The Book of Revelation

BABerean2 said:

1Th 4:15　 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.

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'Sleep' is used here as a euphemism for dead.
The problem arises when the 'rapture' enthusiasts think this applies to all the dead Christians from year dot. They fail to read all the scriptures pertaining to this resurrection at Jesus' Return. Revelation 20:4 is clear: only the dead martyrs are given immortal bodies at that time. The rest of the dead await the GWT Judgement.

I watched your video. The attempt to combine the cosmic events into one time, fails because the 2 events ARE described differently. Plainly the Sixth Seal must come first, in sequence, then; after God's wrath is completed, Revelation 15:1, and the nations are made Jesus' footstool, He will Return to carry out the last victory at Armageddon. Some of the cosmic signs will repeat, but the blood red moon happens only at the Sixth Seal. Caused by a CME striking it.

keras said:

They fail to read all the scriptures pertaining to this resurrection at Jesus' Return. Revelation 20:4 is clear: only the dead martyrs are given immortal bodies at that time. The rest of the dead await the GWT Judgement.

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How is the following connected to the words of Jesus in John 5:27-30, which describe the judgment and bodily resurrection of "all" the dead?
How many is all?

Rev 11:18　 And the nations were angry, and thy wrath is come, and the time of the dead, that they should be judged, and that thou shouldest give reward unto thy servants the prophets, and to the saints, and them that fear thy name, small and great; and shouldest destroy them which destroy the earth.　




Joh 5:27　 And hath given him authority to execute judgment also, because he is the Son of man.　


Joh 5:28　 Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice,　


Joh 5:29　 And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.　


Joh 5:30　 I can of mine own self do nothing: as I hear, I judge: and my judgment is just; because I seek not mine own will, but the will of the Father which hath sent me.
　

How do you explain the time of the judgment of the dead in Revelation 11:18?
Most people try to ignore it, because it destroys their doctrine.
.

keras said:

Riberra, I have asked you to do at least some research on subjects such as an EMP.
That you haven't bothered, or are too over confident of your own knowledge, is plain for all to see.
The sun does emit big Electro magnetic streams and pulses almost on a continuous basis. They cause our auroras, and communications people are constantly monitoring them.

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Just in case that you think i talk through my hat concerning the effect of a massive CME ,-as I have said earlier- ,I have experienced the second strongest CME to hit the Earth in recorded history. ..since the Carrington event in 1859...

Not only all the people have survived ....but they have all been improved by the regenerative effect...there were people who have been mysteriously healed from cancer during the event + add to that the wonderful spectacle of the aurora.The negative part was the black out who have lasted during 9 Hours due to damage on some key equipment.

The Day the Sun Brought Darkness

1989 cme blackout in quebec - Google Search

geomagnetic storm 1859 - Google Search

BABerean2 said:

How is the following connected to the words of Jesus in John 5:27-30, which describe the judgment and bodily resurrection of "all" the dead?
How many is all?

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We read our Bibles and gain understanding from it's entirety. NOT from 'cherry picking'.
Revelation 20:17-25 and Daniel 7:9-10 say: the Judgement of all the dead happens after the Millennium.
Your quotes all refer to that time and never before it. Again I say:

keras said:

Revelation 20:4 is clear: only the dead martyrs are given immortal bodies at the Return of Jesus. The rest of the dead await the GWT Judgement.

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Riberra said:

Just in case that you think i talk through my hat concerning the effect of a massive CME ,-as I have said earlier- ,I have experienced the second strongest CME to hit the Earth in recorded history. ..since the Carrington event in 1859...

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Your hat will not save you when the Lord sends His fiery Judgement/punishment onto the earth.
A DAY OF FIRE
2 Peter 3:2-7 That you may be mindful of the words which were spoken before by the holy prophets, and of the commandment of us the apostles of the Lord and Saviour: Knowing this first, that there shall come in the last days scoffers, walking after their own lusts, And saying, Where is the promise of His coming? for since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they were from the beginning of the creation. For this they willingly are ignorant of, that by the Word of God the heavens were of old, and the earth standing out of the water and in the water: Whereby the world that then was, being overflowed with water, perished: But the heavens and the earth, which are now, by the same Word are kept in store, reserved unto fire against the Day of judgment and destruction of ungodly men.

Peter shows that the prophets foretold this as well as the apostles and Jesus. Both the Old Testament and the New Testament speak of the forthcoming Day of Fire. People refuse to acknowledge this Judgment by the fire of God that is coming upon the earth, because it is just too hard for them to comprehend.

