Major1

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Nobody has the mark of the beast yet.
No one gets this mark till after the beast is exposed on the earth.
V7 , all people worshipping the beast and the war against the saints and him being allowed to overcome the saints has not yet happened. This will be for a time of 42 months.
None of these verses have had fulfillment yet, so then there is no mark of the beast yet you could get.
These events are not done in SECRET, they are extremely public to the world.

Revelation 13New King James Version (NKJV)
The Beast from the Sea
13 Then I stood on the sand of the sea. And I saw a beast rising up out of the sea, having seven heads and ten horns, and on his horns ten crowns, and on his heads a blasphemous name. 2 Now the beast which I saw was like a leopard, his feet were like the feet of a bear, and his mouth like the mouth of a lion. The dragon gave him his power, his throne, and great authority. 3 And I saw one of his heads as if it had been mortally wounded, and his deadly wound was healed. And all the world marveled and followed the beast. 4 So they worshiped the dragon who gave authority to the beast; and they worshiped the beast, saying, “Who is like the beast? Who is able to make war with him?”

5 And he was given a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies, and he was given authority to continue for forty-two months. 6 Then he opened his mouth in blasphemy against God, to blaspheme His name, His tabernacle, and those who dwell in heaven. 7 It was granted to him to make war with the saints and to overcome them. And authority was given him over every tribe,tongue, and nation. 8 All who dwell on the earth will worship him, whose names have not been written in the Book of Life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.

9 If anyone has an ear, let him hear. 10 He who leads into captivity shall go into captivity; he who kills with the sword must be killed with the sword. Here is the patience and the faith of the saints.


The Beast from the Earth
11 Then I saw another beast coming up out of the earth, and he had two horns like a lamb and spoke like a dragon. 12 And he exercises all the authority of the first beast in his presence, and causes the earth and those who dwell in it to worship the first beast, whose deadly wound was healed. 13 He performs great signs, so that he even makes fire come down from heaven on the earth in the sight of men. 14 And he deceives those who dwell on the earth by those signs which he was granted to do in the sight of the beast, telling those who dwell on the earth to make an image to the beast who was wounded by the sword and lived. 15 He was granted power to give breath to the image of the beast, that the image of the beast should both speak and cause as many as would not worship the image of the beast to be killed. 16 He causes all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and slave, to receive a mark on their right hand or on their foreheads, 17 and that no one may buy or sell except one who has the mark or the name of the beast, or the number of his name.

18 Here is wisdom. Let him who has understanding calculate the number of the beast, for it is the number of a man: His number is666.

Agreed.
 
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eartheart

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You will either get the mark of the beast or the mark of God, its simple, you either have God on your mind or mankind, you cant have both because one will love more than the other. Hope this eases your mind, as this has once worried mine.

Sent from my LGLS665 using Tapatalk
 
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Major1

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You will either get the mark of the beast or the mark of God, its simple, you either have God on your mind or mankind, you cant have both because one will love more than the other. Hope this eases your mind, as this has once worried mine.

Sent from my LGLS665 using Tapatalk

I was not worried my dear friend.

You may very well be correct but in my understanding the mark is going to be a "Literal" mark on those who accept and follow the A/C.

The original Greek word for this mark is "Charagma." It is a word used to describe an image, a stamp, a brand or some other identifying mark but it is not used to describe a "feeling".


That is Greek grammar and it can not be changed. It is what it is whether we like it or not.

Me being a "Literalist" believe that the mark is exactly what it says it is. Some kind of identifying stamp or tattoo that tells the world that that person is following the A/C and that mark allow him to buy food and survive.
 
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Alawishis

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How can that be an insult? The Apostle Paul coined the phrase.

I guess I just didn't understand what you meant by it. I think Paul was referring to new Christians who didn't yet have a lot of experience in the faith if that's the reference you were making.
 
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masmpg

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Like I said at first, I'm paranoid. I want to be 100% sure i don't get this mark. I'm afraid because I read this post of someone theorising about how the devil will speak to people to deceive them and it popped into my head "that sounds nice" because I was looking at the part about people going to heaven and eternal bliss then I realised it was SATAN'S eternal bliss and saying he could overthrow God and I'm scared I don't support the devil I just got misled for a second.

One way you can be certain not to receive the Mark of the beast is by studying to show yourself approved unto God. Forget everything you have ever learned in church and open you bible and read and pray over every verse, not moving on to the next verse until you are certain that the Comforter, whom Jesus promised will guide you into all truth (John 14:26 & 16:13) does just that. The Comforter will do exactly what Jesus promised He would do but it takes the faith that knows, not just believes. Far too many settle for some belief system which amounts to nothing more than saying a few words and doing nothing to show that the even understand what they are professing.

