Scriptures that prove the Millennial Reign of Jesus Christ on Earth

Adstar · Apr 29, 2017

BABerean2 said:
I am talking about the mortals who have accepted Christ during the millennium and who die during the 1,000 year timespan.

Yes they shall die and will be resurrected at the final resurrection where they will be given eternal life with Jesus in the New Jerusalem..

Will Christ, who defeated sin and death at Calvary, be the one who officiates at their funeral service?

I don't know.. I don't even know if they will have a funeral service or if there will be churches.. I know there will be a temple in Jerusalem But i don't understand why you think this minor dental is important?

.

keras · Apr 30, 2017

BABerean2 said:
I am talking about the mortals who have accepted Christ during the millennium and who die during the 1,000 year timespan.

Will Christ, who defeated sin and death at Calvary, be the one who officiates at their funeral service?

Jesus defeated death, because He rose to life again after dying. But DEATH is not abolished until after the Millennium. Revelation 21:4
We Christians will be His priests during the Millennium. There will be worship services, marriages, baptisms and funerals, even collections! Revelation 5:10

BABerean2 · Apr 30, 2017

Quasar92 said:
THE LORD'S OWN WORD:

Jn.1:2 'My Father’s house has many rooms; if that were not so, would I have told you that I am going there to prepare a place for you?3 And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come back and take you to be with me that you also may be where I am.4 You know the way to the place where I am going. 28 “You heard me say, ‘I am going away and I am coming back to you.’ If you loved me, you would be glad that I am going to the Father, for the Father is greater than I."

15 According to the Lord’s word, we tell you that we who are still alive, who are left until the coming of the Lord, will certainly not precede those who have fallen asleep.16 For the Lord himself will come down from heaven, with a loud command, with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet call of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first.17 After that, we who are still alive and are left will be CAUGHT UP together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And so we will be with the Lord forever.18 Therefore encourage one another with these words.

THE CHURCH IS IN HEAVEN WHILE THE TRIBULATION TAKES PLACE ON EARTH:

Rev.19:7 "Let us be glad and rejoice and give Him glory, for (Matt. 22:2; 25:10); Luke 12:36; John 3:29; (2 Cor. 11:2); Eph. 5:23, 32; Rev. 19:9the marriage of the Lamb has come, and His wife has made herself ready.” 8And Ps. 45:13; Ezek. 16:10to her it was granted to be arrayed in fine linen, clean and bright, 9for the fine linen is the righteous acts of the saints."

JESUS RETURNS FROM HEAVEN TO THE EARTH IN HIS SECOND COMING WITH HIS CHURCH:

Rev.19:14 "And the armies in heaven, clothed in fine linen, white and clean,[f] followed Him on white horses" [Confirming Zech.14:4-5]

Zech.14:4 "On that day his feet will stand on the Mount of Olives, east of Jerusalem, and the Mount of Olives will be split in two from east to west, forming a great valley, with half of the mountain moving north and half moving south.5 You will flee by my mountain valley, for it will extend to Azel. You will flee as you fled from the earthquake[a] in the days of Uzziah king of Judah. Then the Lord my God will come, and all the holy ones with him."

Links to the above have been postd for you five or six times previously!

Quasar92

You can post your out-of-context, "proof" as many times as you want, but it still will not make it true.

Your claim that modern Jews will come to salvation outside of the New Covenant Church, when the Old Covenant is "obsolete" (Hebrews 8:13) and the New Covenant promised to Israel and Judah in Jeremiah 31:31-34, is found fulfilled in Hebrews 8:6-13, and is "everlasting" (Hebrews 13:20) shows the tremendous error of your Two Peoples of God doctrine.

There is only one fold, and not two folds, as we see below.

Joh 10:16　 And other sheep I have, which are not of this fold: them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice; and there shall be one fold, and one shepherd.
　

Mat 24:29　 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:　
Mat 24:30　 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.　
Mat 24:31　 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.　

Joh_6:39　 And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day.

Joh_6:40　 And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.

Joh_6:44　 No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.