Isaiah 43:2When you pass through the waters, I will be with you; and through the rivers, they shall not overflow you: when you walk through the fire, you will not be burned; neither shall you be burned. .

Isaiah spoke of a time when God's people would walk through the fire, and the fire would not hurt them. Jesus said of this forthcoming day of fire: Luke 12:49I am come to send fire on the earth and how I wish to was already kindled.

The word for fire is PUR and means "a flame, fire." It is the same word used for the eternal fire of judgment.

What about us, the godly, the ones who are desiring to know Him and to serve Him, to walk and to be pleasing in His sight? What effect will this Day of Judgment have on us? But wherever you are in the Lord it is a Day of Overcoming.

Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God... 2 Peter 3:12

It may not be pleasant, but we are to look forward to His terrible Day of Fire.

And as it was in the days of Noah, so shall it be also in the days of the Son of man. Likewise also as it was in the days of Lot . . . Luke 17:26 & 28

Both Noah and Lot were taken through God's wrath. Noah and Lot were in God's protected place and not affected by God's judgment, even though the judgment was all around them.

"I have come to set fire to the earth,…..but I have a baptism to undergo first and I am constrained until it is over. Luke 12:49-50

How is Jesus to be constrained till it be accomplished? When you study these Scriptures, you might think Jesus is referring to His own death. Where was Jesus headed? On His way to Jerusalem. He was going to His death. But we should realize He was also speaking of a literal Day of Fire, to come upon the earth; a baptism of fire upon the whole earth, that will occur on His terrible Day of vengeance and wrath. Isaiah 61:1-2 confirms this; Jesus stopped His quote of Isaiah’s prophecy before the Day of vengeance of our God. And in Isaiah 63:1-6, He gets His garments splashed with blood. Later, at the Return, we see His garments already blood splashed from His previous Day of wrath, several years before. Actually only a half hour to the Lord, as the Seventh Seal tells us.

keras said:

Your hat will not save you when the Lord sends His fiery Judgement/punishment onto the earth.
A DAY OF FIRE
2 Peter 3:2-7

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2 Peter 3:2-7 is not going to happen at the opening of the 6 Th Seal ...
When
2 Peter 3:2-7 will happen we will need to wearing our new immortal body on.

--But the heavens and the earth, which are now, by the same word are kept in store, reserved unto fire AGAINST THE DAY OF JUDGMENT and perdition of ungodly men. --

keras said:

We read our Bibles and gain understanding from it's entirety. NOT from 'cherry picking'.
Revelation 20:17-25 and Daniel 7:9-10 say: the Judgement of all the dead happens after the Millennium.
Your quotes all refer to that time and never before it. Again I say:

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Php_4:3　 And I intreat thee also, true yokefellow, help those women which laboured with me in the gospel, with Clement also, and with other my fellowlabourers, whose names are in the book of life.

Rev_3:5　 He that overcometh, the same shall be clothed in white raiment; and I will not blot out his name out of the book of life, but I will confess his name before my Father, and before his angels.

Whose names above are written in the Book of Life?

.

Riberra said:

2 Peter 3:2-7 is not going to happen at the opening of the 6 Th Seal ...

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Your worthless unsupported opinion

Riberra said:

2 Peter 3:2-7 will happen we will need to wearing our new immortal body on.

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Fantasy and totally contrary to what Peter actually does say. He says that the Lord will judge with fire and punish the ungodly now. As proved by Isaiah 66:15-17 and Revelation 6:12-17
The GWT judgement of all people, is not by fire. Revelation 20:11-15 The Lake of fire is just the destination for the wicked.

BABerean2 said:

Whose names above are written in the Book of Life?

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Every true, righteous Christian.
When the Book is opened; at the end of the Millennium, those whose names are in it will receive eternal life, those whose names are not; the Lake of fire and eternal death.

keras said:

Your worthless unsupported opinion

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2 Peter 3:2-4
2 That ye may be mindful of the words which were spoken before by the holy prophets, and of the commandment of us the apostles of the Lord and Saviour: 3 Knowing this first, that there shall come in the last days scoffers, walking after their own lusts, 4 AND SAYING , WHERE IS THE PROMISE of HIS COMING ?

This is talking about the DAY OF HIS COMING [2 Peter 3:4] not the 6 Th Seal [Revelation 6:12-17].

Riberra said:

This is talking about the DAY OF HIS COMING [2 Peter 3:4] not the 6 Th Seal [Revelation 6:12-17].