I will say this, the "mark of the beast" has little to do with technology and computers and such, but has everything to do with WORSHIP John wrote "if ANY man WORSHIP. . ." (revelation 14:9) This is a matter of earnest prayer. Prayer like Jesus did in Gethsemane for you when He sweat blood. Have you ever prayed that much? Before and during the time of the mark of the beast God's people will be tried more then ever. A good word study is the word deceive. Whenever you hear Jesus or any bible authors use that word it means pay close attention. In Matthew 24 when the disciples asked Jesus when will these things be, speaking about the end of the world, the first words out of Jesus mouth were "TAKE HEED THAT NO MAN DECEIVE YOU". This is probably the most important place to pay attention in the whole bible. All denominations are teaching things that the beast is promoting, like the ecumenical unity which every denomination is taking part in. All uniting with the catholic church is one of the biggest deceptions satan has fooled Christianity with. The leaders of every mainstream protestant denomination have joined back with the mother church and have signed a unity agreement in the past. So like the faithful bereans of acts 17:10&11 we must not take anybody's word for anything, especially these days, but we must study it out, even what I wrote here!
 
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masmpg

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Well then its literal, but only those who get it will know, not the ones who dont. Catch 22

The mark of the beast is literal but not necessarily physical. The mark IN represents deciding to do. IN our forehead represents making a conscientious decision, and IN our right hand represents carrying out that decision by obeying the beast and his image. It must be a conscientious decision. The biggest warning that should be yelled from rooftops is "if anyone tries to force us to do what the bible states, like worship on a certain day, or follow some sort of moral standard or else be punished by the civil authorities, that is not biblical".
 
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Major1

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One way you can be certain not to receive the Mark of the beast is by studying to show yourself approved unto God. Forget everything you have ever learned in church and open you bible and read and pray over every verse, not moving on to the next verse until you are certain that the Comforter, whom Jesus promised will guide you into all truth (John 14:26 & 16:13) does just that. The Comforter will do exactly what Jesus promised He would do but it takes the faith that knows, not just believes. Far too many settle for some belief system which amounts to nothing more than saying a few words and doing nothing to show that the even understand what they are professing.

I will say this, the "mark of the beast" has little to do with technology and computers and such, but has everything to do with WORSHIP John wrote "if ANY man WORSHIP. . ." (revelation 14:9) This is a matter of earnest prayer. Prayer like Jesus did in Gethsemane for you when He sweat blood. Have you ever prayed that much? Before and during the time of the mark of the beast God's people will be tried more then ever. A good word study is the word deceive. Whenever you hear Jesus or any bible authors use that word it means pay close attention. In Matthew 24 when the disciples asked Jesus when will these things be, speaking about the end of the world, the first words out of Jesus mouth were "TAKE HEED THAT NO MAN DECEIVE YOU". This is probably the most important place to pay attention in the whole bible. All denominations are teaching things that the beast is promoting, like the ecumenical unity which every denomination is taking part in. All uniting with the catholic church is one of the biggest deceptions satan has fooled Christianity with. The leaders of every mainstream protestant denomination have joined back with the mother church and have signed a unity agreement in the past. So like the faithful bereans of acts 17:10&11 we must not take anybody's word for anything, especially these days, but we must study it out, even what I wrote here!

The very best way to miss the mark of the beast is to be saved today. Accept the Lord Jesus Christ and when He comes for the believers in the Rapture, BOOM! You are out of here.

Then the A/C will be known and his right hand man, the false prophet will cause men to accept the literal mark of allegiance to him.
 
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Major1

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The mark of the beast is literal but not necessarily physical. The mark IN represents deciding to do. IN our forehead represents making a conscientious decision, and IN our right hand represents carrying out that decision by obeying the beast and his image. It must be a conscientious decision. The biggest warning that should be yelled from rooftops is "if anyone tries to force us to do what the bible states, like worship on a certain day, or follow some sort of moral standard or else be punished by the civil authorities, that is not biblical".

No disrespect offered here but you are reading into the Scriptures what YOU want them to say my friend.

The Greek word for "mark" in Rev. 13:16-17 is "CHARAGMA". It literally means......Stamp or image and brand.

Again.....that is Greek grammar and it can not be changed to fit our thinking or wants or wishes.

You need to understand that everyone left after the Rapture will be LOST except 144 K Jewish men.

There is not going to be a world wide revolt because we think that millions of righteous people will overturn the A/C. There will not be any righteous neither will there be a revolt. The A/C will track down the 144 K believers and those who accept Christ through their witness and most will be killed.

The WORLD will have no problem taking the mark of their new ruler. The World will do it just as did the Germans when Hitler brought out the Swastikas.
 
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Major1

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Well then its literal, but only those who get it will know, not the ones who dont. Catch 22

Sent from my LGLS665 using Tapatalk

Of course not. The ones who do not accept will be running for their lives because they do not have the mark.