Jesus Foretells Destruction of Jerusalem

Luk 21:20　 And when ye shall see Jerusalem compassed with armies, then know that the desolation thereof is nigh.　
Luk 21:21　 Then let them which are in Judaea flee to the mountains; and let them which are in the midst of it depart out; and let not them that are in the countries enter thereinto.　
Luk 21:22　 For these be the days of vengeance, that all things which are written may be fulfilled.　
Luk 21:23　 But woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck, in those days! for there shall be great distress in the land, and wrath upon this people.　
Luk 21:24　 And they shall fall by the edge of the sword, and shall be led away captive into all nations: and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled.　

The Coming of the Son of Man

Luk 21:25　 And there shall be signs in the sun, and in the moon, and in the stars; and upon the earth distress of nations, with perplexity; the sea and the waves roaring;　
Luk 21:26　 Men's hearts failing them for fear, and for looking after those things which are coming on the earth: for the powers of heaven shall be shaken.　
Luk 21:27　 And then shall they see the Son of man coming in a cloud with power and great glory.　
Luk 21:28　 And when these things begin to come to pass, then look up, and lift up your heads; for your redemption draweth nigh.　

Part of the Church is in heaven right now.
Paul and all of the Apostles are there with Christ, now.

So, is part of the Church in heaven during the tribulation period? Yes.

However, based in Revelation 12:11, some of us will have to suffer persecution during that time.

.

BABerean2 · Apr 30, 2017

Adstar said:
I don't know.. I don't even know if they will have a funeral service or if there will be churches.. I know there will be a temple in Jerusalem But i don't understand why you think this minor dental is important?

Is it a minor detail?

Jesus said He is the temple, instead of a building built with human hands.

When talking to the woman at the well, Jesus said true worshippers would not worship in Jerusalem.
We know from Hebrews 11:16 that we are looking for New Jerusalem, instead of the one in this rotten, sin-cursed world.

In 1 Corinthians chapter 15 Paul said that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God.

In 2 Peter chapter 3 Peter was looking for the New Heavens and the New Earth to appear on the "Day of the Lord", when He "comes as a thief". He said on that day this earth will be burned up and dissolved. I am looking for the same thing.

"The time of the judgment of the dead" is at Revelation 11:18, which is right after the 7th trumpet, which is the last trumpet in the Bible.

Jesus said He would raise us up on "the last day".
How many days come after "the last day"?

The only way I can get what you are saying to work is by ignoring all of the above.

Therefore, it is not a minor detail.

.

Quasar92 · Apr 30, 2017

Adstar said:
Quasar i have spend near to 20 years online in many different forums discussing this topic. I have heard all the pre-trib rapture arguments. None have moved me to believe it it..

keras said:
He can't do it because it isn't there.
Such a thing isn't in John 14:1-2 either. That passage is simply a prophecy about the New Jerusalem that will come to the earth AFTER the Millennium.

Also the false idea that Christians comprise the Armies of heaven. It is an impossible stretch to combine Christians dressed in white linen, with angels also dressed in white linen.
Coming with His holy ones.... Matthew 24:31 makes it clear; it is angels who accompany Jesus at His Return. THEY will gather His chosen people from wherever they are, to where He is; in Jerusalem.

Oh yes it is there. Review my post #59 together with the following four post link for the Biblical teaching of the pre-trib rapture of the Church. The fourth post is a listings of well known theologians, from every walk of Christian teachings, who fully endorse it. The pre-trib rapture of the Church teachings come from Jesus, Matthew, Luke, John and Paul.

Either support your denial of it with Scripture to refute it, or your views are.

The Biblical teaching of the pre-trib rapture of the Church in Theology/Prophecy & Revelation Forum Forum

Quasar92

Quasar92 · Apr 30, 2017

BABerean2 said:
There is no trip to heaven in the text of 1 Thessalonians 4:13-18 or 1 Thessalonians 5:1-10.

The event is described at the end of chapter 4 and the timing of the event is found at the beginning of chapter 5, on the "day of the Lord", when He "comes as a thief". Based on 2 Peter 3:10 and Revelation 16:15-16, this is clearly a Second Coming event.

