Jeremiah 17:9

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seeingeyes

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Thanks for the reply. :)

Let me be more specific.

New International Version (©1984)
The heart is deceitful above all things and beyond cure. Who can understand it?
Click to expand...
This seems to say that the heart is primarily deceitful. (More 'deceitful' than, say, 'kind', or 'murderous', or 'selfish', or any attribute. Or that 'deceitfulness' is the main attribute of the heart.)
New American Standard Bible (©1995)
"The heart is more deceitful than all else And is desperately sick; Who can understand it?
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This one seems to say that the heart is more deceitful than anything else. (No other thing is more deceitful than the heart.)
King James Bible (Cambridge Ed.)
The heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked: who can know it?
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This one uses 'wickedness' rather than 'sickness' to describe the heart. (Though the Hebrew doesn't have a word for either 'wickedness' or 'sickness' here, so I'm wondering if one of those meanings is implied in the Hebrew for 'desperately')
 
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seeingeyes said:
Thanks for the reply. :)

Let me be more specific.

This seems to say that the heart is primarily deceitful. (More 'deceitful' than, say, 'kind', or 'murderous', or 'selfish', or any attribute. Or that 'deceitfulness' is the main attribute of the heart.)
This one seems to say that the heart is more deceitful than anything else. (No other thing is more deceitful than the heart.)
This one uses 'wickedness' rather than 'sickness' to describe the heart. (Though the Hebrew doesn't have a word for either 'wickedness' or 'sickness' here, so I'm wondering if one of those meanings is implied in the Hebrew for 'desperately')
Click to expand...
Not sure what you mean...but I see the point is the way each translation says the verse

NIV - Understand the NIV is a "dynamic equivalence" translation. How it says it makes the point though, because the conclusion is the heart is incurable without the help of God.

NASB - "desperately sick" is also acceptable literally, the NASB 95 translates it most correct.

KJV - "wicked" according to Blue Letter Bible - Blue Letter Bible - Lexicon

As you can see from Blue Letter Bible, all translations are acceptable, though I think the NIV and NASB 95 translate it better than the KJV
 
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pshun2404

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In its context

Septuagint

17:7 But blessed is the man who trusts in the Lord, and whose hope the Lord shall be.

17:8 And he shall be as a thriving tree by the waters, and he shall cast forth his root toward a moist place: he shall not fear when heat comes, and there shall be upon him shady branches: he shall not fear in a year of drought, and he shall not fail to bear fruit.

17:9 The heart is deep beyond all things, and it is the man, and who can fathom him?

17:10 I the Lord try the hearts, and prove the reins, to give to every one according to his ways, and according to the fruits of his devices.

Pre-JPS Masoretic

17:7 Blessed is the man that trusts in the LORD, and whose hope the LORD is.

17:8 For he shall be as a tree planted by the waters, and that spreads out her roots by the river, and shall not see when heat comes, but her leaf shall be green; and shall not be careful in the year of drought, neither shall cease from yielding fruit.

17:9 The heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked: who can know it?

17:10 I the LORD search the heart, I try the reins, even to give every man according to his ways, and according to the fruit of his doings.

Paul
 
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seeingeyes

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pshun2404 said:
17:9 The heart is deep beyond all things, and it is the man, and who can fathom him?


17:9 The heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked: who can know it?
Click to expand...

Huh. 'Deep' beyond all things...

When I read this verse in context it seems to be contrasting the cloudiness of the human heart with the clarity of our God. (As opposed to it's usual status as a 'proof text' of the universal wickedness of the heart of man.) The Septuagint seems to support that idea.
 
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Mark51

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This is a warning that those seeking to please God must give attention not merely to what is acceptable conduct to others but to the kind of person they really are, the inner self.

A person may have been a Christian for many years, have a fine knowledge of the Bible, and feel confident that they can safely handle any situation that may arise. Yet, although knowing full well that an act is wrong and specifically condemned by God’s law, thoughts and desires that are secretly cherished may be an enticement to sinful action.

For these reasons a Christian, though he may consider themselves mature, must remember the treachery that their hearts can display and must, therefore, exercise great care not to place themselves in the way of temptation.-Matthew 6:13; 1Corinthians 10:8-12.
 
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pshun2404 said:
In its context

Septuagint

17:7 But blessed is the man who trusts in the Lord, and whose hope the Lord shall be.

17:8 And he shall be as a thriving tree by the waters, and he shall cast forth his root toward a moist place: he shall not fear when heat comes, and there shall be upon him shady branches: he shall not fear in a year of drought, and he shall not fail to bear fruit.

17:9 The heart is deep beyond all things, and it is the man, and who can fathom him?

17:10 I the Lord try the hearts, and prove the reins, to give to every one according to his ways, and according to the fruits of his devices.

Pre-JPS Masoretic

17:7 Blessed is the man that trusts in the LORD, and whose hope the LORD is.

17:8 For he shall be as a tree planted by the waters, and that spreads out her roots by the river, and shall not see when heat comes, but her leaf shall be green; and shall not be careful in the year of drought, neither shall cease from yielding fruit.

17:9 The heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked: who can know it?

17:10 I the LORD search the heart, I try the reins, even to give every man according to his ways, and according to the fruit of his doings.

Paul
Click to expand...

The Septuagint translation in the Orthodox Study Bible has different verse numbering - not sure why. It looks like you used the Brenton translation. The OSB has a note regarding verse 9 (5 in the OSB), The heart is deep beyond all things: "St. John Chrysostom labors the point that only God can know men's hearts, citing Ps 7:9, 1Kg 16:7; 2Chr 6:30; and Mt 9:3,4"


Oh let the wickedness of sinners come to an end; and then thou shalt direct the righteous, O God that searchest the hearts and reins.

- Psalm 7:9 LXX


But the Lord said to Samuel, Look not on his appearance, nor on his stature, for I have rejected him; for God sees not as a man looks; for man looks at the outward appearance, but God looks at the heart.

- 1 Kingdoms 16:7 LXX


Then shalt thou hear from heaven, out of thy prepared dwelling-place, and shalt be merciful, and shalt recompense to the man according to his ways, as thou shalt know his heart to be; for thou alone knowest the heart of the children of men:

- 2 Chronicles 6:30 LXX


And, behold, certain of the scribes said within themselves, This man blasphemeth. And Jesus knowing their thoughts said, Wherefore think ye evil in your hearts?

- Matthew 9:3–4​
 
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