7 year peace treaty, what 7 year peace treaty?

miamited · Feb 21, 2016

Hi fusion,

Good points! However, I'm not convinced that stopping something by force of arms would necessarily be meant to be understood as 'captivity' and 'destruction of the city and gates'.

In Ezra 4:3 we read that the Jews are presently working on rebuilding the temple according to the command of Cyrus. So, it would seem that the time that this passage of Ezra is referring to is the time that Cyrus, after releasing the Jews from the 70 year captivity, authorized, or their words 'commanded' the temple to be rebuilt from the destruction of the armies of Nebuchadnezzar.

We also read in the next couple of verses that the people surrounding them bribed officials to waylay their rebuilding efforts through the reign of Cyrus and into the reign of Darius. So, it would seem that the rebuilding didn't get completed in either of these king's reign.

Then, throughout the next few verses we find that it carried over to king Artaxerxes reign and the city was still not rebuilt. The people have sent a letter to Artaxerxes informing him that he will lose taxes if the city is rebuilt and the gates are restored. So, up to this point the city has not been rebuilt or the gates restored from the overrunning of the city by the armies of Nebuchadnezzar. The people of the surrounding cities are doing their best to keep that work uncompleted.

In verse 21 Artaxerxes responds that the city will not be rebuilt until he says so. Now we find that the Jews were stopped by force, but the city had not been rebuilt or the gates restored at that point. So, it is not likely that this 'stopping by force' had anything to do with the state of the city and the gates. This would, however, be very convincing as to the fact in the prophecy of the troublous times which we are told would be a part of the rebuilding efforts.

Finally, chapter 4 ends: Thus the work on the house of God in Jerusalem came to a standstill until the second year of the reign of Darius king of Persia. This refers to only the house of God, the temple, and doesn't even begin to touch the rebuilding of the city.

In Nehemiah we read that Artaxerxes so cared for Nehemiah that he apparently changed directions and now decided that it was good to order that the rebuilding of the city and the restoration of the gates begin again. He thus issues the decree that the prophecy of Daniel refers to. So, what the Scriptures confirm is that Cyrus did begin the rebuilding efforts in Israel, but they were waylaid by the neighboring nations. The work was never completed until Artaxerxes finally issued a decree that began the work again. The decree to restore and rebuild the city and its gates.

It's all about the same captivity of the 70 years in Babylon and the same destruction of the city done by the armies of Nebuchadnezzar. According to Ezra's writing, the city lay in ruins already when the 'stopping by force' occurred.

I am glad that this subject has come up again. All the various Scripture references have given me a chance to brush up on this piece of Jewish history and recall some of the things that I had completely forgotten to support my understanding. It's really been years since I actually studied this time in Israel's history.

God bless you.
In Christ, Ted

BABerean2 · Feb 21, 2016

Douggg said:
Ted, the whole problem with precepts and Bab2 is that they don't see that verses 9:24, 25, 26, 27 is about the 70 weeks determined on Daniel's people Israel and Jerusalem.

You have got that exactly backwards, in my case.
The 70 weeks was determined on Daniel's people Israel and Jerusalem.

However, you have jammed the time when the Gospel was taken to the Jewish people into the second block of time given by the angel Gabriel.

7 weeks of years : For rebuilding

62 weeks of years: From the rebuilding until the Messiah was annointed

1 week of years: For taking the Gospel to Daniel's people

You have crammed the last block of time into the second block of time.

The prophecy was for Daniel's people and it was all accomplished in the first century.

The New Covenant had been foretold at Jeremiah 31:31-34.

It was spoken by Jesus at Matthew 26:28.

And right in between the two passages is Daniel 9:27.

Gen 3:15 And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel.

Jer 31:31 Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah:
Jer 31:32 Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake, although I was an husband unto them, saith the LORD:

Daniel 9:27 from the 1599 Geneva Bible, which is the Bible the Pilgrims brought to America

And he (a) shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to (b) cease, (c) and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make [it] desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.

(a) By the preaching of the Gospel he affirmed his promise, first to the Jews, and after to the Gentiles.

(b) Christ accomplished this by his death and resurrection.

(c) Meaning that Jerusalem and the sanctuary would be utterly destroyed because of their rebellion against God, and their idolatry: or as some read, that the plague will be so great, that they will all be astonished at them.
.........................................................................

Mat 26:28 For this is My blood of the new covenant, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.
NKJV

Joh 19:30 When Jesus therefore had received the vinegar, he said, It is finished: and he bowed his head, and gave up the ghost.

Heb 8:6 But now hath he obtained a more excellent ministry, by how much also he is the mediator of a better covenant, which was established upon better promises.

Heb 8:13 In that he saith, A new covenant, he hath made the first old. Now that which decayeth and waxeth old is ready to vanish away.

Heb 12:24 And to Jesus the mediator of the new covenant, and to the blood of sprinkling, that speaketh better things than that of Abel.

Heb 13:20 Now the God of peace, that brought again from the dead our Lord Jesus, that great shepherd of the sheep, through the blood of the everlasting covenant,

The Gospel was taken to Daniel's people for one week of years through the earthly ministry of Christ and later His disciples, before the Gospel was taken to the Gentiles. You are denying this historical fact.

It is you who are denying that the Lord Jesus Christ fulfilled the New Covenant at Calvary, by your insistence that Daniel 9:27 is about the obsolete Sinai covenant instead.

It is finished.

Fusion77 · Feb 21, 2016

miamited said:
Hi fusion,

Good points! However, I'm not convinced that stopping something by force of arms would necessarily be meant to be understood as 'captivity' and 'destruction of the city and gates'.

In Ezra 4:3 we read that the Jews are presently working on rebuilding the temple according to the command of Cyrus. So, it would seem that the time that this passage of Ezra is referring to is the time that Cyrus, after releasing the Jews from the 70 year captivity, authorized, or their words 'commanded' the temple to be rebuilt from the destruction of the armies of Nebuchadnezzar.

We also read in the next couple of verses that the people surrounding them bribed officials to waylay their rebuilding efforts through the reign of Cyrus and into the reign of Darius. So, it would seem that the rebuilding didn't get completed in either of these king's reign.