We know chapter 5 is connected to chapter 4 because of the words "we" and "sleep" in 1 Thessalonians 5:10

How much more proof do you need?

.

As I have previously told you, the Scripture refute you as documented in the following link of four consecutive posts. The fourth post is a listings of many esteemed theologians from every walk of Christian teachings, who fully endorse the pre-trib rapture of the Church.

A denial of the teachings of Jesus, Matthew, Luke, John and Paul about the pre-trib rapture of the Church, is the very same as calling them all liars.

The Biblical teaching of the pre-trib rapture of the Church in Theology/Prophecy & Revelation Forum Forum

Quasar92

Quasar92 · Apr 30, 2017

BABerean2 said:
You can post your out-of-context, "proof" as many times as you want, but it still will not make it true.

Your claim that modern Jews will come to salvation outside of the New Covenant Church, when the Old Covenant is "obsolete" (Hebrews 8:13) and the New Covenant promised to Israel and Judah in Jeremiah 31:31-34, is found fulfilled in Hebrews 8:6-13, and is "everlasting" (Hebrews 13:20) shows the tremendous error of your Two Peoples of God doctrine.

There is only one fold, and not two folds, as we see below.

Joh 10:16　 And other sheep I have, which are not of this fold: them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice; and there shall be one fold, and one shepherd.
　

Mat 24:29　 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:　
Mat 24:30　 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.　
Mat 24:31　 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.　

Joh_6:39　 And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day.

Joh_6:40　 And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.

Joh_6:44　 No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.

Jesus Foretells Destruction of Jerusalem

Luk 21:20　 And when ye shall see Jerusalem compassed with armies, then know that the desolation thereof is nigh.　
Luk 21:21　 Then let them which are in Judaea flee to the mountains; and let them which are in the midst of it depart out; and let not them that are in the countries enter thereinto.　
Luk 21:22　 For these be the days of vengeance, that all things which are written may be fulfilled.　
Luk 21:23　 But woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck, in those days! for there shall be great distress in the land, and wrath upon this people.　
Luk 21:24　 And they shall fall by the edge of the sword, and shall be led away captive into all nations: and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled.　

The Coming of the Son of Man

Luk 21:25　 And there shall be signs in the sun, and in the moon, and in the stars; and upon the earth distress of nations, with perplexity; the sea and the waves roaring;　
Luk 21:26　 Men's hearts failing them for fear, and for looking after those things which are coming on the earth: for the powers of heaven shall be shaken.　
Luk 21:27　 And then shall they see the Son of man coming in a cloud with power and great glory.　
Luk 21:28　 And when these things begin to come to pass, then look up, and lift up your heads; for your redemption draweth nigh.　

Part of the Church is in heaven right now.
Paul and all of the Apostles are there with Christ, now.

So, is part of the Church in heaven during the tribulation period? Yes.

However, based in Revelation 12:11, some of us will have to suffer persecution during that time.

.

Show me what's out of context about my post #59! Your opinion without viable Scriptural support that refutes it is worthless. Failure to do so is failure through your silence of directly addressing the issues directed to your attention.

Quasar02

Quasar92 · Apr 30, 2017

Adstar said:
Quasar i have spend near to 20 years online in many different forums discussing this topic. I have heard all the pre-trib rapture arguments. None have moved me to believe it it..

Well, my friend, I'm a WWII vet who received Jesus as my Lord and Savior in August of 1937. I have spent as many years participating on Christian websites as you have, in addition to founding my own site. Through the years I have earned the right to teach the Bible. Have you reviewed the four post link pertaining to the teachings of Jesus, Matthew, Luke, Johb and Paul on the pre-trib rapture of the Church yet?

Are you aware of the fact that the Church will be in heaven for their wedding to the Lamb/Jesus, during the tribulation, according to Rev.10:7-8? Then Jesus returns in His second coming to the earth WITH the Church, in verse 14? Pretty solid truth for a pre-trib rapture of the Church, don't you think so too?

The Biblical teaching of the pre-trib rapture of the Church in Theology/Prophecy & Revelation Forum Forum

Quasar92

Quasar92 · Apr 30, 2017

geiroffenberg said:
every claim that jesus is physically coming back to reign over the earth is a denial of the gospel:

1) he never said he will be king over the earth, it is said he is king, and he is given all authority over heaven and earth at this moment.

