A question for anyone to answer

Bell122855

Active Member
Sep 30, 2016
28
14
57
RI
✟10,453.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Why do you resent him?
Good question. He lied a lot for the first two years we were married. We dated a year prior to marriage and he lied about a lot of things then as well, only for me to find out soon after. As I confronted him about things I thought I was just being paranoid but after a while and a lot of prayer asking God to show me truth, God started exposing things and things started becoming clear. As I tried to work through things with him he just kept denying and lying over and over. I don't want to get into too much detail but the lies have affected a lot of things. One area is finances. I have literally spent my entire savings I had set aside to start a busies/ministry that I saved for years to cover his debts and irresponsible decisions. Another is, we were looking at buying a farm when we married and he kept dragging his feet and making excuses and I found out he has very bad credit and does not qualify for a loan. Its like he made all these promises of a life we would share together knowing he could not provide but instead of just being honest and working through the issues he chose to cover things up and add a lie upon a lie. He is now starting to work on changing some things but going through this for 2 years has caused me to close up and build resentments. He just wants to erase his mistakes and start over but I am having a difficult time just erasing the hurt and disappointment not to mention he gets defensive when he claims he's going to do something and I question him. I told him it will take a long time for me to rebuilt trust in him because he lied so much. I also resent the fact that he wants to erase the damage he caused to my heart and trust. I know I am suppose to forgive but I cant just erase my feelings.
 
Upvote 0

Deadworm

Well-Known Member
May 26, 2016
1,061
714
76
Colville, WA 99114
✟68,313.00
Faith
Methodist
Marital Status
Single
This is a textbook case for the 2 of you to seek a Christian counselor to assist the reconciliation process. There is an old saying in the pop psychology movement that does have merit: "Change brings permanence; recreation brings disappearance."

Consider the first part of this principle: "Change brings permanence." After long festering mistrust and resentment, your efforts to simply forgive will likely achieve little more than repressing your resentment, so that it remains buried like volcanic lava, ready to erupt at the slightest provocation.

Now the second part of the principle: "recreation brings disappearance." If you and your husbands "recreate" your smoldering hidden resentments with the guidance of a skilled listener (preferably a Christian counselor), the resentment can slowly dissolve and "disappear." Your husband needs to understand that this is just how festering human emotions work and needs to love you enough to seek such a resolution.

This process is similar to the best way to conquer chronic depression. No one can talk you out of your depression. But a skilled friend/ listener can serve as a companion in your journey to help you process your depression by continually expressing it until it loses its hold on you.
 
Upvote 0

Bell122855

Active Member
Sep 30, 2016
28
14
57
RI
✟10,453.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
This is a textbook case for the 2 of you to seek a Christian counselor to assist the reconciliation process. There is an old saying in the pop psychology movement that does have merit: "Change brings permanence; recreation brings disappearance."

Consider the first part of this principle: "Change brings permanence." After long festering mistrust and resentment, your efforts to simply forgive will likely achieve little more than repressing your resentment, so that it remains buried like volcanic lava, ready to erupt at the slightest provocation.

Now the second part of the principle: "recreation brings disappearance." If you and your husbands "recreate" your smoldering hidden resentments with the guidance of a skilled listener (preferably a Christian counselor), the resentment can slowly dissolve and "disappear." Your husband needs to understand that this is just how festering human emotions work and needs to love you enough to seek such a resolution.

This process is similar to the best way to conquer chronic depression. No one can talk you out of your depression. But a skilled friend/ listener can serve as a companion in your journey to help you process your depression by continually expressing it until it loses its hold on you.
Thank you for your reply it is encouraging to me. We tried marriage counseling last year and he was not being genuine and honest in the sessions. She was a Christian counselor and I honestly ended up angry after our 6th session because all she kept focusing on was me and telling me that I need to respect him and I need to forgive him and to get over the past. I kept trying to explain to her that it was not past behavior with him it is current, it was still occurring. I also kept asking why the sessions were all about me and what I need to do yet focusing on his behavior and his lying was not being addressed. I ended up very discouraged. Now, yes, it is a year later and I do see his efforts to change so maybe it is worth trying again. He is seeing a counselor on his own (Christian man) but he comes home constantly telling me how I need to change and get over the past. I do realize this but again, how? I do like your answer to this because at least this approach validates my feeling in the process of healing.
 