Only unbelievers will take the mark.
 
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Blade

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Dear DeerGlow...

We seem to always here about the MARK 666 huh? 1st.. its not 666. Well it was not written in English. Its 600,60,6. Each number means something. Then some scrolls show it as 600,16,6. But.. DONT get stuck here.

Well ANY chip now is just a chip no more no less. See what happens BEFORE the mark? Yeah that HAS to happen 1st. That is.. did you see a beast come to life? No.. and when it comes to life.. even at that very day.. not one person on the whole earth has a mark. Cant.. that beast comands the WORLD to bow down and worship it. If you/they do not you die. So if ANYONE bows down and worships the beast they are lost forever.. mark or no mark. That is written.

And if you didnt bow down..your dead. THEN after ALL bow down and worship the beast they then take is mark. And EVERONE that does this knows that they know that they know they are saying YES to satan and NO to God. Not ONE does this by mistake. That is why they are lost forever. They KNOW Jesus GOD is real and are saying NO to Him.

So.. that has not happen.. and watch for JESUS NOW! Be ready NOW and there is now no condemnation to them in Christ Jesus.. you are saved washed in tbe BLOOD OF JESUS and GOD NEVER EVER EVER EVER USES FEAR! So if you have FEAR.. rejoice.. its not of God and satan can NOT ever tell the truth!. REJOICE! Jesus is coming to GET YOU
 
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precepts

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I guess I just didn't understand what you meant by it. I think Paul was referring to new Christians who didn't yet have a lot of experience in the faith if that's the reference you were making.
Read the verses again. Paul calls all who aren't "weaned" off the physical land of Israel babes, not ready for strong meat, which is the exercising of the senses to hear and see the movements and sounds of quickened beings, which classifies many a Israeli supporters today.

Nobody takes the Word for what's it worth anymore.
 
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LadyCrosstalk said in post 197:

I do not believe it is a coincidence that Jesus depicts the time of the End as a parallel to the time leading up to the Flood judgment. We are given few details in Genesis of that period but it appears likely that it was filled with unimaginable evil.

Good point.

Also, note that Matthew 24:37-41 refers to "the coming of the Son of man" (Matthew 24:37,39), which Jesus had just finished saying will not occur until "immediately after the tribulation" (Matthew 24:29-30).

So Matthew 24:37-41 means that the unsaved people of the world will have no idea that most of them are going to be killed at Jesus' 2nd coming until it actually happens. For they could think that the 2nd coming had already occurred with the coming into power of the Antichrist's miracle-working False Prophet (of Revelation 13:13-14, Revelation 19:20), who could claim to be Jesus returned. And just as the people of the world shortly before Noah's flood, even though they could see or hear about Noah building his huge ark, no doubt rejected the idea that YHWH God had the power to actually cause a global flood which would kill them, so the people of the world at the end of the future tribulation could reject the idea that YHWH has the power to actually defeat them.

For during the tribulation's 2nd half, the world will see the power of Lucifer (Satan, the dragon) and his fallen angels (Revelation 12:9); and the power that Lucifer will give to the Antichrist (the individual-man aspect of Revelation's "beast") to take over the entire earth (Revelation 13:4-8), and to utterly revile YHWH year after year without being destroyed (Revelation 13:5-6, Daniel 11:36); and to physically overcome and kill people in the church in every nation (Revelation 13:7-10, Revelation 14:12-13, Revelation 20:4-6, Matthew 24:9-13). And the world will see the amazing miraculous powers which Lucifer will give to the Antichrist's False Prophet, by which he will be able to even call fire down from heaven in the sight of everyone (Revelation 13:13, cf. 2 Thessalonians 2:9).

And near the end of the future tribulation, the world will see the Antichrist's defeat of YHWH's amazingly-powerful two witnesses (Revelation 11:3-9), after which defeat the world will rejoice and make merry and send gifts to each other because the two witnesses had been sending plagues on the world (Revelation 11:10,6). And even though those plagues will be shortly followed by even more plagues from YHWH, poured out directly from heaven (Revelation 16, the tribulation's final stage), the people of the world will not lose their confidence that YHWH can still be defeated. For after almost all of the plagues from heaven are over, the world will see the amazing miraculous powers of some unclean spirits, convincing the world's armies to gather together for a battle against YHWH (Revelation 16:13-14, Revelation 19:19). And so the world could come to that battle at the very end of the tribulation with the same careless attitude as some people at the start of the American Civil War, who held picnics at the expected first battleground of Bull Run/Manassas to watch the battle and what they expected to be a quick and easy victory.
 
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eartheart said in post 202:

You will either get the mark of the beast or the mark of God . . .

Regarding "the mark of God", are you thinking of the following verses?

