Is it against God to see life as vanity?

Angeleyes7715 · May 31, 2017

AlexDTX said:
Solomon does not say that life is vanity, but all is vanity, and he refers to the world system, sin and death. Life is good and glorious because God is life. I am in sympathy with your point of view, though. I have spent many years understanding the conspiracy of the aristocracy to destroy freedom and set up and one world government. They want the population reduced so they feed us GMO's filled with Round-UP and fill the skies with chemtrails of aluminum. They dumb us down through government school indoctrination, and steal from us blindly through inflation, income taxes and unending wars.

This made me very angry and discouraged. But this anger has only come because of focusing too much on the evil that surrounds us instead refocusing on the good that is everywhere. Life does not suck. Sin, death and evil suck. The creation is good, but is marred with sin and death. Nonetheless, the animals multiply, plants grow, rain falls and the created world is filled with magnificent beauty from the sunsets, plants and even down to the molecular level. The creation is good.

And even if the entire creation was evil, which it is not, God is greater than all of His creation and He is purely good, right, just and perfect in his kindness, love and generosity. The English word, "God," is a truncation of the word, "good." Our ancestors understood the goodness of God.

Feeling this way is not sin. One third of the psalms are called Deprecatory Psalms because the psalmists are complaining about the evil around them, their success, and their pursuit of the psalmists to trap them. No, it is not sin, for God knows the evil. Take heart. Remember the goodness of the Lord and all of the creation, and know that this present evil will pass.

This helps me, thank you.

Angeleyes7715 · May 31, 2017

grasping the after wind said:
I find nothing in Ecclesiastes that abrogates anything in the Bible. The Preacher lays out how vain our temporary existence can be. He is not blaming God for that vanity. He is merely pointing out humanity's folly in what we consider valuable. The equation he lays out is Human ideas about what is important, or meaningful or necessary =vanity. His advice is to obey God and to enjoy whatever portion God has given you in this life rather than attempting to find meaning in the meaningless or importance in the trivial. His complaints are not aimed at God but at humanity and humanity's false ideas about what matters in life.

I agree for the most part, but Solomon was still complaining about life itself being vain because there's a verse where he complains about working hard just to die and that work to mean nothing and then it goes to your kids and who knows if they'll be good or not. Of course I'm paraphrasing from memory, but I recall him definitely complaining about putting effort into life just to die and have it mean nothing. This is my main complaint also.

Angeleyes7715 · May 31, 2017

Uber Genius said:
Ironic that he writes a good portion of Proverbs and all of Ecclesiastes. Where he abrogate some of his own teaching. Too bad we don't have a time stamp on his writing to know which came first or when. But he did finish with faith in the Lord.

"
12I, the Preacher, have been king over Israel in Jerusalem. 13And I set my mind to seek and explore by wisdom concerning all that has been done under heaven. It is a grievous task which God has given to the sons of men to be afflicted with. 14I have seen all the works which have been done under the sun, and behold, all is vanity and striving after wind. 15What is crooked cannot be straightened and what is lacking cannot be counted.

16I said to myself, “Behold, I have magnified and increased wisdom more than all who were over Jerusalem before me; and my mind has observed a wealth of wisdom and knowledge.” 17And I set my mind to know wisdom and to know madness and folly; I realized that this also is striving after wind. 18Because in much wisdom there is much grief, and increasing knowledge results in increasing pain." (Eccles. 1:12-18)

Notice he doesn't say "it is the general condition of man."

He say "I observed," he is talking about his own observations and in fact only his. These observations are due to his unique wisdom. M

Yeah but his observations are mine too lol. I feel like I could have wrote this book in my teenage angst or even now in my 20 something angst. Knowledge has done nothing but make me miserable (I have a science degree and it makes me miserable everyday lol) and everything really is vanity imo. This is the main book of the Bible I relate to, written by the wisest guy on Earth who ironically was taken out by 700 women and their idols. Why my gender causes the downfall of even the wisest of males I do not know lol.

timewerx · May 31, 2017

mukk_in said:
Not sure. But we do know that those who want to live a godly life will be persecuted. However, we also know that He has overcome this world .

Metaphorically speaking since God is timeless.

