7 year peace treaty, what 7 year peace treaty?

Luke17:37 said:

Did you know that the Jews had several traditions added to their celebration of the Feast of Tabernacles that went beyond the basic requirements in the Bible? There was a water pouring ceremony (water from the lowest pool in Jerusalem, the Pool of Siloam, was carried up to the temple area and poured out) and there was a large menorah lighting ceremony. It is believed to be in the context of these Feast of Tabernacles (John 7:2) traditions that Jesus proclaimed, "I am the Living Water" (John 7:37-39) and, "I am the Light of the World" (John 8:12). To top that off, he healed the man born blind by sending him to wash mud off his eyes in the pool of Siloam (John 9). I learned all about it in this book, which is very good: http://store.jewsforjesus.org/books/christ-in-the-feast-of-tabernacles.html

Remember we Gentiles aren't better than Jews. Faith and wisdom are gifts from the Lord so there's nothing to boast about.

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precepts said:

It's interesting that you would jump from vs 5 to 24 when the context of vs 7 to 24 is Artaxerxes.

<Staff Edit>v


So when did the building stop, and when did it resume?


So who caused the building to cease?


A greater chance than thinking this is Nehem--h's Artaxerxes who you also claime gave the decree to build the city and not Cyrus. See the insanity?


Ezra didn't interpret the book into English.


The word there is frustrated, not stopped. And if it was stopped in vs 4 and 5, there wouldn't be a letter to Artaxerxes in vs 7 resulting in his decreeing the work to stop in vs 24, the reason you have to jump from vs 5 to 24 in your interpretation - the confusion.


I can see where you're coming from now, but even if it did cease from Cyrus to Darius, it is still 71 yrs of unhindered building to Artaxerxes!

This is the umpteenth time I'm saying it. How couldn't Israel have finished rebuilding the city in that 71yrs what you claim Nehem--h completed in 52 days?

Plus it's recorded in the new testament that the temple took a number of years to rebuild, and Solomon took at least 7 yrs. Four years from Darius' 2nd year to his 6th year doesn't cut it.



You're forcing that square peg in the wrong hole again. Frustrate means frustrate, harassment, not ceasing, or else Ezra 6:14 wouldn't have been reporting building thru the reigns of Cyrus, Darius, and Artaxerxes.

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precepts said:

Brother, please! Christ saying he's the Living Water or the Light of the World has NOTHING to do with the practice of the Maccabees and everything to do with what is written in the OT way before the Maccabees.

You people will believe anything. It's as if you don't know anything for yourself.

The Maccabees is the result of the forsaking of the Levitical priesthood, which is the AOD.

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Goodbook said:

I dont remember Jesus ever saying that!! It was the pharisees saying could anything good come out of nazareth!

What bible are you reading????

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precepts said:

If anything, you should be addressing the fact the AOD is the replacement of the sons of Aaron as high priests, the forsaking of the Levitical covenant, the reason the temple meet it's final desolation.

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Fusion77 said:

Well the word frustrate in Ezra 4:5 is derived from H6565 cause to cease, break asunder, disannul, defeat, make void, to come to naught, make of none effect...they're all there

◄ 6565. parar ►
Strong's Exhaustive Concordance
break asunder, cast off, cause to cease, clean, defeat, disannul, disappoint,
A primitive root; to break up (usually figuratively, i.e. To violate, frustrate -- X any ways, break (asunder), cast off, cause to cease, X clean, defeat, disannul, disappoint, dissolve, divide, make of none effect, fail, frustrate, bring (come) to nought, X utterly, make void.

