Discussion Truth is Truth

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Farine

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The Kingdom is within, yet so many look outside for the entrance.

I have no desire to contend, Torben. We all see from where we are at in the process.

The original premise of this discussion IS: God's message is so often rejected--it should not matter who God chooses to send as His messenger. God's authenticated messengers need some refreshing and equipping to deal with The frequent rejections they receive.

So several times a week there are topics that are refreshing and equipping to those who are being sent. I am explaining this so discussions don't get so stuck in debate which is not refreshing or equipping. I picked this particular post to refresh the original premise because you give the impression that we have nothing to add to your insight. You may not realize that is the impression. You have not asked me one question about who I am and my journey of faith. I might surprise you.
 
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PeaceJoyLove

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The original premise of this discussion IS: God's message is so often rejected--it should not matter who God chooses to send as His messenger. God's authenticated messengers need some refreshing and equipping to deal with The frequent rejections they receive.

So several times a week there are topics that are refreshing and equipping to those who are being sent. I am explaining this so discussions don't get so stuck in debate which is not refreshing or equipping. I picked this particular post to refresh the original premise because you give the impression that we have nothing to add to your insight. You may not realize that is the impression. You have not asked me one question about who I am and my journey of faith. I might surprise you.

It is not the journey, but the process and where it ends, but then begins and is without end...a garden enclosed, a river that flows living waters...a white stone and a new name. The Father establishes all my steps. "Thou shalt not eat..." and "Take no thought..." HIS Love unfolds more and more...Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.

EDIT: Should say "The Father establishes all OUR steps."
 
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Aseyesee

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Post 542 in this discussion ..

The phrase labor to enter into His rest ... involves holding onto faith... there is definitely one thing I admire about your posts. You have solidness to what you believe. Much of my face to face interactions with people in my locale are focused on what one might call the dashboard of human experience. So what such a person believes is circumstantial. I am starting to get to know you..

We hold on to faith until faith becomes who we are; which is similar to our will. It is a truth of the process our soul goes through, and at the end of the process, to be understood in the light that the city depicts in the book of Revelation.
 
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Aseyesee

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Being Built Up In The Lord.

To define this term--let's try this on for size--An advanced partnership with the Holy Spirit, where decisions are submitted to the partnership. The humanity is not extinguished, but enhanced by the flow of God's thoughts through that person's life.

God's supply of grace is experienced as additional love, acceptance, joy, peace and endurance as life events are softened by divine qualities. And one's true, divinely appointed purpose is increasingly obvious.

So how does one get pointed in this direction? First one has to desire it. Most don't.

Since there are so many well positioned people in this discussion, I look forward to reading your responses to this topic.

To me, its not an outward direction (which I am sure it is not to you as well) and of course now that I look, has been said already) which genders to confusion of face; its an inward direction, that causes an outward expression, which in scripture is laid out in picture form in patterns that define this process in us from it's first word to it's last (yet not limited to this).

We labor (by thought) to possess what is freely given, but few know how to enter into the gates of the city as something relational to a kingdom in them.

Like Martha they wait for a day that is coming, not a knowing of the gift of God as the present truth it/he is.

The time was at hand 2000 plus years ago, as the raven flies (pun intended).
 
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Alithis

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The Kingdom is within, yet so many look outside for the entrance.





The main point from Act 2:42-43 was the people who were being healed were "devoted to the Apostles teachings" and we know they taught of Jesus Christ and faith. Jesus, when He healed always said "your faith has made you whole" and "go and sin no more."