Then, throughout the next few verses we find that it carried over to king Artaxerxes reign and the city was still not rebuilt. The people have sent a letter to Artaxerxes informing him that he will lose taxes if the city is rebuilt and the gates are restored. So, up to this point the city has not been rebuilt or the gates restored from the overrunning of the city by the armies of Nebuchadnezzar. The people of the surrounding cities are doing their best to keep that work uncompleted.

In verse 21 Artaxerxes responds that the city will not be rebuilt until he says so. Now we find that the Jews were stopped by force, but the city had not been rebuilt or the gates restored at that point. So, it is not likely that this 'stopping by force' had anything to do with the state of the city and the gates. This would, however, be very convincing as to the fact in the prophecy of the troublous times which we are told would be a part of the rebuilding efforts.

Finally, chapter 4 ends: Thus the work on the house of God in Jerusalem came to a standstill until the second year of the reign of Darius king of Persia. This refers to only the house of God, the temple, and doesn't even begin to touch the rebuilding of the city.

In Nehemiah we read that Artaxerxes so cared for Nehemiah that he apparently changed directions and now decided that it was good to order that the rebuilding of the city and the restoration of the gates begin again. He thus issues the decree that the prophecy of Daniel refers to. So, what the Scriptures confirm is that Cyrus did begin the rebuilding efforts in Israel, but they were waylaid by the neighboring nations. The work was never completed until Artaxerxes finally issued a decree that began the work again. The decree to restore and rebuild the city and its gates.

It's all about the same captivity of the 70 years in Babylon and the same destruction of the city done by the armies of Nebuchadnezzar. According to Ezra's writing, the city lay in ruins already when the 'stopping by force' occurred.

I am glad that this subject has come up again. All the various Scripture references have given me a chance to brush up on this piece of Jewish history and recall some of the things that I had completely forgotten to support my understanding. It's really been years since I actually studied this time in Israel's history.

God bless you.
In Christ, Ted

Yes, I agree. I don't think much (if any) work (rebuilding) on the actual city was carried out during the reign of Cyrus. After they laid the foundation of the second temple Ezra 3:10 it appears as though they were discouraged from doing any other work shortly after that. It appears as though Cyrus's felt like it was his job to build the House of the Lord. Ezra 1:2. So definitely, the city still lay in ruins all the way until the time of Artexerxes, as I don't see Cyrus's concern with the city, but rather the House of the Lord.

I absolutely agree too Ezra 4:24 is speaking of the temple work being resumed. We see it completed in Ezra 6:14-16 about 3 1/2 years later. In the 6th year of Darius.

Whether or not Nehemiah 1:2-3 is speaking of the Remnant of the Jews (say the grandchildren of the captives). Seems quite difficult to get a grasp on. How could they have survived something from 175 years ago? Maybe it's speaking of the posterity of the ones taken captive? Perhaps it speaks of their line of descendants having survived? If it is not speaking of the captivity during the time of Nebudcadnezzar, then it speaks of a later date.

Douggg · Feb 21, 2016

BABerean2 said:
You have got that exactly backwards, in my case.
The 70 weeks was determined on Daniel's people Israel and Jerusalem.

However, you have jammed the time when the Gospel was taken to the Jewish people into the second block of time given by the angel Gabriel.

7 weeks of years : For rebuilding

62 weeks of years: From the rebuilding until the Messiah was annointed

1 week of years: For taking the Gospel to Daniel's people

You have crammed the last block of time into the second block of time.

The prophecy was for Daniel's people and it was all accomplished in the first century.

The New Covenant had been foretold at Jeremiah 31:31-34.

It was spoken by Jesus at Matthew 26:28.

And right in between the two passages is Daniel 9:27.

Gen 3:15 And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel.

Jer 31:31 Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah:
Jer 31:32 Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake, although I was an husband unto them, saith the LORD:

Daniel 9:27 from the 1599 Geneva Bible, which is the Bible the Pilgrims brought to America

And he (a) shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to (b) cease, (c) and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make [it] desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.

(a) By the preaching of the Gospel he affirmed his promise, first to the Jews, and after to the Gentiles.

(b) Christ accomplished this by his death and resurrection.

(c) Meaning that Jerusalem and the sanctuary would be utterly destroyed because of their rebellion against God, and their idolatry: or as some read, that the plague will be so great, that they will all be astonished at them.
.........................................................................

Mat 26:28 For this is My blood of the new covenant, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.
NKJV

Joh 19:30 When Jesus therefore had received the vinegar, he said, It is finished: and he bowed his head, and gave up the ghost.

Heb 8:6 But now hath he obtained a more excellent ministry, by how much also he is the mediator of a better covenant, which was established upon better promises.

Heb 8:13 In that he saith, A new covenant, he hath made the first old. Now that which decayeth and waxeth old is ready to vanish away.

Heb 12:24 And to Jesus the mediator of the new covenant, and to the blood of sprinkling, that speaketh better things than that of Abel.

Heb 13:20 Now the God of peace, that brought again from the dead our Lord Jesus, that great shepherd of the sheep, through the blood of the everlasting covenant,

The Gospel was taken to Daniel's people for one week of years through the earthly ministry of Christ and later His disciples, before the Gospel was taken to the Gentiles. You are denying this historical fact.

It is you who are denying that the Lord Jesus Christ fulfilled the New Covenant at Calvary, by your insistence that Daniel 9:27 is about the obsolete Sinai covenant instead.

It is finished.

The 70 weeks are not about the 70 weeks of the messiah. Look at your post, Bab2, you are focusing on who the messiah is, not the 70 weeks determined on Israel and Jerusalem..

The gospel was offered to the Jews after the resurrection. The gospel will not be embraced by Israel and Jerusalem until the last week, and the seventy weeks complete at the end of the war (of Armageddon).

Daniel 9:27 is not about the Mt. Sinai covenant, it is about the 70 weeks determined on Israel and Jerusalem. It is a amazing how you can get things diverted.

The covenant to be confirmed for the seven year cycle by the Antichrist is the Mt. Sinai covenant, but the Mt. Sinai covenant is not what Daniel 9:27 is about.