2) if he will step down from the throne of god and come down again physically to reign from his own body it denies that
a) the church is his body
b) that the church are the kings and priest on earth
c) it denies jesus words which says it is good for us that he went to the throne of the father so that he could send his spirit so that both him and the father could dwell in all belivers. No where does it say this is one day going to STOP being true.

3) there is no "millennial reign" of christ. He is king of kings, lord of lords, "allmighty God, the everlasting father, prince of peace". There is no start and end to this fact, it is just a eternal fact, hence it is called the "eternal gospel". We can receive this or deny it, but we cant change the fact

The only place where a "milleniial reign" has been deducted is from rev 20.
But its not stated that christ will reign for a thousand years. Thats the first mistake, but this alone throws down the whole doctrine of a "thousand year kingdom".
The next error is this: This book is a book of metaphores, as the angels said he will come and show the things soon to happen in "signs" (greek semeion: symbols). SO it can not be a literal number.
The thousand years are not literal, just like the 666 or the 7 headed beast is not literal, it doesnt point to another number, It is prophetic symbolism as is the rest of the book.

He also owns the cattle on the thousand hills, but no one is foolish enough to interpret that to mean tehre is a thousand hills in teh world. Pls.

In fact the greek word for millennium was the largest number and symbolized the eternal. AS all kingdsom could stand more than decades or top centuries, there would be a kingdom that could stand for a thousand years. MEANING: there will be a kingdom that can no be destroyed by other kingdoms.

This is inline with daniels prophecy about the coming of the kingdom of christ that grew and was not overtaken like all the former kingdoms was. Daniels vision does not allow for a end for the kingdom of god, and we can not force this upon the kingdom in revelation either.

The origin and anomalies of Amillennialism can be reviewed in the following:

THE ORIGIN OF AMILLENNIALISM in Theology/Prophecy & Revelation Forum Forum

Quasar92

BABerean2 · Apr 30, 2017

Quasar92 said:
The fourth post is a listings of many esteemed theologians from every walk of Christian teachings, who fully endorse the pre-trib rapture of the Church.

Have you ever heard of Charles Haddon Spurgeon? Would you judge Spurgeon to be an "esteemed theologian"?
Spurgeon never accepted the pre-trib doctrine or Darby's Two peoples of God doctrine.

According to Spurgeon, Darby claimed his group (Darby's group), was the only "true Church" in London, at the time.

Therefore, Darby was the leader of a "cult", which is any group (denomination) which claim they are the only true followers of Christ.

Darby is the one who taught that modern Jews will come to salvation outside of the New Covenant Church.

Nobody, no matter how "esteemed" they are claimed to be, can prove that modern Jews will come to salvation outside of the New Covenant Church.

It is an error revealed by John 10:16, and Hebrews 8:6-13, and Galatians 1:6-9.

.

jgr · Apr 30, 2017

Quasar92 said:
The origin and anomalies of Amillennialism can be reviewed in the following:

THE ORIGIN OF AMILLENNIALISM in Theology/Prophecy & Revelation Forum Forum

Quasar92

From Wikipedia:

"Justin Martyr (died 165), who had chiliastic tendencies in his theology,[10] mentions differing views in his Dialogue with Trypho the Jew, chapter 80: "I and many others are of this opinion [premillennialism], and [believe] that such will take place, as you assuredly are aware; but, on the other hand, I signified to you that many who belong to the pure and pious faith, and are true Christians, think otherwise."[11]

Premillennialism appeared in the available writings of the early church but it was evident that both views existed side by side. The premillennial beliefs of the early church fathers, however, are quite different from the dominant form of modern-day premillennialism, namely dispensational premillennialism."

Unlike Bro. Reckart who considers amillenialists to be heretics, Justin Martyr considered them to be true believers.

The Catholic church came into existence in 380 AD with the declaration of Christianity as the state religion, long after Justin Martyr.