I have no desire to contend, Torben. We all see from where we are at in the process.
the apostles teaching was teaching the people to Go and do the same works Jesus did.
So one devoted to thier teaching is one who goes and does.
Not one who talks much about the teachings.
It is necessary to place things in balance and correct long standing religious stance.
For instance Jesus did not say to Every one “your faith has made you well” only to few whose faith made them whole.
And what was this faith. ? It was the Action they did in response to Truely believing..
Did the centurien`s servant have or exercise any action of faith? Nope he was at home being very sick.
Did the cripple lowered through the roof have or exercise any faith..?Nope .the ones who carried him there did.
As its written “ Jesus SAW their faith ...how do you see faith? Simple..he saw the ACTION they took in response to believing in him.
Did lazereth have faith..?Nope, he was Dead!
We must not build and overlay doctrines on top of the written word that appease our own failure to live in it.
These traditional religious stances that put blame for no healing onto the one seeking healing are cruel and condemning them for our own lack.
If I pray for a sick person and they are not healed I never put it on them .I go to God and say lord help my unbelief .my lack of faith.

When the diciples could not heal the epilitic child upon whom did the Lord lay responsibility...? Upon the disciples lack of faith . not in the boy nor his parents.then he healed him by casting out the demon.

Sorry .I always feel it necessary to correct such blanket statements about healing etc.when they are not the facts but an overlaid generalisation that is simply incorrect .
Not a blame to point at. but a set of traditional doctrines that have been planted in our generation by unbelieving religious leaders this past century .that must be rejected and corrected in order for us to return to being disciples of Jesus
 
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Aseyesee

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The interesting thing about the kingdom of God is that to the measure you have entered into it as a reality in you (which is a being built up), is to the measure you see it without you; not only in the things without thought you do, but in those things that surround you, or play out before you.

"Where art thou?" is a question of perception.
 
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Farine

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To me, its not an outward direction (which I am sure it is not to you as well) and of course now that I look, has been said already) which genders to confusion of face; its an inward direction, that causes an outward expression, which in scripture is laid out in picture form in patterns that define this process in us from it's first word to it's last (yet not limited to this).

We labor (by thought) to possess what is freely given, but few know how to enter into the gates of the city as something relational to a kingdom in them.

Like Martha they wait for a day that is coming, not a knowing of the gift of God as the present truth it/he is.

The time was at hand 2000 plus years ago, as the raven flies (pun intended).

Thank you. This was well said. In placing examples around what you have offered, the 'few [who] know how to enter' may be helped.

Air is necessary. You don't even think about it most of the time unless something is physically wrong or there's smoke impeding your ability to breathe or one is underwater too long. Unconsciously, most of the time, you grab one lung full of air at a time and take inside of you. Once inside of you, this air is spread out into every cell of your body. Oxygen is used for thinking and energy and all kinds of chemistry. What would be the spiritual equivalent of air?

LOVE... God is LOVE. You need to have His LOVE inside of you to function. God built mankind like CS Lewis described in Mere Christianity like a man designed an engine. The fuel mankind is designed to run on is Him. That's why John 10 says "I am the vine.. you are the branches-apart from Me you can do nothing'. Human love isn't like divine love. Human love is conditional. It's sporadic and easily frustrated. Jesus had to solve the sin problem in order to reestablish communication with humanity. And along with that reconnection was the Spirit of God to the spirit of man connection.

So when you hear us talking about being near GOd and perceiving things that are not physically seen, heard, touched... that's because there is this reconnection in our spirit. THat's what every person on the planet needs like you need air to breathe. It's not optional.

You said, 'it's an inward direction, that causes an outward expression'. So here's the proof of it in scripture.
THe parable of the sower lies in the exact explanation given by Jesus. It's one of the few parables he explained directly himself. "The seed is the word of God." So what is a seed? It is a genetic bundle of information that when stimulated produces roots and leaves and eventually fruit. The Bible even explains in Galatians 5 what the fruit of the spirit is.. Let's zoom in on that thought of genes and John 1:12's insistence that God gave the right to become 'children of God'. Ok.. so the genes are HIS genes. Divine Genes.. So what outward expression? Divine expression. We're going back to the Garden of Eden, folks. Original plan restored. Let's go.
 
