Romans 14:4-6

Gregory Wilson

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Hello Friends,

So I've come across another verse that casts some shadows on God's command to keep the Sabbath. This is Romans 14:4-6, NASB:

"4 - Who are you to judge the servant of another? To his own master he stands or falls; and he will stand, for the Lord is able to make him stand.

5 - One person regards one day above another, another regards every day alike. Each person must be fully convinced in his own mind.

6 - He who observes the day, observes it for the Lord, and he who eats, does so for the Lord, for he gives thanks to God; and he who eats not, for the Lord he does not eat, and gives thanks to God.
"

So... It seems Paul is saying that it is ok that some people regard every day alike. He says "Each person must be fully convinced in his own mind." He could've said, "Let everyone observe the Sabbath day."

Any thoughts?

Thank you,

-Greg
 

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Hello Friends,

So I've come across another verse that casts some shadows on God's command to keep the Sabbath. This is Romans 14:4-6, NASB:

"4 - Who are you to judge the servant of another? To his own master he stands or falls; and he will stand, for the Lord is able to make him stand.

5 - One person regards one day above another, another regards every day alike. Each person must be fully convinced in his own mind.

6 - He who observes the day, observes it for the Lord, and he who eats, does so for the Lord, for he gives thanks to God; and he who eats not, for the Lord he does not eat, and gives thanks to God.
"

So... It seems Paul is saying that it is ok that some people regard every day alike. He says "Each person must be fully convinced in his own mind." He could've said, "Let everyone observe the Sabbath day."

Any thoughts?

Thank you,

-Greg


One HAS to stop reading scripture from the gentile mind. Paul was not a gentile. He was an observant Pharisee who delighted in Messiah Yeshua.

Acts 21 forever settles the debate as to if Paul observed Torah when James tells Paul in order to PROVE:

"take them and purify yourself along with them, and pay their expenses so that they may shave their heads; and all will know that there is nothing to the things which they have been told about you, but that you yourself also walk orderly, keeping the Law."

So when you read Romans it is imperative that you understand that Paul is teaching from a belief that scripture tells us what IS and what IS NOT food.

What Paul is NOT saying is the following; Hey, guys if a believer is weak in faith its okay if they eat pork, crustaceans and shellfish.

What Paul is NOT saying is: If a believer wants to worship on Sunday and do away with Sabbath that's fine, its not that important. In Galatia Jews (non believers) were accosting gentile believers about HOW they were observing and attempting to lay upon them the burden imposed by the pharisee's. Some of which were the very things Yeshua blasted the pharisee's over.

What Paul is saying is basically the same thing he is saying to the Galatians... dont allow someone to judge you on HOW you keep the sabbath. Dont allow someone (including yourself) to judge you on which appointed time is supposedly more important.

Remember that Yeshua railed against the Pharisee's because they were setting aside some of the commandments in favor of their tradition.

This is what Paul is talking about.

G-d tells us what is and is not food. Even to this day science is showing that eating Pork may not be good for you.

http://www.conspiracyclub.co/2015/05/25/why-you-shouldnt-eat-pork-2/


http://draxe.com/why-you-should-avoid-pork/

http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2012/12/12/eating-pork.aspx

As we conduct more scientific study we discover that the things listed to abstain from eating are just frankly not good for us.

One of the things a believer MUST settle in their own minds (hopefully by a complete study of what G-D has to say on the matter) is Sabbath and the appointed times.

#1 Sabbath is a part of the creation. It predates any notion of the Jewish Law.

#1 The feast days are G-d's appointed times. They are not feast days of the Jews but rather, scripture declares they are G-d's appointed times. If they are HIS days then they are for US as believers today PERIOD.
 
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dfw69

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Hello Friends,

So I've come across another verse that casts some shadows on God's command to keep the Sabbath. This is Romans 14:4-6, NASB:

"4 - Who are you to judge the servant of another? To his own master he stands or falls; and he will stand, for the Lord is able to make him stand.

5 - One person regards one day above another, another regards every day alike. Each person must be fully convinced in his own mind.

6 - He who observes the day, observes it for the Lord, and he who eats, does so for the Lord, for he gives thanks to God; and he who eats not, for the Lord he does not eat, and gives thanks to God.
"

So... It seems Paul is saying that it is ok that some people regard every day alike. He says "Each person must be fully convinced in his own mind." He could've said, "Let everyone observe the Sabbath day."