Upvote 0

Deadworm

Well-Known Member
May 26, 2016
1,061
714
76
Colville, WA 99114
✟68,313.00
Faith
Methodist
Marital Status
Single
Competent counseling is not a matter of advice and therefore should not feature "shoulds!" it is a matter of skillful listening that empowers you and your spouse to develop your own insights by sharing your experience. Thus, the "shoulds" should be self-generated. Maybe you need a better counselor.

I would thank your husband for his willingness to accept counseling and then add that "make wrong games" are the furthest thing from your mind. Instead, you want counseling because you want to get beyond your supportive wife act and rekindle a mature love that makes it safe for both of you to share honest feelings that might erect barriers to your marriage. I would assure him that this goal is in his best interests because it will allow you to get past your stereotype of the lying husband and instead experience him as the potential masterpiece he might yet become by God's grace.
 
Upvote 0

Larniavc

Leading a blameless life
Jul 14, 2015
12,271
7,626
51
✟312,535.00
Country
United Kingdom
Faith
Atheist
Marital Status
Married
Politics
UK-Liberal-Democrats
Good question. He lied a lot for the first two years we were married. We dated a year prior to marriage and he lied about a lot of things then as well, only for me to find out soon after. As I confronted him about things I thought I was just being paranoid but after a while and a lot of prayer asking God to show me truth, God started exposing things and things started becoming clear. As I tried to work through things with him he just kept denying and lying over and over. I don't want to get into too much detail but the lies have affected a lot of things. One area is finances. I have literally spent my entire savings I had set aside to start a busies/ministry that I saved for years to cover his debts and irresponsible decisions. Another is, we were looking at buying a farm when we married and he kept dragging his feet and making excuses and I found out he has very bad credit and does not qualify for a loan. Its like he made all these promises of a life we would share together knowing he could not provide but instead of just being honest and working through the issues he chose to cover things up and add a lie upon a lie. He is now starting to work on changing some things but going through this for 2 years has caused me to close up and build resentments. He just wants to erase his mistakes and start over but I am having a difficult time just erasing the hurt and disappointment not to mention he gets defensive when he claims he's going to do something and I question him. I told him it will take a long time for me to rebuilt trust in him because he lied so much. I also resent the fact that he wants to erase the damage he caused to my heart and trust. I know I am suppose to forgive but I cant just erase my feelings.
This is just my opinion but there are loads of good people out there who deserve your time more than this fellow seems to.

I'm paraphrasing here but shake the dust from your shoes and find someone better for you.

All the best.
 
Upvote 0

akmom

Newbie
Jun 13, 2012
1,479
338
U.S.
✟23,005.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Libertarian
We're all flawed. If we give up on everyone who disappoints us, we will never have a relationship. Marriage requires commitment. There will plenty of shortcomings of her own, I am sure, in which she will value that commitment and willingness to work through problems.

Her grievances are legitimate, but they are not deal-breakers. She has a husband who wants to work through it, but just doesn't realize what that actually entails. It sounds like she is willing to try also, but needs guidance.
 
Upvote 0

Bell122855

Active Member
Sep 30, 2016
28
14
57
RI
✟10,453.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
We're all flawed. If we give up on everyone who disappoints us, we will never have a relationship. Marriage requires commitment. There will plenty of shortcomings of her own, I am sure, in which she will value that commitment and willingness to work through problems.

