the conventions coming up

dogs4thewin · Jul 14, 2016

Calvinist Dark Lord said:
What there is to stop him is the FACT that there is no provision for him to continue in office after January 20, 2017 at 1200PM EST. He will CEASE to be US President at that time, and Paul Ryan --assuming he is still speaker of the House-- would become acting President. Martial Law notwithstanding.

After 1200PM on 20 January 2017 the US Military ceases to take orders from Barack Obama because he is NO LONGER US President. Martial Law notwithstanding.

There will be an election. There were elections in the midst of WWII so there is absolutely no Constitutional justification for suspending the elections. They were not suspended during the US Civil War.

Well, when we had World WarII the fighting was NOT here. The civil war would have been 64 not 68 and as you said the union did not reconize the south, anyway.

dogs4thewin · Jul 14, 2016

Albion said:
Calvinist DL,

You mean that the Constitution would rightly confer the presidency upon the Speaker. But that's not the same as acting as president under some pretext or other.

Look, I don't think that this is going to happen; I was simply responding to the idea that if it did, the American people would immediately rise up ("go to war") to stop it. I don't think we would do that, not any more than we did something like that when Obama and previous presidents violated the Constitution. And of course there would be a lot of mumbo jumbo explanations about emergency measures and some obscure law being cited as backing blah blah blah for the incumbent to justify his actions and keep the issue in limbo awaiting a Supreme Court ruling.

In war, it gets crazy and people do not always follow the laws of a government they are trying to overthrow, so that may even make the war worse.

dogs4thewin · Jul 14, 2016

Nithavela said:
Considering how the USA handled the New Orleans flooding, I doubt they will be able to set up the fema death camps in time.

lol considering that the president has just over six months if it was deceared to TODAY.

dogs4thewin · Jul 14, 2016

Calvinist Dark Lord said:
Who declared war on the Confederate States of America? Since Lincoln did not recognise the Confederacy, how was there a quarum of Senators and Congressmen to make such a declaration? Aside from that, who declared war on North Korea or North Vietnam, or Iraq, or Afghanistan, or...

The last war legally declared by congress was World War II, I believe.

essentialsaltes · Jul 14, 2016

dogs4thewin said:
How likely is it that there will be issues?

I expect there will be lots of demonstrations outside the conventions. More than usual, hopefully less intense than 1968.

I have been hearing much about Obama trying to cause enough issues to cancel the elections and stay in office

I have a bet with someone. If Obama is in office in February 2017, I pay him $100. If Obama is not in office, I get $1. PM me if you want a piece of that action.

but the security forces are going to be federal

No doubt, there will be lots of secret service, but I think the primary security will be handled by local police. This is why, for instance, the Cleveland police chief has been asking the 2nd Amendment fan-boys to leave their toys at home.

so what is your take?

You are worried about an imaginary thing.

AirPo · Jul 14, 2016

Willtor said:
Have you guys ever really stopped to look at the moon? I keep hearing it's made of cheese and that the Earth is flat and the moon landing was a hoax. What do you think?

...

Why isn't anybody addressing the first question?!

Maybe because the first question is a hoax made of cheese on the moon. :scratch:

AirPo · Jul 14, 2016

dogs4thewin said:
Alex Jones is a lunatic.
Trump Ally Roger Stone Is Convinced He Will Die by Hillary Clinton’s Hand

Do you have anything more reputable? This stuff would go straight to the conspiracy forum here.

What does the fact that Ben Carson said it in Nov. of last year have to do with anything?

Lunatic fringe does not age with time like a fine wine. It just sits there and rots.

Larniavc · Jul 14, 2016

dogs4thewin said:
Well, as I said it would be war plus if I really believed in something I may well be willing to go to trial. Remember, I said I would be willing to DIE for what was right if it came to that.

How's that different from anyone willing to die for their sincerely held beliefs?

Can you see where I'm going with this?

super animator · Jul 14, 2016

Calvinist Dark Lord said:
Who declared war on the Confederate States of America? Since Lincoln did not recognise the Confederacy, how was there a quarum of Senators and Congressmen to make such a declaration? Aside from that, who declared war on North Korea or North Vietnam, or Iraq, or Afghanistan, or...

Good luck declare war on a country where majority of the senate hate your guts.

chandraclaws · Jul 14, 2016

dogs4thewin said:
How likely is it that there will be issues? I have been hearing much about Obama trying to cause enough issues to cancel the elections and stay in office, but the security forces are going to be federal, so what is your take?