Any thoughts?

Thank you,

-Greg

I agree to what it seems to say ..:)
 
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Romans 14:1 HNV - "Now receive one who is weak in faith, but not for disputes over opinions."

Those who were recent believers still held onto old customs such as mandatory vegetarianism as seen in latter verses. Vegetarianism was very prominent in Ancient Greece.

"In Greece during classical antiquity the vegetarian diet was called abstinence from beings with a soul (Greek ἀποχὴ ἐμψύχων). As a principle or deliberate way of life it was always limited to a rather small number of practitioners belonging to specific philosophical schools or certain religious groups." -Wikipedia


Romans 14:2 HNV - "One man has faith to eat all things, but he who is weak eats only vegetables."


What does "all things" mean? Well the Greek word is "pas" which means:

  1. individually
    1. each, every, any, all, the whole, everyone, all things, everything
  2. collectively
    1. some of all types
I am not going to get into "pas" extensively, but I will be posting a commentary on 1 Timothy 4 as well so it can be understood better, but for now I will render "pas" as "some of all types" or "collectively" which refers to the foods define in Lev. 11. This will be covered on my 1 Timothy 4 commentary.

Romans 14:3 HNV - "Don't let him who eats despise him who doesn't eat. Don't let him who doesn't eat judge him who eats, for God has received him."

Now we see something different here. Now, Paul is talking about fasting. In fasting, we esteem a day by fasting on it. Look at the next few verses.

Romans 14:4 HNV - "Who are you who judge another's servant? To his own lord he stands or falls. Yes, he will be made to stand, for God has power to make him stand."

Once we understand now it is about fasting, we should see that this verse says we should not judge others for fasting or not fasting on certain days.

Romans 14:5 HNV - "One man esteems one day as more important. Another esteems every day alike. Let each man be fully assured in his own mind."

Notice how it says "man" not "God". God esteems his holy days:

Leviticus 23:2 HNV - ""Speak to the children of Yisra'el, and tell them, 'The set feasts of the LORD, which you shall proclaim to be holy convocations, even these are my set feasts."

Leviticus 23:4 HNV - ""'These are the set feasts of the LORD, even holy convocations, which you shall proclaim in their appointed season."

Leviticus 23:37 HNV - ""'These are the appointed feasts of the LORD, which you shall proclaim to be holy convocations, to offer an offering made by fire to the LORD, a burnt offering, and a meal offering, a sacrifice, and drink offerings, each on its own day;"

Leviticus 23:44 HNV - "Moshe declared to the children of Yisra'el the appointed feasts of the LORD."


So in context, Paul is not talking about feast days but days in general. Some people fast on Monday, some one Wednesday, or some on Friday.


Romans 14:6 HNV - " He who observes the day, observes it to the Lord; and he who does not observe the day, to the Lord he does not observe it. He who eats, eats to the Lord, for he gives God thanks. He who doesn't eat, to the Lord he doesn't eat, and gives God thanks."

Like I said, the context is fasting. Therefore, once read with that context, we see that some fast while some do not.

Romans 14:13 HNV - "Therefore let's not judge one another any more, but judge this rather, that no man put a stumbling block in his brother's way, or an occasion for falling."

Romans 14:14 HNV - "I know, and am persuaded in the Lord Yeshua, that nothing is unclean of itself; except that to him who considers anything to be unclean, to him it is unclean."

Now we switch gears again, this is similar to that of a conclusion to the vegetarian and fasting issues. The vegetarians viewed meat as "unclean" or unfit to eat. I know this is going to be hard to grasp without 1 Timothy 4, but bare with me. Remember "pas"? (I will cover this topic more extensively, there is a lot more I wish to say) It can refer to a specific type of food. This verse is referring to that food. Therefore, this verse is showing that you cannot call food

Romans 14:15 HNV - "Yet if because of food your brother is grieved, you walk no longer in love. Don't destroy with your food him for whom Messiah died."

Romans 14:20 HNV - "Don't overthrow God's work for food's sake. All things indeed are clean, however it is evil for that man who creates a stumbling block by eating."