Daniel 9:24, 25, 26, 27 is about the 70 weeks determined on Israel and Jerusalem.

precepts · Feb 21, 2016

Douggg said:
Read it again. Messiah is within the 70 weeks. Not the 70 weeks within the Messiah. Verse 24, 25, 26, 27 are about the 70 weeks.

It is about the Mess--h.

Verse 24 is about his anointing at the 70th week because the 70wks is about the 70yrs in Babylon. Seven weeks to the commandment to go and rebuild the city and the temple to the Mess--h is the 7yrs to the 70th week in Babylon, the message in verse 25.

Verse 26, the Mess--h is cut off "after" sixty and two weeks - not part of the 70wks in Babylon, but after - "after sixty and two weeks" when the walls and streets are rebuilt in the troublous times. The appositive clauses then gives more detail on the cutting off after the sixty and two weeks, the reason Nehem--h has to rebuild the wall and reseal the covenant that was confirmed post-Babylon by the Mess--h in Neh 9:38 and 10:1.

Verse 27 then tells that for the overspreading of abomination, the Mess--h is going to cause the daily sacrifice and oblation to cease in the middle of the week of confirmation, signaling, since it's done by the Greek little horn hundreds of years later, that the week is not 7 days or 7 years in this case but 1,260 years (half the week, half the #'s of days in a year - 1,260 days), the reason the defilement is said to be 1,290 days (years) and 1,335 days/years to the "consummation," which is the entering in to the new Shalem.

This is how I know the 1,000 yrs reign began at the fall of the scriptural 11th Roman Emperor, Nerva. It adds up. The covenant that the Mess--h confirms is Israel's covenant as a nation. When the daily sacrifice and oblation ceases by the hand of the Greek little horn, it is the 1.260th year of Israel's existence. The other half of the week is from there to the "consummation" in Rev's 2nd resurrection.

The Mess--h is not the Greek little horn. He does not cause the daily sacrifice and oblation to cease physically, but just like how he destroyed cities, he had a destroyer do the work.

The prince and the people who were to come is one of those destroyer/fallen angels, one of the 4 to 5 beast kingdoms and beast. He is the one that destroyed the walls and gates during the "troublous times," but he is also the Great horn and the Great horn's little horn, the spirit of Grecia.

Douggg said:
In verse 9:26, the messiah is the subject of one of the independent clauses - that fits in with the 70 weeks explanation of events.

The other three independent clauses in verse 9:26, are things that take place unitl the completion of the seventy weeks - signified in the text by "the end thereof (the seventy weeks) shall be with a flood," The last independent clause goes all the way to be battle of armageddon, and the end of that war.

The subject does not change from Christ in verses 24 and 25 to the "non-Jewish prince and non-Jewish people" in verses 26 and 27. Those three clauses following the colon are appositive clauses.

Douggg said:
24 Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy.

25 Know therefore and understand, that from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the Messiah the Prince shall be seven weeks, and threescore and two weeks: the street shall be built again, and the wall, even in troublous times. [Appositives after the colon again]

26 And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself [Why?]: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined.

27 And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.

Who does the pouring on the desolate?

precepts · Feb 21, 2016

miamited said:
Hi precepts,

Well, at this point you and I will have to agree to disagree.

God bless you.
In Christ, Ted

I don't have to agree to disagree on anything. The Jews built from the 7th month of their Babylonian exodus, 17yrs, until their 2yrs interruption by the imposter. They then continued building after the 2yrs in the 2nd year of Darius' reign and completed the temple in his 6th year, the year 516 bc. It would then be 71 yrs to Nehem--h's wall building, which I asked you what excuse could you come up with to explain why the city wasn't finished in that time but could be finished by Nehem in 52 days. That is not something to agree to disagree on.

94 yrs of uninterrupted building is more than enough time to finish the city than Nehem's 52 days. Your claim of Nehem not knowing the condition of Israel laying in ruins for 164yrs is ludicrous. It was Esther that was Queen at that time. The ruins reported to him couldn't have been Nebuchadnezzar's because it is recorded that the Jews were building the city and temple from the 7th month of arriving in Israel.
<staff edit>

miamited · Feb 21, 2016

Fusion77 said:
Yes, I agree. I don't think much (if any) work (rebuilding) on the actual city was carried out during the reign of Cyrus. After they laid the foundation of the second temple Ezra 3:10 it appears as though they were discouraged from doing any other work shortly after that. It appears as though Cyrus's felt like it was his job to build the House of the Lord. Ezra 1:2. So definitely, the city still lay in ruins all the way until the time of Artexerxes, as I don't see Cyrus's concern with the city, but rather the House of the Lord.

I absolutely agree too Ezra 4:24 is speaking of the temple work being resumed. We see it completed in Ezra 6:14-16 about 3 1/2 years later. In the 6th year of Darius.

Whether or not Nehemiah 1:2-3 is speaking of the Remnant of the Jews (say the grandchildren of the captives). Seems quite difficult to get a grasp on. How could they have survived something from 175 years ago? Maybe it's speaking of the posterity of the ones taken captive? Perhaps it speaks of their line of descendants having survived? If it is not speaking of the captivity during the time of Nebudcadnezzar, then it speaks of a later date.

Hi fusion,

Oh, I absolutely agree that we aren't talking about the actual same people who were taken captive to Babylon as being the same people still living in Nehemiah's day. But, just as we have a national identity in the U.S., the people of Israel constituted a people with a national identity who apparently lived a life, in and around Jerusalem, among buildings that had been burned and ruined during the Babylonian siege and within city confines that had no gates.

In those days a good size city would usually have gates to protect against incursions. The Scriptures often speak of gates to a city and even when Babylon was overrun it was done by lowering the water level of the river running through the city and under a set of gates that controlled river access. Yes, it would appear that nearly 100 years after the Jews had been given the freedom to return to Israel, there were after all a lot of cities and towns in the land of Israel, the city of Jerusalem, the 'capital city' so to speak, had not been put right again.

Considering the size of the land of Israel, it's very possible that as people returned from Babylon they just set up homes in other cities and towns. Leaving the main city of Jerusalem pretty much dormant for many, many years.

