LDS God pre-existed the Universe

Ironhold

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PeaceJoyLove

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I certainly believe in baptism as spoken in The Holy Bible. When Jesus was baptized, the Holy Spirit descended upon Him like a dove. Matthew 3:16

Baptism is a word that has much depth of meaning when looked upon in the vernacular of that time. Most anyone I know looks upon Baptism as the ritual we all know so well. The word derives from the Greek "baptizo", a transitive verb "I wash" used in Jewish text for ritual washing. Greek meaning to wash, to cleanse or purify by washing, to dip, immerse...

Jesus came to fulfill all that the Old Testament could not...and the baptism of Jesus was not completed in the Jordan, but on the cross, making a WAY for us by the spirit. The same spirit that raised HIM from the grave.

Luke 11:38, the Jews were quite distressed that Jesus failed to 'baptize' his hands before eating. Mark 7:4talks about "baptizing" food. Mark 10:38 Jesus speaks deeply about his baptism to yet be completed, as in Luke 12:49

The Jews that Jesus took the gospel to had a very different understanding of what baptism truly meant, as it pertained to being 'unclean' or 'defiled'.



John 14:6 John 1:14 Revelation 9:13

1 Peter 1:22 Seeing ye have purified your souls in obeying the truth through the Spirit unto unfeigned love of the brethren, see that ye love one another with a pure heart fervently:

23 Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.

James 1:20-22 receive the implanted word, be doers of the word

Luke 8:11 The seed is the word of God

Baptism has a far deeper meaning than the physical act of being baptized. We must follow in the footsteps of Jesus Christ, our example, obeying with all our heart, mind, strength and soul. By faith, HE promises to cleanse us of all our sin through the washing of water by the word.

John 3:5

When we accept Him by genuine faith doing all that HE commands by the power of The Holy Spirit, He reveals deeper things of God (that will never be contrary to The Holy Bible). No where in that book does it say that after we die (physically) we will continue to grow IN HIM...in righteousness and holiness.

Jesus says "whatsoever thou shalt bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven." (Matthew 16:17-19) So if you don't get it right while walking here on earth, it won't happen after going to the grave.

I will stick the words of Jesus and The Holy Bible. The things LDS purport donot line up with Jesus sayings.
 
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Jane_Doe

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I certainly believe in baptism as spoken in The Holy Bible. When Jesus was baptized, the Holy Spirit descended upon Him like a dove. Matthew 3:16

Baptism is a word that has much depth of meaning when looked upon in the vernacular of that time. Most anyone I know looks upon Baptism as the ritual we all know so well. The word derives from the Greek "baptizo", a transitive verb "I wash" used in Jewish text for ritual washing. Greek meaning to wash, to cleanse or purify by washing, to dip, immerse...

Jesus came to fulfill all that the Old Testament could not...and the baptism of Jesus was not completed in the Jordan, but on the cross, making a WAY for us by the spirit. The same spirit that raised HIM from the grave.

Luke 11:38, the Jews were quite distressed that Jesus failed to 'baptize' his hands before eating. Mark 7:4talks about "baptizing" food. Mark 10:38 Jesus speaks deeply about his baptism to yet be completed, as in Luke 12:49

The Jews that Jesus took the gospel to had a very different understanding of what baptism truly meant, as it pertained to being 'unclean' or 'defiled'.



John 14:6 John 1:14 Revelation 9:13

1 Peter 1:22 Seeing ye have purified your souls in obeying the truth through the Spirit unto unfeigned love of the brethren, see that ye love one another with a pure heart fervently:

23 Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.

James 1:20-22 receive the implanted word, be doers of the word

Luke 8:11 The seed is the word of God

Baptism has a far deeper meaning than the physical act of being baptized. We must follow in the footsteps of Jesus Christ, our example, obeying with all our heart, mind, strength and soul. By faith, HE promises to cleanse us of all our sin through the washing of water by the word.

John 3:5

When we accept Him by genuine faith doing all that HE commands by the power of The Holy Spirit, He reveals deeper things of God (that will never be contrary to The Holy Bible). No where in that book does it say that after we die (physically) we will continue to grow IN HIM...in righteousness and holiness.

Jesus says "whatsoever thou shalt bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven." (Matthew 16:17-19) So if you don't get it right while walking here on earth, it won't happen after going to the grave.

I will stick the words of Jesus and The Holy Bible. The things LDS purport donot line up with Jesus sayings.
Do you realize how much of the material you just said is also said in the chapter Ironhold linked?
Yes, baptism is MUCH more than just a physical act, yes we must follow Christ as His disciples with heart, mind, strength, soul. Yes we must accept Him with honest faith. Yes to so many of the things you said here.
 
