In the Name of Allah

cenimo

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"In the name of Allah" [font="verdana, arial, helvetica"]<B>Lawmakers snub imam's
opening prayer</B>
State rep cites Islam's tie to terrorism: 'My god is not Muhammad'

Posted: March 4, 2003
3:24 p.m. Eastern

<I>© 2003 WorldNetDaily.com</I> [/font]

Two lawmakers refused to participate in a Muslim cleric's opening prayer at a session of the Washington state legislature yesterday.

Calling it "an issue of patriotism," Rep. Lois McMahan, a Republican from Gig Harbor, near Tacoma, said her decision to remain at the back of the House chamber instead of at her desk was not a protest, but a personal decision because "the religion is the focal point of the hate-America sentiment in the world."

"My god is not Muhammad," McMahan said in an interview with the Seattle Post-Intelligencer.

"The Islamic religion is so . . . part and parcel with the attack on America. I just didn't want to be there, be a part of that," she said. "Even though the mainstream Islamic religion doesn't profess to hate America, nonetheless it spawns the groups that hate America."

The Seattle paper said McMahan and Rep. Cary Condotta, a Republican from Eastern Washington, left the floor during the prayer.

But McMahan's spokesman, Scott Peterson, told WorldNetDaily that McMahan already had left the floor to get a drink of water and decided not to return for the prayer.

"She wasn't being confrontational, the way it's being portrayed," Peterson said, noting that about 30 of the 98 representatives were absent from their desks for various reasons. "She didn't necessarily want to make a public statement. It was more of a personal point, something she felt she had to do for herself."

The director of the interfaith group that schedules the clerics for the prayers said she was "embarrassed to know that some of our legislators can't even treat someone with that common respect," the Post-Intelligencer reported.

"He's an American citizen and he's praying for their work, then how can it be an act of patriotism to walk away?" said Kathy Erlandson of Associated Ministries of Thurston County.

Peterson said the issue will come up again tomorrow and Friday. Since this is "Muslim week" for the opening prayers, an Islamic cleric also will pray at the beginning of those sessions.

"She hasn't decided what she's going to do," Peterson told WND. "But she would never turn her back on a man of faith and walk out."

The Council on American-Islamic Relations, a Muslim lobby group in Washington, D.C., issued a statement today calling on state and national Republican leaders to condemn the lawmakers' actions and apologize to Washington's Muslim community.

"How many times must American Muslims ask Republican leaders to repudiate Islamophobic hate within their own ranks?" said the group's executive director, Nihad Awad. "Americans must not allow the actions of a few, whatever their positions of authority, to divide our nation along religious and ethnic lines. Such divisive actions by elected leaders can only serve to increase discrimination against ordinary American Muslims and harm our nation's image and interests worldwide."

<B>'In the name of Allah' </B>

Imam Mohamad Joban, of the Islamic Center of Olympia, presented yesterday's brief opening prayer, the Seattle paper said.

The Muslim cleric said, in part: "We open this session of House of Representatives in the name of Allah, the one God of Abraham, God of Moses, God of Jesus, and God of Muhammad, peace be upon them all. . . . We ask Allah or God to bless the state of Washington so it may continue to prosper and become a symbol of peace and tranquility for people of all ethnic and religious backgrounds. We pray that Allah may guide this House in making good decisions for the people of Washington.

"At this time, we also pray that America may succeed in the war against terrorism. We pray to God that the war may end with world peace and tranquility."


The Seattle paper reported that Condotta, who also remained at the back of the room, declined to comment further except to offer: "Let's just say I wasn't particularly interested."

The Muslim cleric, Joban, said the lawmakers' actions were not hurtful, but ignorant, the Seattle daily reported.

"They're unable to distinguish between Islam as religion and way of life, and bad Muslims," said Joban, who also has opened a session of the Senate. "They are easily able to distinguish between Christianity and bad Christians.

"They need to understand that like [President] Bush said . . . Islam is a peaceful religion."

Joban said he would accept another invitation to give the prayer: "Even if half of them leave it's OK for me. As a Muslim we have to respect what people believe and . . . we have to forgive something because of ignorance."

"The Holy Quran," added Joban, says that one should "always respond to bad action with good and those who used to be enemies become friends."

target=_blank>http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/a...RTICLE_ID=31350
http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=31350

[font="verdana, arial, helvetica"]__________________
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cenimo

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My input...

No great mystery that some here are going to quickly come to the defense of the idea of letting the Imam say the prayer to open the session...

and it is also even less of a mysterey that had the opening prayer been by a Christian preacher and a couple of representatives refused to say the prayer many here would immediately come to their defense, and therein is the problem, it has to go both ways, not one way.

i.e., oh it's fine for the legislature (a state ligislature in the US) to have an Imam open the session with an Islamic prayer (and thus offend some Christians, Christians don't count on the protected-under-pc list, &nbsp;BUT if the legislature is opened with a Christian prayer THAt may offend some non-Christians in attendance.

No one can say this is not one -sided, not when malarkey like this goes on.&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;

&nbsp;
 
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Michael0701

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While I can understand the point she was trying to make, I don't think that the imam's god is muhammad, I believe their god is called allah. If she's going to protest she should at least get the names right ;)
 
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Morat

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.e., oh it's fine for the legislature (a state ligislature in the US) to have an Imam open the session with an Islamic prayer (and thus offend some Christians, Christians don't count on the protected-under-pc list, BUT if the legislature is opened with a Christian prayer THAt may offend some non-Christians in attendance.

No one can say this is not one -sided, not when malarkey like this goes on.
What world do you live in? Every legislature I'm aware of, including the Federal one, opens with a prayer. Generally by their own personal chaplain.

The Courts have always thrown that in the "reasonable adult" and "ceremonial deism" boxes.
 