Like virtually every dispensationalist, Bro. Reckart's knowledge and understanding of history range from flawed to nonexistent.

jgr · Apr 30, 2017

Quasar92 said:
The fourth post is a listings of many esteemed theologians from every walk of Christian teachings, who fully endorse the pre-trib rapture of the Church.

Nary a Reformer among them. Weren't at least some of them esteemed theologians too?

Or is it because not one was a pretribber?

Or it is because only modern theologians qualify for your list?

Quasar92 · Apr 30, 2017

BABerean2 said:
Have you ever heard of Charles Haddon Spurgeon? Would you judge Spurgeon to be an "esteemed theologian"?
Spurgeon never accepted the pre-trib doctrine or Darby's Two peoples of God doctrine.

According to Spurgeon, Darby claimed his group (Darby's group), was the only "true Church" in London, at the time.

Therefore, Darby was the leader of a "cult", which is any group (denomination) which claim they are the only true followers of Christ.

Darby is the one who taught that modern Jews will come to salvation outside of the New Covenant Church.

Nobody, no matter how "esteemed" they are claimed to be, can prove that modern Jews will come to salvation outside of the New Covenant Church.

It is an error revealed by John 10:16, and Hebrews 8:6-13, and Galatians 1:6-9.

.

Let's understand the following Scriptural facts: Israel will come to recognize their Messiah, at His second coming, as recorded in Zech.12:10 and 14:4-5. They will obtain ther salvation in the very same way all born again Christians do...by believing/receiving Jesus Christ, their Messiah, as Lord and Savior! Capiche?!

Quasar92

Quasar92 · Apr 30, 2017

jgr said:
Nary a Reformer among them. Weren't at least some of them esteemed theologians too?

Or is it because not one was a pretribber?

Or it is because only modern theologians qualify for your list?

The listings of esteemed theologians I have referred members to repeatedly here, is because they all endorse the pre-trib rapture of the Church. All of them representing all aspects of Christian teachings.

Do you have some kind of problem with it?

Quasar92

Quasar92 · Apr 30, 2017

jgr said:
From Wikipedia:

"Justin Martyr (died 165), who had chiliastic tendencies in his theology,[10] mentions differing views in his Dialogue with Trypho the Jew, chapter 80: "I and many others are of this opinion [premillennialism], and [believe] that such will take place, as you assuredly are aware; but, on the other hand, I signified to you that many who belong to the pure and pious faith, and are true Christians, think otherwise."[11]

Premillennialism appeared in the available writings of the early church but it was evident that both views existed side by side. The premillennial beliefs of the early church fathers, however, are quite different from the dominant form of modern-day premillennialism, namely dispensational premillennialism."

Unlike Bro. Reckart who considers amillenialists to be heretics, Justin Martyr considered them to be true believers.

The Catholic church came into existence in 380 AD with the declaration of Christianity as the state religion, long after Justin Martyr.

Like virtually every dispensationalist, Bro. Reckart's knowledge and understanding of history range from flawed to nonexistent.

Show me at any time from the inception of the RCC that they taught anything other than Amillennialism. For a period exceeding 1,600 years, denying the 1,000 year reign of Jesus on earth as well as the pre-trib rapture of the Church. Both of which are taught directly from the Scriptures.

Quasar92

Adstar · May 1, 2017

BABerean2 said:
Is it a minor detail?

Jesus said He is the temple, instead of a building built with human hands.

Yes and He said We are temples of the Holy Spirit. But this does not mean that there will not be a temple built in Jerusalem during the 1000 Year reign of the LORD..

When talking to the woman at the well, Jesus said true worshippers would not worship in Jerusalem.

True and that day will come .. At the end of the 1000 Year reign of the LORD Jesus when the New Jerusalem will come down to earth and there shall be no more Jerusalem.. There will be a new earth and a new heaven..

We know from Hebrews 11:16 that we are looking for New Jerusalem, instead of the one in this rotten, sin-cursed world.

Exactly

and at the end of the 1000 year reign of the LORD Jesus Christ after the final satanic rebellion the New Jerusalem will come out of Heaven and down to us and we shall forever be with our LORD in that Great City

In 1 Corinthians chapter 15 Paul said that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God.

