Does God live inside our observable universe?
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John Hyperspace
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I don't believe so. See, our observable universe is the material universe. But God is immaterial; God lives in the abstract universe; the realm of thought and idea: consciousness. God is consciousness. He lives in your mind. That's why David said, everywhere I go, there You are. We have two realities: empirical, and, abstract. I presume you know the difference between the two. Now the scripture uses words like "earthly/carnal/sensual" to describe empirical, and it uses the words "heavenly/spiritual" to describe abstract.
The problem is that people are locked into carnal/earthly/sensual comprehension of heavenly things. So when they think of "heaven" and "spirit" and "God" they think of, like a secondary carnal place. They think heaven is an empirical place, that spirits are like, carnal beings that fly around, that God is this, flesh man who sits on a earthly throne like they could walk up to God and touch him. But God is spirit; immaterial; conscious idea. The kingdom of heaven isn't a carnal, earth-like place; it is an abstract idea. That is why Jesus said, the kingdom of heaven doesn't come with observation; neither do they say, lo, here, or, lo, there.
But people can't comprehend that He is speaking of abstract, immaterial things. They're all locked into the dominance of earthly understanding - beastly understanding. What is the difference between a man and a beast? A beast can't comprehend abstractions. All they know is the sensual world: what the see and hear and taste and smell. That is their world. Pure carnality, pure sensuality. The bible calls it "devilish" (James 3:15), you see that? "Earthly" "sensual" "devilish" aka "empirical": but the man can comprehend abstractions, he can discern things of the spirit- that is, unless his mind is mastered by the mind of the world, and all he can do is read the Word of God and think it's talking about earthly things. This is why we get people reading the Revelation and all they can comprehend is, earthly things: it's a meteor! It's a microchip! It's all earthly and carnal! But it's not: it's abstract. It is a revelation of understanding.
But men are locked into earthly, sensual, devilish understanding. They think there is a secondary carnal realm called "heaven" where people fly around with wings, and there is this place under the ground with sensual fire, and little men with horns, and it is all so laughable. It's like, from the mind of children. This is why Paul talked about the "natural man" not being able to comprehend the "things of God" (1 Corinthians 2:14) and why "religion" of men is an earthly thing, earthly rituals done in earthly buildings, preaching carnal commandments and all manner of cartoonish understanding. That's what it means to "overcome the world" it means to overcome the worldly understanding: to move from thinking "born again" means crawling into your mother's womb, to move from thinking "living water" needs a bucket to be drawn; to perceive beyond the material world, to apprehend the immaterial.
But, I'm going on. No, I believe God does not live in the observable universe. He lives in our heart and mind, and He gets in there by the WORD: Romans 10:6-8
The problem is that people are locked into carnal/earthly/sensual comprehension of heavenly things. So when they think of "heaven" and "spirit" and "God" they think of, like a secondary carnal place. They think heaven is an empirical place, that spirits are like, carnal beings that fly around, that God is this, flesh man who sits on a earthly throne like they could walk up to God and touch him. But God is spirit; immaterial; conscious idea. The kingdom of heaven isn't a carnal, earth-like place; it is an abstract idea. That is why Jesus said, the kingdom of heaven doesn't come with observation; neither do they say, lo, here, or, lo, there.
But people can't comprehend that He is speaking of abstract, immaterial things. They're all locked into the dominance of earthly understanding - beastly understanding. What is the difference between a man and a beast? A beast can't comprehend abstractions. All they know is the sensual world: what the see and hear and taste and smell. That is their world. Pure carnality, pure sensuality. The bible calls it "devilish" (James 3:15), you see that? "Earthly" "sensual" "devilish" aka "empirical": but the man can comprehend abstractions, he can discern things of the spirit- that is, unless his mind is mastered by the mind of the world, and all he can do is read the Word of God and think it's talking about earthly things. This is why we get people reading the Revelation and all they can comprehend is, earthly things: it's a meteor! It's a microchip! It's all earthly and carnal! But it's not: it's abstract. It is a revelation of understanding.
But men are locked into earthly, sensual, devilish understanding. They think there is a secondary carnal realm called "heaven" where people fly around with wings, and there is this place under the ground with sensual fire, and little men with horns, and it is all so laughable. It's like, from the mind of children. This is why Paul talked about the "natural man" not being able to comprehend the "things of God" (1 Corinthians 2:14) and why "religion" of men is an earthly thing, earthly rituals done in earthly buildings, preaching carnal commandments and all manner of cartoonish understanding. That's what it means to "overcome the world" it means to overcome the worldly understanding: to move from thinking "born again" means crawling into your mother's womb, to move from thinking "living water" needs a bucket to be drawn; to perceive beyond the material world, to apprehend the immaterial.
