The Second Coming not before 2065?

rockytopva

Love to pray! :)
Supporter
Mar 6, 2011
20,039
7,665
.
Visit site
✟1,056,468.00
Faith
Pentecostal
Marital Status
Single
If I had to pick an end time date I would go with the scientist, Isaac Newton...

“And I heard the man clothed in linen, which was upon the waters of the river, when he held up his right hand and his left hand unto heaven, and sware by him that liveth for ever that it shall be for a time, times, and an half.” –Daniel 12:7

From a folio cataloged as Yahuda MS 7.3g, f. 13v:

"So then the time times & half a time are 42 months or 1260 days or three years & an half, reckoning twelve months to a year & 30 days to a month as was done in the Calendar of the primitive year. And the days of short lived Beasts being put for the years of lived kingdoms, the period of 1260 days, if dated from the complete conquest of the three kings A.C. 800, will end A.C. 2060.”" - – Isaac Newton

As Charlemagne was crowned king on December 25, 800 by Pope Leo the III so the day of Christ's coming will be on Christmas Day, 2060. If the rapture of the saints (1 Thessalonians 4:16-17) occurs seven years before the time of Christ’s coming the date of the rapture 12.25 2053. However… Isaac Newton notes…

“It may end later, but I see no reason for its ending sooner. This I mention not to assert when the time of the end shall be, but to put a stop to the rash conjectures of fancifull men who are frequently predicting the time of the end, & by doing so bring the sacred prophesies into discredit as often as their predictions fail. Christ comes as a thief in the night, & it is not for us to know the times & seasons which God hath put into his own breast." –- Isaac Newton

Before Christ comes the Anti-Christ must be revealed...

Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition; - 2 Thessalonians 2:3

Who....

16 And he causeth all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and bond, to receive a mark in their right hand, or in their foreheads:
17 And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark, or the name of the beast, or the number of his name.
18 Here is wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast: for it is the number of a man; and his number is Six hundred threescore and six. - Revelation 13:16-18
 
Upvote 0

Psalm3704

And He shall give you the desires of your heart.
Aug 10, 2015
1,723
391
✟7,925.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Private
Haggai 2:1-9 FUTURE. Haggai 2:9 the LORD will give PEACE. This is the MILLENIAL TEMPLE. We won't know true peace until the Lord returns. If the Lord says he will give peace, he means true eternal peace. Haggai 2:9 millenial temple! Haggai 2:1 Darius's name not there...FUTURE MESSAGE!

You're confusing the third temple with the Millenial temple. Do you know why there will be no walls around Jerusalem? Because the LORD HIMSELF WILL BE A WALL OF FIRE. Zechariah 2:4-5 Millenial ERA! Or are you saying the Lord will sit in the midst of Jerusalem when the third temple is standing? Wrong again? MILLENIAL ERA!!!!!

Zechariah 3:8 Joshua is a type of the Branch (Messiah) it says right here! Same encounter with the same angel. Zechariah 6:11-12 crowning the high priest as King. HE shall build the temple of the Lord! That's symbolic of Christ! He will build the Temple of the Lord Zechariah 6:13 the he sits on the throne of David eternally as high priest. He will rule with PEACE ETERNALLY! Do have the gall to suggest Christ is coming to build the third temple? Zechariah 6:14-15 is NOT speaking of the third temple. Joshua the high priest is a symbol of the Branch IN ZECHARIAH 3 and 6 for starters. Read Zechariah 3:8 he is a symbol of the Branch. Isaiah 11:1 Jeremiah 33:15-16 THE PEOPLE will dwell in SAFETY! MILLENIAL! Zechariah 3:9 this is the stone in Zion Isaiah 28:16 the SPIRIT of the Lord will be upon HIM. Isaiah 11:2 The 7 eyes upon the Stone are the 7 Spirits Revelation 5:6

Haggai 2:20-21 is a message to ZERUBBABEL! You have no concept of who Zerubbabel is!

If you want to continue to lean on your own misunderstanding, that's your choice.

If you think Zechariah 2:1-5 is talking about the third temple...and you're expecting Jesus to be a a wall of fire while the third temple is standing. Furthermore, that He will dwell in the midst of Jerusalem during that time the third temple is up...I rest my case! YOU ARE WRONG!!!!!

Zechariah 14:16-17 And Zechariah 14:8-9 speak of the same time as Zechariah 2:4-5. This is NOT during the third temple is era! The Lord will be king over all the earth and reign from Jerusalem. He will be a wall of fire around the city and dwell in the midst! This is speaking of the MILLENIAL ERA!!!

Like everything else so far, you're the one who's in error here. Zechariah does not prophecise on the millennium or the millennium temple. His entire prophecy is on the tribulation from the beginning to the end until Zechariah 14:16-21. Zechariah's book is a continuation from Haggai. Haggai's prophesied the beginning construction of the 3rd temple in the final days just before the start of the tribulation. The 3rd temple gets completed in the first year of the year of the tribulation. I already told you Haggai and Zechariah go together like Ezra with Nehemiah.

The millennium temple is mentioned is in Ezekiel 40-47.

Of the many comments I've seen people made, you're the only one that think Zechariah's prophecy is about the millennium. In fact, you're also the only person I know that thinks Zerubbabel is one of the two witnesses. /facepalm! Some of the prophecies he wrote are so obvious of Israel in the tribulation, not the millennium!

Zechariah 1:16-17 NKJV
16 ‘Therefore thus says the Lord:

“I am returning to Jerusalem with mercy;
My house shall be built in it,” says the Lord of hosts,
“And a surveyor’s line shall be stretched out over Jerusalem.”’

17 “Again proclaim, saying, ‘Thus says the Lord of hosts:

“My cities shall again spread out through prosperity;
The Lord will again comfort Zion,
And will again choose Jerusalem.”’”

Zechariah 1:16-17 is not a prophecy about Christ return in the millennium. It's about God turning His attention back to the Israelites to start Daniel's 70th week. The church is gone. God now focuses on restoring the Jews in the beginning of the tribulation after the beginning construction of the 3rd temple mentioned in Haggai. Christ's return is at Zechariah 14, near the end of the book.

Zechariah 2:4-5 NKJV
4 who said to him, “Run, speak to this young man, saying: ‘Jerusalem shall be inhabited as towns without walls, because of the multitude of men and livestock in it. 5 For I,’ says the Lord, ‘will be a wall of fire all around her, and I will be the glory in her midst.’”

Zechariah 2:4-5 is not about the millennium either. In the millennium, there will be peace all over the world, you don't need God's protection surrounding the city in the millennium. God is protecting Jerusalem during the first half of the tribulation while the rest of the world is under tribulation and war.

Zechariah 2:6-9 NKJV
6 “Up, up! Flee from the land of the north,” says the Lord; “for I have spread you abroad like the four winds of heaven,” says the Lord. 7 “Up, Zion! Escape, you who dwell with the daughter of Babylon.”

8 For thus says the Lord of hosts: “He sent Me after glory, to the nations which plunder you; for he who touches you touches the apple of His eye. 9 For surely I will shake My hand against them, and they shall become spoil for their servants. Then you will know that the Lord of hosts has sent Me.

Zechariah 2:6-9 is also not the millennium as there's no war in the millennium until Revelation 20:7-10. Zechariah 2:6-9 is the middle of the tribulation when a coalition of Muslim nations will be gathered to invade Jerusalem and some will flee the city to escape.

Zechariah 4:11-14 NKJV
11 Then I answered and said to him, “What are these two olive trees—at the right of the lampstand and at its left?”12 And I further answered and said to him, “What are these two olive branches that drip into the receptacles of the two gold pipes from which the golden oil drains?”

13 Then he answered me and said, “Do you not know what these are?”

And I said, “No, my lord.”

14 So he said, “These are the two anointed ones, who stand beside the Lord of the whole earth.”

Zechariah 4:11-14 is not the millennium either because this reveals the two witness located in the temple: Zechariah 4:1-5. The two witnesses appears during the tribulation, not in the millennium. And get it through your head, Zerubbabel is not one of the two witnesses.

Zechariah 7:12-14 ERV
12 They were very stubborn
and would not obey the law.
The Lord All-Powerful used his Spirit
and sent messages to his people through the prophets.
But the people would not listen,
so the Lord All-Powerful became very angry.
13 So the Lord All-Powerful said,
“I called to them,
and they did not answer.
So now, if they call to me,
I will not answer.
14 I will bring the other nations against them like a storm.
They didn’t know those nations,
but the country will be destroyed
after those nations pass through.
This pleasant country will be destroyed.”

Zechariah 7:12-14 is also not in the millennium. Since when did God decided to gather nations against Jerusalem during the millennium? And destroy all of Israel? This only happens during the 2nd half of the tribulation.

Zechariah 8:7-8 NKJV
7 “Thus says the Lord of hosts:

‘Behold, I will save My people from the land of the east
And from the land of the west;
8 I will bring them back,
And they shall dwell in the midst of Jerusalem.
They shall be My people
And I will be their God,
In truth and righteousness.’