We look at pictures of cities and towns even today in the middle east where there has been major fighting and the buildings are pock marked with holes and divots and there is rubble from collapsed building walls laying in the streets and these cities have remained this way for 20-30 years. Yet, you will also see in such pictures that life goes on. People are walking among the buildings and the rubble. Children are playing in the streets. I imagine that the city of Jerusalem was much like those cities. People just hadn't made any major effort to rebuild it, and according to the Scriptures in several places, even when they tried, their work was foiled. So, yes, for nearly 100 years the Jews had lived and worked while the city lay in ruins with buildings and homes burned and whatever other damage that had been made to the structures just lay around unrepaired. The entrances to the city were wide open and people just freely walked in and out of the city proper and most of the people who returned to Israel after the captivity just made their homes somewhere else.

But, the prophecy given to Daniel makes it clear that a time would come when a decree would be issued that would begin a time of serious and concerted work to rebuild the city of Jerusalem. That from that time, the Jews had 70 weeks in which they were expected to accomplish some tasks that God assigned to them. Basically the task was to get their act together regarding the things important to God. The Jews had often and regularly been accused by God of being faithless towards Him. The writings of the Chronicles and Kings portray many, many times in the history of the Jews when they set up other idols to worship and just didn't take the commands of God, as far as being righteous and holy for Him, particularly seriously.

God knew that they never would. Even though the prophecy tells them that they had this time to return to righteousness ( “Seventy ‘sevens’ are decreed for your people and your holy city to finish transgression, to put an end to sin, to atone for wickedness, to bring in everlasting righteousness, to seal up vision and prophecy and to anoint the Most Holy Place), it also tells us that the Messiah would be 'cut off'.

As is often the case with biblical prophecies, the people living in the days that a prophecy was given may not have fully understood the prophecy. Today, however, we have the advantage of being past the end of the prophecy and looking back and seeing how it all came to be. Just as with Daniel's prophecy, it was to begin with a decree to restore and rebuild Jerusalem and Daniel had no idea that such a decree would even be made and certainly had no idea when such a decree would come about. But God knows! And He gave us a timeline to know when we could expect the Messiah. I believe that this prophecy is what led the 'magi from the east' to begin their journey to Israel in search of Jesus. They may well have 'known and understood' the implications of the prophecy and the timeline therein. While they told Herod that they had seen a star, they did know that it signified some great personage. They had to glean this knowledge from somewhere. I can hardly imagine that the 'star' had a sign hanging from it that said, 'new king here'.

God bless you.
In Christ, Ted

precepts · Feb 21, 2016

Fusion77 said:
I was considering what That captivity of Nehemiah 1:2-3 was speaking of.

2that Hanani, one of my brothers, and some men from Judah came; and I asked them concerning the Jews who had escaped and had survived the captivity, and about Jerusalem. 3They said to me, “The remnant there in the province who survived the captivity are in great distress and reproach, and the wall of Jerusalem is broken down and its gates are burned with fire.”

Obviously we're not speaking of the Babylonian captivity by Nebucadnezzar 170+ years prior.
I have found the answer likely to be in Ezra 4:23

23Then as soon as the copy of King Artaxerxes’ document was read before Rehum and Shimshai the scribe and their colleagues, they went in haste to Jerusalem to the Jews and stopped them by force of arms.

Notice here the Jews were stopped by force of arms. This is possibly where the captivity (in Nehemiah 1:2-3) began to occur. Right at the time when Artexerxes was king. This because the Jews were stopped "by force of arms".

Ezra 4 is a little tricky. I think the most logical explanation is that Ezra 4:6-23 is like a parenthetical. Which jumps ahead to the future to explain a little of what occurred in Ahasuerus (Xerxes) reign, but mostly what occurred in Artexerxes reign. Namely the letter written by the enemies of the Jews. Then ultimately, them behing stopped by force of arms. As a result of the order of Artexerxes. So, really Ezra 4:6-23 is a description of what occurred several years after the completion of the second temple structure. So Ezra 4:6-23 covers 485-440? BC. Whereas Ezra 4:1-5 covers 538-520 BC. And Ezra 4:24 picks right back up at 520 BC where the work on the second temple (structure) resumed.

Also we are told that Cyrus fulfilled the words of the prophet Jeremiah. Not specifically the words of the prophet Isaiah Ezra 1:1

1Now in the first year of Cyrus king of Persia, in order to fulfill the word of the LORD by the mouth of Jeremiah, the LORDstirred up the spirit of Cyrus king of Persia, so that he sent a proclamation throughout all his kingdom, and also put itin writing, saying:

What I'm saying is, it is a possibility the Cyrus in Isaiah is a future prophecy. I noticed in Isaiah how it is the Lord who named (or at least calls him) Cyrus. Isaiah 45:3-4 speaking of Cyrus.

3I will give you the treasures of darkness
and the hoards in secret places,
that you may know that it is I, the LORD,
the God of Israel, who call you by your name.
4For the sake of my servant Jacob,
and Israel my chosen,
I call you by your name,
I name you, though you do not know me.

The impression I get, it that it is the Lord who calls him Cyrus. Sort of a spiritual name of sorts? I don't see the city having been rebuilt during Cyrus's reign. Ezra 4:4

4Then the people of the land discouraged the people of Judah and made them afraid to build 5and bribed counselors against them to frustrate their purpose, all the days of Cyrus king of Persia, even until the reign of Darius king of Persia.

This seems to indicate that shortly after the foundation was laid. About 536 BC the people were discouraged until 520 BC. Therefore, the city could not have been rebuilt during Cyrus's reign.

I definitely see it as you do though.
That's the way I see it and Ive always heard, as you are stating, that the decree was given by Artexerxes to rebuild the city and that's when the "count" starts.

Ezra 1:2

2“Thus says Cyrus king of Persia: The LORD, the God of heaven, has given me all the kingdoms of the earth, and he has charged me to build him a house at Jerusalem, which is in Judah.

Notice here Cyrus talks about building the house of the Lord, not the city of Jerusalem.

YOU ARE MIXING UP ARTAXERXES OF NEHEM--H'S DAYS, WHO REIGNED 51YRS AFTER DARIUS, WITH THE "IMPOSTER" WHO CAUSED THE BUILDING TO CEASE UNTIL SAID DARIUS' 2ND YR.