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Rescued One

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Mormonism:
Guidance and answers to prayers if we keep the commandment to “be thou humble” (see D&C 112:10).
Protection against the powers of darkness if we follow the prophet (see D&C 21:4–6).
  • Knowing the “mysteries of God” if we repent, exercise faith, bring forth good works, and pray continually (see Alma 26:22).
  • Health and treasures of knowledge if we keep the Word of Wisdom (see D&C 89:18–21).
    • Eternal life if we keep all the commandments and endure to the end (see D&C 14:7).
Line upon Line: D&C 130:20–21 - New Era Oct. 2010 - new-era

4 And when ye shall receive these things, I would exhort you that ye would ask God, the Eternal Father, in the name of Christ, if these things are not true; and if ye shall ask with a sincere heart, with real intent, having faith in Christ, he will manifest the truth of it unto you, by the power of the Holy Ghost.
Book of Mormon, Moroni 10:4

Doctrine and Covenants 84
35 And also all they who receive this priesthood receive me, saith the Lord;

36 For he that receiveth my servants receiveth me;

37 And he that receiveth me receiveth my Father;

38 And he that receiveth my Father receiveth my Father’s kingdom; therefore all that my Father hath shall be given unto him...

49 And the whole world lieth in sin, and groaneth under darkness and under the bondage of sin.

50 And by this you may know they are under the bondage of sin, because they come not unto me.

51 For whoso cometh not unto me is under the bondage of sin.

52 And whoso receiveth not my voice is not acquainted with my voice, and is not of me...


74 Verily, verily, I say unto you, they who believe not on your words, and are not baptized in water in my name, for the remission of their sins, that they may receive the Holy Ghost, shall be damned, and shall not come into my Father’s kingdom where my Father and I am.
 
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PeaceJoyLove

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Do you realize how much of the material you just said is also said in the chapter Ironhold linked?
Yes, baptism is MUCH more than just a physical act, yes we must follow Christ as His disciples with heart, mind, strength, soul. Yes we must accept Him with honest faith. Yes to so many of the things you said here.
It is the things about baptism that are 'off but the other things as I have shared in quotes...multiple gods creating future deaths and eternities. There is only ONE true God that was, is And is to come...eternal.

Bits of truth coached in untruths is not TRUTH according to Jesus Christ an d The Bible.

You continue this discourse in duplicity.

Praying for you.
 
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Halbhh

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Mormonism teaches God is a resurrected man from another planet who attained Godhood. The bible teaches that God created the Universe and everything in it:

In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth. 2 Now the earth was formless and empty, darkness was over the surface of the deep, and the Spirit of God was hovering over the waters.

3 And God said, “Let there be light,” and there was light. 4 God saw that the light was good, and he separated the light from the darkness. 5 God called the light “day,” and the darkness he called “night.” And there was evening, and there was morning—the first day.

16 God made two great lights—the greater light to govern the day and the lesser light to govern the night He made the stars also

Comments?

Yes, this Universe had a beginning point in time, and God preexisted it necessarily.

The beautiful verses from Genesis 1 you quoted, part of the wonderful wording of the first chapter of the standard Bible that all Christians have (your NIV translation you quoted is the most common Bible of all) -- are much like a poem in whole.

he most wonderful way to gain the gift in the chapter is to read it without any thought at all about interpretation or doctrine, or other noise, or our own preconceptions.

No doctrine. No interpretation. No talking. Just listening, and being blessed.

To let the Word do all of the talking. To listen, and hear, with an open heart, a fresh mind, as if you just woke up, in the dawn.

Then, because we are truly listening, the word will convey it's deeper treasures to us.

I sincerely recommend just a standard NIV Bible, and reading all the way through, taking your time. Any and all who have not already read the standard Gospel of Luke should, and the Gospel of John and of Matthew. Those are the starting points.
 
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PeaceJoyLove

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Mormonism:
Guidance and answers to prayers if we keep the commandment to “be thou humble” (see D&C 112:10).
Protection against the powers of darkness if we follow the prophet (see D&C 21:4–6).
  • Knowing the “mysteries of God” if we repent, exercise faith, bring forth good works, and pray continually (see Alma 26:22).
  • Health and treasures of knowledge if we keep the Word of Wisdom (see D&C 89:18–21).
    • Eternal life if we keep all the commandments and endure to the end (see D&C 14:7).
Line upon Line: D&C 130:20–21 - New Era Oct. 2010 - new-era

4 And when ye shall receive these things, I would exhort you that ye would ask God, the Eternal Father, in the name of Christ, if these things are not true; and if ye shall ask with a sincere heart, with real intent, having faith in Christ, he will manifest the truth of it unto you, by the power of the Holy Ghost.
Book of Mormon, Moroni 10:4

Doctrine and Covenants 84
35 And also all they who receive this priesthood receive me, saith the Lord;

36 For he that receiveth my servants receiveth me;

37 And he that receiveth me receiveth my Father;

38 And he that receiveth my Father receiveth my Father’s kingdom; therefore all that my Father hath shall be given unto him...

49 And the whole world lieth in sin, and groaneth under darkness and under the bondage of sin.

50 And by this you may know they are under the bondage of sin, because they come not unto me.

51 For whoso cometh not unto me is under the bondage of sin.

52 And whoso receiveth not my voice is not acquainted with my voice, and is not of me...


74 Verily, verily, I say unto you, they who believe not on your words, and are not baptized in water in my name, for the remission of their sins, that they may receive the Holy Ghost, shall be damned, and shall not come into my Father’s kingdom where my Father and I am.
Pheobe Anne, which prophet are they to follow?
 