Zechariah 8:13 NKJV
And it shall come to pass
That just as you were a curse among the nations,
O house of Judah and house of Israel,
So I will save you, and you shall be a blessing.
Do not fear,
Let your hands be strong.’

Zechariah 8:7-8 and 8:13 is also not in the millennium. There is no gathering of the remaining house of Jacob as they've being gather together during the first half of the tribulation. You can't have Daniel's 70th week without the entire house of Jacob together back in the holy land to fulfill the Time of Jacob's Trouble.

Zechariah 9:2-4 NKJV
2 Also against Hamath, which borders on it,
And against Tyre and Sidon, though they are very wise.

3 For Tyre built herself a tower,
Heaped up silver like the dust,
And gold like the mire of the streets.
4 Behold, the Lord will cast her out;
He will destroy her power in the sea,
And she will be devoured by fire.

Explain to me how this can happen in the millennium, Fusion77. Lebanon is no longer exist as a country in the millennium as the land of Israel expands into modern day Lebanon. Why is Lebanon mentioned here if Zechariah is prophecy of the millennium?

Zechariah 9:5-7
5 Ashkelon shall see it and fear;
Gaza also shall be very sorrowful;
And Ekron, for He dried up her expectation.
The king shall perish from Gaza,
And Ashkelon shall not be inhabited.

6 “A mixed race shall settle in Ashdod,
And I will cut off the pride of the Philistines.
7 I will take away the blood from his mouth,
And the abominations from between his teeth.
But he who remains, even he shall be for our God,
And shall be like a leader in Judah,
And Ekron like a Jebusite.

Same thing here too Fusion77. Explain why the area of the Gaza is still in existence in the millennium. Israel will expand it's borders into the Gaza too. There won't be a Gaza left by the end of the tribulation.

Zechariah 9:9-10 NKJV
9 “Rejoice greatly, O daughter of Zion!
Shout, O daughter of Jerusalem!
Behold, your King is coming to you;
He is just and having salvation,
Lowly and riding on a donkey,
A colt, the foal of a donkey.
10 I will cut off the chariot from Ephraim
And the horse from Jerusalem;
The battle bow shall be cut off.
He shall speak peace to the nations;
His dominion shall be ‘from sea to sea,
And from the River to the ends of the earth.

Zechariah 9:9-10 is also not the millennium. Jesus doesn't return to earth during the millennium, He comes in the second half of the tribulation. You can't start the millennium without Jesus coming first.

Zechariah 9:14-16 NKJV
14 Then the Lord will be seen over them,
And His arrow will go forth like lightning.
The Lord God will blow the trumpet,
And go with whirlwinds from the south.
15 The Lord of hosts will defend them;
They shall devour and subdue with slingstones.
They shall drink and roar as if with wine;
They shall be filled with blood like basins,
Like the corners of the altar.
16 The Lord their God will save them in that day,
As the flock of His people.
For they shall be like the jewels of a crown,
Lifted like a banner over His land—

Zechariah 9:14-16 is also not the millennium. Jesus doesn't come and fight the enemies of God during the millennium, He comes to fight them during the tribulation. He reigns during the millennium. There's a difference.

Zechariah 12:1-3 NKJV
The burden of the word of the Lord against Israel. Thus says the Lord, who stretches out the heavens, lays the foundation of the earth, and forms the spirit of man within him: 2 “Behold, I will make Jerusalem a cup of drunkenness to all the surrounding peoples, when they lay siege against Judah and Jerusalem. 3 And it shall happen in that day that I will make Jerusalem a very heavy stone for all peoples; all who would heave it away will surely be cut in pieces, though all nations of the earth are gathered against it.

Zechariah 12:1-3 does not happen in the millennium either. No country will ever invade Jerusalem or Israel ever again after the tribulation.

Zechariah 12:7-9 NKJV
7 “The Lord will save the tents of Judah first, so that the glory of the house of David and the glory of the inhabitants of Jerusalem shall not become greater than that of Judah. 8 In that day the Lord will defend the inhabitants of Jerusalem; the one who is feeble among them in that day shall be like David, and the house of David shall be like God, like the Angel of the Lord before them. 9 It shall be in that day that I will seek to destroy all the nations that come against Jerusalem.

Zechariah 12:7-9 does not happen in the millennium either. Jesus saves them during the tribulation, not in the millennium.

Zechariah 14:1-5 NKJV
1 Behold, the day of the Lord is coming,
And your spoil will be divided in your midst.
2 For I will gather all the nations to battle against Jerusalem;
The city shall be taken,
The houses rifled,
And the women ravished.
Half of the city shall go into captivity,
But the remnant of the people shall not be cut off from the city.

3 Then the Lord will go forth
And fight against those nations,
As He fights in the day of battle.
4 And in that day His feet will stand on the Mount of Olives,
Which faces Jerusalem on the east.
And the Mount of Olives shall be split in two,
From east to west,
Making a very large valley;
Half of the mountain shall move toward the north
And half of it toward the south.
5 Then you shall flee through My mountain valley,
For the mountain valley shall reach to Azal.
Yes, you shall flee
As you fled from the earthquake
In the days of Uzziah king of Judah.

Thus the Lord my God will come,
And all the saints with You.

Since when did the Day of the Lord happen during the millennium? Zechariah 14:1-5 is Christ's return on earth and it happens during the tribulation.

Zechariah 14:12-14 NKJV
12 And this shall be the plague with which the Lord will strike all the people who fought against Jerusalem:

Their flesh shall dissolve while they stand on their feet,
Their eyes shall dissolve in their sockets,
And their tongues shall dissolve in their mouths.

13 It shall come to pass in that day
That a great panic from the Lord will be among them.
Everyone will seize the hand of his neighbor,
And raise his hand against his neighbor’s hand;
14 Judah also will fight at Jerusalem.
And the wealth of all the surrounding nations
Shall be gathered together:
Gold, silver, and apparel in great abundance.

A nuclear bomb does not drop on Jerusalem during the millennium either. Zechariah 14:12 happens during the tribulation.


*********************************************

The only place Zechariah spoke of the millennium is at the end of his book in Zechariah 14:16-21.

Zechariah 14:16-21 NKJV
16 And it shall come to pass that everyone who is left of all the nations which came against Jerusalem shall go up from year to year to worship the King, the Lord of hosts, and to keep the Feast of Tabernacles. 17 And it shall be that whichever of the families of the earth do not come up to Jerusalem to worship the King, the Lord of hosts, on them there will be no rain. 18 If the family of Egypt will not come up and enter in, they shall have no rain; they shall receive the plague with which the Lord strikes the nations who do not come up to keep the Feast of Tabernacles. 19 This shall be the punishment of Egypt and the punishment of all the nations that do not come up to keep the Feast of Tabernacles.

20 In that day “HOLINESS TO THE LORD” shall be engraved on the bells of the horses. The pots in the Lord’s house shall be like the bowls before the altar. 21 Yes, every pot in Jerusalem and Judah shall be holiness to the Lord of hosts. Everyone who sacrifices shall come and take them and cook in them. In that day there shall no longer be a Canaanite in the house of the Lord of hosts.

Seriously, did you just recently started studying bible prophecy, found the message in Haggai 2:20, got excited over your discovery and decided to share this find with the world? In case you don't know, some of us already knew the prophecy in Haggai before you joined this forum 2 months ago and already held discussions on the book of Haggai.

You've shown no knowledge on the books of Haggai and Ezra. Now you show the same ignorance on the book of Zechariah too. You're the only person I've ever heard claim Zechariah as prophetic book about the millennium. Do you honestly think the millennium is this doom and gloom?




.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

Fusion77

Well-Known Member
Dec 18, 2015
756
267
50
Texas
✟62,877.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Worst case of cherry-picking scriptures I've ever seen. Do you always assume cats and dogs are the same animals because they both have certain parallels? Because both have 2 ears, 2 eyes, 1 nose and 1 mouth, this makes dogs and cats the same animal to you?

You've continued to push this issue over and over again dogmatically claiming the books of Haggai and Ezra as being the same because they both mentioned just "one single" parallel: "the second year of Darius" without taking into consideration tons of conflicting views.

All you're doing is just following one parallel while ignoring 15 plus conflicting views mentioned in the bible. You're totaling disregarding the bible trying to get it to conform to your own view.

Do you understand at all what I wrote in post #97 about what God stated in Haggai 2:3? When the foundation was being worked on, God praised the appearance of this new temple being better than those in the past. The second temple described by Ezra was pitiful made from poverty. The first temple was made with King Solomon's riches and wealth built on marvel and gold. There's no way Haggai was writing about the same temple Ezra wrote. The temple written by Ezra was inferior to the first temple.

You're also ignoring all the other conflicting views I've mentioned in post #89.