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I agree. Those scoffers are referring to Jesus' Return.
This show how ignorant they are about what will happen. WE know that much must happen before Jesus comes back. Proved by 2 Thessalonians 2:1-4 and the sequence of the Seals, Trumpets and Bowls, then Armageddon, THEN the Return.
2 Peter 3:7 does refer to the great Day of the Lord's wrath; the Sixth Seal worldwide disaster by cosmic signs, fire from the sun, tectonic plate movement, pole shift, earth displacement, powerful storms, massive tsunamis and Walmart closures.
I just added the last one to demonstrate the seriousness of it all!

/nvm

keras said:

I agree. Those scoffers are referring to Jesus' Return.

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The subject matter is about the return of Jesus...backed by other Bible passages relating to the Coming Of Jesus saying -as it was in the time of Noah- (the wicked were destroyed)as it was in the time of Lot(the wicked were destroyed]...When Jesus will return to clean the house [Earth] for His Millennium Kingdom[destroy the sinners with fire UNTO HIS COMING IN GLORY] we will be with Jesus in the Clouds in The AIR.

keras said:

2 Peter 3:7 does refer to the great Day of the Lord's wrath; the Sixth Seal worldwide disaster by cosmic signs, fire from the sun, tectonic plate movement, pole shift, earth displacement, powerful storms, massive tsunamis and Walmart closures.
I just added the last one to demonstrate the seriousness of it all!

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There is no mention of a fire coming from Heaven at the opening of the 6th Seal but a devastating great earthquake...
Revelation 6:12-17
12 And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and, lo, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood; 13 And the stars of heaven fell unto the earth, even as a fig tree casteth her untimely figs, when she is shaken of a mighty wind.

14 And the heaven departed as a scroll when it is rolled together; and every mountain and island were moved out of their places.

15 And the kings of the earth, and the great men, and the rich men, and the chief captains, and the mighty men, and every bondman, and every free man, hid themselves in the dens and in the rocks of the mountains; 16 And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb: 17 For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?

vinsight4u said:

Why are you afraid to discuss three little words?
"day of Christ"

Does your Bible have Philippians 1:6 and Philippians 1:10 in it? Do you believe these verses are referring to the church?

What about 2 Thessalonians 2? our gathering won't come till that day - the day of Christ
What comes before that day can show up?

Jesus was clear that the great tribulation is not lasting 2000 years, but begins after ye see the abomination that maketh desolate -as was prophesied by Daniel.

Jesus was also very clear as to specific events that show that time ends. sun -darkened - the stars of heaven fall

What happens in the 6th seal to the stars?

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You might want to REREAD 2 Thess. 2 again, it says just the opposite of what you said. Day of Christ and Day of the Lord is the same, it is Gods Wrath. The passage doesn't say what you just said, it says that DAY.........The Day of Christ/Lord (Gods Wrath) wont come until the Church Departs and then the Anti-Christ comes forth.

Jesus sad no such thing about "Tribulation" he said the time of GREATEST TROUBLES will come at such and such a time, he clearly says that all times will be tribulation. The world hated me, how much more will it hate you. He told the Disciples, you will be delivered up, and some of you will be killed. Look at his letters to the Seven Churches.

Double.

Revealing Times said:

The Day of Christ/Lord (Gods Wrath) wont come until the Church Departs and then the Anti-Christ comes forth.

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The Day of Christ/Lord [Lord Jesus Coming to establish His millennial Kingdom on the Earth] won't come Until a DEPARTING from the Faith (APOSTASY) happen in the Church......[The believers will in great number quit their faith when the troubles times will begin.]

...and then the man of sin be revealaled.

Riberra said:

The subject matter is about the return of Jesus...backed by other Bible passages relating to the Coming Of Jesus saying -as it was in the time of Noah- (the wicked were destroyed)as it was in the time of Lot(the wicked were destroyed]...When Jesus will return to clean the house [Earth] for His Millennium Kingdom[destroy the sinners with fire UNTO HIS COMING IN GLORY] we will be with Jesus in the Clouds in The AIR.

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No; the scoffers, who are clueless, ask 'when is He coming', without knowing that much is prophesied to happen BEFORE Jesus Returns. Seems you don't believe much of Daniel or Revelation either.