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Farine

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the apostles teaching was teaching the people to Go and do the same works Jesus did.
So one devoted to thier teaching is one who goes and does.
Not one who talks much about the teachings.
It is necessary to place things in balance and correct long standing religious stance.
For instance Jesus did not say to Every one “your faith has made you well” only to few whose faith made them whole.
And what was this faith. ? It was the Action they did in response to Truely believing..
Did the centurien`s servant have or exercise any action of faith? Nope he was at home being very sick.
Did the cripple lowered through the roof have or exercise any faith..?Nope .the ones who carried him there did.
As its written “ Jesus SAW their faith ...how do you see faith? Simple..he saw the ACTION they took in response to believing in him.
Did lazereth have faith..?Nope, he was Dead!
We must not build and overlay doctrines on top of the written word that appease our own failure to live in it.
These traditional religious stances that put blame for no healing onto the one seeking healing are cruel and condemning them for our own lack.
If I pray for a sick person and they are not healed I never put it on them .I go to God and say lord help my unbelief .my lack of faith.

When the diciples could not heal the epilitic child upon whom did the Lord lay responsibility...? Upon the disciples lack of faith . not in the boy nor his parents.then he healed him by casting out the demon.

Sorry .I always feel it necessary to correct such blanket statements about healing etc.when they are not the facts but an overlaid generalisation that is simply incorrect .
Not a blame to point at. but a set of traditional doctrines that have been planted in our generation by unbelieving religious leaders this past century .that must be rejected and corrected in order for us to return to being disciples of Jesus

It's established in the past pages of this discussion --if someone wants ot know exactly which posts go to read I would wander around and find it and come back and report it. Most love convenience so I'm going to summarize some past activity here.

My husband's best friend got very sick back in April 2016. He had emergency surgery for a perforated bowel which released dead tissue into his whole abdomen. He nearly died right then. It was a long, hard struggle afterwards in ICU where he nearly died at several points. I started this discussion in August 2016 soon after Jim, this friend, was released to us and living in our home with us caring for his surgery wounds and an ongoing infection which dogged his recovery.

It didn't occur to me to ask for faith healing. We were taking Jim to various hospitals as this infection got more and more dangerous. Ultimately, we took him to Cedar Sinai Hospital in Los Angeles. There, over 30 doctors were contemplating how to help him. Three teams of doctors were involved--GI, Surgery and Infection Control. It got really dicey. AFter two months of fighting the infection, the surgery team operated and took out a lot of material to clean up the situation. It's a truism that surgeries should not be close in time because the body tends to reject the intervention--basically a failure to thrive. This is the backdrop for my request here for prayer.

Alithis was direct. His post read like a teacher giving a student notes in class. The instructions were to go and do this set of instructions. Jim was dying. We had done the conventional everything. Cedar's was stumped. I finally brought this to a question about faith. So I took this process at face value. This was Alithis' life. He was anointed to heal by faith. This is what he did when he participated in the Spirit of Jesus' healing. I would do it too. Oh, I was really worked up. I followed what I was told. Then I waited for God to act.

Jim rallied in the Hospital. Then he was released to a rehab facility where he got stronger. He kept on getting better. Then he was released to live with us. The inner man is being healed too. My husband's best friend is alive and his wounds are closing successfully because God healed him. God used Alithis in this process. You can fault him for his manner if you like. Don't question his faith.
 
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PeaceJoyLove

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It's established in the past pages of this discussion --if someone wants ot know exactly which posts go to read I would wander around and find it and come back and report it. Most love convenience so I'm going to summarize some past activity here.

My husband's best friend got very sick back in April 2016. He had emergency surgery for a perforated bowel which released dead tissue into his whole abdomen. He nearly died right then. It was a long, hard struggle afterwards in ICU where he nearly died at several points. I started this discussion in August 2016 soon after Jim, this friend, was released to us and living in our home with us caring for his surgery wounds and an ongoing infection which dogged his recovery.