Different Events in the building of each Temple:

a) Books of 2 Chronicles to Ezra to Nehemiah (documentation on the historic rebuilding of the 2nd Temple).
b) Books of Haggai to Zechariah (prophecy on the rebuilding of the 3rd temple).


a) God called King Cyrus (2 Chronicles 36:21-23) to issue a decree for the return of the Jewish back to the holy land and to start construction of Jerusalem and the temple.
b) God calls Haggai to tell the people in Jerusalem and explain to them why their land isn't blessed (Haggai 1:3-6, Haggai 1:9-11), and to start rebuilding the temple. (Haggai 1:7-8, Haggai).

a) King Cyrus issued a decree for the Jews to return and begin rebuilding Jerusalem and the temple. (Ezra 1:1-4).
b) Haggai issues God message to the people. (Haggai 1:12-13).

a) Jerusalem and the temple was destroyed and became an empty city for 70 years when the captives returned. (2 Chronicles 36:19-21).
b) Jerusalem is occupied with people living in nice homes, producing crops and working. People are already there. (Haggai 1:3-6, Haggai 1:9-10).

a) Tribes of Judah and Benjamin returns to the holy land to rebuild Jerusalem and the temple (Ezra 1:5). The other 10 tribes does not return.
b) Jerusalem is already occupied before the construction of the temple. (Haggai 1:3-6, Haggai 1:9-10)

a) Construction of the temple began immediately after the return of the captives from Babylon after 70 years. (Ezra 3:6-8, 2 Chronicles 36:21).
b) Construction of the temple delay for 70 years after the Jews return to Israel. (Zechariah 1:12, Zechariah 7:5, Daniel 9:2).

a) Foundation of the 2nd temple completed. (Ezra 3:10).
b) Foundation of the 3rd temple completed. (Haggai 2:18).

a) God did not promise great blessings and prosperity for the construction of the 2nd temple when the foundation was completed. (Nothing found in 2 Chronicles, Ezra or Nehemiah).
b) God promised great blessings and prosperity for the construction of the 3rd temple when the foundation is completed. (Haggai 2:18-19).

a) Construction of the 2nd temple ran into problems and adversity. (Ezra 4-5) The prophet Daniel also revealed the 2nd temple and Jerusalem will be rebuilt during troublesome times. (Daniel 9:25).
b) Construction of the 3rd temple will be built with no problems and with aid from people all over the world. (Zechariah 6:15)

a) Construction of Jerusalem also ran into problems and adversity and a wall constructed to protect the city. (Nehemiah 2:19-6:14). The prophet Daniel also revealed the 2nd temple and Jerusalem will be rebuilt during troublesome times. (Daniel 9:25). Jerusalem is a city with walls!
b) Jerusalem not in ruins. Jerusalem expands with prosperity without a wall surrounding the city.
(Zechariah 2:4-5). Read this again! Jerusalem is a city without walls! (Zechariah 2:4-5). It's also mentioned in Ezekiel's prophecy of future Jerusalem. (Ezekiel 38:11).

a) God does not return to Jerusalem. Nothing found in Ezra to Nehemiah.
b) God returns to Jerusalem and blesses everything. (Zechariah 1:16-17, Zechariah 8:1-23). Church is gone and God focuses His attention once again to Israel. Daniel's 70th week begins.

a) Only the tribes of Judah and Benjamin returned to Jerusalem during the time of the 2nd temple. (Ezra 1:5).
b) The House of Judah is seen together with the House of Israel. All the tribes of Jacob is back in the holy land. (Zechariah 8:13, Zechariah 10).

a) God never mentioned the shaking of heaven and earth in Ezra to Nehemiah.
b) God promised to shake heaven and earth. (Haggai 2:6, Haggai 2:21-22)

a) The two witnesses are not seen anywhere in Ezra and Nehemiah after the foundation was completed.
b) The two witnesses are revealed in Zechariah 4:12-14.

a) No mentioning of the Lord's return anywhere in Ezra and Nehemiah.
b) Christ returns in Zechariah 14:4-5.


Did you just recently started studying bible prophecy? I already told you in post #66, how many more times do I need to tell you? It's a common practise for prophets to use the ancient names of cities, countries and people associated within their own time when prophesying about the future.

You need to watch this video from Joel who's one of the best scholars on Middle East prophecy. He can explain it better than me.



And where do you come up with such nonsense that it only involves Darius' name and only in the book of Haggai, and not names of other past biblical characters or books? Such gobbledygook eschatology!



The only smokescreen is what's in front of you as you can't seem to see or understand the things you read in the bible.

Case and point. Darius' name is mentioned twice in Haggai 1, you already claim the entire first chapter is past because of his name being there.

In chapter 2, Darius is mention once in Haggai 2:10. It said on the 24th day of the 9th month in the 2nd year.

Read the rest of chapter. the 24th day of the 9th month appears in Haggai 2:18 when the foundation was completed and Haggai 2:20 when God announced the shaking of heaven and earth. All this information from Haggai 2:10-23 happens on the same day: 24th day on the 9th month. It doesn't matter if Darius' name also appears in the middle and the end of Haggai 2 as it all happens on the same day. THE SAME DAY!!!!!!!

By your logic and reasoning involving the use of the name Darius, pretty much the entire book of Haggai is all past, having no bearing on the future! Complete Gobbledygook Eschatology!



Haggai 2:10-23 GNT
10 On the twenty-fourth day of the ninth month of the second year that Darius was emperor, the Lord Almighty spoke again to the prophet Haggai. 11 He said, “Ask the priests for a ruling on this question: 12 Suppose someone takes a piece of consecrated meat from a sacrifice and carries it in a fold of his robe. If he then lets his robe touch any bread, cooked food, wine, olive oil, or any kind of food at all, will it make that food consecrated also?”

When the question was asked, the priests answered, “No.”

13 Then Haggai asked, “Suppose someone is defiled because he has touched a dead body. If he then touches any of these foods, will that make them defiled too?”

The priests answered, “Yes.”

14 Then Haggai said, “The Lord says that the same thing applies to the people of this nation and to everything they produce; and so everything they offer on the altar is defiled.”

15 The Lord says, “Can't you see what has happened to you? Before you started to rebuild the Temple, 16 you would go to a pile of grain expecting to find twenty bushels, but there would be only ten. You would go to draw fifty gallons of wine from a vat, but find only twenty. 17 I sent scorching winds and hail to ruin everything you tried to grow, but still you did not repent. 18 Today is the twenty-fourth day of the ninth month, the day that the foundation of the Temple has been completed. See what is going to happen from now on.19 Although there is no grain left, and the grapevines, fig trees, pomegranates, and olive trees have not yet produced, yet from now on I will bless you.”

20 On that same day, the twenty-fourth of the month, the Lord gave Haggai a second message 21 for Zerubbabel, the governor of Judah: “I am about to shake heaven and earth 22 and overthrow kingdoms and end their power. I will overturn chariots and their drivers; the horses will die, and their riders will kill one another. 23 On that day I will take you, Zerubbabel my servant, and I will appoint you to rule in my name. You are the one I have chosen.” The LordAlmighty has spoken.

Seriously, did you just recently started studying bible prophecy, found the message in Haggai 2:20, got excited over your discovery and decided to share this find with the world? In case you don't know, some of us already knew the prophecy in Haggai before you joined this forum 2 months ago and already held discussions on the book of Haggai. Anyways, you're so lost on this prophecy you're constantly spelling it LSTO and don't even realized it.










.[/QUOTE
The prophetic books are not limited to only prophesying about the MILLENIAL or only the tribulation or only the second coming or only Christs first coming. Each and every Prophet had the capacity the see at anytime into the future. Or to give any historical account. It all depends on how God speaks to them. There's no doubt you are very confused. You disregard the clear teaching of the scriptures to support you incorrect views. A prophet can give a historical account, or a prophecy about anytime in the future. They speak for God, and God is not constrained by time. He sees the beginning to the end of time.

I been shown the true meaning of Zechariah 4 on 11-11-2003. The Lord has recently stirred up my spirit and shown me that Haggai 2:20-23 has been spoken. It's right for me to warn. Again, be prepared those events described above will happen soon. I've given you the key to understanding which messages are past and future in Haggai only.

Since you believe Haggai and Zechariah are limited to prophesying only about a certain time, your understanding is limited. A prophet can speak for anytime...history or in the future. The events in Ezra 4:24 even until the completion of the temple coincide with Haggai 1.


You claimed the second temple was built with tin and.

The bible says not so. Ezra 5:8 Ezra 6:3-5 Ezra 6:8-9 huge stones and timber etc. etc. much of what you say can be disproved in the Bible. Zechariah 2:4-5 is clearly speaking of the Millinium, but you disregard it. You think Christ will be the glory in the midst of Jerusalem and a wall of fire of protection during the 3rd temple era? Really? Zechariah 3 is all about the Branch. Zechariah 4 is all about the 2, well really 1 of the witnesses.



I was feeling sorry for you, but you just keep burying yourself deeper and avoiding the truth of scripture. Without realizing the fact that, THE PROPHETS ARENT LIMITED to prophesying about a certain time period. Just as God sees from Begining to end He relays that to His prophets and they speak it.