Revelation 7:2 And I saw another angel ascending from the east, having the seal of the living God: and he cried with a loud voice to the four angels, to whom it was given to hurt the earth and the sea,
3 Saying, Hurt not the earth, neither the sea, nor the trees, till we have sealed the servants of our God in their foreheads.
4 And I heard the number of them which were sealed: and there were sealed an hundred and forty and four thousand of all the tribes of the children of Israel.

If so, note that this refers to a marking of the 144,000.

The 144,000 will all be Christians (Revelation 14:1,4), and so they will all be part of the church (cf. Ephesians 4:4-6). They will be the firstfruits of the church (Revelation 14:4), in the sense of its best part (cf. Numbers 18:12). They will be male virgins (Revelation 14:4), who could all have been born in the 20th or 21st century, and who could all already be part of the church. For they will all be alive on the earth, and will all already be God's servants (Revelation 7:3; cf. Romans 6:22, Philippians 1:1), by the time of Revelation 7:3-8, during the first stage of the future tribulation of Revelation chapters 6 to 18 and Matthew 24. They will have entered the tribulation along with the rest of the church alive at that time, for there will be no pre-tribulation rapture (2 Thessalonians 2:1-8, Matthew 24:29-31, Revelation 19:7 to 20:6).

Also, the 144,000, who are of the 12 tribes of Israel (Revelation 7:4-8), can include both Jews and Gentiles in the church. For all genetic Jews in the church remain members of whichever tribe of Israel they were born into (Romans 11:1, Acts 4:36). And all genetic Gentiles in the church have been grafted into Israel (Romans 11:17,24, Ephesians 2:12,19, Galatians 3:29), and so have been grafted into its various tribes (cf. Ezekiel 47:21-23).

The tribe of Dan is missing from the list of the 144,000's twelve tribes (Revelation 7:4-8; there, "Joseph" stands for Ephraim: Numbers 1:32, Psalms 78:67, Ezekiel 37:16b,19) because the Israel they are from is not genetic Israel with its 12 genetic tribes which include Dan (Genesis 49:28,17), but rather spiritual Israel (Romans 9:6-8), which consists of all the elect (Romans 9:11-13), both elect Jews and elect Gentiles (Romans 9:24).

-

Also, while at the future point in time of Revelation 7:2-4, only the 144,000 male-virgins part of the church (Revelation 14:1,4) will be sealed for physical protection, all obedient people in the church will still be spiritually protected during the future tribulation of Revelation chapters 6 to 18 and Matthew 24, no matter what happens to them physically (Romans 8:35-37). Also, before Revelation 7:2-4 happens, the 144,000, along with some others, will be physically protected so that they will survive the tribulation's first stage (in Revelation 6), while others will die and their souls will enter heaven (Revelation 7:9,14). It is near the end of this first stage that the 144,000 will be sealed (Revelation 7:3-4) for physical protection before the unsealing of the 7th seal (Revelation 8:1), out of which will come the tribulation's 7 trumpets (Revelation 8:1-2). The first 6 trumpets' events, up to Revelation 9:19, will be the tribulation's 2nd stage. The seal which the 144,000 will receive (which will be different from and in addition to the seal of the Holy Spirit himself which they and all others in the church receive: Ephesians 1:13) will physically protect them during this 2nd stage (Revelation 9:4).

After this 2nd stage, the 144,000 male-virgins part of the church will be caught up in their mortal bodies as the "man child" to God's throne in heaven (Revelation 12:5, Revelation 14:4-5, Textus Receptus), like how Enoch and Elijah were caught up in their mortal bodies to heaven (Hebrews 11:5; 2 Kings 2:11). Right after the 144,000 are caught up, the tribulation's 3rd stage, the literal 3.5-year worldwide reign of the Antichrist (the individual-man aspect of Revelation's "beast") will begin (Revelation 12:5-6). This time period is shown from 4 different angles in Revelation chapters 11 to 14 (Revelation 11:2b-3, Revelation 12:6,14, Revelation 13:5-18, Revelation 14:9-13).

The 144,000 will remain in heaven before God's throne (Revelation 14:5, Textus Receptus) during the time of the Antichrist's reign (Revelation 14:9-13, Revelation 13:5-18), while two other parts of the church will still be on the earth: the figurative "woman" who represents those in the church who will flee into prepared wilderness places and be physically protected (Revelation 12:6,14-16); and the remnant of her seed (Revelation 12:17), those in the church who will remain in the cities and not be physically protected, but will be persecuted in every nation, imprisoned, and beheaded by the Antichrist (Revelation 13:7-10, Revelation 14:12-13, Revelation 20:4-6, Matthew 24:9-13).