It didn't occur to me to ask for faith healing. We were taking Jim to various hospitals as this infection got more and more dangerous. Ultimately, we took him to Cedar Sinai Hospital in Los Angeles. There, over 30 doctors were contemplating how to help him. Three teams of doctors were involved--GI, Surgery and Infection Control. It got really dicey. AFter two months of fighting the infection, the surgery team operated and took out a lot of material to clean up the situation. It's a truism that surgeries should not be close in time because the body tends to reject the intervention--basically a failure to thrive. This is the backdrop for my request here for prayer.

Alithis was direct. His post read like a teacher giving a student notes in class. The instructions were to go and do this set of instructions. Jim was dying. We had done the conventional everything. Cedar's was stumped. I finally brought this to a question about faith. So I took this process at face value. This was Alithis' life. He was anointed to heal by faith. This is what he did when he participated in the Spirit of Jesus' healing. I would do it too. Oh, I was really worked up. I followed what I was told. Then I waited for God to act.

Jim rallied in the Hospital. Then he was released to a rehab facility where he got stronger. He kept on getting better. Then he was released to live with us. The inner man is being healed too. My husband's best friend is alive and his wounds are closing successfully because God healed him. God used Alithis in this process. You can fault him for his manner if you like. Don't question his faith.


Wonderful testimony of the power of God to heal! I don't question his faith nor any other's...it is something God gave each of us a measure of for the process that takes place within...and it is God that gives the increase...of all things...even our perspective, which is directly relational to where we are in that process.
 
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Aseyesee

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Teach people how to pick up their cross, and their labor to enter is over, if we don't eat, we rule over the process; it is the lesson of Cain, by it he drives the very thing he desires from himself.
 
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mozo41

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Out of the mouth of the most High proceedeth not evil and good?

No point adding to this as it speaks for itself, our Father is in complete control of everything, seeing everything serves His purpose which He has purposed in Himself ....
 
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Farine

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Wonderful testimony of the power of God to heal! I don't question his faith nor any other's...it is something God gave each of us a measure of for the process that takes place within...and it is God that gives the increase...of all things...even our perspective, which is directly relational to where we are in that process.
Yes! Praise to God! Absolutely! That this post regarding my friend's healing got your spirit further into worship made my day! I am ever so grateful that God participated. The boost to my prayer life and enthusiasm was big. Hopefully this testimony energizes others facing big health crises....
 
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Farine

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The interesting thing about the kingdom of God is that to the measure you have entered into it as a reality in you (which is a being built up), is to the measure you see it without you; not only in the things without thought you do, but in those things that surround you, or play out before you.

"Where art thou?" is a question of perception.
This post intrigued me. I am going to chew on this awhile. My request as I ponder is that you quote this post and add some examples... would you mind doing that for me?? It would cut my pondering time at least in half!! Woo!
 
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Farine

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Teach people how to pick up their cross, and their labor to enter is over, if we don't eat, we rule over the process; it is the lesson of Cain, by it he drives the very thing he desires from himself.
I THINK I understand this one-- and maybe I flatter myself. There have been quite a few past topics on this discussion that deal with self and self's preoccupation with making choices and usurping identity.

If Gideon was writing- I think he is taking a break-- he would write you a book in response. It is his favorite topic.

Can self deny self?? I don't know. What do you believe?
 
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Farine

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Out of the mouth of the most High proceedeth not evil and good?

No point adding to this as it speaks for itself, our Father is in complete control of everything, seeing everything serves His purpose which He has purposed in Himself ....
It is good to see you enjoying this discussion. Seeing some deep thoughts when I got back home after a long trip was very enjoyable. Hope your day was lovely.

It has been my experience about the time life has settled into a pleasant rhythm that care should be taken. Not the other shoe falling, but the back and forth conflict between good and evil heats up again. With the clear confidence I hear in your tone, if your life is anything like mine, check your six...

A wager could be made that you are one of the people who is called when life does go awry. When circumstances sour, what do you tell them when they do call? This sentiment does not endear in a season of stormy weather...
 
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