If you're not willing to admit Ezra 4:24 and Haggai 1:14-15 speak about the same time the SECOND YEAR of DARIUS and the SAME event. Resuming work on the second temple...then You disregard scripture. Haggai 1 is all about the plight of the people and then saying it's not time to build Gods House. Haggai 1:8 the people respond to Gods word. Haggai 1:12 Haggai 1:13 the Lord was with them same as Here Ezra 5:5 then they begin building the same temple in Haggai 1:8 in the SECOND YEAR of DARIUS Haggai 1:14-15 Ezra 4:24 Ezra 5:1-2 the same people Zerubbabel and Joshua and the people of the land (the sons of Israel) Ezra 6:16 finished in the SIXTH year of DARIUS Ezra 6:14-15. Urged by the prophets. How do you blatantly disregard scripture?
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

Fusion77

Well-Known Member
Dec 18, 2015
756
267
50
Texas
✟62,877.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
God called Haggai and Zechariah to be prophets. The books of Haggai and Zechariah are prophecies about the future 3rd temple. God did NOT call Ezra and Nehemiah to be prophets. Their job was to document what was happening in the construction of the 2nd temple.

Haggai (/ˈhæɡaɪ/; Hebrew: חַגַּי‎, Ḥaggay or Hag-i, Koine Greek: Ἀγγαῖος; Latin: Aggaeus) was a Hebrew prophet during the building of the Second Temple in Jerusalem, and one of the twelve minor prophets in the Hebrew Bible and the author of the Book of Haggai.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haggai

Zechariah (/zɛkəˈraɪ.ə/; Hebrew: זְכַרְיָה, Modern Zekharya, Tiberian Zəḵaryā, "YHWH has remembered"; Arabic: زكريّا‎ Zakariya' or Zakkariya; Greek: Ζαχαρίας Zakharias; Latin: Zacharias) was a person in the Hebrew Bible and traditionally considered the author of the Book of Zechariah, the eleventh of the Twelve Minor Prophets. He was a prophet of the two-tribe Kingdom of Judah, and, like the prophet Ezekiel, was of priestly extraction.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zechariah_(Hebrew_prophet)

God did NOT call Ezra and Nehemiah to be prophets. The books of Ezra and Nehemiah are historic books documenting the events of the past during the building of the second temple.

You need to get a good bible that can reveal this to you since you have a hard time believing anything I tell you. It'll tell you who the prophets are.
**************************

You're just not getting it. The foundation has to be built first before any shaking can happen. In Haggai 2:18-20, he said on the same day the foundation was completed, Haggai received from the Lord He will shake heaven and earth.

Haggai 2:18-22 GNT
18 Today is the twenty-fourth day of the ninth month, the day that the foundation of the Temple has been completed. See what is going to happen from now on. 19 Although there is no grain left, and the grapevines, fig trees, pomegranates, and olive trees have not yet produced, yet from now on I will bless you.”
20 On that same day, the twenty-fourth of the month, the Lord gave Haggai a second message 21 for Zerubbabel, the governor of Judah: “I am about to shake heaven and earth 22 and overthrow kingdoms and end their power. I will overturn chariots and their drivers; the horses will die, and their riders will kill one another.


Get this through your head. "No construction on the 3rd temple has begun yet in Jerusalem!"

This is what the temple mount currently looks like in this video. There's no worker there building the foundation.
*****************************************
When you see this happening in Jerusalem, than the shaking of heaven and earth is around the corner. This will be all over the news!

When you see this happening, you'll know Daniel's 70th week is near. When you see this happening, you'll know the rapture is near.

This is one of the final prophecy before it all happens. You can NOT have the tribulation without the temple.


Your problem with this prophecy is you've commingled the messages in a prophetic book: Haggai with records from an historic book: Ezra. You've also added messages from Zechariah and records from Nehemiah into the picture trying to combine all four writers to form one speculative conclusion based on two different events.

If you read about the construction of the temple in Ezra and Nehemiah first, than compare the construction of temple prophesied by Haggai and Zechariah, it's 110% clear they are not describing the same temple.


.
Different Events in the building of each Temple:


a) Books of 2 Chronicles to Ezra to Nehemiah (documentation on the historic rebuilding of the 2nd Temple).
b) Books of Haggai to Zechariah (prophecy on the rebuilding of the 3rd temple).


a) God called King Cyrus (2 Chronicles 36:21-23) to issue a decree for the return of the Jewish back to the holy land and to start construction of Jerusalem and the temple.
b) God calls Haggai to tell the people in Jerusalem and explain to them why their land isn't blessed (Haggai 1:3-6, Haggai 1:9-11), and to start rebuilding the temple. (Haggai 1:7-8, Haggai).

a) King Cyrus issued a decree for the Jews to return and begin rebuilding Jerusalem and the temple. (Ezra 1:1-4).
b) Haggai issues God message to the people. (Haggai 1:12-13).

a) Jerusalem and the temple was destroyed and became an empty city for 70 years when the captives returned. (2 Chronicles 36:19-21).
b) Jerusalem is occupied with people living in nice homes, producing crops and working. People are already there. (Haggai 1:3-6, Haggai 1:9-10).

a) Tribes of Judah and Benjamin returns to the holy land to rebuild Jerusalem and the temple (Ezra 1:5). The other 10 tribes does not return.
b) Jerusalem is already occupied before the construction of the temple. (Haggai 1:3-6, Haggai 1:9-10)

a) Construction of the temple began immediately after the return of the captives from Babylon after 70 years. (Ezra 3:6-8, 2 Chronicles 36:21).
b) Construction of the temple delay for 70 years after the Jews return to Israel. (Zechariah 1:12, Zechariah 7:5, Daniel 9:2).

a) Foundation of the 2nd temple completed. (Ezra 3:10).
b) Foundation of the 3rd temple completed. (Haggai 2:18).

a) God did not promise great blessings and prosperity for the construction of the 2nd temple when the foundation was completed. (Nothing found in 2 Chronicles, Ezra or Nehemiah).
b) God promised great blessings and prosperity for the construction of the 3rd temple when the foundation is completed. (Haggai 2:18-19).

a) Construction of the 2nd temple ran into problems and adversity. (Ezra 4-5) The prophet Daniel also revealed the 2nd temple and Jerusalem will be rebuilt during troublesome times. (Daniel 9:25).
b) Construction of the 3rd temple will be built with no problems and with aid from people all over the world. (Zechariah 6:15)

a) Construction of Jerusalem also ran into problems and adversity and a wall constructed to protect the city. (Nehemiah 2:19-6:14). The prophet Daniel also revealed the 2nd temple and Jerusalem will be rebuilt during troublesome times. (Daniel 9:25). Jerusalem is a city with walls!
b) Jerusalem not in ruins. Jerusalem expands with prosperity without a wall surrounding the city. (Zechariah 2:4-5). Read this again! Jerusalem is a city without walls! (Zechariah 2:4-5). It's also mentioned in Ezekiel's prophecy of future Jerusalem. (Ezekiel 38:11).

a) God does not return to Jerusalem. Nothing found in Ezra to Nehemiah.
b) God returns to Jerusalem and blesses everything. (Zechariah 1:16-17, Zechariah 8:1-23). Church is gone and God focuses His attention once again to Israel. Daniel's 70th week begins.

a) Only the tribes of Judah and Benjamin returned to Jerusalem during the time of the 2nd temple. (Ezra 1:5).
b) The House of Judah is seen together with the House of Israel. All the tribes of Jacob is back in the holy land. (Zechariah 8:13, Zechariah 10).

a) God never mentioned the shaking of heaven and earth in Ezra to Nehemiah.
b) God promised to shake heaven and earth. (Haggai 2:6, Haggai 2:21-22)

a) The two witnesses are not seen anywhere in Ezra and Nehemiah after the foundation was completed.
b) The two witnesses are revealed in Zechariah 4:12-14.

a) No mentioning of the Lord's return anywhere in Ezra and Nehemiah.
b) Christ returns in Zechariah 14:4-5.


They're obviously different books describing the building of two separate temples during different timeline.









.
I'll answer the first 2 points. As its too much to go into everything at once.