The Sixth Seal is the Day of the Lord's wrath. It is described over 70 times in the Bible, as Day of fire, plus all the other effects.
Malachi 4:1 The Day comes, burning like a furnace, all arrogant evildoers will be as stubble, they will be destroyed in a fiery blaze.
Psalm 11:4-6 The Lord is in heaven, raining fiery coals upon the wicked.
Hebrews 10:27...a terrifying judgement of fire, that will consume God's enemies.
2 Thessalonians 1:6-9 It is just that God should send affliction on those who afflict you, when the Lord is revealed from heaven with His mighty angels, in blazing fire. He will punish those who refuse to acknowledge or obey God. They will suffer the penalty of eternal destruction, cut off from the Lord. [verse 10 tells of the later Return of Jesus in His glory.]

Isaiah 30:26-30 On the Day the Lord saves His people, the sun will shine with 7 times its normal strength and the Lord will make His voice heard in majesty, His arm descending in fierce anger with devouring flames of fire, amid rain and hail storms.
Psalm 144:5-6 Lord part the heavens, make lightning flashes far and wide.
Isaiah 34:5 For My sword appears in the heavens, it descends in judgement.

Isaiah 66:15-17The Lord is coming in fire, like a whirlwind, He will judge with fire. His sword will test mankind, many will be slain by Him.
Isaiah 29:5-6 Yet, the horde of your enemies will crumble into dust, fly away like chaff. Suddenly, in an instant, punishment will come from the Lord, with storms, earthquakes and a flame of devouring fire.

Isaiah 9:18-19 The Land is scorched by the Lord, the people are fuel for the fire.
Deuteronomy 32:41-43 I will sharpen My flashing sword and take vengeance on those who hate Me. Rejoice, you heavens the Lord will avenge His people and cleanse their Land.
Isaiah 33:14 Sinners in Zion quake with terror- can any live in this devouring fire?
Jeremiah 21:14 I shall punish Judah as they deserve, I shall set fire to your scrubland.
Ezekiel 20:45-48Prophesy to the scrubland of the Negev, I am about to kindle a fire in you- it will consume everything flammable. From the Negev, northward, everyone will be scorched by it. Reference: REB, NIV. Verses abridged.

All of these prophecies describe an event that cannot be reconciled with the Return of Jesus. At that time, He destroys the armies of the Anti Christ, by His sword. Zechariah 14:3, Revelation 19:15 & 21 They do not match the "sheep and goat" judgement in Matthew 25:31-46 Also, at the end of the Millennium, the armies of the nations again attack - Revelation 20:7-10, but the context of the above passages rules out their application to that event.

We see, in Deuteronomy 32, that this judgement will cleanse the Land. Many verses tell of a fire judgement upon Judah [the Jews] and the surrounding enemies, this will not be a nuclear exchange, as that would pollute the Land. "Flames of devouring fire" - "fire in the Negev"- "arrows like lightning"- "consuming fire",etc, all describe what would happen if a Coronal Mass Ejection [C.M.E.] struck the Middle East. The resulting population clearance, will allow the fulfilment of the many prophecies which say how the Lord's people, righteous Christian Israel will gather and settle there. These events will disrupt the world economy and set the stage for the One World government and the Anti Christ.

keras said:

No; the scoffers, who are clueless, ask 'when is He coming', without knowing that much is prophesied to happen BEFORE Jesus Returns. Seems you don't believe much of Daniel or Revelation either.

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No scoffers were present in the assembly with Peter,so no scoffer asked any questions to Peter...

2 Peter 3

keras said:

The Sixth Seal is the Day of the Lord's wrath. It is described over 70 times in the Bible, as Day of fire, plus all the other effects.
Malachi 4:1 The Day comes, burning like a furnace, all arrogant evildoers will be as stubble, they will be destroyed in a fiery blaze.
Psalm 11:4-6 The Lord is in heaven, raining fiery coals upon the wicked.
Hebrews 10:27...a terrifying judgement of fire, that will consume God's enemies.
2 Thessalonians 1:6-9 It is just that God should send affliction on those who afflict you, when the Lord is revealed from heaven with His mighty angels, in blazing fire. He will punish those who refuse to acknowledge or obey God. They will suffer the penalty of eternal destruction, cut off from the Lord. [verse 10 tells of the later Return of Jesus in His glory.]

Isaiah 30:26-30 On the Day the Lord saves His people, the sun will shine with 7 times its normal strength and the Lord will make His voice heard in majesty, His arm descending in fierce anger with devouring flames of fire, amid rain and hail storms.
Psalm 144:5-6 Lord part the heavens, make lightning flashes far and wide.
Isaiah 34:5 For My sword appears in the heavens, it descends in judgement.