After the Antichrist's reign is declared legally over at the sounding of the 7th trumpet (Revelation 11:15), the 7 plagues of the 7 vials of God's wrath will come out of the 7th trumpet's heavenly-temple opening (Revelation 11:19, Revelation 15:5 to 16:1). These 7 vials (Revelation 16) will be the tribulation's 4th and final stage. Because the church is not appointed to God's wrath (1 Thessalonians 5:9), none of these vials will be directed at those in the church who will still be alive on the earth at that time, still waiting for Jesus' coming as a thief (Revelation 16:15). Instead, they will go into protective chambers which they will have built for themselves on the earth (Isaiah 26:20), just as Noah and his family went into the protective ark which they had built for themselves on the earth (Genesis 7:7). So some in the church will survive the entire future tribulation on the earth. They are those who will still be "alive and remain" at Jesus' 2nd coming to be raptured (1 Thessalonians 4:15-17), immediately after the tribulation (Matthew 24:29-31; 2 Thessalonians 2:1-8). These survivors will have experienced God's miraculous physical protection (Psalms 91) without having to have been part of the 144,000.
 
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masmpg said in post 205:

Before and during the time of the mark of the beast God's people will be tried more then ever.

That's right.

And Biblical Christians need to read verses like Mark 13:9-13 as applicable to them today. For in our future, "political correctness" will make Biblical Christianity "hate speech", because the Bible says that homosexuality is a sin (Romans 1:26-27) and that Christianity is the only way to be saved (John 14:6, John 3:36, Acts 4:12), and that all other religions are cursed (Galatians 1:8-9).

Be prepared to be arrested and tried before courts of law for the violation of "hate speech" laws which will be instituted in our future (by the Supreme Court, without any approval from the People in Congress). When you go to trial, remember Mark 13:9-13, and testify as the Holy Spirit gives you at that time. But do not expect to be set free after your testimony. You must be willing to face imprisonment and even execution for the truths of Jesus Christ and His Word the Holy Bible (Matthew 24:9-13, Mark 8:34-38, John 8:31b).

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Also, compare the example of 2 Timothy 1:15, which was written at the time of Paul the prisoner's (2 Timothy 1:8) first testimony at his trial (2 Timothy 4:16-17) before Caesar (Acts 25:12) in Rome (2 Timothy 1:16-18). Those who rejected Paul at that time could have done so because, unlike Onesiphorus, they were ashamed of Paul's chain (2 Timothy 1:16), ashamed of Paul as a prisoner (2 Timothy 1:8), because they had the spirit of fear that they would become partakers of the afflictions of the gospel (2 Timothy 1:7-8), that they would suffer imprisonment and martyrdom for Jesus and his gospel along with Paul if they publicly supported him. They could have publicly rejected Paul temporarily because at that time they, like Demas, still "loved this present world" (2 Timothy 4:10).

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2 Timothy 2:12 shows that "we" believers can wrongly employ our free will to deny Jesus in order to escape suffering during a persecution against Christians (e.g. Matthew 24:9-13), and that such denial (such apostasy) will result in Jesus denying us (our losing our salvation) at his 2nd coming (Mark 8:35-38, Hebrews 6:4-8, John 15:6).

masmpg said in post 205:

In Matthew 24 when the disciples asked Jesus when will these things be, speaking about the end of the world, the first words out of Jesus mouth were "TAKE HEED THAT NO MAN DECEIVE YOU".

Good point.

And it brings to mind the fact that in Matthew 24:24, the original Greek doesn't say "if it were possible", in the sense of it not being possible. Instead, it simply says "if possible", meaning that false Christs and false prophets will in our future perform great miracles by the power of Satan (2 Thessalonians 2:9, Revelation 13:13-18, Revelation 19:20), as part of Satan's intention to deceive as many of the elect as possible. The Bible nowhere says that it is impossible for any elect person to be deceived. Instead, as you pointed out, Jesus had started out in Matthew 24 by specifically warning the elect to "Take heed that no man deceive you" (Matthew 24:4), meaning that it is possible for the elect to be deceived, if they do not take heed to Jesus' warning regarding great-miracle-working false Christs and false prophets, who will appear in our future (Matthew 24:4-5,23-25, Revelation 13:13-18, Revelation 19:20).

The elect can also be deceived in other ways, whether before their salvation (Titus 3:3, Romans 7:11) or after their salvation (1 John 3:7; 1 Corinthians 6:9; 1 Corinthians 15:33, Galatians 6:7, Ephesians 5:6; 2 Thessalonians 2:3). Paul warns the elect: "The Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils" (1 Timothy 4:1). The time will come when some "shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables" (2 Timothy 4:4). For it is possible for a saved person to commit apostasy, to the ultimate loss of his salvation (Hebrews 6:4-8, John 15:6; 2 Timothy 2:12b).

The fact that a saved person can be deceived into committing apostasy does not mean that Satan is stronger than God, or that God would for no reason abandon a saved person, but means that the principle of the "deceivableness of unrighteousness" (2 Thessalonians 2:10, Proverbs 17:4a) applies even to a saved person.