You said,


letter a) represents the second temple and letter b) represents the 3rd temple and time period. The bible says no!__________\\_______________________________________
a) God called King Cyrus (2 Chronicles 36:21-23) to issue a decree for the return of the Jewish back to the holy land and to start construction of Jerusalem and the temple.
b) God calls Haggai to tell the people in Jerusalem and explain to them why their land isn't blessed (Haggai 1:3-6, Haggai 1:9-11), and to start rebuilding the temple. (Haggai 1:7-8, Haggai).
a) King Cyrus issued a decree for the Jews to return and begin rebuilding Jerusalem and the temple. (Ezra 1:1-4).
b) Haggai issues God message to the people. (Haggai 1:12-13)__________________________________________________________
My answer,
Cyrus was king over the entire empire from 539 BC until 530 BC in his second year the foundation was laid. Because the Jews did come relatively soon, but it takes time to travel. Ezra 3:8 in the SECOND YEAR of their return (536 BC) the foundation only was laid Ezra 3:10. The Jews encounter adversity and cease the work shortly after the foundation is laid. Ezra 4:4-5 shortly after the foundation was laid, the work ceased until the reign of Darius. Again Ezra 4:24. Haggai 1:14-15 After the foundation was completed... The Jews stopped work,and built houses for themselves and neglected building the house of God for 16 plus years. Haggai 1:2 addresses this. Then, They are urged by the prophets to resume building in Haggai 1:7-8 Ezra 5:1-2 shows the parallel account. This happens 16 YEARS LATER 2ND YEAR OF DARIUS Haggai 1:1 (520 or 519 BC) Ezra 4:24 the prophets ( Haggai and Zechariah) that urged them are found in Ezra 5:1-2 they urged from the WORD OF GOD. IN ThE NAME OF THE GOD OF ISRAEL. Ezra 5:1 again. The word of the Lord came to Haggai in the second year of Darius (520 BC) Haggai 1:1. 16+ years after the Jews had made excuses, about building the temple. He encouraged the people. Haggai 1:7-8 Account found in Also in Ezra 5:2 Ezra 6:14 successful in building through THE ENCOURAGEMENT OF THE PROPHETS/ SUPPORTING THEM! Haggai Explains why they're not blessed in Haggai 1:3-6 because they tended to their own wants and neglected the Lords house, for 16 + years. We see this in Haggai 1:2 they neglected the building for 16+ years! Haggai tells them what to do Haggai 1:7-8 and the people obey Haggai 1:12 Ezra 4:24 the lord declares He is with them Haggai 1:13 same account found in Ezra 5:5 the eye of God was upon them! the people resumed building on 24th 6th month SECOND YEAR OF DARIUS! Ezra 4:24 SAME THING, SAME TIME! There's not just 1 parallel! EVERYTHING IS A PARALLEL! There was a 16+ year gap in the time between the completion of the foundation Ezra 3:10 (536 BC 2-3 year of Cyrus) and the beginning of the work on the temple structure Ezra 4:24 Haggai 1:14-15 (2 year of Darius 520 or 519 BC).


piece by piece I'll show you the truth. Please if you could provide your rebuttal to this. I would ask that you don't get sidetracked. The truth is, there's no answer to this except you didn't read it? Or you disregard scripture.

The bible is clear Haggai 1 gives the same account as Ezra 4:24- Ezra 6:16. I'll knock down your next question as soon as we get through this.You can't say it doesn't mention the completion, because right here it tells us the prophets Haggai and Zechariah were involved. Ezra 6:14

You say 1 parallel? Okay? same prophets Haggai and Zechariah. Ezra 5:1-2 Ezra 6:14--Haggai 1 and Zechariah. Same time period,2nd year of Darius Ezra 4:24 and Haggai 1:14-15 The Lord is with them in both cases...Ezra 5:5 and Haggai 1:13. Commanded, encouraged regarding Building a temple Haggai 1:8 and Ezra 5:1 and Haggai Same people, building the temple Zerubbabel, Joshua, and the children of Israel found in Haggai 1:1 Haggai 1:12 parallel in Ezra 5:1-2 Ezra 6:16. ITS ALL A PARALLEL!!
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

Psalm3704

And He shall give you the desires of your heart.
Aug 10, 2015
1,723
391
✟7,925.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Private
The prophetic books are not limited to only prophesying about the MILLENIAL or only the tribulation or only the second coming or only Christs first coming. Each and every Prophet had the capacity the see at anytime into the future. Or to give any historical account. It all depends on how God speaks to them. There's no doubt you are very confused. You disregard the clear teaching of the scriptures to support you incorrect views. A prophet can give a historical account, or a prophecy about anytime in the future. They speak for God, and God is not constrained by time. He sees the beginning to the end of time.

I been shown the true meaning of Zechariah 4 on 11-11-2003. The Lord has recently stirred up my spirit and shown me that Haggai 2:20-23 has been spoken. It's right for me to warn. Again, be prepared those events described above will happen soon. I've given you the key to understanding which messages are past and future in Haggai only.

Since you believe Haggai and Zechariah are limited to prophesying only about a certain time, your understanding is limited. A prophet can speak for anytime...history or in the future. The events in Ezra 4:24 even until the completion of the temple coincide with Haggai 1.

Wrong! Wrong! Wrong!

The prophets are fine, the bible is perfect. The problem is "YOU" and your ability to understand the bible, knowing how to differentiate what's prophecy and what's historic. And if anyone disagrees with your error, you view them as heretics. My view is consistent with the bible. My view only disagrees with yours, not the bible.

That's a big difference.

Case of your errors below:

The bible says not so. Ezra 5:8 Ezra 6:3-5 Ezra 6:8-9 huge stones and timber etc. etc. much of what you say can be disproved in the Bible. Zechariah 2:4-5 is clearly speaking of the Millinium, but you disregard it. You think Christ will be the glory in the midst of Jerusalem and a wall of fire of protection during the 3rd temple era? Really? Zechariah 3 is all about the Branch. Zechariah 4 is all about the 2, well really 1 of the witnesses.

NO! NO! NO!

Zechariah 2:4-5 is NOT a prophecy of the millennium. Read verses 6-7. The Jewish people don't get scatter in the millennium. This is NOT describing the millennium. YOU NEED TO LEARN TO READ EVERYTHING OR UNDERSTAND EVERYTHING YOU READ!

Zechariah 2:4-7 ERV
4 He said to him, “Run and tell that young man this:
‘Jerusalem will be a city without walls,
because there will be too many people and animals living there.’
5 The Lord says,
‘I will be a wall of fire around her, to protect her,
and to bring glory to that city, I will live there.’”
The Lord says,
6 “Hurry! Leave the land in the North in a hurry.
Yes, it is true that I scattered your people in every direction.

7 You people from Zion now live in Babylon.
Escape! Run away from that city!”
Terrible case of cherry picking scripture!

*****************

And I already told you, Christ does NOT return until Zechariah 14:4. I told you, Zechariah 1:16 implies God's spirit is returning to dwell amongst the Israelites within the temple. God is turning His attention back to the Jewish people after 2000 years working with the gentiles.

Do you need a babysitter to translate everything for you into kindergarten terminology? How do you not know these things and be so dogmatic at the same time?

*****************

And Zechariah 4 does have the two witnesses mentioned. You just think one of them is Zerubbabel. That's your error.

We keep going over the same things but you disregard the bible. You say the other 10 tribes didn't return during Ezra. But, Ezra 1:5 says EVEN EVERYONE whose spirit the Lord stirred retuned. Along with the head fathers if of Judah, Benjamin, and the priests and Levites. Please read the bible. Ezra 2:2 mentions the people of ISRAEL! Ezra 4:3 Mentions the chief fathers of ISRAEL! Ezra 6:16 mentions the sons of ISRAEL! Jerusalem is right on the lands of Judah and Benjamin! That's their allotted portion.

NO! NO! NO! An emphatic NO!

The 10 tribes never returned after the babylonian exile. Only the tribes of Judah and Benjamin returned. Just because you see the word Israel in Ezra 6:16 doesn't mean all of Jacob's descendant returned after the exile.

It's amazing, each day you reveal new level of ignorance about the bible, prophecy, the Jewish people etc. While not knowing anything is fine and human, but not knowing anything and mouth off as if you know everything is another thing.

***********************************************

Do you know what your problem is Fusion77?

You're telling people based on Haggai 2:20-23, the date of this shaking happens shortly after 12/06/2015. I already told you the year is incorrect. The bible points to a different year. You refused to believe me. Than I tried to show you in Haggai 2:18-19 that Haggai mentioned the temple foundation had to be completed before any shaking begins.

We don't see construction on a 3rd temple at this time. There's no evidence of a foundation as of 12/06/2015. You continue to blatantly disregard scripture: Haggai 2:18 and other parts of the bible that reveals a different year.


I believe with a certainty of about 99% that this message has gone forth on the 24th day of the 9th month (Kislev) in our year 2015, which was the first day of Chanukah, which is the first day of the feast of dedication, which was on 12/06/2015. I do not know exactly when this "shaking" will occur, but I believe it will be this year. of course, it could be more than a year. I will move one punctuation mark from 2:20-21 Look at Haggai 2:20-21 in the ESV a good word for word. I will simply move one period.
the word of the Lord came a second time to Haggai. On the 24th day of the month, Speak to Zerubbabel, the Governor of Judah saying "I am about to shake the heavens and the earth".










.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

Psalm3704

And He shall give you the desires of your heart.
Aug 10, 2015
1,723
391
✟7,925.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Private
You said,
letter a) represents the second temple and letter b) represents the 3rd temple and time period. The bible says no!__________\\_______________________________________
a) God called King Cyrus (2 Chronicles 36:21-23) to issue a decree for the return of the Jewish back to the holy land and to start construction of Jerusalem and the temple.
b) God calls Haggai to tell the people in Jerusalem and explain to them why their land isn't blessed (Haggai 1:3-6, Haggai 1:9-11), and to start rebuilding the temple. (Haggai 1:7-8, Haggai).
a) King Cyrus issued a decree for the Jews to return and begin rebuilding Jerusalem and the temple. (Ezra 1:1-4).
b) Haggai issues God message to the people. (Haggai 1:12-13)__________________________________________________________
My answer,
Cyrus was king over the entire empire from 539 BC until 530 BC in his second year the foundation was laid. Because the Jews did come relatively soon, but it takes time to travel. Ezra 3:8 in the SECOND YEAR of their return (536 BC) the foundation only was laid Ezra 3:10. The Jews encounter adversity and cease the work shortly after the foundation is laid. Ezra 4:4-5 shortly after the foundation was laid, the work ceased until the reign of Darius.

