Our lives matter.

AirPo said:

Why would you think that?

Click to expand...

Gonna go out on a limb, here: He heard that responding to "Black Lives Matter" with "All Lives Matter" was racist (which it is -- or at least, incredibly insensitive and unaware), and didn't understand why, so he extrapolated that saying anything other than "Black Lives Matter" was racist.

Willtor said:

Gonna go out on a limb, here: He heard that responding to "Black Lives Matter" with "All Lives Matter" was racist (which it is -- or at least, incredibly insensitive and unaware), and didn't understand why, so he extrapolated that saying anything other than "Black Lives Matter" was racist.

Click to expand...

And the op was a lot more inclusive than what has previously been permitted.

And only with this sort of nonsensical rhetoric would saying that everyone's life matters be considered racist

Willtor said:

Gonna go out on a limb, here: He heard that responding to "Black Lives Matter" with "All Lives Matter" was racist (which it is -- or at least, incredibly insensitive and unaware), and didn't understand why, so he extrapolated that saying anything other than "Black Lives Matter" was racist.

Click to expand...

I mean, seriously, what is the difference practically between All Lives Matter and the OP's Our Lives Matter, and why is the former "racist" when it is isn't and the latter is fine and no different to the former?

What have the speech police changed the rules to today?

AirPo said:

"All Lives Matter" came across as a big F U <insert fovorite Afriican racial slur here>.

Click to expand...

And how is saying All Lives Matter different from Our Lives Matter? Both are being extended to everyone, no? Instead of using the Black Lives Matter mantra?

Kinda hard to shoot for equality when the rules of engagement keep changing when convenient, wouldn't you say?

AirPo said:

That's the way it came across. I was careful in the way I worded the OP so as to not make that mistake.

Click to expand...

Ok, so you've basically said the same thing that we've been told all along is RAAAACIST....but it's not racist when you do it.

Seems legit.

I guess I'd say I do realize the blacks are often treated as if they are criminals and I do agree that racist. But I also feel alot of that has to do with how you let yourselves look to the outside world. My wife came here from another country a few years ago. I didn't put any ideas in her head about blacks in america. Aside from the history (slavery, MLK...etc), the good things that we changed in this country. But she formed a view pretty quickly from seeing how they portray themselves in tv, movies and so on. Or how they act in public. She, like me, realizes not all are like that. But she doesn't understand why they don't change things in their culture first.

Just as during the time of the mafia, people stereotyped italians us criminals and assumed every italian was in the mafia and what not. Even my dad when he was younger was approached by a local mafia leader. And we did have uncles in it. So as time went by the mafia sort of fell apart. But the stereotype still stuck around for a long time. Its not as bad as it used to be, but sometimes I get people who still say who may argue with me and be like "What you gonna do about it brake my knees?" or "I'll make you an offer you can't refuse!". I get it and while it can be annoying, I know its a culture thing that over time will improve more so we are just seen as Italian americans, not mafia Italians.

Many of our blacks friend (they are usually older, 45+) do know the black stereotype still exists and they dislike it. But they do point out the younger kids/young adults today were raised by parents who tell them the world is against them, whites do not like them, they can't do what they set their mind to. Which just makes them growing up thinking everyone is against them. Interestingly enough yesterday at the theater a old friend of mine came out the same time we did and he said hi. He is black but adopted by white parents. He is very down to earth and his mom raised him telling him he could be anything he wanted to. Taught him not to get involved with people that say you won't be anything...etc. Hes a great guy, nice job...etc.

On a sad note, today (unless it was yesterday) a new video was shot by a black man and his two friends in a car as someone came up to their car and shot them 30 times. From what I heard no one died. But if this shooter was black, this is sort of the problem whites see. The violence is way higher amongst their own race but BLM is no where to be found. I say they should focus on themselves ALONG with making sure others stop stereotyping instead of just focusing on them being stereotyped. Because even if you get people to stop stereotyping you, it won't change the internal war of black violence against each other.

Its why I say All Lives Matter. We are all precious regardless of skin color. Though honestly I wish no one went by skin color. Me? I'm not white. I am italian, french, german, scotish and english. Just as no one is black really. They are jamaican, haitian...etc whatever their background is. White and black is TO narrowed down. When I take something I write mainly "Italian american", not white. Unless they tell me I have to choose it.