Her grievances are legitimate, but they are not deal-breakers. She has a husband who wants to work through it, but just doesn't realize what that actually entails. It sounds like she is willing to try also, but needs guidance.
I am not willing or even considering giving up at this point. I am very dedicated and loyal and I am also very easy going when it comes to other people faults and weaknesses, even with him but I am completely frustrated at this point because it takes two to work it out. Even though he is willing he still won't admit his lies. It seems he just wants to focus on "fixing" me. He told me yesterday his counselor told him that he needs to tell me to stop falsely accusing him. Its not false statements and I am not accusatory in my approach. I used to approach it with compassion willing to just work through it but when he was caught in a lie he still just made excuses. He calls them "reasons" and says they are not excuses. When he lies am I suppose to just turn away and let him lie? I don't believe that is the way to handle this.
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

Gwen-is-new!

The Lord is my rock!
Feb 25, 2016
485
209
United States
✟27,741.00
Faith
Pentecostal
Marital Status
Married
Yes, let him lie. He is/will be accountable to God. In his mind, he is "justifying" what you call lies. Staying frustrated until he "admits" it's a lie is a waste of your time and energy and doesn't glorify the Lord.

Bell - sometimes men just need a few years to grow up. I'm sorry that's marriage - growing up and maturing together. Focusing on each others strengths and enduring (compensating for) each others weaknesses.

I'm guessing the Christian counselor focused on you because we can't change our husbands, or anybody for that matter.

You will have so much more peace (assuming you want it) if you focus on your relationship with the Lord, and trust Him to change/convict your husband. Pray pray and pray some more.
 
Upvote 0

dayhiker

Mature veteran
Sep 13, 2006
15,557
5,287
MA
✟220,067.00
Faith
Charismatic
Marital Status
In Relationship
Politics
US-Others
Hi Bell .... From what you said I believe you are justified to have the feelings you have.

I think it would be good to understand what he lied/lies so much. Something was going on in his youth I'm guessing. This can be a source for compassion.
Be sure to compliment him when you see him making an effort to correct his faults. You want him to know that the work he is doing is appreciated.
Personal growth takes time. We don't usually change core parts of our behavior/personality very quickly.

Might be good to find a small project that you both can work on together that tests each of you, you with your trust and him with the money and truthfulness.
 
Upvote 0

Bell122855

Active Member
Sep 30, 2016
28
14
57
RI
✟10,453.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Hi Bell .... From what you said I believe you are justified to have the feelings you have.

I think it would be good to understand what he lied/lies so much. Something was going on in his youth I'm guessing. This can be a source for compassion.
Be sure to compliment him when you see him making an effort to correct his faults. You want him to know that the work he is doing is appreciated.
Personal growth takes time. We don't usually change core parts of our behavior/personality very quickly.

Might be good to find a small project that you both can work on together that tests each of you, you with your trust and him with the money and truthfulness.
Thank you for your reply. While I do agree with everything your saying I find myself wondering why it always has to fall on me to understand, show compassion, encourage, build up and so on. I don't mean to sound selfish but I am drowning in my own mental and emotional struggles and I don't feel like anyone, (counselors, our pastor) seem to acknowledge this. I reach out for help and all I get is..."He's a good guy", "Don't be so hard on him", "Its just a guy thing" and so on. However, living with someone who has violated your trust is heart wrenching to say the least. Avoiding conversations because you just don't want another excuse about why we are broke and have no money for food till next pay check because he financially irresponsible. Just trying to live life and survive can be a struggle. Dealing with a defensive attitude when you do ask a question then being told you have an attitude. I'm just venting but when does it end? When do I get some relief? I never lied to this man. I did exactly what I said I would do before we married and I disclosed more to him than I have with anyone except God! At first I blamed myself, thought I was going crazy but truth is truth. When does the focus on what I need to do change to what HE needs to do? Or does it? Just venting.
 