If you're gonna argue about apples, than present a case about apples. Don't argue with oranges.

Here's the apple you're trying to debate:

You said,
letter a) represents the second temple and letter b) represents the 3rd temple and time period. The bible says no!__________\\_______________________________________
a) God called King Cyrus (2 Chronicles 36:21-23) to issue a decree for the return of the Jewish back to the holy land and to start construction of Jerusalem and the temple.
b) God calls Haggai to tell the people in Jerusalem and explain to them why their land isn't blessed (Haggai 1:3-6, Haggai 1:9-11), and to start rebuilding the temple. (Haggai 1:7-8, Haggai).
a) King Cyrus issued a decree for the Jews to return and begin rebuilding Jerusalem and the temple. (Ezra 1:1-4).
b) Haggai issues God message to the people. (Haggai 1:12-13)__________________________________________________________
Here's your reply: (It's all about oranges. Nothing here about apple).

My answer,
Cyrus was king over the entire empire from 539 BC until 530 BC in his second year the foundation was laid. Because the Jews did come relatively soon, but it takes time to travel. Ezra 3:8 in the SECOND YEAR of their return (536 BC) the foundation only was laid Ezra 3:10. The Jews encounter adversity and cease the work shortly after the foundation is laid. Ezra 4:4-5 shortly after the foundation was laid, the work ceased until the reign of Darius.


King Cyrus is in 2 Chronicles 36:21-23. It about him calling the Jewish people to return to Jerusalem. It's not about the building of the temple foundation. You just skipped 3 chapters into Ezra and commented about the temple instead.

Stop making yourself look so ignorant and post something intelligence for once.

***********************************************

Do you know what your problem is Fusion77?

You're telling people based on Haggai 2:20-23, the date of this shaking happens shortly after 12/06/2015. I already told you the year is incorrect. The bible points to a different year. You refused to believe me. Than I tried to show you in Haggai 2:18-19 that Haggai mentioned the temple foundation had to be completed before any shaking begins.

We don't see construction on a 3rd temple at this time. There's no evidence of a foundation as of 12/06/2015. You continue to blatantly disregard scripture: Haggai 2:18 and other parts of the bible that reveals a different year.


I believe with a certainty of about 99% that this message has gone forth on the 24th day of the 9th month (Kislev) in our year 2015, which was the first day of Chanukah, which is the first day of the feast of dedication, which was on 12/06/2015. I do not know exactly when this "shaking" will occur, but I believe it will be this year. of course, it could be more than a year. I will move one punctuation mark from 2:20-21 Look at Haggai 2:20-21 in the ESV a good word for word. I will simply move one period.
the word of the Lord came a second time to Haggai. On the 24th day of the month, Speak to Zerubbabel, the Governor of Judah saying "I am about to shake the heavens and the earth".










.







.





 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

Fusion77

Well-Known Member
Dec 18, 2015
756
267
50
Texas
✟62,877.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
If you're gonna argue about apples, than present a case about apples. Don't argue with oranges.

Here's the apple you're trying to debate:

You said,
letter a) represents the second temple and letter b) represents the 3rd temple and time period. The bible says no!__________\\_______________________________________
a) God called King Cyrus (2 Chronicles 36:21-23) to issue a decree for the return of the Jewish back to the holy land and to start construction of Jerusalem and the temple.
b) God calls Haggai to tell the people in Jerusalem and explain to them why their land isn't blessed (Haggai 1:3-6, Haggai 1:9-11), and to start rebuilding the temple. (Haggai 1:7-8, Haggai).
a) King Cyrus issued a decree for the Jews to return and begin rebuilding Jerusalem and the temple. (Ezra 1:1-4).
b) Haggai issues God message to the people. (Haggai 1:12-13)__________________________________________________________
Here's your reply: (It's all about oranges. Nothing here about apple).

My answer,
Cyrus was king over the entire empire from 539 BC until 530 BC in his second year the foundation was laid. Because the Jews did come relatively soon, but it takes time to travel. Ezra 3:8 in the SECOND YEAR of their return (536 BC) the foundation only was laid Ezra 3:10. The Jews encounter adversity and cease the work shortly after the foundation is laid. Ezra 4:4-5 shortly after the foundation was laid, the work ceased until the reign of Darius.


King Cyrus is in 2 Chronicles 36:21-23. It about him calling the Jewish people to return to Jerusalem. It's not about the building of the temple foundation. You just skipped 3 chapters into Ezra and commented about the temple instead.

Stop making yourself look so ignorant and post something intelligence for once.

***********************************************

Do you know what your problem is Fusion77?

You're telling people based on Haggai 2:20-23, the date of this shaking happens shortly after 12/06/2015. I already told you the year is incorrect. The bible points to a different year. You refused to believe me. Than I tried to show you in Haggai 2:18-19 that Haggai mentioned the temple foundation had to be completed before any shaking begins.

We don't see construction on a 3rd temple at this time. There's no evidence of a foundation as of 12/06/2015. You continue to blatantly disregard scripture: Haggai 2:18 and other parts of the bible that reveals a different year.













.







.




just as I thought, you make comparisons of fruit. Then call me ignorant again and suggest I have no intelligence regarding the scriptures. You fail to make any sort of rebuttal. Or focus on the substance of the debate.

It's common historical knowledge after the second temple foundation was laid there was a 16 or more year gap until they started the structure of the temple. Cyrus issued the decree in Ezra 1:1 in 538-539 BC
YOU Said,
__________________________________________________________________
NO! NO! NO! An emphatic NO!

The 10 tribes never returned after the babylonian exile. Only the tribes of Judah and Benjamin returned. Just because you see the word Israel in Ezra 6:16 doesn't mean all of Jacob's descendant returned after the exile.____________________________________________________________

You say ONLY the tribes of Judah and Benjamin return. But, the bible doesn't SPECIFICALLY say that...


The decree that Cyrus made was a decree over the entir Media Persian empire. It applied to Jews that were taken captive by Assyria as well.

How could we ever know if NOBODY of the other 10 tribes returned? It was their choice if they wanted to return. It is a debatable issue.

The main point I'm making is that Haggai 1 has historically transpired. The people in Haggai 1 are the same people in Ezra 4:24 and Ezra 5:1-2. Whether I'm wrong in thinking that some people from the 10 tribes returned or not, has no bearing on the fact that Haggai 1 and Ezra 4:25-6:16 are the same account. I believe there WERE people from the 10 tribes though. there was always a remnant left.

Bottom line, most almost anyone understands Haggai 1 HAS HISTORICALLY TRANSPIRED!
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

John S

I'm Here - For Now
Nov 19, 2010
3,135
74
✟11,359.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Private
The Kingdom of Israel was strong under David and Solomon. Then later, the kingdom broke up into 2 - the larger Kingdom of Israel and the smaller Kingdom of Judah. The Assyrians conquered Israel and evicted the inhabitants. They were never allowed to return. History knows them as the Ten Lost Tribes.
Later, the Babylonians conquered the Kingdom of Judah and they were also evicted - but they were later allowed to return.
In Genesis 49, Jacob prophesized the fate of his son's tribes. He said that Judah would be the ONLY Tribe to maintain it's identity - the Jews. I prefer to believe that these prophecies were accurate and not the ramblings of an old dying man.
God told Abraham that his descendants would be as plentiful as sand. Either God lied to Abraham or those tribes are out there in the world today. I choose to believe that they make up most of Europe, the entire western hemisphere, and parts of every other continent.
 
Upvote 0

Fusion77

Well-Known Member
Dec 18, 2015
756
267
50
Texas
✟62,877.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
The Kingdom of Israel was strong under David and Solomon. Then later, the kingdom broke up into 2 - the larger Kingdom of Israel and the smaller Kingdom of Judah. The Assyrians conquered Israel and evicted the inhabitants. They were never allowed to return. History knows them as the Ten Lost Tribes.
Later, the Babylonians conquered the Kingdom of Judah and they were also evicted - but they were later allowed to return.
In Genesis 49, Jacob prophesized the fate of his son's tribes. He said that Judah would be the ONLY Tribe to maintain it's identity - the Jews. I prefer to believe that these prophecies were accurate and not the ramblings of an old dying man.
God told Abraham that his descendants would be as plentiful as sand. Either God lied to Abraham or those tribes are out there in the world today. I choose to believe that they make up most of Europe, the entire western hemisphere, and parts of every other continent.
Point is, the bible doesn't specifically say that the exiles were limited to only Judah and Benjamin. The media Persia empire was over the land to where the children of Israel had been exiled before (Assyria). Cyrus's decree gave them the right to rebuild with that decree. We know priests and Levites were there. It wasn't Solely limited to just Judah and Benjamin.

Galatians 3:29 Galatians 3:14-16 we are the Spiritual seed of Abraham. It is through Christ this is completely fulfilled. This is the way that Abraham has potentially billions of descendants by the end of this age!

