- Jun 26, 2004
- 17,358
- 3,625
- Country
- Canada
- Faith
- Protestant
- Marital Status
- Married
- Politics
- CA-Others
Just looking for a roll call. Check in and say something. What lead you to Amil?
Your scriptures proving A-Mill, do not do that at all.The key point in 1 Corinthians 15 is that when Jesus comes back, his reign ends (he delivers the kingdom to the Father). Which means he comes back at the end of the thousand years, not the beginning. And the key point in Acts 3:21 is that Jesus does not come back to earth until the time of the restoration of heaven and earth. Which also happens of course after the thousand years.
First of all, they're not my scriptures. You can read them too. Secondly if the "restoration of all things" does not mean the restoration of heaven and earth then I don't know what does.Your scriptures proving A-Mill, do not do that at all.
Acts 3:21 speaks of the restoration of God's rule of mankind, the end of our messed up self governance and the commencement of King Jesus' 1000 year reign.
The verse itself and the context of that verse don't fit the New Heaven New Earth scenario.
Now you're just making things up. It doesn't say anything about "Jesus must reign on earth first".The same for 1 Corinthians 15:24, Jesus must reign on earth first, deposing every other sovereignty and power.
Yes, he reigns until he has put all enemies under his feet, including death. That's what happens at the resurrection. The resurrection is literally the end of death, as we all come to life. And that happens on the last day, just as Jesus promised.1 Corinthians 15:25 For He is destined to reign until He has put all His enemies under His feet.
Er,.. no. You just have to understand that Revelation is written in the style of progressive parallelism, and you also have to admit that it says nothing about reigning on earth. (I know admitting that is a tough one for you guys, but the first step is always admitting you have a problem.)Then to believe A-Mill, you must deny Revelation 20:
There are no such references. You're confusing prophecies of the new earth, with the thousand year reign. And how does Luke 13:32 fit into this?all the references to a literal 1000 year reign of Jesus, His goal and reward, as Jesus said in Luke 13:32b
Right. Except of course for Acts 3:21 and 1 Corinthians 15. There you don't believe what the prophets say. You know God will restore all things, yet when you come across a verse that literally says God will restore all things you claim "it's talking about something else!!". Right. You can disagree with me all you want about the millennium, but don't claim that you "just believe what the prophets actually say".FYI, I am not a pre, mid or post anything, just a believer of what the prophets actually say.
The context of Acts 3:21 refutes your NHNE claim. Verses 19-20 talks about repentance and a time of recovery, when the Messiah will come. But for now He is in heaven until the Appointed time of restoration..... That restoration, rejoining is the prophesied and not yet happened fulfillment of Ezekiel 37 and the many prophesied Second Exodus of all the Lord's people into the holy Land. Isaiah 11:11See also how in Revelation 21 we see the fulfillment of Acts 3:21
Revelation 21:5
I am making everything new!
I used a bit of logic, obviously Jesus must reign physically in order for those powers to be deposed.Now you're just making things up. It doesn't say anything about "Jesus must reign on earth first".
The resurrection of the saints will happen at the Return. Revelation 20:4Yes, he reigns until he has put all enemies under his feet, including death. That's what happens at the resurrection. The resurrection is literally the end of death, as we all come to life. And that happens on the last day, just as Jesus promised.
Progressive Parallelism? Where did you drag that up from? I understand Revelation OK, without resorting to such notions. Yes, it does have later details that refer to previous prophesies, not too hard to sort it and get the full picture.Er,.. no. You just have to understand that Revelation is written in the style of progressive parallelism,
You stepped in a sloppy cowpat there and then made yourself look silly by saying we Millennists have a problem. Check Revelation 5:10 and Revelation 7:1-9 is an earthly scene.and you also have to admit that it says nothing about reigning on earth. (I know admitting that is a tough one for you guys, but the first step is always admitting you have a problem.)
Revelation 20:3-6 says 4 times, there will be a thousand year reign of Jesus.There are no such references. You're confusing prophecies of the new earth, with the thousand year reign. And how does Luke 13:32 fit into this?
After many years of intensive study, I can say I do have a good understanding of what the prophets wrote. I see a coherent and logical progression of events, leading up to the Eternal state.You can disagree with me all you want about the millennium, but don't claim that you "just believe what the prophets actually say".
1 Corinthians 15:23 says things will happen in their proper order and from that chapter and other scriptures, we know the end comes after the Millennium reign of Jesus.Tell me. Does 1 Corinthians 15 not say that when Jesus comes, we are resurrected? And does it not also say that then the end will come? And does he not at that time hand over the kingdom to the Father? How could you possibly claim it doesn't say those things?
Sure, you and many others prefer to believe there will be no Millennium reign of Jesus on earth.I don't think it says what you think it says Keras.
Those things will come to pass, of course. They're in scripture, so we believe them to be true. However, they're all references to the renewed earth, not the thousand years.Sure, you and many others prefer to believe there will be no Millennium reign of Jesus on earth.
I prefer to believe there will be the time when Psalms 93:1-5, Isaiah 60:17-22, Psalms 102:21-22, Isaiah 11:1-9, Isaiah 33:20-24, Micah 4:1-5, Zechariah 9:10, will come to pass.
Wise in your own conceits. Unwilling to learn about a new concept? Maybe you should research progressive parallelism in Revelation before you dismiss it. Don't be so arrogant to think you have it all figured out and couldn't possibly be wrong. First honestly consider all the facts and all the angles.Progressive Parallelism? Where did you drag that up from? I understand Revelation OK, without resorting to such notions.
And how many times does it say the thousand year reign will be on earth? Zero.Revelation 20:3-6 says 4 times, there will be a thousand year reign of Jesus.
Many years of study does not guarantee you've got it right. I know many people who've been "studying" for many years and still don't understand some basic concepts because they're approaching scripture with a certain mindset. Your mindset is based on a chronological reading of Revelation. That's your first mistake. All your other mistakes are a result of that.After many years of intensive study, I can say I do have a good understanding of what the prophets wrote. I see a coherent and logical progression of events, leading up to the Eternal state.
You see? You need to insert large gaps between phrases in 1 Corinthians 15 in order for your understanding to fit. Large gaps that are not actually indicated in scripture.1 Corinthians 15:23 says things will happen in their proper order and from that chapter and other scriptures, we know the end comes after the Millennium reign of Jesus.
1 Corinthians 15:23 says things will happen in their proper order and from that chapter and other scriptures, we know the end comes after the Millennium reign of Jesus.
And how many times does it say the thousand year reign will be on earth? Zero.