THE TEXT WRONGLY ALIGNED THE REIGNS OF CYRUS, THE IMPOSTER CALLED ARTAXERXES, AND DARIUS. IT NAMES HIM AFTER DARIUS, WHICH IS INCORRECT BECAUSE IT IS DARIUS WHO DECREED THE REBUILDING IN HIS 2ND YEAR, AFTER THE BUILDING WAS CEASED BY THE IMPOSTER FOR THE TWO YRS, PROVING THE IMPOSTER ONLY REIGNED FOR LESS THAN A YEAR SINCE THE BUILDING CEASED IN DARIUS' FIRST 2 YEARS OF REIGN.

THIS IS A HISTORICAL FACT. CHECK THE RECORDS AND STOP REPEATING WHAT YOU'VE BEEN TOLD. RESEARCH IT YOURSELVES.

precepts · Feb 21, 2016

miamited said:
Hi fusion,

Oh, I absolutely agree that we aren't talking about the actual same people who were taken captive to Babylon as being the same people still living in Nehemiah's day. But, just as we have a national identity in the U.S., the people of Israel constituted a people with a national identity who apparently lived a life, in and around Jerusalem, among buildings that had been burned and ruined during the Babylonian siege and within city confines that had no gates.

In those days a good size city would usually have gates to protect against incursions. The Scriptures often speak of gates to a city and even when Babylon was overrun it was done by lowering the water level of the river running through the city and under a set of gates that controlled river access. Yes, it would appear that nearly 100 years after the Jews had been given the freedom to return to Israel, there were after all a lot of cities and towns in the land of Israel, the city of Jerusalem, the 'capital city' so to speak, had not been put right again.

Considering the size of the land of Israel, it's very possible that as people returned from Babylon they just set up homes in other cities and towns. Leaving the main city of Jerusalem pretty much dormant for many, many years.

We look at pictures of cities and towns even today in the middle east where there has been major fighting and the buildings are pock marked with holes and divots and there is rubble from collapsed building walls laying in the streets and these cities have remained this way for 20-30 years. Yet, you will also see in such pictures that life goes on. People are walking among the buildings and the rubble. Children are playing in the streets. I imagine that the city of Jerusalem was much like those cities. People just hadn't made any major effort to rebuild it, and according to the Scriptures in several places, even when they tried, their work was foiled. So, yes, for nearly 100 years the Jews had lived and worked while the city lay in ruins with buildings and homes burned and whatever other damage that had been made to the structures just lay around unrepaired. The entrances to the city were wide open and people just freely walked in and out of the city proper and most of the people who returned to Israel after the captivity just made their homes somewhere else.

But, the prophecy given to Daniel makes it clear that a time would come when a decree would be issued that would begin a time of serious and concerted work to rebuild the city of Jerusalem. That from that time, the Jews had 70 weeks in which they were expected to accomplish some tasks that God assigned to them. Basically the task was to get their act together regarding the things important to God. The Jews had often and regularly been accused by God of being faithless towards Him. The writings of the Chronicles and Kings portray many, many times in the history of the Jews when they set up other idols to worship and just didn't take the commands of God, as far as being righteous and holy for Him, particularly seriously.

God knew that they never would. Even though the prophecy tells them that they had this time to return to righteousness ( “Seventy ‘sevens’ are decreed for your people and your holy city to finish transgression, to put an end to sin, to atone for wickedness, to bring in everlasting righteousness, to seal up vision and prophecy and to anoint the Most Holy Place), it also tells us that the Messiah would be 'cut off'.

As is often the case with biblical prophecies, the people living in the days that a prophecy was given may not have fully understood the prophecy. Today, however, we have the advantage of being past the end of the prophecy and looking back and seeing how it all came to be. Just as with Daniel's prophecy, it was to begin with a decree to restore and rebuild Jerusalem and Daniel had no idea that such a decree would even be made and certainly had no idea when such a decree would come about. But God knows! And He gave us a timeline to know when we could expect the Messiah. I believe that this prophecy is what led the 'magi from the east' to begin their journey to Israel in search of Jesus. They may well have 'known and understood' the implications of the prophecy and the timeline therein. While they told Herod that they had seen a star, they did know that it signified some great personage. They had to glean this knowledge from somewhere. I can hardly imagine that the 'star' had a sign hanging from it that said, 'new king here'.

God bless you.
In Christ, Ted

That's why I say you people know how to write but don't know how to read. Didn't I explain the confusion of the two Artaxerxes in Ezra and in Nehem? Yet, still, you agree with this guy without acknowledging the fact.

miamited · Feb 21, 2016

Hi precepts,

You know, you continually berate 'us' for following after others who have 'told us' the different way to understand the prophecy from your way, but quite honestly, in all the evidences that have been given no one has brought up some other writers claim about them. No! Every response to you has been from the Scriptures. We have quoted Ezra, Nehemiah, Daniel, etc. We have none of us said, "well, so and so says that it should be understood thus". Although, there are certainly several so and so's who do say such.

Anyway, for me there comes a time in a discussion or disagreement with someone when I know that continuing to beat the horse is only going to kill it. I think we have passed that point.

God bless you.
In Christ, Ted

Fusion77 · Feb 21, 2016

miamited said:
Hi fusion,

Oh, I absolutely agree that we aren't talking about the actual same people who were taken captive to Babylon as being the same people still living in Nehemiah's day. But, just as we have a national identity in the U.S., the people of Israel constituted a people with a national identity who apparently lived a life, in and around Jerusalem, among buildings that had been burned and ruined during the Babylonian siege and within city confines that had no gates.

In those days a good size city would usually have gates to protect against incursions. The Scriptures often speak of gates to a city and even when Babylon was overrun it was done by lowering the water level of the river running through the city and under a set of gates that controlled river access. Yes, it would appear that nearly 100 years after the Jews had been given the freedom to return to Israel, there were after all a lot of cities and towns in the land of Israel, the city of Jerusalem, the 'capital city' so to speak, had not been put right again.