But, I'm going on. No, I believe God does not live in the observable universe. He lives in our heart and mind, and He gets in there by the WORD: Romans 10:6-8
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JESUS=G.O.A.T
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This is a good question with to me an simple answer. IF god is outside the strands of time, then he isn't contained in an universe. Sure you can argue his pretense is everywhere but to suggest he's confined to the universe is no.
Now if you're a oneness guy like myself JESUS=God manifesting himself in time JESUS is described as the self expression of the deity we seek (just using as an example to point out something)
Sure he can manifest his glory on Earth but he's not restrained in any form or fashion. Time is simply really something that God made for us to keep track of our days, and so he could manifest his glory to us in time.
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Lazarus Short
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The Creator is not contained in His creation.
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Paul called it the third heaven in 2 Corinthians 12:2
Also,
How could the universe be created from within. Within means already there. So, clearly, God the creator. Doesn't live within our observable universe.
Scripture make it clear, He does have the ability to operate inside it.
There was no TIME or MATTER when He gave the command "LIGHT BE".
The fact He exists in a dimension outside of time.
Answers a much asked question. Who created God?
Only within the confines of TIME is a beginning or an end necessary. Maranatha
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Sure, He is immanent. He is also transcendent (though He is present within it, He cannot be contained by His own creation as He precedes it .. as LS already mentioned above). God is "omnipresent", meaning that 100% of Him is present in all places and at all times simultaneously.
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I just spoke to that.
1st heaven, where birds & plains fly.
2nd heaven, the stars-galaxies our universe.
And the 3rd heaven, that Paul spoke of beyond our universe in another realm/dimension.
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NothingIsImpossible
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Yes and no. You know how sci-fi stuff like to talk about other "dimensions". Ones that are everywhere but unseeable to us? Think of God like that. He is everywhere. Inside and outside the universe. He is big.... well He is infinite. One example I was always taught was the angels for example are always fighting demons around us. Now not sure if that was meant literal or not. But I take it as literal in my mind.
My mind still can't wait to see God after I die. I will be able to see Him, even though He is everywhere. Doesn't make sense to my human mind. But I am ok with that. There are things beyond my understand since we are limited in our thinking.
My mind still can't wait to see God after I die. I will be able to see Him, even though He is everywhere. Doesn't make sense to my human mind. But I am ok with that. There are things beyond my understand since we are limited in our thinking.
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geiroffenberg
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what a great question.
Thre are layers to this truth though.
At first we see god in heaven and us on earth, so we seperate it and pray to a god fara way sort of.
But then we realize god is omnipresent, so we start to acknoledge he is at hand, right here right now.
Then when we concider creation we find he can not psosible be here because of all the evil.
But then we concider that god is the very word that creted and uphold all of creation so he by defition must not only be herem but he IS the very substance of existance that everything is made up from!!
So how do we reconcile the fact that an good omnipresent perfect god is here, while the world is so evil..
Becuase what we see around us is not reality, its jsut a proejction of what we sense with our carnal senses. All evil does not really exist "out there", jesus said all evil comes form the heart of men, not what comes into us that is evil, it is waht comes out of us.
So gods realm is omnirespent and perfect and he is DEFINITLY here, because he wouldnt be the omnipresent "i am" if he wasnt. But the realm we see, the fallen realm of good and evil, is not actually a creation, it is a projection from human minds.
You can prove it simply by concidering colors. Everything around us we see is color, but colors doesnt actually exist, becuase its just energy waves coming to our eyes in different frequencies, then thre different kinds of cells in the eye react to that energy, and our brains and bodies MAKES up a world of color that is projected out there. ITs what indian philisophy always have called maya, which is a illusion, its there, but it is not what it seems
IN THAT REALM, the world we project, god definitly is not, its not even real.
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geiroffenberg
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Third heaven we know is the dimension of god so to speak, since paul basically says it, but remember he didnt know if he was in the body our out of it, so in that sense he is talking about that dimension that IS HERE, but just invisible to the carnal senses. It is the same as jesus said in his gospel "tke kingdom of god IS at hand" and "IS within you" meaning, it is here, now and available.
SO the workd we see is the first heaven, what we wrgonly call creation sometimes, since its jsut a fraction of what actually exist, and the second heaven is that plane of good and evil that our fallen minds give life. It did not have any power until adam ate of that tree, and it will have no power when humanity repents out of it.