Upvote 0

dayhiker

Mature veteran
Sep 13, 2006
15,557
5,287
MA
✟220,067.00
Faith
Charismatic
Marital Status
In Relationship
Politics
US-Others
Thank you for your reply. While I do agree with everything your saying I find myself wondering why it always has to fall on me to understand, show compassion, encourage, build up and so on. I don't mean to sound selfish but I am drowning in my own mental and emotional struggles and I don't feel like anyone, (counselors, our pastor) seem to acknowledge this. I reach out for help and all I get is..."He's a good guy", "Don't be so hard on him", "Its just a guy thing" and so on. However, living with someone who has violated your trust is heart wrenching to say the least. Avoiding conversations because you just don't want another excuse about why we are broke and have no money for food till next pay check because he financially irresponsible. Just trying to live life and survive can be a struggle. Dealing with a defensive attitude when you do ask a question then being told you have an attitude. I'm just venting but when does it end? When do I get some relief? I never lied to this man. I did exactly what I said I would do before we married and I disclosed more to him than I have with anyone except God! At first I blamed myself, thought I was going crazy but truth is truth. When does the focus on what I need to do change to what HE needs to do? Or does it? Just venting.

My thought on you understanding him and then being able to show compassion has nothing to do with accepting his lies and bad decisions in my book. Its just a way to have compassion for him. He is not a good guy by lying and not spending money wisely. As you say the councilors aren't supporting you then I'd say go find another one till you find one who will support you. Who will give you techniques on how to stand up for yourself.
I don't think anything you desire in this situation is selfish. Your situation shows how one can't live in a world of lies and be sane.
In what ways in he financially irresponsible? So far you have kept this discussion on the concept level. Knowing something of what he is doing might help us understand. Has any thought been giving to having his paycheck deposited in the bank and only you having the say over the money. He get an allowance.
Personally I welcome venting. I think it is good to announce at the top of the vent so people that get triggered by a vent can not read it.

Do you have children? Do you work and have your own money? If so is he blowing your money as well?
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

akmom

Newbie
Jun 13, 2012
1,479
338
U.S.
✟23,005.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Libertarian
Perhaps you could remove some of his opportunities to disappoint you. If his big shortcoming is spending, then separate your accounts. Don't give him any discretionary money. Don't bail him out of his debts and don't put him on the title for anything of value that is yours. If he constantly lies, then stop depending on his statements. Go look it up for yourself every single time you make an inquiry, until he realizes he is going to be held accountable for what he says.

I don't mean to invalidate you or suggest that men just behave this way sometimes. But they do. My husband just used to say whatever I wanted to hear, and I was used to just taking people at face value, because that's how I am. I just give a correct answer. I'm not trying to impress anyone. So I kept forgetting he didn't do that. I'd ask if the dishes were clean and he'd say yes, perhaps intending to get it done soon, or perhaps he just didn't care about my future reaction when I found them to be dirty. Who knows? But I learned to stop assuming they were clean just because he said so, and I got in the habit of checking them myself. Asking him anything was just for the sake of conversation, not something I relied on. I don't call him out on it anymore... causes too much hostility. Besides, he doesn't do that so much any more. He outgrew it. But every now and then I'll ask him if he remembered to do such-and-such, and he'll say yes, and then I'll realize... "Wait. He would have mentioned it already if he cleaned the chimney. I bet he didn't." So I check and sure enough... he cleaned the chimney five years ago, sure. But I'm not relying on his answer. I'll quietly do it myself later. (Then brag about it.)
 
Upvote 0

Bell122855

Active Member
Sep 30, 2016
28
14
57
RI
✟10,453.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Bell - does the venting help? Does focusing on how you have been wronged give you peace?
The venting helps me get it off my chest because I don't talk to anyone, especially family because i don't want anyone forming a negative perception of him. I truly believe deep inside that God will heal all this and then use it for His glory. However, venting is not enough. I need encouragement and answers to help me stay focused on the positives and leave the negatives behind. Focusing on how I been wronged does not bring peace at all...quite the opposite to be honest but I have to face the wrongs to move on and heal and also somehow find a way to manage my sanity and my life because fact is, he lies and he does not communicate AT ALL which causes more lies and distrust. I guess if I did not desire a close relationship with my husband it wouldn't matter but I do desire it. However, it is near impossible to be intimate and close with someone who is dishonest. It feel more like a constant violation.
 