The real point is the same people in Haggai 1 ex. Haggai 1:2 and Haggai 1:14 are the same as Ezra 4:24 and Ezra 5:1-2 and really all the way until Ezra 6:16. course mostly, but not limited to just the tribes of Judah and Benjamin. Other people from other tribes were there...but not fully organized and "in tact". The bible doesn't specifically say otherwise.

The real fact I'm trying to show is that Haggai 1 is history. Ezra 4:24-6:26 gives the account of the building of the second temple. That's what Haggai 1 (making the comparison to Haggai 1ONLY right now), is referring to.

Whether or not ANY people from the 10 tribes of exiles returned is debatable. The point I'm trying to make is that Haggai 1 has historically transpired. There was always a remnant left behind.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

Fusion77

Well-Known Member
Dec 18, 2015
756
267
50
Texas
✟62,877.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
If you're gonna argue about apples, than present a case about apples. Don't argue with oranges.

Here's the apple you're trying to debate:

You said,
letter a) represents the second temple and letter b) represents the 3rd temple and time period. The bible says no!__________\\_______________________________________
a) God called King Cyrus (2 Chronicles 36:21-23) to issue a decree for the return of the Jewish back to the holy land and to start construction of Jerusalem and the temple.
b) God calls Haggai to tell the people in Jerusalem and explain to them why their land isn't blessed (Haggai 1:3-6, Haggai 1:9-11), and to start rebuilding the temple. (Haggai 1:7-8, Haggai).
a) King Cyrus issued a decree for the Jews to return and begin rebuilding Jerusalem and the temple. (Ezra 1:1-4).
b) Haggai issues God message to the people. (Haggai 1:12-13)__________________________________________________________
Here's your reply: (It's all about oranges. Nothing here about apple).

My answer,
Cyrus was king over the entire empire from 539 BC until 530 BC in his second year the foundation was laid. Because the Jews did come relatively soon, but it takes time to travel. Ezra 3:8 in the SECOND YEAR of their return (536 BC) the foundation only was laid Ezra 3:10. The Jews encounter adversity and cease the work shortly after the foundation is laid. Ezra 4:4-5 shortly after the foundation was laid, the work ceased until the reign of Darius.


King Cyrus is in 2 Chronicles 36:21-23. It about him calling the Jewish people to return to Jerusalem. It's not about the building of the temple foundation. You just skipped 3 chapters into Ezra and commented about the temple instead.

Stop making yourself look so ignorant and post something intelligence for once.

***********************************************

Do you know what your problem is Fusion77?

You're telling people based on Haggai 2:20-23, the date of this shaking happens shortly after 12/06/2015. I already told you the year is incorrect. The bible points to a different year. You refused to believe me. Than I tried to show you in Haggai 2:18-19 that Haggai mentioned the temple foundation had to be completed before any shaking begins.

We don't see construction on a 3rd temple at this time. There's no evidence of a foundation as of 12/06/2015. You continue to blatantly disregard scripture: Haggai 2:18 and other parts of the bible that reveals a different year.













.







.




Haggai 2:20-23 is a message to Zerubbabel. Haggai 2:18-19 is also a message only to Zerubbabel. Haggai 2:18 doesn't say there needs to be temple standing.

Bible > Hebrew > Haggai 2:18
Haggai 2:18
Text Analysis
Str Translit Hebrew English Morph
7760[e] śî-mū- שִׂימוּ־ consider Verb
4994[e] נָ֣א now Inj
3824[e] lə-ḇaḇ-ḵem, לְבַבְכֶ֔ם consider Noun
4480[e] min- מִן־ from Prep
3117[e] hay-yō-wm הַיּ֥וֹם day Noun
2088[e] haz-zeh הַזֶּ֖ה this Pro
4605[e] wā-mā-‘ə-lāh; וָמָ֑עְלָה and upward Subst
3117[e] mî-yō-wm מִיּוֹם֩ day Noun
6242[e] ‘eś-rîm עֶשְׂרִ֨ים twentieth Noun
702 [e] wə-’ar-bā-‘āh וְאַרְבָּעָ֜ה and from the four Noun
8671[e] lat-tə-šî-‘î, לַתְּשִׁיעִ֗י of the ninth Adj
4480[e] lə-min- לְמִן־ day Prep
3117[e] hay-yō-wm הַיּ֛וֹם [month even] the day Noun
834 [e] ’ă-šer- אֲשֶׁר־ that Prt
3245[e] yus-saḏ יֻסַּ֥ד the foundation Verb
1964[e] hê-ḵal- הֵֽיכַל־ temple Noun
3068[e] Yah-weh יְהוָ֖ה of the LORD Noun
7760[e] śî-mū שִׂ֥ימוּ consider Verb
3824[e] lə-ḇaḇ-ḵem. לְבַבְכֶֽם׃ heart Noun
Hebrew Texts

All it says to (Zerubbabel) is to consider in his heart from the day the foundation of the Lords temple was laid until the day he received the message.
Is the seed in the barn? Haggai 2:19.
The seed represents the Word of God Luke
8:11 ESV Now the parable is this: the seed is the word of God.

This Zerubbabel will be a sower of seed (word of God) in end time Babylon (NOW, the world as a whole is a slave to sin). This is not a message for anyone, it is just for him. It does NOT say the 3rd temple foundation must be laid.

( Zerubbabel) consider in your heart. From the day the foundation was laid until the day you received this message

Isaiah 28:16

16Therefore thus says the Lord GOD,
“Behold, I am laying in Zion a stone, a tested stone,
A costly cornerstone for the foundation, firmly placed.

Ephesians 2:20-22

20having been built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Christ Jesus Himself being the corner stone,21in whom the whole building, being fitted together, is growing into a holy temple in the Lord, 22in whom you also are being built together into a dwelling of God in the Spirit.

And again in 1 Peter 2:4-6

As Living Stones

4And coming to Him as to a living stone which has been rejected by men, but is choice and precious in the sight of God, 5you also, as living stones, are being built up as a spiritual house for a holy priesthood, to offer up spiritual sacrifices acceptable to God through Jesus Christ.

6For this is contained in Scripture:
“BEHOLD, I LAY IN ZION A CHOICE STONE, APRECIOUS CORNER stone,
AND HE WHO BELIEVES IN HIM WILL NOT BEDISAPPOINTED.”


It's not given for most to understand. It's the veiled word of The Lord God Almighty. Just accept my warning.

In essence, the message to Zerubbabel is to be sure he has the "seed" word of God stored/gathered up in his heart. He will soon be witnessing to the world.


Haggai 2:20-23 is another message to Zerubbabel only. That message has gone forth. Forget the 99% ,I'm 100%. I'm trying to warn people just to make sure their spiritual house is in order.

Here is Haggai 2:20-21 in the ESV I'll move one period, as the original writings had no periods.


20The word of the LORD came a second time to Haggai. on the twenty-fourth day of the month, 21“Speak to Zerubbabel, governor of Judah, saying, I am about to shake the heavens and the earth

That message HAS gone forth! the Lord told Haggai to speak through His word on THAT DAY! Why not wait and see? Then, if it doesn't happen by the end of next year I'll apologize whenever I'm in this forum for giving a false warning. But if it does happen, my intent is to warn people to be prepared.

The book of Haggai has a reference to all 4 physical temples and even the spiritual temple as described in Ephesians 2:20-22. Again in 1 Peter 2:4-6


As Living Stones

4And coming to Him as to a living stone which has been rejected by men, but is choice and precious in the sight of God, 5you also, as living stones, are being built up as a spiritual house for a holy priesthood, to offer up spiritual sacrifices acceptable to God through Jesus Christ.

6For this is contained in Scripture:
“BEHOLD, I LAY IN ZION A CHOICE STONE, APRECIOUS CORNER stone,
AND HE WHO BELIEVES IN HIM WILL NOT BEDISAPPOINTED.”

EVERY TEMPLE is referenced in the book of Haggai...4 physical 1 spiritual. Haggai 1 is ALL about the second temple! How could there even be a debate on this?

This Zerubbabel that is here now is NOT a physical builder! He is a SPIRITUAL BUILDER! It is living stones! His ministry begins after this shaking!
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

Psalm3704

And He shall give you the desires of your heart.
Aug 10, 2015
1,723
391
✟7,925.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Private
You say ONLY the tribes of Judah and Benjamin return. But, the bible doesn't SPECIFICALLY say that...

And I'll say it again, only the tribes of Judah and Benjamin returned to the holy land after the Babylonian exile. The house of Israel did NOT return, only the house of Judah returned. The house of Israel did NOT occupy the holy land anytime during the period of the second temple. The house of Israel did NOT return to the holy land in 1948 either.

You can keep arguing this till your head turns pinkish-blue and you'll still be wrong.

You can hold your breath till your face turns purple and you'll still be wrong.

You can pound your forehead on the desk till it cracks and you'll still be wrong.

You can smash your face against the pavement till you get a bloody nose and you'll still be wrong.

It says EVEN EVERYONE! EVEN EVERYONE!

The decree that Cyrus made was a decree over the entir Media Persian empire. It applied to Jews that were taken captive by Assyria as well.

How could we ever know if NOBODY of the other 10 tribes returned? It was their choice if they wanted to return. It is a debatable issue.