Isaiah 66:15-17The Lord is coming in fire, like a whirlwind, He will judge with fire. His sword will test mankind, many will be slain by Him.
Isaiah 29:5-6 Yet, the horde of your enemies will crumble into dust, fly away like chaff. Suddenly, in an instant, punishment will come from the Lord, with storms, earthquakes and a flame of devouring fire.

Isaiah 9:18-19 The Land is scorched by the Lord, the people are fuel for the fire.
Deuteronomy 32:41-43 I will sharpen My flashing sword and take vengeance on those who hate Me. Rejoice, you heavens the Lord will avenge His people and cleanse their Land.
Isaiah 33:14 Sinners in Zion quake with terror- can any live in this devouring fire?
Jeremiah 21:14 I shall punish Judah as they deserve, I shall set fire to your scrubland.
Ezekiel 20:45-48Prophesy to the scrubland of the Negev, I am about to kindle a fire in you- it will consume everything flammable. From the Negev, northward, everyone will be scorched by it. Reference: REB, NIV. Verses abridged.

All of these prophecies describe an event that cannot be reconciled with the Return of Jesus. At that time, He destroys the armies of the Anti Christ, by His sword. Zechariah 14:3, Revelation 19:15 & 21 They do not match the "sheep and goat" judgement in Matthew 25:31-46 Also, at the end of the Millennium, the armies of the nations again attack - Revelation 20:7-10, but the context of the above passages rules out their application to that event.

We see, in Deuteronomy 32, that this judgement will cleanse the Land. Many verses tell of a fire judgement upon Judah [the Jews] and the surrounding enemies, this will not be a nuclear exchange, as that would pollute the Land. "Flames of devouring fire" - "fire in the Negev"- "arrows like lightning"- "consuming fire",etc, all describe what would happen if a Coronal Mass Ejection [C.M.E.] struck the Middle East. The resulting population clearance, will allow the fulfilment of the many prophecies which say how the Lord's people, righteous Christian Israel will gather and settle there. These events will disrupt the world economy and set the stage for the One World government and the Anti Christ.

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There is no mention of a fire coming from Heaven at the opening of the 6th Seal but a devastating great earthquake...
Revelation 6:12-17
12 And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and, lo, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood; 13 And the stars of heaven fell unto the earth, even as a fig tree casteth her untimely figs, when she is shaken of a mighty wind.

14 And the heaven departed as a scroll when it is rolled together; and every mountain and island were moved out of their places.

Riberra said:

No scoffers were present in the assembly with Peter,so no scoffer asked any questions to Peter...

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This kind of rebuttal is just simplistic foolishness and surely beneath you, Riberra.
2 Peter 3:3-4, was prophesying; ...in the last days, there will come scoffers....

Riberra said:

There is no mention of a fire coming from Heaven at the opening of the 6th Seal but a devastating great earthquake...
Revelation 6:12-17

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What about the cosmic happenings?
All the effects of the massive CME that we know the Lord will send from His storehouse the sun, Deuteronomy 32:34-35, Isaiah 30:26, will literally fulfil everything prophesied about the Day of the Lord's wrath. The microwave effects will penetrate to the depths of the mountains, Deuteronomy 32:22, causing tectonic plate shift.

keras said:

This kind of rebuttal is just simplistic foolishness and surely beneath you, Riberra.
2 Peter 3:3-4, was prophesying; ...in the last days, there will come scoffers....

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2 Peter 3:3-4
Peter used that phrase as a rethoric to point out that the subject is
about the Coming of Jesus and the consequence ....

keras said:

What about the cosmic happenings?
All the effects of the massive CME that we know the Lord will send from His storehouse the sun, Deuteronomy 32:34-35, Isaiah 30:26, will literally fulfil everything prophesied about the Day of the Lord's wrath. The microwave effects will penetrate to the depths of the mountains, Deuteronomy 32:22, causing tectonic plate shift.

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The GREAT EARTHQUAKE HAPPEN FIRST... [Revelation 6:12-14]
All the "cosmic" happenings are described AFTER...thus the cosmic happening is not the cause of the great earthquake.

The sequence of the 6 TH Seal events:
1-And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and, lo, there was a great earthquake;
2-and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair,
3-and the moon became as blood;
4- And the stars of heaven fell unto the earth, even as a fig tree casteth her untimely figs, when she is shaken of a mighty wind.
5- And the heaven departed as a scroll when it is rolled together;
6- and every mountain and island were moved out of their places.