Romans 14:21 HNV - "It is good to not eat meat, drink wine, nor do anything by which your brother stumbles, is offended, or is made weak."

Again, 1 Timothy 4 is needed to understand this chapter due to it's correlations. But, what it is saying is that we should not eat food (some of a type or clean) if it displeases someone such as a vegetarian. "All things" is "pas" again which could mean collectively or some of a type.
 
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Romans 14:1 HNV - "Now receive one who is weak in faith, but not for disputes over opinions."

Those who were recent believers still held onto old customs such as mandatory vegetarianism as seen in latter verses. Vegetarianism was very prominent in Ancient Greece.

"In Greece during classical antiquity the vegetarian diet was called abstinence from beings with a soul (Greek ἀποχὴ ἐμψύχων). As a principle or deliberate way of life it was always limited to a rather small number of practitioners belonging to specific philosophical schools or certain religious groups." -Wikipedia


Romans 14:2 HNV - "One man has faith to eat all things, but he who is weak eats only vegetables."


What does "all things" mean? Well the Greek word is "pas" which means:

  1. individually
    1. each, every, any, all, the whole, everyone, all things, everything
  2. collectively
    1. some of all types
I am not going to get into "pas" extensively, but I will be posting a commentary on 1 Timothy 4 as well so it can be understood better, but for now I will render "pas" as "some of all types" or "collectively" which refers to the foods define in Lev. 11. This will be covered on my 1 Timothy 4 commentary.

Romans 14:3 HNV - "Don't let him who eats despise him who doesn't eat. Don't let him who doesn't eat judge him who eats, for God has received him."

Now we see something different here. Now, Paul is talking about fasting. In fasting, we esteem a day by fasting on it. Look at the next few verses.

Romans 14:4 HNV - "Who are you who judge another's servant? To his own lord he stands or falls. Yes, he will be made to stand, for God has power to make him stand."

Once we understand now it is about fasting, we should see that this verse says we should not judge others for fasting or not fasting on certain days.

Romans 14:5 HNV - "One man esteems one day as more important. Another esteems every day alike. Let each man be fully assured in his own mind."

Notice how it says "man" not "God". God esteems his holy days:

Leviticus 23:2 HNV - ""Speak to the children of Yisra'el, and tell them, 'The set feasts of the LORD, which you shall proclaim to be holy convocations, even these are my set feasts."

Leviticus 23:4 HNV - ""'These are the set feasts of the LORD, even holy convocations, which you shall proclaim in their appointed season."

Leviticus 23:37 HNV - ""'These are the appointed feasts of the LORD, which you shall proclaim to be holy convocations, to offer an offering made by fire to the LORD, a burnt offering, and a meal offering, a sacrifice, and drink offerings, each on its own day;"

Leviticus 23:44 HNV - "Moshe declared to the children of Yisra'el the appointed feasts of the LORD."


So in context, Paul is not talking about feast days but days in general. Some people fast on Monday, some one Wednesday, or some on Friday.


Romans 14:6 HNV - " He who observes the day, observes it to the Lord; and he who does not observe the day, to the Lord he does not observe it. He who eats, eats to the Lord, for he gives God thanks. He who doesn't eat, to the Lord he doesn't eat, and gives God thanks."

Like I said, the context is fasting. Therefore, once read with that context, we see that some fast while some do not.

Romans 14:13 HNV - "Therefore let's not judge one another any more, but judge this rather, that no man put a stumbling block in his brother's way, or an occasion for falling."

Romans 14:14 HNV - "I know, and am persuaded in the Lord Yeshua, that nothing is unclean of itself; except that to him who considers anything to be unclean, to him it is unclean."

Now we switch gears again, this is similar to that of a conclusion to the vegetarian and fasting issues. The vegetarians viewed meat as "unclean" or unfit to eat. I know this is going to be hard to grasp without 1 Timothy 4, but bare with me. Remember "pas"? (I will cover this topic more extensively, there is a lot more I wish to say) It can refer to a specific type of food. This verse is referring to that food. Therefore, this verse is showing that you cannot call food

Romans 14:15 HNV - "Yet if because of food your brother is grieved, you walk no longer in love. Don't destroy with your food him for whom Messiah died."

Romans 14:20 HNV - "Don't overthrow God's work for food's sake. All things indeed are clean, however it is evil for that man who creates a stumbling block by eating."