But now, evil is ruling the world

1 John 5:19 (NIV)
We know that we are children of God, and that the whole world is under the control of the evil one.

Uber Genius · May 31, 2017

Angeleyes7715 said:
Yeah but his observations are mine too lol. I feel like I could have wrote this book in my teenage angst or even now in my 20 something angst. Knowledge has done nothing but make me miserable (I have a science degree and it makes me miserable everyday lol) and everything really is vanity imo. This is the main book of the Bible I relate to, written by the wisest guy on Earth who ironically was taken out by 700 women and their idols. Why my gender causes the downfall of even the wisest of males I do not know lol.

Indeed. I have spent quite a long time in that book. My early understanding about how God administers his world were chalked full of false beliefs. They have come out a little at a time over the last 40 years.

Just lost a business deal that would have made me a millionaire several times over. Been working on it for two years. It was an absurd incident where the company got divested after 15 years of successful operation. I have had over $500,000 stolen from me. Been lied about by three separate pastors destroying my misistry, and my wife of 29 years is divorcing me because I no longer make $200,000 per year.

But God is good.

And he has been close to me in my pain and suffering.

I have much work in the kingdom left to do. And am starting over with nothing at 55 years old.

Big deal. I also get specific words from God to give to people I meet at grocery stores and smoke shops and bars. They break down crying (even the guys) when I share what God has told me to tell them. So at least God is using me.

My challenge was Imwas arrogant and self-reliant. After three and a half years of complete destruction of all that was important to me I am starting to rely on God.

And I am avoiding reading Ecclesiastes altogether.

Best of luck in your journey and remember God loves you and has a horrible plan for your life.

noam burde · May 31, 2017

Angeleyes7715 said:
I can't accept the explaination for death. I also don't accept being a martyr or leading people to Christ / giving up everything for other people as justification for being stuck on this evil planet with a miserable life only to die and be promised something I can't see.

Is this wrong to feel this way?

One my favorite books is Ecclesiastes and the author basically says what I'm saying. This whole life is meaningless and vain.

Sometimes I also feel like our condition that God left us in is much worse than losing your only son. We are stuck on an evil planet for years doing meaningless labor and work only to lose our loved ones and die and have everything go to nothingness. Not only that he promises us something we cant see. And we live in fear for years just waiting for our time. And then if we don't do what God says we burn for all eternity.

I'm a Christian. I am no stranger to the teachings. I even have the Holy Spirit infilling, but yet I feel so unhappy about this life God gave us that I find it hard to live.

Can feeling this way be a sin?

I have a couple of things to say about what you wrote.
1. first of all feeling like you feel is not only not a sin. but in fact, I think in most cases. maybe all. feeling at some point in your life your life that you want to die is the only thing that can make a person be interested enough in doing the will of God(יהוה).
because, the thing is, that when people have it good in this world. they think and care only about this world.
when people have it bad here. when someone doesn't want his life here anymore. than at least some people start getting serious about doing Gods will.

jesus said about this in Matthew 11:28-30:

"28 Come to Me all ye that labor and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.
29 Take My yoke upon you and learn of Me, for I am meek and lowly in heart, and ye shall find rest unto your souls.
30 For My yoke is easy, and My burden is light."

so this is what you should use this feeling for.
and you will gradually start feeling better after you do that. as jesus said it gives some type of "rest" to know you God is on your side.

2. Solomon was a sinful person (the king with 1000 wifes). he does not represent God.
maybe you remember, God was saddened by the demand of the Hebrew to have a king. he wanted a prophet chosen by him to be the leader.
like moses was.
I think better not take as the word of God anything that was not said by a prophet.
one that actually succeeded in making some supernatural prophecy. that came true.
without repeating some previous prophecy. or saying something after it happened.
as jesus commanded in matthew:
"15 Beware of false prophets, who come to you in sheep’s clothing but inwardly are ravenous wolves. 16You will recognize them by their fruits. Are grapes gathered from thornbushes, or figs from thistles? 17So, every healthy tree bears good fruit, but the diseased tree bears bad fruit. 18A healthy tree cannot bear bad fruit, nor can a diseased tree bear good fruit. 19Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. 20Thus you will recognize them by their fruits."

so not:
kings writings.
man that just wrote stuff. and here and prophesied that the world will end very soon. before some of them will die. but it didn't of course. like paul and the ones after him.
all their prophecies that can be checked failed.
like for example:
2 Thessalonians 2:2. 1 Thessalonians 4:15-18. Revelation 1:1 + revelation 20 + revelation 22:20 (need to compare them).

also not Mohamed, joseph smith, Nostradamus.

