Hurner

visionary said:

Does God not have the power, or does God not have the desire, to save humanity? I'll just leave it with that question. God bless..

It is not a question of power or desire, but principle. God is a God of Principles by which He rules.

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Your statement is askew.

God does have principles and He has power. He has ALL power and is the source of the concept of principles. What your statement implies that principles and power are essentially the same thing. To wit: if God does have the power to save humanity (and we don't know from what), then He must, is bound, to do so.

No, I don't think so. Would you care to re-word the question?

visionary said:

Does God not have the power, or does God not have the desire, to save humanity? I'll just leave it with that question. God bless..

It is not a question of power or desire, but principle. God is a God of Principles by which He rules.

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We are given free will. If God was always intervening, then there would not be consequences for our actions. This world, such as it is, is temporary, because it is a test of our spirit.

visionary said:

and obedience...

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Correct. I have said that is the reason for keeping the Sabbath commandment, and they blow it off as not important.


Matthew 12:8
For the Son of Man is Lord of the Sabbath.”


Mark 2:27
Then he said to them, “The Sabbath was made for man, not man for the Sabbath.


Mark 2:28
So the Son of Man is Lord even of the Sabbath.”


Luke 6:5
Then Yahshua said to them, “The Son of Man is Lord of the Sabbath.”

Man, as in mankind. It does not say the Sabbath was made for the Jew, but mankind. The seventh day is Yahshua’s Sabbath.

visionary said:

Sorry, if my post is not clear. Hurner posted "Does God not have the power, or does God not have the desire, to save humanity? I'll just leave it with that question. God bless."

I was starting a new thread on the concept. To you, I have to ask "if God does have the power to save humanity (and we don't know from what), then He must, is bound, to do so." What makes you think that just because you have power, that you are obligated. Same thing with God, because yes he has the power to save humanity, but is not bound to, except by principles and love.

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Visionary, the Above quotes you post. It is directed to to your statement. Now you seem to try to attribute your statement to me. NO visionary, it it is you who attempted to equate God's power with His Principle.

Trying to make me responsible is telling.

visionary said:

You are not Hurner.

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Define (Hurner?)

Romans 11:25-27
25 I do not want you to be ignorant of this mystery, brothers, so that you will not be conceited: A hardening in part has come to Israel, until the full number of the Gentiles has come in.
26 And so all Israel will be saved, as it is written: "The Deliverer will come from Zion, He will remove godlessness from Jacob.
27 And this is My covenant with them when I take away their sins.”


Song of Solomon 2:4 JPS
He hath brought me to the banqueting-house, And his banner over me is love.
Jeremiah 31:3 JPS
The LORD appeared to him from afar, saying, "I have loved you with an everlasting love; Therefore I have drawn you with loving kindness.
Hosea 11:4 JPS
I drew them with cords of a man, With bands of love; And I was to them as they that take off the yoke on their jaws, And I fed them gently.
Micah 6:8 JPS
It hath been told thee, O man, what is good, And what the LORD doth require of thee: Only to do justly, and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with thy God.
"love mercy" (ahavat chesed)

visionary said:

Does God not have the power, or does God not have the desire, to save humanity? I'll just leave it with that question. God bless..

It is not a question of power or desire, but principle. God is a God of Principles by which He rules.

Click to expand...

You are asking really good questions. It takes a lot of thought to answer.

God is all powerful, but also all loving. He is willing to save the whole world, but not willing to force the whole world to be saved against our wills. Sovereignty exists on a scale. At the extreme end, it becomes Tyranny. God is not a tyrant -- such a God would be a monster, not a God of love. God wants children who love him because we choose to, not who fawn over him because he beats us if we don't.

And so, He reaches out to the whole world with His grace. "For God so loved the world..." "God is not willing that any should perish..." And then he waits for our response.