Romans 14:21 HNV - "It is good to not eat meat, drink wine, nor do anything by which your brother stumbles, is offended, or is made weak."

Again, 1 Timothy 4 is needed to understand this chapter due to it's correlations. But, what it is saying is that we should not eat food (some of a type or clean) if it displeases someone such as a vegetarian. "All things" is "pas" again which could mean collectively or some of a type.

That crazy vegan Paul, always boasting his weakness in Messiah . . . :D

Romans 14:2 For one believes that he may eat all things: another, who is weak, eats herbs.

1 Corinthians 1:27 But Elohim has chosen the foolish things of the world to confound the wise; and Elohim has chosen the weak things of the world to confound the things which are mighty:

1 Corinthians 4:10 We are fools for the sake of Messiah, but you are wise in Messiah; we are weak, but you are strong; you are honorable, but we are despised.

2 Corinthians 10:10 For his letters, say they, are weighty and powerful; but his bodily presence is weak, and his speech contemptible.

2 Corinthians 11:21 I speak as concerning reproach, as though we had been weak. Howbeit wherein any is bold, (I speak foolishly) I am bold also.

2 Corinthians 11:29 Who is weak, and I am not weak? who is offended, and I burn not?

2 Corinthians 12:10 Therefore I take pleasure in infirmities, in reproaches, in necessities, in persecutions, in distresses for the sake of Messiah: for when I am weak, then am I strong.

2 Corinthians 13:4 For though he was crucified through weakness, yet he lives by the power of Elohim. For we also are weak in him, but we shall live with him by the power of Elohim toward you.

.
.
 
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Romans 14:1 HNV - "Now receive one who is weak in faith, but not for disputes over opinions."

Those who were recent believers still held onto old customs such as mandatory vegetarianism as seen in latter verses. Vegetarianism was very prominent in Ancient Greece.

"In Greece during classical antiquity the vegetarian diet was called abstinence from beings with a soul (Greek ἀποχὴ ἐμψύχων). As a principle or deliberate way of life it was always limited to a rather small number of practitioners belonging to specific philosophical schools or certain religious groups." -Wikipedia


Romans 14:2 HNV - "One man has faith to eat all things, but he who is weak eats only vegetables."


What does "all things" mean? Well the Greek word is "pas" which means:

  1. individually
    1. each, every, any, all, the whole, everyone, all things, everything
  2. collectively
    1. some of all types
I am not going to get into "pas" extensively, but I will be posting a commentary on 1 Timothy 4 as well so it can be understood better, but for now I will render "pas" as "some of all types" or "collectively" which refers to the foods define in Lev. 11. This will be covered on my 1 Timothy 4 commentary.

Romans 14:3 HNV - "Don't let him who eats despise him who doesn't eat. Don't let him who doesn't eat judge him who eats, for God has received him."

Now we see something different here. Now, Paul is talking about fasting. In fasting, we esteem a day by fasting on it. Look at the next few verses.

Romans 14:4 HNV - "Who are you who judge another's servant? To his own lord he stands or falls. Yes, he will be made to stand, for God has power to make him stand."

Once we understand now it is about fasting, we should see that this verse says we should not judge others for fasting or not fasting on certain days.

Romans 14:5 HNV - "One man esteems one day as more important. Another esteems every day alike. Let each man be fully assured in his own mind."

Notice how it says "man" not "God". God esteems his holy days:

Leviticus 23:2 HNV - ""Speak to the children of Yisra'el, and tell them, 'The set feasts of the LORD, which you shall proclaim to be holy convocations, even these are my set feasts."

Leviticus 23:4 HNV - ""'These are the set feasts of the LORD, even holy convocations, which you shall proclaim in their appointed season."

Leviticus 23:37 HNV - ""'These are the appointed feasts of the LORD, which you shall proclaim to be holy convocations, to offer an offering made by fire to the LORD, a burnt offering, and a meal offering, a sacrifice, and drink offerings, each on its own day;"

Leviticus 23:44 HNV - "Moshe declared to the children of Yisra'el the appointed feasts of the LORD."


So in context, Paul is not talking about feast days but days in general. Some people fast on Monday, some one Wednesday, or some on Friday.