3. you wrote "I also don't accept being a martyr or leading people to Christ / giving up everything for other people as justification for being stuck on this evil planet with a miserable life only to die and be promised something I can't see. ".
you are not asked to do that (at least not by God).
he said he put us in this world to see who chooses to do good over evil (in the story of adam and eve).
them he will accept to heaven.
the others will be permanently destroyed. or in some bad cases be tormented and then will be permanently destroyed.

dqhall · May 31, 2017

1 Corinthians 2:9 (WEB)

9 But as it is written,

“Things which an eye didn’t see, and an ear didn’t hear,
which didn’t enter into the heart (mind) of man,
these God has prepared for those who love him.”

When I was young, I partied much, dropped out of college and became destitute. I thought my only hope was if there is a God. I started to read the Bible. In my extreme poverty, I found some Christians helped me without expecting to be repaid. They told me they were helping because they wanted a reward in heaven through faith in Jesus. It helped me learn God is good, for God makes people help one another. I found employment. I moved to the Washington D.C. area where the largest library in the world is. In my spare time, I read about Biblical archaeology and geography for fifteen years. I had access to university and Seminary libraries. I joined a Biblical Archaeology lecture society. I traveled to Israel. I also studied the Talmud, Roman era Israel history and ancient Near Eastern history. I read early church authors like Clement of Alexandria and Eusebius. I learned the Bible is fact and fiction. I could not be brainwashed to accept it as 100% truth. I continued to read the New Testament over and over; skipping Revelation. Late in life, a wealthy relative granted me a trust fund. A burden was lifted from me. I was led to study nutrition science. Some infirmity and weakness left me.

If you allow God to structure you life, will you not work in vain?

Angeleyes7715 · May 31, 2017

Adstar said:
Yes and No..

You have detailed a lot of different issues not just one... So you need to break down your beliefs and ideas in forms that can be dealt with one by one..

""""I can't accept the explaination for death."""""

You state this but don't bother stating the explanation that has been given to you... So how can anyone respond to this if they do not know what explanation you have received?

"""I also don't accept being a martyr or leading people to Christ""""

This is sin... Jesus said to go out ans share His message to all nations ( peoples) so rejecting what Jesus says is rejecting Jesus.. And Christians have to be willing to choose death over renouncing Jesus as our LORD and Redeemer..

""""""giving up everything for other people as justification for being stuck on this evil planet with a miserable life only to die and be promised something I can't see.""""""

i cannot understand this question / statement.. Was there supposed to be a full stop in there? like was it two points? And explain what is /are you talking about when you say justification by giving up everything??? Justification comes by believing Jesus and trusting in the Atonement He secured for our salvation.. Jesus gives us salvation we do not gain salvation by giving stuff..

""""""""One my favorite books is Ecclesiastes and the author basically says what I'm saying. This whole life is meaningless and vain."""""""

King Solomon was correct that the pursuit of wealth power and social status was vanity and a waste of time.. But the very fact He came to that wisdom made His life just that little bit less vain.. A life where someone comes to the knowledge of salvation and the Love of the LORD is not a life of vanity.. A good thing has come out of ones life and what is good is not vanity.. King Solomon was talking about all the things people peruse and are consumed by that do not have eternal worth being vanity..

""""""We are stuck on an evil planet for years doing meaningless labor and work only to lose our loved ones and die and have everything go to nothingness. Not only that he promises us something we cant see. And we live in fear for years just waiting for our time. And then if we don't do what God says we burn for all eternity.""""""

The knowledge of the Love of God through the Atonement of the LORD Jesus Christ removes fear from us... Faith is trust and specifically trusting God so those who trust God do not need to see what lays beyond this world / life.. If one trusts Gods declarations then we trust that what He says about eternity and what will be there is Truth... Christians should have 100% confidence in all the Message of God..