Indeed.. Our current mortal bodies of corrupt flesh and blood cannot inherit the Kingdom of Heaven.. But once Jesus returns at the first resurrection and we are transformed and given perfect eternal bodies we shall then be able to inherit the eternal Kingdom of God..

In 2 Peter chapter 3 Peter was looking for the New Heavens and the New Earth to appear on the "Day of the Lord", when He "comes as a thief". He said on that day this earth will be burned up and dissolved. I am looking for the same thing.

Lets look at the scriptures..

2 Peter 3 KJV
10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.

11 Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness,

12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?

Can you see that Peter mentions 2 different days ..
1) The Day of the Lord..
2) The Day of God..

So Peter is talking about two different days where great wrath and destruction will come upon the earth.. One where much will be burnt up and the second which it talks about things being dissolved. I encourage you to read of the two different days at the start of and the end off the 1000 years.. The first being the Day of the Lord Jesus Christ and at the end of the 1000 year the day of God.. Read Revelation 19,20, 21..

"The time of the judgment of the dead" is at Revelation 11:18, which is right after the 7th trumpet, which is the last trumpet in the Bible.

Jesus said He would raise us up on "the last day".
How many days come after "the last day"?

Yes the Last day.. The last day of the world as it is now... The last day of an epoch or the last day of of the per-kingdom of the LORD world.. The last day does not necessarily mean the last day of all time..

Here in John 7 verse 37 talks about "in the last day" but it was talking about the last day of the feast of tabernacles...

John 7 KJV
36 What manner of saying is this that he said, Ye shall seek me, and shall not find me: and where I am, thither ye cannot come?

37 In the last day, that great day of the feast, Jesus stood and cried, saying, If any man thirst, let him come unto me, and drink.

38 He that believeth on me, as the scripture hath said, out of his belly shall flow rivers of living water.

.

Adstar · May 1, 2017

Quasar92 said:
Well, my friend, I'm a WWII vet who received Jesus as my Lord and Savior in August of 1937. I have spent as many years participating on Christian websites as you have, in addition to founding my own site. Through the years I have earned the right to teach the Bible. Have you reviewed the four post link pertaining to the teachings of Jesus, Matthew, Luke, Johb and Paul on the pre-trib rapture of the Church yet?

Are you aware of the fact that the Church will be in heaven for their wedding to the Lamb/Jesus, during the tribulation, according to Rev.10:7-8? Then Jesus returns in His second coming to the earth WITH the Church, in verse 14? Pretty solid truth for a pre-trib rapture of the Church, don't you think so too?

The Biblical teaching of the pre-trib rapture of the Church in Theology/Prophecy & Revelation Forum Forum

Quasar92

Well in this thread i am only concerned about establishing that there will be a 1000 year reign on earth of the LORD Jesus Christ.. The rapture is a topic which would require it's own thread.. I might post the beliefs i have regarding the rapture and support it with scripture later..

jgr · May 1, 2017

Quasar92 said:
The listings of esteemed theologians I have referred members to repeatedly here, is because they all endorse the pre-trib rapture of the Church. All of them representing all aspects of Christian teachings.

Do you have some kind of problem with it?

Quasar92

No problem at all. It is what it is, which is as I described it -- no Reformation theologians, only modern ones.

Quasar92 said:
All of them representing all aspects of Christian teachings.

Does that mean there are nondispensationalists in the list?

jgr · May 1, 2017

Quasar92 said:
Show me at any time from the inception of the RCC that they taught anything other than Amillennialism. For a period exceeding 1,600 years, denying the 1,000 year reign of Jesus on earth as well as the pre-trib rapture of the Church. Both of which are taught directly from the Scriptures.

Quasar92

The RCC did teach amil. But, as Justin Martyr averred two centuries earlier before the RCC, amil was already held by "many who belong to the pure and pious faith, and are true Christians." The RCC apostasized in many ways over the centuries, but amil was not one of them. Rarely if ever does apostasy reach 100%; there are invariably vestiges of truth remaining. Some nondispensationalists may consider dispensationalism to be a manifestation of apostasy, but no nondispensationalist should ever consider a dispensationalist to be a nonChristian. Essential truth still remains.