Forms and Transliterations
אָפֵ֧ר אפר הֲפֵרָ֔ם הִֽתְפּוֹרְרָה֙ הֵ֝פֵ֗רוּ הֵפֵ֖ר הֵפֵ֖רוּ הֵפֵ֣רוּ הֵפֵ֤ר הֵפֵ֤רוּ הֵפַ֑ר הֵפַֽר׃ הָפֵ֗רָה הָפֵ֣ר הָפֵ֥ר הָפֵר֩ הפר הפר׃ הפרה הפרו הפרם התפוררה וְהֵפֵ֖ר וְהֵפֵ֗ר וְהֵפֵ֥ר וְהֵפֵר֙ וְהֵפַרְתָּ֣ה וְהָפֵ֖ר וְתָפֵ֖ר וְתֻפָ֑ר וַֽיְפַרְפְּרֵ֗נִי וַיָּ֥פֶר וַיָּפֵ֙רוּ֙ וַתֻּפַ֖ר והפר והפרתה ויפר ויפרו ויפרפרני ותפר יְפֵרֶֽנּוּ׃ יָפֵ֑ר יָפֵ֛ר יָפֵ֨ר יפר יפרנו׃ לְהַפְרְכֶ֖ם לְהָפֵ֞ר לְהָפֵ֣ר לְהָפֵ֥ר לְהָפֵיר֙ לְהָפֵר֙ להפיר להפר להפרכם מֵ֭פֵר מֵפֵר֙ מפר פּ֤וֹר פוֹרַ֣רְתָּ פור פוררת תָּפֵ֙רוּ֙ תָּפֵ֣ר תָּפֵ֥ר תֻפַר֙ תפר תפרו ’ā·p̄êr ’āp̄êr aFer foRarta hā·p̄ê·rāh hă·p̄ê·rām hā·p̄êr haFer haFerah hafeRam hāp̄êr hāp̄êrāh hăp̄êrām hê·p̄ar hê·p̄ê·rū hê·p̄êr heFar heFer heFeru hêp̄ar hêp̄êr hêp̄êrū hiṯ·pō·wr·rāh hitporRah hiṯpōwrrāh lə·hā·p̄êr lə·hap̄·rə·ḵem lehaFeir lehaFer lehafreChem ləhāp̄êr ləhap̄rəḵem mê·p̄êr Mefer mêp̄êr p̄ō·w·rar·tā pō·wr Por pōwr p̄ōwrartā tā·p̄ê·rū tā·p̄êr taFer taFeru tāp̄êr tāp̄êrū ṯu·p̄ar tuFar ṯup̄ar vaiYafer vaiyaFeru vattuFar vayfarpeReni vehaFer vehefarTah veheFer vetaFer vetuFar wat·tu·p̄ar wattup̄ar way·p̄ar·pə·rê·nî way·yā·p̄ê·rū way·yā·p̄er wayp̄arpərênî wayyāp̄er wayyāp̄êrū wə·hā·p̄êr wə·hê·p̄ar·tāh wə·hê·p̄êr wə·ṯā·p̄êr wə·ṯu·p̄ār wəhāp̄êr wəhêp̄artāh wəhêp̄êr wəṯāp̄êr wəṯup̄ār yā·p̄êr yaFer yāp̄êr yə·p̄ê·ren·nū yefeRennu yəp̄êrennū
Links
Interlinear Greek • Interlinear Hebrew • Strong's Numbers • Englishman's Greek Concordance • Englishman's Hebrew Concordance • Parallel Texts

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Luke17:37 said:

Jesus called out the hypocrisy of the religious rulers, but my point is He didn't despise the Jews or their traditions in general (just the ones that nullified God's law).

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Goodbook said:

I dont remember Jesus ever saying that!! It was the pharisees saying could anything good come out of nazareth!

What bible are you reading????

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Luke17:37 said:

I don't remember Jesus saying that, either (and I can't find it in a search).

It was Nathanael who asked, "Can anything good come out of Nazareth?"

John 1:45-46
45 Philip found Nathanael and said to him, “We have found Him of whom Moses in the law, and also the prophets, wrote—Jesus of Nazareth, the son of Joseph.”
46 And Nathanael said to him, “Can anything good come out of Nazareth?”
Philip said to him, “Come and see.”

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precepts said:

You can say what ever you want. The text from vs 7 to 24 tells you specifically when the building cease. There's nothing saying the building cease and had to had begun again in order for Artaxerxes' ceasing in vs 7 to 24. Plus Ezra 6:14 tells you they built thru the reigns of Cyrus, Darius, and Artaxerxes.

It's as if you have a one track mind. You see only what you want to see. How many times have I asked you how could Israel not complete the city in 71yrs to Nehem, but Nehem could finish it in 52 days?

<Staff Edit>

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precepts said:

To err is human. I recalled it to be the other way around. But that Nathaniel saying still paints the picture of "nothing good in Israel."

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Fusion77 said:

<Staff Edit>It is the most plausible answer to read Ezra 4:6-23 as a parentheses that jumps into a future description of what occurred during the reign of Xerxes and Artexerxes.

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Fusion77 said:

It's better than thinking an imposter who usurped authority for a matter of months is who Ezra is referring to in Ezra 4 and Ezra 6:14. If he were, I'm sure that he being a scribe would make record of it.