Upvote 0

Bell122855

Active Member
Sep 30, 2016
28
14
57
RI
✟10,453.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Perhaps you could remove some of his opportunities to disappoint you. If his big shortcoming is spending, then separate your accounts. Don't give him any discretionary money. Don't bail him out of his debts and don't put him on the title for anything of value that is yours. If he constantly lies, then stop depending on his statements. Go look it up for yourself every single time you make an inquiry, until he realizes he is going to be held accountable for what he says.

I don't mean to invalidate you or suggest that men just behave this way sometimes. But they do. My husband just used to say whatever I wanted to hear, and I was used to just taking people at face value, because that's how I am. I just give a correct answer. I'm not trying to impress anyone. So I kept forgetting he didn't do that. I'd ask if the dishes were clean and he'd say yes, perhaps intending to get it done soon, or perhaps he just didn't care about my future reaction when I found them to be dirty. Who knows? But I learned to stop assuming they were clean just because he said so, and I got in the habit of checking them myself. Asking him anything was just for the sake of conversation, not something I relied on. I don't call him out on it anymore... causes too much hostility. Besides, he doesn't do that so much any more. He outgrew it. But every now and then I'll ask him if he remembered to do such-and-such, and he'll say yes, and then I'll realize... "Wait. He would have mentioned it already if he cleaned the chimney. I bet he didn't." So I check and sure enough... he cleaned the chimney five years ago, sure. But I'm not relying on his answer. I'll quietly do it myself later. (Then brag about it.)
Good advice and I am glad to hear I am not alone. I do have a separate account and I stopped bailing him out. I gave him money to buy a used car back in august because he didn't take care of his jeep and the engine blew but...it was either give him money for a car, drive him to work ,or let him take mine. I feel like I am placed in difficult positions. I wish we could just pool all our resources together but I don't trust him. My Mom gave him 500 bucks to put toward repairs on the car I bought him and he spent it on other things so he drove around with bad struts for 4 months which caused other problems and now not only does he need struts but the sway bar is broke as well. This is a prime example of the things he does. Its not even that he spent the 500 on bad things. He looked at it as extra in the account so when I asked him what the heck he spent it on (Because the car wasn't getting fixed and he said he had to save for it, keep in mind his credit is so poor he cant even get approved for a credit card and the one he still owes money on cut him off from using it) it was things like taking me out to eat, buying pizza on friday night, things like that...and...when I question if we have the extra for this stuff as well as ask if all the bills are paid he says yes, I don't find out till later that he lied so I no longer let him take me out unless I see everything is paid. Here is another example. I asked him for the tax info so I can get the taxes done, well, he failed to change his address from one state to another when we married two years ago so they took taxes out all last year for the other state. Instead of telling me this, he lied and said HR messed up and he's waiting for them to fix it so he can get his W2's. Then, when I questioned it (I think he forgot I worked in HR for almost 20 year) his answer made NO sense so I kept asking questions until I realized he must be lying because I don't always think he's lying, but I have learned to pick up on these kinds of situations. Long story short, I just let it go because it was his error but once again he refused to admit it. I just asked him to give me the stuff when he gets it. SO, he brings it home, doesn't tell me, places it on top of a pile of stuff on the counter, still doesn't tell me he brought it home. 4 days later I ask again and he tells me he put it on the counter 4 days ago and assumed I saw it. I don't understand this line of thinking, why wouldn't he just say, "Hey it on the counter"? This is constant with him and there is no rationalizing it with him, just excuses so I stopped trying to rationalize for my own sanity. As far as separating accounts and only giving him descetionary money...he controls the account, he pays the bills, I don't even have a card to access that account. He says its his responsibility to manage it. I gave up trying to help. I also, like you gave up assuming he will do what he says, I just do it now and he gets upset now because I don't ask him to do anything. I cant win lol...I just need to emotionally survive until things change. I am encouraged that your husband changed, that gives me hope
 