Considering the size of the land of Israel, it's very possible that as people returned from Babylon they just set up homes in other cities and towns. Leaving the main city of Jerusalem pretty much dormant for many, many years.

We look at pictures of cities and towns even today in the middle east where there has been major fighting and the buildings are pock marked with holes and divots and there is rubble from collapsed building walls laying in the streets and these cities have remained this way for 20-30 years. Yet, you will also see in such pictures that life goes on. People are walking among the buildings and the rubble. Children are playing in the streets. I imagine that the city of Jerusalem was much like those cities. People just hadn't made any major effort to rebuild it, and according to the Scriptures in several places, even when they tried, their work was foiled. So, yes, for nearly 100 years the Jews had lived and worked while the city lay in ruins with buildings and homes burned and whatever other damage that had been made to the structures just lay around unrepaired. The entrances to the city were wide open and people just freely walked in and out of the city proper and most of the people who returned to Israel after the captivity just made their homes somewhere else.

But, the prophecy given to Daniel makes it clear that a time would come when a decree would be issued that would begin a time of serious and concerted work to rebuild the city of Jerusalem. That from that time, the Jews had 70 weeks in which they were expected to accomplish some tasks that God assigned to them. Basically the task was to get their act together regarding the things important to God. The Jews had often and regularly been accused by God of being faithless towards Him. The writings of the Chronicles and Kings portray many, many times in the history of the Jews when they set up other idols to worship and just didn't take the commands of God, as far as being righteous and holy for Him, particularly seriously.

God knew that they never would. Even though the prophecy tells them that they had this time to return to righteousness ( “Seventy ‘sevens’ are decreed for your people and your holy city to finish transgression, to put an end to sin, to atone for wickedness, to bring in everlasting righteousness, to seal up vision and prophecy and to anoint the Most Holy Place), it also tells us that the Messiah would be 'cut off'.

As is often the case with biblical prophecies, the people living in the days that a prophecy was given may not have fully understood the prophecy. Today, however, we have the advantage of being past the end of the prophecy and looking back and seeing how it all came to be. Just as with Daniel's prophecy, it was to begin with a decree to restore and rebuild Jerusalem and Daniel had no idea that such a decree would even be made and certainly had no idea when such a decree would come about. But God knows! And He gave us a timeline to know when we could expect the Messiah. I believe that this prophecy is what led the 'magi from the east' to begin their journey to Israel in search of Jesus. They may well have 'known and understood' the implications of the prophecy and the timeline therein. While they told Herod that they had seen a star, they did know that it signified some great personage. They had to glean this knowledge from somewhere. I can hardly imagine that the 'star' had a sign hanging from it that said, 'new king here'.

God bless you.
In Christ, Ted

Yes, I agree. Nehemiah 1:3 mentions the remnant in the province.likely speaking of the province of Judah. Wherein, the people just settled in the land around Jerusalem. All the while Jerusalem continued to lay in ruins.

3And they said to me, “The remnant there in the province who had survived the exile is in great trouble and shame. The wall of Jerusalem is broken down, and its gates are destroyed by fire.”

Nehemiah 2:3

3I said to the king, “Let the king live forever! Why should not my face be sad, when the city, the place of my fathers’ graves, lies in ruins, and its gates have been destroyed by fire?”

So it's clear the city is still in ruins. I am not sure there's any evidence that would suggest that any substantial (or even minimal) rebuilding on the city occurred during the reign of Cyrus, Cambyses, Darius, Or Ahasuerus (Xerxes). or the imposter who history says usurped power for just a few months, before Darius. As a matter of fact, I believe it still lying in ruins is evidence that not much work, if any at all had been done in the city. Until after Artexerxes gave the decree to rebuild. It's clear the Lord put Nehemiah in his position, for such a time as this.

Fusion77 · Feb 21, 2016

precepts said:
YOU ARE MIXING UP ARTAXERXES OF NEHEM--H'S DAYS, WHO REIGNED 51YRS AFTER DARIUS, WITH THE "IMPOSTER" WHO CAUSED THE BUILDING TO CEASE UNTIL SAID DARIUS' 2ND YR.

THE TEXT WRONGLY ALIGNED THE REIGNS OF CYRUS, THE IMPOSTER CALLED ARTAXERXES, AND DARIUS. IT NAMES HIM AFTER DARIUS, WHICH IS INCORRECT BECAUSE IT IS DARIUS WHO DECREED THE REBUILDING IN HIS 2ND YEAR, AFTER THE BUILDING WAS CEASED BY THE IMPOSTER FOR THE TWO YRS, PROVING THE IMPOSTER ONLY REIGNED FOR LESS THAN A YEAR SINCE THE BUILDING CEASED IN DARIUS' FIRST 2 YEARS OF REIGN.

THIS IS A HISTORICAL FACT. CHECK THE RECORDS AND STOP REPEATING WHAT YOU'VE BEEN TOLD. RESEARCH IT YOURSELVES.

This is what history says Cyrus 539-530 BC. Cambyses 530-522 BC the imposter usurped for 6 MONTHS. Darius in September 522 or 521-485 BC. Then Ahasuerus (Xerxes) 485-465 BC. Then Artexerxes 465-422 BC. I've checked MULTIPLE SOURCES on this. I've included one, but this information is right at anyone's fingertips.

The imposter is pseudo smyrdis he usurped power for only 6 months.

The dates I've provided are of the top of my head. They may be off by a year or 2. Some sources vary by a year.

Maybe you have access to different sources that give different information. How do you believe the order of the kings of Persia went?

What exactly do you mean when you say the text wrongly aligned the reign of Cyrus with The "imposter Artexerxes? A scribal error you're suggesting?

BABerean2 · Feb 21, 2016

Douggg said:
The 70 weeks are not about the 70 weeks of the messiah. Look at your post, Bab2, you are focusing on who the messiah is, not the 70 weeks determined on Israel and Jerusalem..

Who do you think wrote the whole Bible?

Joh 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

Joh 1:14 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.

When in the Bible was the Messiah first mentioned?

Gen 3:15 And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel.

God's Plan of Salvation is not only about Daniel's people.
The nation of Israel's purpose was to produce the Messiah.

The whole Bible is about Him.