That is, one way that a saved person could be deceived into committing apostasy would be if he finds a particular sin to be very pleasurable, so pleasurable and so fulfilling (in the short term) that he continues in it over time until his heart becomes hardened by the deceitfulness of sin (Hebrews 3:13), to where his love for God grows cold because of the abundance of iniquity (Matthew 24:12), to where he quenches the Spirit (1 Thessalonians 5:19), to where he sears his conscience as with a hot iron (1 Timothy 4:2), to where he begins to listen to the lies of demons and latch onto them, to the point where he departs from the faith (1 Timothy 4:1). In a wrong desire to continue in their lusts without repentance, saved people can reach the point where they become no longer able to endure the sound doctrine of the Bible, and they instead seek out and latch onto other teachings which will help to support them in their lusts (2 Timothy 4:3-4).

So saved people need to be living righteously now, they need to be obedient now if they want to spiritually endure to the end during the future tribulation of Revelation chapters 6 to 18 and Matthew 24 (Matthew 24:13). For only obedient believers will have their spiritual houses on the rock, as it were, so that they will endure the coming storm (Matthew 7:24-25). Disobedient believers will have their spiritual houses on the sand, so that they will fall away during the storm (Matthew 7:26-27). They will become part of the falling away, the apostasy (2 Thessalonians 2:3), the departure from the faith (1 Timothy 4:1), which will occur during the future tribulation (Matthew 24:9-13, cf. Isaiah 8:21-22), to the ultimate loss of their salvation (Hebrews 6:4-8, John 15:6; 2 Timothy 2:12b).

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masmpg said in post 207:

The mark IN represents deciding to do. IN our forehead represents making a conscientious decision, and IN our right hand represents carrying out that decision by obeying the beast and his image.

Regarding "IN", note that in Revelation 13:16, the original Greek word (epi: G1909) translated as "in", actually means "on" (Revelation 14:1a) or "upon" (Revelation 14:14), not inside, like how our "epi"-dermis (our skin) is on our body, not inside it.
 
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Major1 said in post 208:

The very best way to miss the mark of the beast is to be saved today. Accept the Lord Jesus Christ and when He comes for the believers in the Rapture, BOOM! You are out of here.

Note that nothing in the Bible teaches or requires a pre-tribulation rapture of the church. Instead, the Bible shows that Jesus will not come and gather together (rapture) the church until immediately after the future tribulation of Revelation chapters 6 to 18 and Matthew 24 (Matthew 24:29-31, Mark 13:24-27; 2 Thessalonians 2:1-8). That is why the marriage of the church does not happen until Revelation 19:7, in connection with Jesus' 2nd coming and the physical resurrection of the church at that time (Revelation 19:7 to 20:6; 1 Corinthians 15:21-23,51-53; 1 Thessalonians 4:15-16). Matthew 24:30-31 refers to the same 2nd coming of Jesus and gathering together (rapture) of the church as 2 Thessalonians 2:1, which refers to the same 2nd coming of Jesus and catching up together (rapture) of the church as 1 Thessalonians 4:15-17.

Jesus will not return and gather together (rapture) the church until sometime after there is a falling away (an apostasy) in the church, and the Antichrist sits (at least one time) in a 3rd Jewish temple in Jerusalem and proclaims himself God (2 Thessalonians 2:1-4, Daniel 11:31,36, Revelation 11:1-2, Revelation 13:4-8), and the abomination of desolation (possibly a standing, android image of the Antichrist) is set up in the holy place (the inner sanctum) of the 3rd temple (Matthew 24:15-31, Daniel 11:31). For when Jesus returns to gather together (and marry) the church, he will destroy the Antichrist (2 Thessalonians 2:1,8, Revelation 19:7,20). Before Jesus returns, the church will have to go through the future, literal 3.5 years of the Antichrist's worldwide reign (Revelation 13:5-10, Revelation 14:12-13, Revelation 20:4-6, Matthew 24:9-31).

At Jesus' 2nd coming (1 Thessalonians 4:15; 2 Thessalonians 2:1, Matthew 24:30), the church will be physically resurrected and caught up together/gathered together (raptured) (1 Thessalonians 4:16-17; 2 Thessalonians 2:1, Matthew 24:31), not to remove the church from the earth (Proverbs 10:30, John 17:15,20), but to take the church only as high as the clouds of the sky to hold a meeting in the air with the returned Jesus (1 Thessalonians 4:17).

