).

Is Paul saying the seventh-day Sabbath has been done away with or changed in this verse?

Paul is saying that the seventh-day Sabbath is irrelevant to our Christian walk with Christ. He is saying the seventh-day Sabbath has no bearing on who we are in Christ. We are free to observe it and we are free not to. It does not matter either way, as mentioned in Romans 14.

In addition:

He has made us competent as ministers of a new covenant -- not of the letter but of the Spirit; for the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life. Now if the ministry that brought death, which was engraved in letters on stone, came with glory...will not the ministry of the Spirit be even more glorious? -- (2 Corinthians 3:6-8)

The seventh-day law was engraved in letters on stone tablets. Paul is telling us that we are called to minister in the new covenant of the Spirit, and not in the old covenant of the letter engraved on stone, which included the seventh-day law.

Doveaman · Jul 10, 2017

woobadooba said:
Did you see this post?

Care to respond?

See above.

mark kennedy · Jul 10, 2017

Doveaman said:
I do agree there is much we can learn from the Jewish Sabbaths. There is much spiritual meaning behind them, and we do still benefit from their spiritual meaning.

But we do not have to observe the Jewish Sabbaths to obtain their spiritual meaning. We can obtain their spiritual meaning and apply them without observing the Jewish Sabbaths. The same is true of Jewish circumcision and Jewish animal sacrifice.

I don't think many farmers would survive today if they allowed their land to rest for a whole year every seven years.

All very true, especially the part about resting the land. Read a really interesting thing about the dust bowl of Oklahoma, one of the things they did is to rotate their crops and the land is now productive again. As far as circumcision at Jerusalem the Pharisees stood up and said Gentiles had to be circumcised in order to be saved. Peter stood up and said why would we put a yoke on them neither we nor or fathers could bear. The prescription then for salvation is justification by grace through faith, reflecting Peter's message to the Gentiles. Paul and Barnabas had just returned from the first missionary journey and Paul was livid. He said that even Barnabas was caught up in this and Paul even called Peter a hypocrite. Peter was acting juvenile, he would fellowship with the Gentiles until his Jewish believers came around then Gentiles couldn't sit at the cool kids table.

It's always been puzzling to me that something like a Sabbath rest can be twisted into a works righteousness. Baptism is another one of those things that is so very simple but people can complicate a tuna fish sandwich if their ego gets involved.

I also have no problem with Christians who regard Sunday of the 'Lord's Day', until they make it somehow unchristian not to do so. For me it's still an exegetical challenge since it covers so much of the Scripture from Genesis, in the Gospels and still it's an issue in Galatians. I see nothing terribly controversial about it unless we are just looking for something to be divisive and contentious about.

Grace and peace,
Mark

yeshuaslavejeff · Jul 10, 2017

What else besides YHWH'S set apart day do you object to ?

What church or group have you leaned on for understanding ?

Kenny'sID · Jul 10, 2017

Doveaman said:
The idea that God commanded us to rest 1 day a week to dwell on Him sounds good too, but it has no biblical basis. It's just your opinion.

Something that has been clear to most everyone, Christian or Atheist for thousands of years , because it's clearly stated in the bible is now just my opinion?

Folks, beware of long winded explanations that change what has always been known as truth. Don't always just dismiss it because of just that, but that can be a huge tip off that something isn't right.

mark kennedy · Jul 10, 2017

yeshuaslavejeff said:
What else besides YHWH'S set apart day do you object to ?

What church or group have you leaned on for understanding ?

Um well...The clear testimony of Scripture and the Apostle's doctrine...Christ himself in the Gospels...how does that work for you...

mark kennedy · Jul 10, 2017

mark kennedy said:
Um well...The clear testimony of Scripture and the Apostle's doctrine...Christ himself in the Gospels...how does that work for you...

Kenny'sID said:
Something that has been clear to most everyone, Christian or Atheist for thousands of years , because it's clearly stated in the bible is now just my opinion?

Folks, beware of long winded explanations that change what has always been known as truth. Don't always just dismiss it because of just that, but that can be a huge tip off that something isn't right.

Oh my bad Kenney, somehow thought that was for me.

Kenny'sID · Jul 10, 2017

Doveaman said:
Paul is saying that the seventh-day Sabbath is irrelevant to our Christian walk with Christ. He is saying the seventh-day Sabbath has no bearing on who we are in Christ. We are free to observe it and we are free not to. It does not matter either way, as mentioned in

It's clear the point you are trying to make, but I have to add, you need to reread your op. If you do believe what you do, fine, but you did a very bad job of making your point by simply not telling the truth about the Sabbath, then arguing things that are clear in the bible aren't what the bible states on the subject.

woobadooba · Jul 10, 2017

Doveaman said:
Romans 14 explains:

Who are you to judge another's servant? To his own master he stands or falls. Indeed, he will be made to stand, for God is able to make him stand. One person esteems one day above another; another esteems every day alike. Let each be fully convinced in his own mind. He who observes the day, observes it to the Lord; and he who does not observe the day, to the Lord he does not observe it. He who eats, eats to the Lord, for he gives God thanks; and he who does not eat, to the Lord he does not eat, and gives God thanks. -- (Romans 14:4-6).

Paul is saying that the Sabbath day, as well as food, festivals, or religious celebrations are not standards by which we judge whether a person is right or wrong, good or evil, righteous or unrighteous, sinner or saint

Therefore do not let anyone judge you by what you eat or drink, or with regard to a religious festival, a New Moon celebration or a Sabbath day. These are a shadow of the things that were to come; the reality, however, is found in Christ. -- Colossians 2:16-17

Paul is saying that these religious practices only served as religious symbols pointing forward to the true reality, the true righteousness, that would come to us through faith alone in Christ alone, who alone is our standard.

Before this faith came, we were kept under guard by the law, kept until faith should be revealed. The law was put in charge to lead us to Christ that we might be justified by faith. Now that faith has come, we are no longer under the supervision of the law. You are all sons of God through faith in Christ Jesus -- (Galatians 3:23-26).
Paul is saying that the seventh-day Sabbath is irrelevant to our Christian walk with Christ. He is saying the seventh-day Sabbath has no bearing on who we are in Christ. We are free to observe it and we are free not to. It does not matter either way, as mentioned in Romans 14.

He has made us competent as ministers of a new covenant -- not of the letter but of the Spirit; for the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life. Now if the ministry that brought death, which was engraved in letters on stone, came with glory...will not the ministry of the Spirit be even more glorious? -- (2 Corinthians 3:6-8)

The seventh-day law was engraved in letters on stone tablets. Paul is telling us that we are called to minister in the new covenant of the Spirit, and not in the old covenant of the letter engraved on stone, which included the seven-day law.

I see some problems with this response. Will deal with it later—when I have time.

Kenny'sID · Jul 10, 2017

mark kennedy said:
Oh my bad Kenney, somehow thought that was for me.

I missed whatever happened, but whatever it was, not a problem.

God's Sabbath rest is not a weekly seventh day rest

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