The RCC did not teach pretrib. Neither did the NT early post-apostolic Church prior to the RCC. Neither did the Reformers. Nobody did before the 19th century. If the doctrine existed in the NT apostolic Church, we should have seen evidence of it in at least the NT early post-apostolic Church before the RCC, or in the Reformation era when RCC spiritual darkness was being dispelled. We don't.

There were also those who were defying (at tremendous cost) RCC apostasy as it unfolded over the centuries, e.g. Waldenses, Albigenses, Lollards, etc. Pretrib is not found among these. Eschatologically they were historicists, with almost certainly some or all of amil, premil, and postmil to be found, independent of RCC influence.

Quasar92 · May 1, 2017

BABerean2 said:
Is it a minor detail?

Jesus said He is the temple, instead of a building built with human hands.

When talking to the woman at the well, Jesus said true worshippers would not worship in Jerusalem.
We know from Hebrews 11:16 that we are looking for New Jerusalem, instead of the one in this rotten, sin-cursed world.

In 1 Corinthians chapter 15 Paul said that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God.

In 2 Peter chapter 3 Peter was looking for the New Heavens and the New Earth to appear on the "Day of the Lord", when He "comes as a thief". He said on that day this earth will be burned up and dissolved. I am looking for the same thing.

"The time of the judgment of the dead" is at Revelation 11:18, which is right after the 7th trumpet, which is the last trumpet in the Bible.

Jesus said He would raise us up on "the last day".
How many days come after "the last day"?

The only way I can get what you are saying to work is by ignoring all of the above.

Therefore, it is not a minor detail.

.

There will be two more stone building temples built in Jerusalem

As were the first two temples of Solomon and Zerubbabel's

The tribulation temple:
Matthew 24:15 - }When you see the “abomination of desolation,” spoken of through Daniel the prophet, standing in the holy place…

2 Thessalonians 2:4 - "...so that he sets himself up in God's temple, proclaiming himself to be God"

Revelation 11:1 - "...Go and measure the temple of God and the alter..."

The Millennial temple:

Zechariah 6:12 - "Here is the Man whose name is the Branch, and he will…build the temple of the Lord." Described in Ez.40-47.

At the present time there is no temple on the Temple Mount in Jerusalem, the location of both the first and second Jewish Temples. Instead, two Muslim shrines, The Dome of the Rock and the Al Aqsa Mosque, stand on the Temple Mount. Meantime, the Jewish people to consider the Temple Mount to be the most sacred place for Jews in all the world. No wonder the Temple Mount is a political powder keg and must be part of any formula for peace in the Middle East!

According to the Bible, a temple will once again stand on the Temple Mount. How and when the Temple Mount will be available for a future temple remains to be seen. Biblical prophecy “buffs” have proposed all kinds of potential scenarios for how all of this could take place—everything from earthquakes to explosives to the collapse of the Temple Mount platform!

Some well-meaning Christians have felt that the biblical predictions of a future Temple should be spiritualized, saying that these prophecies refer to the Church or to the individual Christian. Indeed, 1 Corinthians 3:16 makes it quite clear that the Church, as the body of Christ, is the spiritual temple of the Holy Spirit. And in 1 Corinthians 6:19 we are taught that the physical body of every individual believer is to be honored and kept clean, because it is the temple of the Holy
Spirit. But these wonderful New Testament truths do not alter the biblical predictions of a literal future Temple in Jerusalem.

The question of a future Temple gets more complicated when we realize that the Bible teaches that two temples are yet to stand on the Temple Mount in the future. First will come a Tribulation Temple, followed by a Millennium Temple which will be built when the Lord returns and sets upHis kingdom on this earth. Let's look at the Scriptures dealing with
these two future temples.

Here: Israel's Third and Fourth Temples

Here: Millennial Temple Model of Ezekiel's vision, Third 3rd temples, 40-48 Jesus Israeli Land Holy Portion Jewish Messiah Yahshua [No tribulation temple shown]

Quasar92

Scriptures that prove the Millennial Reign of Jesus Christ on Earth

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