At that meeting, Jesus will judge everyone in the church (Psalms 50:3-5, cf. Mark 13:27) by their works (2 Corinthians 5:10, Romans 2:6-8, Luke 12:45-48, Matthew 25:19-30). And then Jesus will marry in the clouds the obedient part of the church (Revelation 19:7-8, Matthew 25:1-12), those in the church (of all times) who "overcame" to the end (Revelation 3:5, Revelation 2:26). They will then mount white horses and come back down from the sky (the 1st heaven) with Jesus (Revelation 19:14) as he defeats the Antichrist (the individual-man aspect of Revelation's "beast") and the world's armies (Revelation 19:15-21). Jesus will then make the marriage supper of Revelation 19:9 for the physically-resurrected and married obedient part of the church in the earthly Jerusalem (Isaiah 25:6-9; 1 Corinthians 15:54). Jesus and the obedient part of the church will then physically reign on the earth for 1,000 years (Revelation 20:4-6, Revelation 5:10, Revelation 2:26-29).

Major1 said in post 208:

The very best way to miss the mark of the beast is to be saved today. Accept the Lord Jesus Christ and when He comes for the believers in the Rapture, BOOM! You are out of here.

Then the A/C will be known . . .

Regarding "Then the A/C will be known", are you thinking of the following verse?

2 Thessalonians 2:3 ¶Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition . . .

If so, note that this refers to when an individual man will be revealed (i.e. without any remaining doubt) as being the Antichrist by his sitting (at least one time) in a future, 3rd Jewish temple in Jerusalem and proclaiming himself God (2 Thessalonians 2:4, Daniel 11:36,31, Matthew 24:15). This is one of the things which have to happen sometime before the future day of Jesus' 2nd coming and the gathering together (rapture) of the church (2 Thessalonians 2:1-8), immediately after the tribulation (Matthew 24:29-31, Revelation 19:7 to 20:6). For at the 2nd coming, the Antichrist will be destroyed (2 Thessalonians 2:8b, Revelation 19:20).
 
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No disrespect offered here but you are reading into the Scriptures what YOU want them to say my friend.

The Greek word for "mark" in Rev. 13:16-17 is "CHARAGMA". It literally means......Stamp or image and brand.

Again.....that is Greek grammar and it can not be changed to fit our thinking or wants or wishes.

You need to understand that everyone left after the Rapture will be LOST except 144 K Jewish men.

There is not going to be a world wide revolt because we think that millions of righteous people will overturn the A/C. There will not be any righteous neither will there be a revolt. The A/C will track down the 144 K believers and those who accept Christ through their witness and most will be killed.

The WORLD will have no problem taking the mark of their new ruler. The World will do it just as did the Germans when Hitler brought out the Swastikas.

I put very little confidence on strongs let alone faith. I will rather take what John said about worship being the focus of the mark of the beast. The whole bible is spiritual, to presume that God will rely on any man made technology to force people to do things against their will, or to implement any kind of mechanism that would cause humanity to receive His wrath to me is too far fetched, even though I use to believe and guess just like the evangelical world is doing now. It takes years of study, and much revelation from the Comforter to understand the bible. Especially prophecy. To follow some teaching because it is popular is not the way. The truth has NEVER been popular. There is no guessing to God's word. I look around nominal churches and they are all saying this man or that machine is the "antichrist" or the "beast". The reason we are told to study to show ourselves approved unto GOD is so HE through the Comforter can reveal truth to our hearts, not attend never ending seminars that always lead to updating and false prophecies.

Sorry but the pre trib, or what use to be known as the "secret" rapture is not biblical. This false teaching which is deceiving multitudes has been updated over and over. When Christian cast their pearls before swine they swine use these pearls to manipulate their false teaching into something harder to refute. Jesus is coming for all His people after the tribulation just like He says, and to separate the "church" from God's people is nonsense, and none of it can be proven by the bible alone. Jack Van Impe even said that himself. The only way you can promote the pre trib rapture is by using bits and pieces of scripture and out of context time lines like the 70 weeks of Danial 9.
 
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masmpg

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That's right.

Good point.

And it brings to mind the fact that in Matthew 24:24, the original Greek doesn't say "if it were possible", in the sense of it not being possible. Instead, it simply says "if possible", meaning that false Christs and false prophets will in our future perform great miracles by the power of Satan (2 Thessalonians 2:9, Revelation 13:13-18, Revelation 19:20), as part of Satan's intention to deceive as many of the elect as possible. The Bible nowhere says that it is impossible for any elect person to be deceived. Instead, as you pointed out, Jesus had started out in Matthew 24 by specifically warning the elect to "Take heed that no man deceive you" (Matthew 24:4), meaning that it is possible for the elect to be deceived, if they do not take heed to Jesus' warning regarding great-miracle-working false Christs and false prophets, who will appear in our future (Matthew 24:4-5,23-25, Revelation 13:13-18, Revelation 19:20).