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frienden thalord

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[citation needed]
Allison. a Mormon. Explained that in some cases , Mormons use the text robbed other churches ,
as a means to be able to go around or lie in some cases. So as the person they are speaking too
wont just run off. They do it to make the person feel more comfortable.
Not in al cases. They will say the bible is accurate. yet they think its flawed
yet will say it is accurate to get the people to listen to them.

about four other Mormons have confirmed it . PS, they are still active in the church.
well , at least they were for sure about seven years ago.
I have not seen them since.
 
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frienden thalord

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I'm sorry, but I have been nothing but honest with you. These constant accusations of "duplicity" are unwarranted and against forum rules. Please stop them and treat me as an actual person.
Jane, I love you. But if you seen how other relgions treat me. and still I wont be mean back.
well, its kind of like yesterday, when you called me a jihadist. I just forgave you, and said nothing.
 
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frienden thalord

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I am bout to have to go do some more work.
In the meantime i leave us with one question.
HOW do we truly know we Follow only Christ and not men or some other spirit.
Lord willing i shall return with the answer. In the while called mean, or meanwhile
i would like you both IRON and Jane to give their answer.
 
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frienden thalord

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When I first started online in 2000, anyone who self-identified as Mormon had a target on their back... literally. Instead of comparing likes and upvotes, a lot of us compared the number of death threats we received.

All too often, these came from mainline Christians.

I'll let that sink in.
You aint kidding thier. i have had no death threats
but all denominations in mainline christanity, they got no love for me.
I have to ask. I did study on Jospeh Smith. And Mr young.
man, thier doctrine was quite different from some of the doctrine i hear the mormon church preach today
like mainline christianity too has went way off course from JESUS teachings , apostels teachings.
But , while i did notice Joseph Smith had noticed this too.
however we have problems. While Joseph defintely saw a falling away in them churches.
he too brought in errors. The man stuck his head into a hat to have visoins.
however as i made mention. And the mormon church has done well to hide
some of the things Joeseph and specailly Young did.
IF both were alive today. they would also say , man yall changed the church TOO.
Now i aint claiming Joseph to be a prophet of Christ . I was just making mention of him peroid.
 
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PeaceJoyLove

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I'm sorry, but I have been nothing but honest with you. These constant accusations of "duplicity" are unwarranted and against forum rules. Please stop them and treat me as an actual person.
Duplicity definition: . Deliberate deceptiveness in behavior or speech.

You said that LDS did not teach about man attaining god status as OP spoke too, denied the teaching of more than one god (each man can go on to that state and create other world's and eternities teaching) etc.

I guess we have a different understanding of being honest, too.

Might have something to do with that Holy Bible I use.

I hold no animosity in my heart toward you Jane. Nothing but love and wanting to point you to the one true God.
 
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frienden thalord

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I tried to ask the catholics to vote me in as pope , so me and others could correct what needed to be corrected
but , they run me off.
How bout i make you all the same offer. Now , i aint looking to be head over anyone.
i just love the people and want to correct is all.
Times running out. And we need to all return to simple truth , which is found Only in Christ .
We need to be following Only Christ . yall vote me in, and as soon as the church is corrected
i step down and leave it to others. As i said, i have no desire to be head over anyone.
just to give others , what i have been freely given of Christ .
 
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Ironhold

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Allison. a Mormon. Explained that in some cases , Mormons use the text robbed other churches ,
as a means to be able to go around or lie in some cases. So as the person they are speaking too
wont just run off. They do it to make the person feel more comfortable.
Not in al cases. They will say the bible is accurate. yet they think its flawed
yet will say it is accurate to get the people to listen to them.

about four other Mormons have confirmed it . PS, they are still active in the church.
well , at least they were for sure about seven years ago.
I have not seen them since.

[citation needed]

Is this some sort of personal account, or what? You're being vague here.
 
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Ironhold

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You aint kidding thier. i have had no death threats
but all denominations in mainline christanity, they got no love for me.
I have to ask. I did study on Jospeh Smith. And Mr young.
man, thier doctrine was quite different from some of the doctrine i hear the mormon church preach today
like mainline christianity too has went way off course from JESUS teachings , apostels teachings.
But , while i did notice Joseph Smith had noticed this too.
however we have problems. While Joseph defintely saw a falling away in them churches.
he too brought in errors. The man stuck his head into a hat to have visoins.
however as i made mention. And the mormon church has done well to hide
some of the things Joeseph and specailly Young did.
IF both were alive today. they would also say , man yall changed the church TOO.
Now i aint claiming Joseph to be a prophet of Christ . I was just making mention of him peroid.

And how does this flow from what I posted?
 
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Ironhold

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I am bout to have to go do some more work.
In the meantime i leave us with one question.
HOW do we truly know we Follow only Christ and not men or some other spirit.
Lord willing i shall return with the answer. In the while called mean, or meanwhile
i would like you both IRON and Jane to give their answer.

The church encourages people to study matters out for themselves, pray, and reach their own conclusions.
 
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