Gadarene said:

I mean, seriously, what is the difference practically between All Lives Matter and the OP's Our Lives Matter, and why is the former "racist" when it is isn't and the latter is fine and no different to the former?

What have the speech police changed the rules to today?

Click to expand...

"All Lives Matter" is not intrinsically racist. It's a general truth we should all teach our children. However...

"All Lives Matter" was stated in response to "Black Lives Matter." BLM was founded, not based on the question: Whose lives matter? but on the observation: Black lives apparently don't matter. Responding, therefore, to "Black Lives Matter" with "All Lives Matter" was a change of topic away from the struggles black Americans face.

As AirPo points out, his OP was carefully worded not as a response to the statement "Black Lives Matter."

Willtor said:

"All Lives Matter" is not intrinsically racist. It's a general truth we should all teach our children. However...

"All Lives Matter" was stated in response to "Black Lives Matter." BLM was founded, not based on the question: Whose lives matter? but on the observation: Black lives apparently don't matter. Responding, therefore, to "Black Lives Matter" with "All Lives Matter" was a change of topic away from the struggles black Americans face.

As AirPo points out, his OP was carefully worded not as a response to the statement "Black Lives Matter."

Click to expand...

It's saying that no-one's lives should be harmed and that's worth aiming for.

Again, you have not established any difference between what the OP said and statements that All Lives Matter.

I admire the OP's sentiment, but it seems rather arbitrary and hypocritical that he isn't having people jumping down his throat for saying in effect that all lives matter. This is nothing different to what people more critical of BLM have been saying *all along*.

All you seem to be doing is making a value judgement on similar statements from the "other" side of this debate that is little more than a uncharitable assumption of poor faith.

AirPo said:

Try reading it again.

Click to expand...

is saying "a big FU to" black people as you put it *not* racist now?

Gadarene said:

It's saying that no-one's lives should be harmed and that's worth aiming for.

Again, you have not established any difference between what the OP said and statements that All Lives Matter.

I admire the OP's sentiment, but it seems rather arbitrary and hypocritical that he isn't having people jumping down his throat for saying in effect that all lives matter. All you seem to be doing is making a value judgement on similar statements from the "other" side of this debate that is little more than a uncharitable assumption of poor faith.

Click to expand...

I say it because "All Lives Matter" became a thing after "Black Lives Matter" and often through defacing of BLM posters. It was a response.

Now, you may never have responded to "Black Lives Matter" or any discussion of the matter with "All Lives Matter" but that's the history of it.

Willtor said:

I say it because "All Lives Matter" became a thing after "Black Lives Matter" and often through defacing of BLM posters. It was a response.

Now, you may never have responded to "Black Lives Matter" or any discussion of the matter with "All Lives Matter" but that's the history of it.

Click to expand...

Ahhhh ok. So because a handful of ALM people did something bad, we can assume ALM is problematic in itself.

I'll remember that the next time some BLM people go off on one.

Gadarene said:

Ahhhh ok. So because a handful of ALM people did something bad, we can assume ALM is problematic in itself.

I'll remember that the next time some BLM people go off on one.

Click to expand...

No, this is different from what I said.

Incidentally, this is why I say that someone talked to you about this but you didn't understand what was being said.

AirPo said:

Of course he did. It's either being ignored on purpose or is beyond comprehension.

Click to expand...

You've not made any distinction between the two other than to assert it! My goodness, what an idle argument you have here

Would you like to use another life line, because ask the audience hasn't help at all?

Click to expand...

It's scarcely a surprise to me that people agitating for equality are going to be completely hypocritical.

Willtor said:

No, this is different from what I said.

Click to expand...

How? Be specific, don't assert.

Incidentally, this is why I say that someone talked to you about this but you didn't understand what was being said.

Click to expand...

You can say that, but you haven't actually demonstrated anything.

Frankly, I get tired of the rules of discussion of this topic changing by the day. There is no bloody difference between Our Lives Matter and All Lives Matter other than your attempt to tar the latter by association with a few whackos ("the history of it"? Please!) - the same approach that BLM fans whine about when done to them.

If you're serious about this equality thing, drop the dishonesty and the double standards. People might have a bit more support for your point of view that way.