There are medications for that.

dogs4thewin · Jul 14, 2016

Larnievc said:
How's that different from anyone willing to die for their sincerely held beliefs?

Can you see where I'm going with this?

Well, in war, both sides tend to have such people.

JonFromMinnesota · Jul 14, 2016

dogs4thewin said:
How likely is it that there will be issues?

There will probably be protests. Hopefully no violence.

I have been hearing much about Obama trying to cause enough issues to cancel the elections and stay in office, but the security forces are going to be federal, so what is your take?

This is conspiracy theory nonsense.

Calvinist Dark Lord · Jul 14, 2016

super animator said:
Good luck declare war on a country where majority of the senate hate your guts.

Good luck trying to conduct any legislative business when there is no quorum and neither house of Congress can legally conduct the business of that respective house.

In other words, they can't even vote on whether or not to hold a war. Lacking a quorum, all the congress or senate can do is adjourn.

In not recognising succession, Lincoln essentially made illegal any legislative act.

Incidentally, the majority of the US Senate would have still been sympathetic to the Union even if not necessarily to the Lincoln administration.

At any rate, this is getting horribly off topic.

The issue as i have pointed out in at least two other threads when this subject comes up is that there is NOT GOING TO BE an insurrection or "Civil War II".

This crazy martial law conspiracy theory has been around since at least the Reagan Administration. At least that was the first time i heard it. i've heard it concerning every President since Clinton.

If such a thing ever does happen in this country, it will not go well for Federal forces. This isn't 1861 any more.

Calvinist Dark Lord · Jul 14, 2016

chandraclaws said:
There are medications for that.

Yes, Huxley called it "Soma", and apparently a great many people in this country are taking it and have been taking it for a long time.

i don't see any martial law sort of thing but the citizens of this country have really tolerated far more than should have been tolerated from their government.

pescador · Jul 14, 2016

JonFromMinnesota said:
There will probably be protests. Hopefully no violence.

<snip>

There is no question in my mind that there will be violence in Cleveland. Feelings are running way too high on both sides of the issues. I well remember Chicago 1968, and the feelings then were/are no match for the current expressions of racism, hatred, torture, bullying, etc. and the opposition to those expressions.

pescador · Jul 14, 2016

Calvinist Dark Lord said:
Good luck trying to conduct any legislative business when there is no quorum and neither house of Congress can legally conduct the business of that respective house.

In other words, they can't even vote on whether or not to hold a war. Lacking a quorum, all the congress or senate can do is adjourn.

In not recognising succession, Lincoln essentially made illegal any legislative act.

Incidentally, the majority of the US Senate would have still been sympathetic to the Union even if not necessarily to the Lincoln administration.

At any rate, this is getting horribly off topic.

The issue as i have pointed out in at least two other threads when this subject comes up is that there is NOT GOING TO BE an insurrection or "Civil War II".

This crazy martial law conspiracy theory has been around since at least the Reagan Administration. At least that was the first time i heard it. i've heard it concerning every President since Clinton.

If such a thing ever does happen in this country, it will not go well for Federal forces. This isn't 1861 any more.

It won't go well for federal forces? Have you seen the armament the feds have compared to what civilians have? There is no contest in this area. Think about the display of weapons of all kinds after the Boston marathon bombing!

super animator · Jul 14, 2016

Calvinist Dark Lord said:
Good luck trying to conduct any legislative business when there is no quorum and neither house of Congress can legally conduct the business of that respective house.

In other words, they can't even vote on whether or not to hold a war. Lacking a quorum, all the congress or senate can do is adjourn.

In not recognising succession, Lincoln essentially made illegal any legislative act.

.

That is debatable and off topic.

SepiaAndDust · Jul 14, 2016

This stupidity comes up every time a two-term president is on his way out. Bush was going to do it. Clinton was going to do it.

But nobody was ever going to do it. It's stupidity.

dogs4thewin · Jul 14, 2016

SepiaAndDust said:
This stupidity comes up every time a two-term president is on his way out. Bush was going to do it. Clinton was going to do it.

But nobody was ever going to do it. It's stupidity.

Honest question Has any prior President had this much craziness going on? I mean particularly in different incidents that seem unrelated.

Willtor · Jul 14, 2016

dogs4thewin said:
Honest question Has any prior President had this much craziness going on? I mean particularly in different incidents that seem unrelated.

Yes. Every single one.

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