Upvote 0

Bell122855

Active Member
Sep 30, 2016
28
14
57
RI
✟10,453.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
My thought on you understanding him and then being able to show compassion has nothing to do with accepting his lies and bad decisions in my book. Its just a way to have compassion for him. He is not a good guy by lying and not spending money wisely. As you say the councilors aren't supporting you then I'd say go find another one till you find one who will support you. Who will give you techniques on how to stand up for yourself.
I don't think anything you desire in this situation is selfish. Your situation shows how one can't live in a world of lies and be sane.
In what ways in he financially irresponsible? So far you have kept this discussion on the concept level. Knowing something of what he is doing might help us understand. Has any thought been giving to having his paycheck deposited in the bank and only you having the say over the money. He get an allowance.
Personally I welcome venting. I think it is good to announce at the top of the vent so people that get triggered by a vent can not read it.

Do you have children? Do you work and have your own money? If so is he blowing your money as well?
Hi, Thank you for your reply. We tried allowing me to manage the money because it happens to be a strength of mine. i did it for almost three months and not only were all the bills paid on time, I managed to place a decent amount into savings. That didn't last long, he took it all back. he feels it is his responsibility as the man in the house to take care of all that and he said he will never improve or learn unless he does. He has done a little better. We no longer get threatened by our landlord for being late on rent. I guess thats progress. He also started working a second job to pay off his outstanding debt he failed to disclose prior to marriage. He should have it paid off by now but he doesn't because he just poorly manages money but he has made a dent in it. We don't have children. My deeper issue is the deeper issue with him, his heart. I spoke mostly about finances because it has a serious effect on our livelihood but there are other issues. I started to notice after we married the way he looks at other women. Its not just a normal look like most guys, it a look, then another look then another and sometimes a long stare where if you watch his eyes you know quite obviously where his eyes are going. I am by far an insecure jealous woman but this was really bothering me. This so called man of God desiring to live righteously, criticizing other men for things like this and building himself up to be more genuine and pure. he lied when I talked to him about it. Continued to lie, continued to do it. then, when it really stared to bother me he started walking behind me or looking when he thought I wasn't looking and I would catch him doing it anyway. He lied so much and it became so uncomfortable I stopped going anywhere with him. I also just stopped addressing it and decided to just give it over to God. One time we were at a church luncheon and this missionary, older man came and sat next to us. We never met him prior to this. After introductions the man looks at my husband and says, I have this problem that I have had all my life. I started reading this book called, 'every mans battle', it's teaching me how to bounce my eyes when I feel tempted to look at other women. Its a struggle for me and its a real problem as a Christian man trying to honor God and honor my wife". I was floored!! But I took advantage and asked the man some questions. I asked of the book was helping. He told me yes and no. Yes because it works but no because I still look but obviously I don't want to change bad enough to stop. So my husband got the book. It helped but...he obviously doesn't want to change or stop bad enough. All these things just create such distrust in my heart that i had to just give it all to God because if he lies this much even when he's caught what else is he capable of doing? I just want and pray that he will allow God to enter those places inside his heart to truly and deeply transform him. I have hope but I just pray that hope can hold on until change happens.
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

Bell122855

Active Member
Sep 30, 2016
28
14
57
RI
✟10,453.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Yes, let him lie. He is/will be accountable to God. In his mind, he is "justifying" what you call lies. Staying frustrated until he "admits" it's a lie is a waste of your time and energy and doesn't glorify the Lord.

Bell - sometimes men just need a few years to grow up. I'm sorry that's marriage - growing up and maturing together. Focusing on each others strengths and enduring (compensating for) each others weaknesses.

I'm guessing the Christian counselor focused on you because we can't change our husbands, or anybody for that matter.

You will have so much more peace (assuming you want it) if you focus on your relationship with the Lord, and trust Him to change/convict your husband. Pray pray and pray some more.
Thank you, I agree and have to come to the place where it truly is just a waste of my time, energy and emotions because he has such a difficult time admitting it.
 
Upvote 0