Romans 14:6 HNV - " He who observes the day, observes it to the Lord; and he who does not observe the day, to the Lord he does not observe it. He who eats, eats to the Lord, for he gives God thanks. He who doesn't eat, to the Lord he doesn't eat, and gives God thanks."

Like I said, the context is fasting. Therefore, once read with that context, we see that some fast while some do not.

Romans 14:13 HNV - "Therefore let's not judge one another any more, but judge this rather, that no man put a stumbling block in his brother's way, or an occasion for falling."

Romans 14:14 HNV - "I know, and am persuaded in the Lord Yeshua, that nothing is unclean of itself; except that to him who considers anything to be unclean, to him it is unclean."

Now we switch gears again, this is similar to that of a conclusion to the vegetarian and fasting issues. The vegetarians viewed meat as "unclean" or unfit to eat. I know this is going to be hard to grasp without 1 Timothy 4, but bare with me. Remember "pas"? (I will cover this topic more extensively, there is a lot more I wish to say) It can refer to a specific type of food. This verse is referring to that food. Therefore, this verse is showing that you cannot call food

Romans 14:15 HNV - "Yet if because of food your brother is grieved, you walk no longer in love. Don't destroy with your food him for whom Messiah died."

Romans 14:20 HNV - "Don't overthrow God's work for food's sake. All things indeed are clean, however it is evil for that man who creates a stumbling block by eating."

Romans 14:21 HNV - "It is good to not eat meat, drink wine, nor do anything by which your brother stumbles, is offended, or is made weak."

Again, 1 Timothy 4 is needed to understand this chapter due to it's correlations. But, what it is saying is that we should not eat food (some of a type or clean) if it displeases someone such as a vegetarian. "All things" is "pas" again which could mean collectively or some of a type.
Excellent presentation...
 
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dfw69

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What seems right....
Deuteronomy 12:8
Ye shall not do after all the things that we do here this day, every man whatsoever is right in his own eyes.

I'm responsible for my own salvation .. So I will put my trust in the work of Y'shia for my righteousness and promises and not trust the works of my own hand sis .. This is my faith
 
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Hello Friends,

So I've come across another verse that casts some shadows on God's command to keep the Sabbath. This is Romans 14:4-6, NASB:

"4 - Who are you to judge the servant of another? To his own master he stands or falls; and he will stand, for the Lord is able to make him stand.

5 - One person regards one day above another, another regards every day alike. Each person must be fully convinced in his own mind.

6 - He who observes the day, observes it for the Lord, and he who eats, does so for the Lord, for he gives thanks to God; and he who eats not, for the Lord he does not eat, and gives thanks to God.
"

So... It seems Paul is saying that it is ok that some people regard every day alike. He says "Each person must be fully convinced in his own mind." He could've said, "Let everyone observe the Sabbath day."

Any thoughts?

Thank you,

-Greg

Hello,

The key to understanding Romans 14 is in the first verse where the context is quarreling over disputable matters of opinion, not about whether to obey God. In other words, they might dispute what counted as work on the Sabbath, but no one was disputing whether to keep the Sabbath. Where God gives a clear command, human opinion must yield, but where no clear command is given, then each should be fully convinced in their own minds. Paul was certainly not saying that people could feel free to sin in disobedience God as long as they were convinced in their own minds that it was ok.

For instance, meat that had been sacrificed to idols was often later sold on the market, so if someone were at a community meal and they didn't know where the meat had come from, they might be of the opinion that only vegetables should be eaten (Romans 14:2). They were judging others who ate everything at the meal and were in turn being resented (Romans 14:3). The only time that God commanded fasting was on Yom Kippur, but as a matter of opinion it has become a common practice to fast twice a week or to commemorate certain events (Luke 18:12). Those who esteemed those days were judging those who didn't fast and were in turn being resented (Romans 14:5-6). Whether man esteems one day over another is very different from whether God does. We aren't to keep the Sabbath because we esteem it over other days, but because God did and blessed it and made it holy and command us to keep it. So whether someone fasts on other days is a disputable matter of human opinion, but whether someone chooses to fast on Yom Kippur is a matter of obedience to God. We must be careful not to misinterpret something that is against obeying man as being against obeying God.
 