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cenimo

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mala

looking in to other dimensions? hardly

all you have to do is pay attenton to the news...let's see, prayer at the football game last year, graduation ceremonies, etc..etc..ad nauseam...

but how soon we forget

&nbsp;

komatsumatsu...

Japanese martial arts term, roughly translates to "born unconscious, died while still sleeping", the way many go through life
 
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cenimo writes: "...U.S. legislatures don't normally open with an Islamic prayer."

Well, since we are so fond in this country of our little displays of public, Pharisaic religiosity, perhaps we should have more Islamic prayers in our legislatures. Hindu prayers, too. In fact, let's go down the entire list of religions/deities that Americans subscribe to and let everyone take a turn, and let's do it on the taxpayer's (your) dime. Perhaps then you'll begin to understand what the rest of us object to every time our tax money is used to offer prayers to Yahweh, however euphemistically he may be referred to by the chaplain.

Of course, the moment we start giving equal time and dignity to other faith systems in our public institutions, certain members of the Christian majority will lose no time bleating about the evils of political correctness and bemoaning the unfairness of it all. *Gasp* You mean Americans of other faiths want equal time in our representative and administrative institutions? Perish the thought!

It's one of two things. Publicly sponsered prayers are either truly instances of ceremonial deism, in which case it shouldn't much matter to people which deity or deities are being prayed to since it's just empty posturing, or the cd argument is a whitewash and it really does "matter" how prayers are being offered up, in which case it is blatantly unconstitutional because of the inevitable exclusivity.

Or, as I mentioned before, we could sensibly opt for none of the above.
 
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cenimo

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at least they have the freedom to practice what they want to here...why can't they be satisfied with that instead of trying to take over?

try demanding your right to practice another faith in an Islamic country and see what happens...
 
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notto

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Today at 11:16 PM cenimo said this in Post #11 (http://www.christianforums.com/showthread.php?postid=693192#post693192)

at least they have the freedom to practice what they want to here...why can't they be satisfied with that instead of trying to take over?

try demanding your right to practice another faith in an Islamic country and see what happens...

Who is "they"?

You seem to be confusing Muslims in America with Muslim dictatorships in other countries. Freedom of Religion is one of the main reasons they come here to escape the regimes in those countries. They love America just like the rest of us because of that freedom. Perhaps we should respect them as fellow Americans, no?

I think the Muslims in question in this story handled the situation with a great deal of dignity and respect and they were right on target that it was done out of ignorance (Muhammad as God?). I would hope that if anyone walked out on a Christian prayer for similar reasons, that it would be handled as respectfully by the Christians who were leading it, but I have my doubts. Treat others as you would want to be treated. Works every time.
 
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Dewjunkie

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Perhaps these lawmakers are forgetting that there are many law-abiding, peaceful, voting Americans of Muslim faith that they represent in their jobs. This story sure does a good job of refuting the "ugly American" image and promoting our heralded "freedom of expression".
 
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Doctrine1st

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She calls it an act of "Patriotism" rather than simply not recognizing a prayer that is not of her particular faith. The Patriotism quip is an obvious inference to the tieing and comdemning all Muslims in light of 9/11.

Anyway, what happen to Jesus teaching of praying in private as to not be seen as hypocrites as the Pharisees? If anyone who is exacly what Jesus was speaking of it's politicians and prayer.
 
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crazyfingers

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Today at 02:37 PM cenimo said this in Post #2


i.e., oh it's fine for the legislature (a state ligislature in the US) to have an Imam open the session with an Islamic prayer (and thus offend some Christians, Christians don't count on the protected-under-pc list, &nbsp;BUT if the legislature is opened with a Christian prayer THAt may offend some non-Christians in attendance.

No one can say this is not one -sided, not when malarkey like this goes on.&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;

&nbsp;

You did notice that they have some kind of prayers every day? I'd bet you that Christian prayer represents about... 99.9% of the opening prayers. Well, perhaps the worldnetdaily story wasn't clear on that.

This is a bit more clear.


The daily prayer is given at the opening of each Senate and House floor session by someone selected by Associated Ministries of Thurston County. Director Kathy Erlandson said she was disappointed.

&nbsp;The Boston Globe

You really need to use news from some other source than the Worldnetdaily.

Of course the right solution is not to mix civil government and religious worship.&nbsp; Nothing good comes when the two are mixed.
 
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mala

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Yesterday at 11:43 PM Dewjunkie said this in Post #14

Perhaps these lawmakers are forgetting that there are many law-abiding, peaceful, voting Americans of Muslim faith that they represent in their jobs. This story sure does a good job of refuting the "ugly American" image and promoting our heralded "freedom of expression".

from what i can tell, one of those lawmakers could care less who is part of her constituency but rather scared of anyone who is different than her.
 
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Very interesting thread. This situation reminds me a little of Daniel refusing to bow although a better testimony would have been for the representative to say that she only prays or bows to one God and no others.
I have no idea what this representative's views are just from this story. However, I am always sceptical of news reports that depict elected officials as ignorant since it requires a fair amount of education and intelligence to get elected to such an office.
Obviously, some details about the muslim religion were inaccurate according to the quotes given but this is hardly conclusive proof that she is bigoted or ignorant.
I stand behind her right to abstain from the prayer and if I were her PR advisor would reccomend against any future interviews or comments like the ones cited. It is simply a wisdom issue in politics to not give ammo to opponents.
I do find it interesting though.
 
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David Gould

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I work at Australia's federal parliament and can report that you do NOT need to be educated or intelligent to get elected. Most of the people elected to parliament are relatively intelligent, and some of them are very smart indeed, but some of them are dumb as a box of hammers.

It is after all a representative system, and some of the population are also dumb as a box of hammers.

&nbsp;;)
 
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