Luk 24:44 And he said unto them, These are the words which I spake unto you, while I was yet with you, that all things must be fulfilled, which were written in the law of Moses, and in the prophets, and in the psalms, concerning me.

I am focused on the Messiah, because He is the ultimate fulfillment of God's Plan.

Based on Romans chapter 11, salvation now only comes by being grafted into the Olive Tree, which is a symbol of the Church.

It you think there is a future 7 year period when people will be saved outside of the Church of Jesus Christ, then you have not heeded Paul's warning below.

Gal 1:6 I marvel that ye are so soon removed from him that called you into the grace of Christ unto another gospel:

Gal 1:7 Which is not another; but there be some that trouble you, and would pervert the gospel of Christ.

Gal 1:8 But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed.

Gal 1:9 As we said before, so say I now again, If any man preach any other gospel unto you than that ye have received, let him be accursed.

.

Douggg · Feb 21, 2016

precepts said:
It is about the Mess--h.

Verse 24 is about his anointing at the 70th week because the 70wks is about the 70yrs in Babylon. Seven weeks to the commandment to go and rebuild the city and the temple to the Mess--h is the 7yrs to the 70th week in Babylon, the message in verse 25.

Verse 26, the Mess--h is cut off "after" sixty and two weeks - not part of the 70wks in Babylon, but after - "after sixty and two weeks" when the walls and streets are rebuilt in the troublous times. The appositive clauses then gives more detail on the cutting off after the sixty and two weeks, the reason Nehem--h has to rebuild the wall and reseal the covenant that was confirmed post-Babylon by the Mess--h in Neh 9:38 and 10:1.

Verse 27 then tells that for the overspreading of abomination, the Mess--h is going to cause the daily sacrifice and oblation to cease in the middle of the week of confirmation, signaling, since it's done by the Greek little horn hundreds of years later, that the week is not 7 days or 7 years in this case but 1,260 years (half the week, half the #'s of days in a year - 1,260 days), the reason the defilement is said to be 1,290 days (years) and 1,335 days/years to the "consummation," which is the entering in to the new Shalem.

This is how I know the 1,000 yrs reign began at the fall of the scriptural 11th Roman Emperor, Nerva. It adds up. The covenant that the Mess--h confirms is Israel's covenant as a nation. When the daily sacrifice and oblation ceases by the hand of the Greek little horn, it is the 1.260th year of Israel's existence. The other half of the week is from there to the "consummation" in Rev's 2nd resurrection.

The Mess--h is not the Greek little horn. He does not cause the daily sacrifice and oblation to cease physically, but just like how he destroyed cities, he had a destroyer do the work.

The prince and the people who were to come is one of those destroyer/fallen angels, one of the 4 to 5 beast kingdoms and beast. He is the one that destroyed the walls and gates during the "troublous times," but he is also the Great horn and the Great horn's little horn, the spirit of Grecia.

Just read your post. You are not talking about what Gabriel said on whom the 70 weeks are determined. The 70 weeks are not determined on the messiah. Nor 70 weeks of what the messiah does.

24 Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city,....

70 weeks are determined upon Israel and Jerusalem.

7 of those weeks tied to the rebuilding of Jerusalem
62 more of those weeks until the arrival of the messiah, and him cutoff
1 of those weeks, the last week, for the prince who shall come actions.

Douggg · Feb 21, 2016

BABerean2 said:
I am focused on the Messiah, because He is the ultimate fulfillment of God's Plan.

But the 70 weeks are not determined upon the Messiah.

24 Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city,....

70 weeks are determined upon Israel and Jerusalem.

7 of those weeks tied to the rebuilding of Jerusalem
62 more of those weeks until the arrival of the messiah, and him cutoff
1 of those weeks, the last week, for the prince who shall come actions.

Luke17:37 · Feb 21, 2016

Goodbook said:
A peace offering isnt a blood sacfrice though. A blood sacrifice was for SIN. When Jesus returns no sin will enter his kingdom so there wont be any need for blood sacrfices anymore. We are the living sacrifices. Peace offerings are just offerings of thanksgiving, they dont need to be killed.

Thats how I understand it anyway.

There were different kinds of blood sacrifices. Not all of them were for sin. The peace offering (Leviticus 3) was killed and it says nothing about sin--it sounds like an offering of worship to celebrate, thank, worship the LORD for the peace He has extended to the offerer. We have peace with God through Jesus Christ.

precepts · Feb 21, 2016

Fusion77 said:
View attachment 170211 View attachment 170209
This is what history says Cyrus 539-530 BC. Cambyses 530-522 BC the imposter usurped for 6 MONTHS. Darius in September 522 or 521-485 BC. Then Ahasuerus (Xerxes) 485-465 BC. Then Artexerxes 465-422 BC. I've checked MULTIPLE SOURCES on this. I've included one, but this information is right at anyone's fingertips.

The imposter is pseudo smyrdis he usurped power for only 6 months.

The dates I've provided are of the top of my head. They may be off by a year or 2. Some sources vary by a year.

Maybe you have access to different sources that give different information. How do you believe the order of the kings of Persia went?

What exactly do you mean when you say the text wrongly aligned the reign of Cyrus with The "imposter Artexerxes? A scribal error you're suggesting?

What? <staff edit> The Artaxerxes you're crediting with ceasing the building is the Imposter you have listed here as Smerdis. He is called Artaxeres in the text.

Cambyses was Cyrus' son. I forgot to mention him, as did the text. The text mentions the Jews built during the days of "Cyrus, Darius, and Artaxerxes" (Ezra 6:14), which can't be Nehem--h's Artaxerxes because the ceasing ended in Darius' 2nd year of reign.

All this I said in the post you're replying to, so why am I repeating myself?

The only interruption of Israel's rebuilding of the city and temple since the 7th month of their Babylonian exodus was before Darius' rule. There is no interruption of their building after Darius' 2nd year, which is 71 yrs to Nehem--h's 52 days of repairing the wall.

The interruption by the Artaxerxes who the enemies of Israel wrote to, who ceased the building of the city and temple, was the imposter (Ezra 4:6-24). He is called Ahasuerus in vs 6 and then Artaxerxes thru out the rest of the chapter.