"""""I'm a Christian. I am no stranger to the teachings.""""""

You are no stranger to the teachings? Yet you live in fear.. are you a stranger to the following scriptural teachings of the Holy Bible?

1 John 4: KJV
17"Herein is our love made perfect, that we may have boldness in the day of judgment: because as he is, so are we in this world. {18} There is no fear in love; but perfect love casteth out fear: because fear hath torment. He that feareth is not made perfect in love. {19} We love him, because he first loved us."

I can only conclude from your post that you are a stranger to the above Bible teaching..

""""I even have the Holy Spirit infilling""""

Are you sure??

"""""but yet I feel so unhappy about this life God gave us that I find it hard to live.""""""

I feel unhappy in this world too.. But i stay here and persevere because i hope to be of some value to God and to my brothers and sisters in Jesus... And in the end suicide is just self murder.. And i really don't want my final act on earth to be committing murder...

No you cut off my statements and broke them apart where they don't make sense. I said I don't accept being a martyr and leading people to Christ and giving up everything for them as justification for being stuck on this planet.... It was one long statement and you broke it in two so it doesn't make sense. I wasn't saying I don't accept leading people to Christ I was saying I don't accept it as justification for being stuck here.

Adstar · May 31, 2017

Angeleyes7715 said:
No you cut off my statements and broke them apart where they don't make sense. I said I don't accept being a martyr and leading people to Christ and giving up everything for them as justification for being stuck on this planet....

I cannot see why anyone would seek or want or need justification to be on planet earth.. God created me and put me down here.. I need not justification to be on earth.. I need justification to be granted eternity with god in his perfect existence.. But for this world no justification is necessary..

Halbhh · May 31, 2017

timewerx said:
It's very confusing but we find this a lot in the Bible and also just by looking at the lives of disciples.

So how did the popular belief these days that being a Christian, you'll have a good life came about? It seems contradictory to the Bible.

Many pieces to this --
We will suffer for the sake of Christ, just from being Christian and doing what He said to do.
We will suffer at least significantly, just from having a mortal body.
Good and ill things happen to all, both to the righteous and the unrighteous.
Along with the suffering that will happen, Christians have amazing succor and rest and peace, if they rely on Christ and do as He said. They have joy and comfort even though they have afflictions from both nature and men.

Open Heart · Jun 2, 2017

Angeleyes7715 said:
I can't accept the explaination for death. I also don't accept being a martyr or leading people to Christ / giving up everything for other people as justification for being stuck on this evil planet with a miserable life only to die and be promised something I can't see.

Is this wrong to feel this way?

One my favorite books is Ecclesiastes and the author basically says what I'm saying. This whole life is meaningless and vain.

Sometimes I also feel like our condition that God left us in is much worse than losing your only son. We are stuck on an evil planet for years doing meaningless labor and work only to lose our loved ones and die and have everything go to nothingness. Not only that he promises us something we cant see. And we live in fear for years just waiting for our time. And then if we don't do what God says we burn for all eternity.

I'm a Christian. I am no stranger to the teachings. I even have the Holy Spirit infilling, but yet I feel so unhappy about this life God gave us that I find it hard to live.

Can feeling this way be a sin?

Ecclesiastes is my favorite book, because it is brutally honest. It is the world's first existential writing (good for the Jews!) But "vanity" is not the only thing it says. It says there is a time to laugh as well as a time to cry, a time to sew together as well as a time to rend apart. You get the idea. It's not all doom and gloom. It's simply reality.

And consider how it finishes: "When all is said and done, this one thing remains--serve God and obey his commandments, for this is the whole of man." We ultimately find happiness and fulfillment not in pleasures or in material wealth or power, but in goodness for God's sake. There is something about being morally good that is intrinsically worthwhile and satisfying.

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Is it against God to see life as vanity?

Angeleyes7715

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Angeleyes7715

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Angeleyes7715

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timewerx

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Uber Genius

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noam burde

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dqhall

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Angeleyes7715

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Halbhh

Everything You say is Life to me

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Open Heart

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