The elect can also be deceived in other ways, whether before their salvation (Titus 3:3, Romans 7:11) or after their salvation (1 John 3:7; 1 Corinthians 6:9; 1 Corinthians 15:33, Galatians 6:7, Ephesians 5:6; 2 Thessalonians 2:3). Paul warns the elect: "The Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils" (1 Timothy 4:1). The time will come when some "shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables" (2 Timothy 4:4). For it is possible for a saved person to commit apostasy, to the ultimate loss of his salvation (Hebrews 6:4-8, John 15:6; 2 Timothy 2:12b).

The fact that a saved person can be deceived into committing apostasy does not mean that Satan is stronger than God, or that God would for no reason abandon a saved person, but means that the principle of the "deceivableness of unrighteousness" (2 Thessalonians 2:10, Proverbs 17:4a) applies even to a saved person.

That is, one way that a saved person could be deceived into committing apostasy would be if he finds a particular sin to be very pleasurable, so pleasurable and so fulfilling (in the short term) that he continues in it over time until his heart becomes hardened by the deceitfulness of sin (Hebrews 3:13), to where his love for God grows cold because of the abundance of iniquity (Matthew 24:12), to where he quenches the Spirit (1 Thessalonians 5:19), to where he sears his conscience as with a hot iron (1 Timothy 4:2), to where he begins to listen to the lies of demons and latch onto them, to the point where he departs from the faith (1 Timothy 4:1). In a wrong desire to continue in their lusts without repentance, saved people can reach the point where they become no longer able to endure the sound doctrine of the Bible, and they instead seek out and latch onto other teachings which will help to support them in their lusts (2 Timothy 4:3-4).

So saved people need to be living righteously now, they need to be obedient now if they want to spiritually endure to the end during the future tribulation of Revelation chapters 6 to 18 and Matthew 24 (Matthew 24:13). For only obedient believers will have their spiritual houses on the rock, as it were, so that they will endure the coming storm (Matthew 7:24-25). Disobedient believers will have their spiritual houses on the sand, so that they will fall away during the storm (Matthew 7:26-27). They will become part of the falling away, the apostasy (2 Thessalonians 2:3), the departure from the faith (1 Timothy 4:1), which will occur during the future tribulation (Matthew 24:9-13, cf. Isaiah 8:21-22), to the ultimate loss of their salvation (Hebrews 6:4-8, John 15:6; 2 Timothy 2:12b).

I like this. The only help we have, even now, and moreso as the antichristian right wing movement shows more of their ugly head on the world scene, is the Comforter. I just read an article this morning about a pastor who was arrested for, are you sitting down? PRAYING! He was praying at a planned parenthood rally for the mothers who want to abort their children.

The way I look at the "elect" is that if we are not the elect we will be deceived.

I agree whole heartedly that there is no such thing as once saved always saved, and that we must have victory from "glory to glory" as we are transformed into the image of Jesus ouR loving Lord and Savior.

As far as the IN=ON I will stick with what the KJV states, because there are far too many manuscripts that have totally perverted God's holy word the KJV bible. I have done intensive research on the manuscripts and the diverse translations and have come to the conclusion that for every truth that God reveals satan has a counterfeit, not necessarily opposite, but twisted just enough to achieve his plan of killing all of God's creation. Bibles are not exempt from this principle. In the past 50 years as the new and "improved" translations have cursed Christianity, far too much debate is centered around which translation is more accurate. KJV has served Christianity well for over 400 years and the textus receptus (masoretic) text for hundreds of years before that. The dead sea scrolls agree with the textus receptus (received text) over any other translation. Besides our understanding has little to do with what God wants to reveal to us at any particular time. We are told in 1John 2:27 that we are to let no man teach us. Not saying that teachers are not needed, but we are to prove everything that man says by the word of God through the Comforter. We are told in John 14:26 & 16:13 that the Comforter guides us into all truth, not sermons, commentaries, or even manuscripts and counterfeit translations. If we rely on picking and choosing which translation sounds better to US we are removing the work of the Comforter. Another thing to consider is that satan has no limitations like God does. God loves satan hates! Hatred knows no boundaries and will do all it can to accomplish misery! There are many lies and great deceptions surrounding the "modern" translations. Many false documents have come to light after the first printing of the westcott and hort revised version. The vatican has done this kind of strategy in the past, and are doing all in their power now to achieve their goal of the very definition of their name catholic = universal. They will stop at nothing to achieve this.[/QUOTE][/QUOTE]
 
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masmpg

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Dear DeerGlow...

We seem to always here about the MARK 666 huh? 1st.. its not 666. Well it was not written in English. Its 600,60,6. Each number means something. Then some scrolls show it as 600,16,6. But.. DONT get stuck here.

I would like to point out here that the bible says nothing about 666 being any sort of "mark".
read it in the only verse in the bible that number is used her in Revelation:13:18: "Here is wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast: for it is the number of a man; and his number is Six hundred threescore and six." 666 IS the NUMBER of the beast, it is the number of a MAN. Not the mark of the beast.
 
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