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Fusion77 said:

The alternative is to think that out of the 100+ years from the time of Cyrus to Artexerxes of Nehemiah's time. That in a window of a matter of months Shimshai the scribe wrote a letter, brought it all the way to the king. The king searched the records, then wrote a decree stopping the building. After that, they brought it all the way back to Judah and then stopped the building. Yet, at the same time, according to Ezra 6:14 the Jews prospered in building by the decree of this imposter. What? If the imposter issued a decree to stop building, how did they finish building by his decree to stop building? Ezra 6:14

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Fusion77 said:

14And the elders of the Jews were successful in building through the prophesying of Haggai the prophet and Zechariah the son of Iddo. And they finished building according to the command of the God of Israel and the decree of Cyrus, Darius, and Artaxerxes king of Persia.

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Luke17:37 said:

Nathanael was an Israelite looking for the Messiah. All Nathanael's statement said is that he didn't think Nazareth's people were very noble. They must have had a poor reputation. You just sound bitter towards Israel.

Also, look at this commentary for Matthew 2:23 (you have to scroll down to the commentary for verse 23).

Matthew 2:23 And he came and dwelt in a city called Nazareth, that it might be fulfilled which was spoken by the prophets, “He shall be called a Nazarene.”

(Matthew understood this prophetic tie--maybe Jesus explained it to him--but apparently Nathanael hadn't.)
http://biblehub.com/commentaries/pulpit/matthew/2.htm

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precepts said:

As it is as plausible to believe Nehem could complete from ruins in 52 days what the entire nation tried to complete in 91yr, yet it still laid in ruins 91yrs after. That is so plausible.


Logic dictates it since the rebuilding began in Darius' 2nd yr of reign. Nehem never mentions Artaxerxes halting any building even though he gets the news of the ruins in the first chapter and verse.


You forgot to mention that when they wrote the imposter and he caused the building to cease, that after two yrs the building began again in Darius' 2nd yr, possibly fulfilling Ezra 6:14's building thru their reign. I don't remember Nehem speaking of any decree by his Artaxerxes to cease building and then decreeing rebuilding for Nehem's 52 days rebuilding. Hmmm!


Where is the decree to stop building between Darius' decree to start rebuilding in his 2nd yr of reign to Nehem's 52 days of building 71 yrs later? Where is that decree located, and who gave it?

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Fusion77 said:

Ezra 6:14 says they finished building by the decree of Cyrus, Darius and Artexerxes. It doesn't say they finished building by the decree of only Cyrus and Darius, in the reign of Artexerxes. Otherwise where's Cambyses name? Besides that not what it says it says by the decree of Cyrus, Darius and Artexerxes.

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Fusion77 said:

It's almost impossible for that Artexerxes or any Artexerxes in the book of Ezra to represent the imposter.

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Fusion77 said:

The Decree to stop building after the reign of Darius is found in Ezra 4:7-23. The effects of that decree can be seen in Artexerxes 20th year. Nehemiah 1:1-3
The words of Nehemiah the son of Hacaliah.
Now it happened in the month Chislev, in the twentieth year, while I was in Susa the capitol, 2that Hanani, one of my brothers, and some men from Judah came; and I asked them concerning the Jews who had escaped and had survived the captivity, and about Jerusalem. 3They said to me, “The remnant there in the province who survived the captivity are in great distress and reproach, and the wall of Jerusalem is broken down and its gates are burned with fire.”

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Fusion77 said:

That imposter was irrelevant. He usurped for a matter of months.

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precepts said:

<Staff Edit>

The high priests from just before the revolt of the Maccabees aren't of the line of firstborn sons of Aaron, the "prince of the covenant." Address the fact.

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precepts said:

Okay, you do have a point on this one. The text might be speaking specifically to their decrees allow for building, but the Artaxerxes in Ezra 4:7-24 is not Nehem's Artaxerxes because vs 24 "specifically" states the building ceased until Darius' 2nd yr.


<Staff Edit> if the ceasing is done by an Artaxerxes in Ezra 4:7-23 and vs 24 goes on to tell that it ceased until Darius' 2nd yr, that it cannot by Nehem's Artaxerxes based on the chronology of events and kings?


How <Staff Edit> can Ezra 4:7-23 be the halting after Darius' decree when the very next verse tells you that that halting was ended by Darius? Are you going to put parenthesis around vs 7-23 and ignore vs 24?


He did not usurped for a matter of months, the rebuilding began in Darius/ 2nd yr. Though Darius slew and dethrone the imposter in less than a yr, the building didn't resume until Darius' 2nd yr.

<Staff Edit>

Plus, even though you're <Staff Edit> trying to make up a decree for a ceasing post Darius, you still haven't explained how Nehem rebuilt in 52 days what Israel supposedly couldn't in 71 or 91 years.

<Staff Edit>

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