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I'm responsible for my own salvation .. So I will put my trust in the work of Y'shia for my righteousness and promises and not trust the works of my own hand sis .. This is my faith

No one has suggested that you are responsible for your salvation, that you should trust in the works of your hands, or that you shouldn't put your trust in Yeshua for your righteousness and promises. That's not why we should obey God. If you had faith that God would lead you into having a holy, righteous, and good conduct, then you would obey His commands.
 
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No one has suggested that you are responsible for your salvation, that you should trust in the works of your hands, or that you shouldn't put your trust in Yeshua for your righteousness and promises. That's not why we should obey God. If you had faith that God would lead you into having a holy, righteous, and good conduct, then you would obey His commands.

There are reasons why I cast off the 10 commandments that I cannot discuss ..

. But I will say that I do believe that God leads me to living a holy righteous and good conduct life .. It just that my holy life is not found in the 10 commandment but in the new commandments that I observe ... I observe the commandments of Y'shia to love forgive sin 70x7 in one day judge not condemn not turn other cheek love my enemies love all men as God and keep the faith ...
 
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Soyeong

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There are reasons why I cast off the 10 commandments that I cannot discuss ..

. But I will say that I do believe that God leads me to living a holy righteous and good conduct life .. It just that my holy life is not found in the 10 commandment but in the new commandments that I observe ... I observe the commandments of Y'shia to love forgive sin 70x7 in one day judge not condemn not turn other cheek love my enemies love all men as God and keep the faith ...

In a list of the greatest 12 commandments, the Ten Commandments would come after the greatest two. God's law is His instructions for how to have a holy, righteous, and good conduct and every time someone in the Bible is talked about as being righteous, it is saying that they lived in obedience to God's commands by faith. You can not have a holy, righteous. and good conduct apart from living in accordance with God's instructions for how to do that. If you cast off the 10 Commandments, then your actions are essentially saying that you don't trust God to lead you in how you should live.

Yeshua was not in disagreement with the Father about what conduct we should have, but rather he said he came only to do the will of the Father (John 6:38) and that his teachings were not his own, but that of the Father (John 7:16). So Yeshua taught nothing new, but rather he taught how to correctly understand and follow God's commands. Forgiving others, not judging them unrighteously, turning the other, and loving your enemies are good things that Yeshua taught, but they are all in accordance with the law/Father's teachings.
 
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I'm responsible for my own salvation .. So I will put my trust in the work of Y'shia for my righteousness and promises and not trust the works of my own hand sis .. This is my faith
Be imitators of Him.
 
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In a list of the greatest 12 commandments, the Ten Commandments would come after the greatest two.

God's law is His instructions for how to have a holy, righteous, and good conduct and every time someone in the Bible is talked about as being righteous, it is saying that they lived in obedience to God's commands by faith. You can not have a holy, righteous. and good conduct apart from living in accordance with God's instructions for how to do that. If you cast off the 10 Commandments, then your actions are essentially saying that you don't trust God to lead you in how you should live.

Yeshua was not in disagreement with the Father about what conduct we should have, but rather he said he came only to do the will of the Father (John 6:38) and that his teachings were not his own, but that of the Father (John 7:16). So Yeshua taught nothing new, but rather he taught how to correctly understand and follow God's commands. Forgiving others, not judging them unrighteously, turning the other, and loving your enemies are "good things" that Yeshua taught, but they are all in accordance with the law/Father's teachings.

I truly understand why you believe what you believe ..
 
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Steve Petersen

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May 11, 2005
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Hello Friends,

So I've come across another verse that casts some shadows on God's command to keep the Sabbath. This is Romans 14:4-6, NASB:

"4 - Who are you to judge the servant of another? To his own master he stands or falls; and he will stand, for the Lord is able to make him stand.

5 - One person regards one day above another, another regards every day alike. Each person must be fully convinced in his own mind.

6 - He who observes the day, observes it for the Lord, and he who eats, does so for the Lord, for he gives thanks to God; and he who eats not, for the Lord he does not eat, and gives thanks to God.
"

So... It seems Paul is saying that it is ok that some people regard every day alike. He says "Each person must be fully convinced in his own mind." He could've said, "Let everyone observe the Sabbath day."

Any thoughts?

Thank you,

-Greg


http://www.christianforums.com/threads/help-me-understand-this.7813541/page-2#post-65311684
 
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