I have never heard anyone call Xerxes I, the father of Nehem--h's Artaxerxes, Ahasuerus.

Fusion77 · Feb 21, 2016

precepts said:
What? You don't know how to read? The Artaxerxes you're crediting with ceasing the building is the Imposter you have listed here as Smerdis. He is called Artaxeres in the text.

Cambyses was Cyrus' son. I forgot to mention him, as did the text. The text mentions the Jews built during the days of "Cyrus, Darius, and Artaxerxes" (Ezra 6:14), which can't be Nehem--h's Artaxerxes because the ceasing ended in Darius' 2nd year of reign.

All this I said in the post you're replying to, so why am I repeating myself?

The only interruption of Israel's rebuilding of the city and temple since the 7th month of their Babylonian exodus was before Darius' rule. There is no interruption of their building after Darius' 2nd year, which is 71 yrs to Nehem--h's 52 days of repairing the wall.

The interruption by the Artaxerxes who the enemies of Israel wrote to, who ceased the building of the city and temple, was the imposter (Ezra 4:6-24). He is called Ahasuerus in vs 6 and then Artaxerxes thru out the rest of the chapter.

I have never heard anyone call Xerxes I, the father of Nehem--h's Artaxerxes, Ahasuerus.

precepts said:
What? <Staff Edit> The Artaxerxes you're crediting with ceasing the building is the Imposter you have listed here as Smerdis. He is called Artaxeres in the text.

Cambyses was Cyrus' son. I forgot to mention him, as did the text. The text mentions the Jews built during the days of "Cyrus, Darius, and Artaxerxes" (Ezra 6:14), which can't be Nehem--h's Artaxerxes because the ceasing ended in Darius' 2nd year of reign.

All this I said in the post you're replying to, so why am I repeating myself?

The only interruption of Israel's rebuilding of the city and temple since the 7th month of their Babylonian exodus was before Darius' rule. There is no interruption of their building after Darius' 2nd year, which is 71 yrs to Nehem--h's 52 days of repairing the wall.

The interruption by the Artaxerxes who the enemies of Israel wrote to, who ceased the building of the city and temple, was the imposter (Ezra 4:6-24). He is called Ahasuerus in vs 6 and then Artaxerxes thru out the rest of the chapter.

I have never heard anyone call Xerxes I, the father of Nehem--h's Artaxerxes, Ahasuerus.

hmm? Many of the sources I've checked refer to Xerxes as Ahasuerus.
As a matter of fact, I typed Xerxes into a search engine and most all I saw was him identified as Ahasuerus.
Ezra 6:14

14And the elders of the Jews built and prospered through the prophesying of Haggai the prophet and Zechariah the son of Iddo. They finished their building by decree of the God of Israel and by decree of Cyrus and Darius and Artaxerxes king of Persia;

So the Jews finished their building by the decree of Cyrus and Darius, which refers to the temple. And, of Artexerxes relating to the building of the wall and the city in the time of Nehemiah. The imposter usurped the kingdom for a few months and was almost irrelevant.

They prospered during the reign of Cyrus (temple foundation). Darius (temple structure). Artexerxes (the wall and the city) time of Nehemiah.

I was wondering what you meant when you say the text wrongly aligned the reign of Cyrus with the reign of the imposter?

BABerean2 · Feb 21, 2016

Douggg said:
But the 70 weeks are not determined upon the Messiah.

24 Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city,....

70 weeks are determined upon Israel and Jerusalem.

7 of those weeks tied to the rebuilding of Jerusalem
62 more of those weeks until the arrival of the messiah, and him cutoff
1 of those weeks, the last week, for the prince who shall come actions.

"7 of those weeks tied to the rebuilding of Jerusalem" You got this one correct.

"62 more of those weeks until the arrival of the messiah, and him cutoff" You got this one wrong.

Jesus arrived as the Messiah, when His cousin John placed Him in the water of the Jordan River and He was anointing by the Holy Ghost, from His Father in heaven.

Luk 3:22 And the Holy Ghost descended in a bodily shape like a dove upon him, and a voice came from heaven, which said, Thou art my beloved Son; in thee I am well pleased.

If I die "after" this year, it will be during the next year or after.

He was cut off "after" the 69 weeks, which had to be a part of the 70th week.

Christ took the Gospel to Daniel's people for a half week.
His disciples took the Gospel to Daniel's people for another half week, up until the time Stephen was stoned.

You are attempting to merge the last block of time with the middle block of time, in order to make your doctrine work.
You are twisting God's Word to make it come out as you desire.

"1 of those weeks, the last week, for the prince who shall come actions"
This last week is the Gospel taken to Daniel's people, before it was taken to the Gentiles.
It is the covenant with the many found in Matthew 26:28.
.

.

Douggg · Feb 21, 2016

BABerean2 said:
"1 of those weeks, the last week, for the prince who shall come actions"
This last week is the Gospel taken to Daniel's people, before it was taken to the Gentiles.
It is the covenant with the many found in Matthew 26:28.

No, it is not 70 weeks determined on the gospel either. Nor the new covenant. The 70 weeks are determined on Israel and Jerusalem.

btw, the gospel was not understood until after the resurrection (Luke 24:44-48) - after the messiah had been cutoff.

Jesus arrived on passover week, riding the donkey fulfilling Zechariah 9:9 the arrival of their king, hailed as the messiah King of Israel, Son of David by his followers; 4 days later was crucified.

The 62 weeks is correct for the arrival of the messiah, and his being cutoff. Zechariah 9:9 was not fulfilled at Jesus's baptism, nor when he was born.

9 Rejoice greatly, O daughter of Zion; shout, O daughter of Jerusalem: behold, thy King cometh unto thee: he is just, and having salvation; lowly, and riding upon an ass, and upon a colt the foal of an ass.
_____________________________________________________________
70 weeks are determined upon Israel and Jerusalem.

7 of those weeks tied to the rebuilding of Jerusalem
62 more of those weeks until the arrival of the messiah (Zechariah 9:9), and him cutoff
1 of those weeks, the last week, for the prince who shall come actions.

7 year peace treaty, what 7 year peace treaty?

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