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Brothers and Sisters:
This is one of the few themes, where modern science might help.
* According do String-Theory, our Universe is not unique. There are lots of them. According to our faith all of them were created by our God.
* The supreme String Universe, where the strings are and all of universes, also contains tructure called "Multidimensional (more then two) Membranes". If two of them collide, one of both will grow upt infinetely. That is what we call a "Big Bang", the birth of another new universe.
If this were true, String Universe, is a Creator.
* Limiting natural laws, like light speed and all the others are created in the beginnig of Big Bang. So they do not exist before and String Universe is not limited by them.
So String Universe is allmighty.
* Scientists consider the system of the strings intelligent.
So String Universe has to be intelligent, too.
If anybody considers String Universe also to have awareness and emotion, String Universe would be God Himself.
String Universe is simultaneously within our Universe and outside, too.
So God is simultaneously inside and outside of the obervabla world.
Bless you all, in the Name of Jesus Christ: Toivo
This is one of the few themes, where modern science might help.
* According do String-Theory, our Universe is not unique. There are lots of them. According to our faith all of them were created by our God.
* The supreme String Universe, where the strings are and all of universes, also contains tructure called "Multidimensional (more then two) Membranes". If two of them collide, one of both will grow upt infinetely. That is what we call a "Big Bang", the birth of another new universe.
If this were true, String Universe, is a Creator.
* Limiting natural laws, like light speed and all the others are created in the beginnig of Big Bang. So they do not exist before and String Universe is not limited by them.
So String Universe is allmighty.
* Scientists consider the system of the strings intelligent.
So String Universe has to be intelligent, too.
If anybody considers String Universe also to have awareness and emotion, String Universe would be God Himself.
String Universe is simultaneously within our Universe and outside, too.
So God is simultaneously inside and outside of the obervabla world.
Bless you all, in the Name of Jesus Christ: Toivo
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Mark L. Pavlot
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Jeremiah 23:23-24King James Version (KJV)
23 Am I a God at hand, saith the Lord, and not a God afar off?
24 Can any hide himself in secret places that I shall not see him? saith the Lord. Do not I fill heaven and earth? saith the Lord.
Psalm 139:7 Whither shall I go from thy spirit? or whither shall I flee from thy presence?
8 If I ascend up into heaven, thou art there: if I make my bed in hell, behold, thou art there.
9 If I take the wings of the morning and dwell in the uttermost parts of the sea;
10 Even there shall thy hand lead me, and thy right hand shall hold me.
11 If I say, Surely the darkness shall cover me; even the night shall be light about me.
12 Yea, the darkness hideth not from thee; but the night shineth as the day: the darkness and the light are both alike to thee.
King James Version (KJV)
23 Am I a God at hand, saith the Lord, and not a God afar off?
24 Can any hide himself in secret places that I shall not see him? saith the Lord. Do not I fill heaven and earth? saith the Lord.
Psalm 139:7 Whither shall I go from thy spirit? or whither shall I flee from thy presence?
8 If I ascend up into heaven, thou art there: if I make my bed in hell, behold, thou art there.
9 If I take the wings of the morning and dwell in the uttermost parts of the sea;
10 Even there shall thy hand lead me, and thy right hand shall hold me.
11 If I say, Surely the darkness shall cover me; even the night shall be light about me.
12 Yea, the darkness hideth not from thee; but the night shineth as the day: the darkness and the light are both alike to thee.
King James Version (KJV)
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Mark L. Pavlot
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John 14:9-11 New King James Version (NKJV)
9 Jesus said to him, “Have I been with you so long, and yet you have not known Me, Philip? He who has seen Me has seen the Father; so how can you say, ‘Show us the Father’? 10 Do you not believe that I am in the Father and the Father in Me? The words that I speak to you I do not speak on My own authority, but the Father who dwells in Me does the works. 11 Believe Me that I am in the Father and the Father in Me, or else believe Me for the sake of the works themselves.
If you would just stay in God's Word your dialogue might have better results...
9 Jesus said to him, “Have I been with you so long, and yet you have not known Me, Philip? He who has seen Me has seen the Father; so how can you say, ‘Show us the Father’? 10 Do you not believe that I am in the Father and the Father in Me? The words that I speak to you I do not speak on My own authority, but the Father who dwells in Me does the works. 11 Believe Me that I am in the Father and the Father in Me, or else believe Me for the sake of the works themselves.
If you would just stay in God's Word your dialogue might have better results...
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