WRONG!!! WRONG!!! WRONG!!!

When Cyrus called back the Jewish people to rebuild the temple and the holy land, the Jews that were dispersed by the Assyrians did not return.










.
 
Upvote 0

Psalm3704

And He shall give you the desires of your heart.
Aug 10, 2015
1,723
391
✟7,925.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Private
Haggai 2:20-23 is a message to Zerubbabel. Haggai 2:18-19 is also a message only to Zerubbabel. Haggai 2:18 doesn't say there needs to be temple standing.

Bible > Hebrew > Haggai 2:18
Haggai 2:18
Text Analysis
Str Translit Hebrew English Morph
7760[e] śî-mū- שִׂימוּ־ consider Verb
4994[e] נָ֣א now Inj
3824[e] lə-ḇaḇ-ḵem, לְבַבְכֶ֔ם consider Noun
4480[e] min- מִן־ from Prep
3117[e] hay-yō-wm הַיּ֥וֹם day Noun
2088[e] haz-zeh הַזֶּ֖ה this Pro
4605[e] wā-mā-‘ə-lāh; וָמָ֑עְלָה and upward Subst
3117[e] mî-yō-wm מִיּוֹם֩ day Noun
6242[e] ‘eś-rîm עֶשְׂרִ֨ים twentieth Noun
702 [e] wə-’ar-bā-‘āh וְאַרְבָּעָ֜ה and from the four Noun
8671[e] lat-tə-šî-‘î, לַתְּשִׁיעִ֗י of the ninth Adj
4480[e] lə-min- לְמִן־ day Prep
3117[e] hay-yō-wm הַיּ֛וֹם [month even] the day Noun
834 [e] ’ă-šer- אֲשֶׁר־ that Prt
3245[e] yus-saḏ יֻסַּ֥ד the foundation Verb
1964[e] hê-ḵal- הֵֽיכַל־ temple Noun
3068[e] Yah-weh יְהוָ֖ה of the LORD Noun
7760[e] śî-mū שִׂ֥ימוּ consider Verb
3824[e] lə-ḇaḇ-ḵem. לְבַבְכֶֽם׃ heart Noun
Hebrew Texts

All it says to (Zerubbabel) is to consider in his heart from the day the foundation of the Lords temple was laid until the day he received the message.
Is the seed in the barn? Haggai 2:19.
The seed represents the Word of God Luke
8:11 ESV Now the parable is this: the seed is the word of God.

This Zerubbabel will be a sower of seed (word of God) in end time Babylon (NOW, the world as a whole is a slave to sin). This is not a message for anyone, it is just for him. It does NOT say the 3rd temple foundation must be laid.

( Zerubbabel) consider in your heart. From the day the foundation was laid until the day you received this message

Isaiah 28:16

16Therefore thus says the Lord GOD,
“Behold, I am laying in Zion a stone, a tested stone,
A costly cornerstone for the foundation, firmly placed.

Ephesians 2:20-22

20having been built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Christ Jesus Himself being the corner stone,21in whom the whole building, being fitted together, is growing into a holy temple in the Lord, 22in whom you also are being built together into a dwelling of God in the Spirit.

And again in 1 Peter 2:4-6

As Living Stones

4And coming to Him as to a living stone which has been rejected by men, but is choice and precious in the sight of God, 5you also, as living stones, are being built up as a spiritual house for a holy priesthood, to offer up spiritual sacrifices acceptable to God through Jesus Christ.

6For this is contained in Scripture:
“BEHOLD, I LAY IN ZION A CHOICE STONE, APRECIOUS CORNER stone,
AND HE WHO BELIEVES IN HIM WILL NOT BEDISAPPOINTED.”


It's not given for most to understand. It's the veiled word of The Lord God Almighty. Just accept my warning.

In essence, the message to Zerubbabel is to be sure he has the "seed" word of God stored/gathered up in his heart. He will soon be witnessing to the world.


Haggai 2:20-23 is another message to Zerubbabel only. That message has gone forth. Forget the 99% ,I'm 100%. I'm trying to warn people just to make sure their spiritual house is in order.

Here is Haggai 2:20-21 in the ESV I'll move one period, as the original writings had no periods.


20The word of the LORD came a second time to Haggai. on the twenty-fourth day of the month, 21“Speak to Zerubbabel, governor of Judah, saying, I am about to shake the heavens and the earth

That message HAS gone forth! the Lord told Haggai to speak through His word on THAT DAY! Why not wait and see? Then, if it doesn't happen by the end of next year I'll apologize whenever I'm in this forum for giving a false warning. But if it does happen, my intent is to warn people to be prepared.

The book of Haggai has a reference to all 4 physical temples and even the spiritual temple as described in Ephesians 2:20-22. Again in 1 Peter 2:4-6


As Living Stones

4And coming to Him as to a living stone which has been rejected by men, but is choice and precious in the sight of God, 5you also, as living stones, are being built up as a spiritual house for a holy priesthood, to offer up spiritual sacrifices acceptable to God through Jesus Christ.

6For this is contained in Scripture:
“BEHOLD, I LAY IN ZION A CHOICE STONE, APRECIOUS CORNER stone,
AND HE WHO BELIEVES IN HIM WILL NOT BEDISAPPOINTED.”

EVERY TEMPLE is referenced in the book of Haggai...4 physical 1 spiritual. Haggai 1 is ALL about the second temple! How could there even be a debate on this?

This Zerubbabel that is here now is NOT a physical builder! He is a SPIRITUAL BUILDER! It is living stones! His ministry begins after this shaking!

This Zerubbabel that is here now is NOT a physical builder! He is a SPIRITUAL BUILDER! It is living stones! His ministry begins after this shaking!

Just get over it. Haggai completely debunked your fable claim of any shaking happening after 12/06/2015 with Haggai 2:18. So does Zachariah, he too debunked your false delusion the 24th day of the 9th month fell on the year 2015.

By the way, today is 02/06/2016, still no shaking of heaven and earth!

Now all you're doing is trying to discredit Haggai with more deceptions, this time claiming the temple being a spiritual temple using scriptures cherry picked of out context: Isaiah 28:16, Ephesians 2:20-22, 1 Peter 2:4-6.

The book of Haggai has a reference to all 4 physical temples and even the spiritual temple as described in Ephesians 2:20-22. Again in 1 Peter 2:4-6

As Living Stones

4And coming to Him as to a living stone which has been rejected by men, but is choice and precious in the sight of God, 5you also, as living stones, are being built up as a spiritual house for a holy priesthood, to offer up spiritual sacrifices acceptable to God through Jesus Christ.

6For this is contained in Scripture:
“BEHOLD, I LAY IN ZION A CHOICE STONE, APRECIOUS CORNER stone,
AND HE WHO BELIEVES IN HIM WILL NOT BEDISAPPOINTED.”

EVERY TEMPLE is referenced in the book of Haggai...4 physical 1 spiritual. Haggai 1 is ALL about the second temple! How could there even be a debate on this?

Get your facts straight boy! No temple has ever been built on Mount Zion, and neither will the next temple. Both 1st and 2nd temple sat on Mount Moriah.

Your attempt to discredit the book of Haggai using 1 Peter 2:6 foiled again and just blew up in your face.

growing-up-geek-dad-dont-blow-my-face-off


***********************************************

Do you know what your problem is Fusion77?

You're telling people based on Haggai 2:20-23, the date of this shaking happens shortly after 12/06/2015. I already told you the year is incorrect. The bible points to a different year. You refused to believe me. Than I tried to show you in Haggai 2:18-19 that Haggai mentioned the temple foundation had to be completed before any shaking begins.

We don't see construction on a 3rd temple at this time. There's no evidence of a foundation as of 12/06/2015. You continue to blatantly disregard scripture: Haggai 2:18 and other parts of the bible that reveals a different year.









.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

Fusion77

Well-Known Member
Dec 18, 2015
756
267
50
Texas
✟62,877.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
And I'll say it again, only the tribes of Judah and Benjamin returned to the holy land after the Babylonian exile. The house of Israel did NOT return, only the house of Judah returned. The house of Israel did NOT occupy the holy land anytime during the period of the second temple. The house of Israel did NOT return to the holy land in 1948 either.

You can keep arguing this till your head turns pinkish-blue and you'll still be wrong.

You can hold your breath till your face turns purple and you'll still be wrong.

You can pound your forehead on the desk till it cracks and you'll still be wrong.

You can smash your face against the pavement till you get a bloody nose and you'll still be wrong.



WRONG!!! WRONG!!! WRONG!!!

When Cyrus called back the Jewish people to rebuild the temple and the holy land, the Jews that were dispersed by the Assyrians did not return.










.
2 Chronicles 11:16-17. Even after the split there was always a remnant of Israel that remained faithful.even after the kingdom was divided, even until after the exile.

16Those from all the tribes of Israel who set their hearts on seeking the LORDGod of Israel followed them to Jerusalem, to sacrifice to the LORD God of their fathers. 17They strengthened the kingdom of Judah and supported Rehoboam the son of Solomon for three years, for they walked in the way of David and Solomon for three years.

Always a remnant left! To say that ONLY Judah and Benjamin returned can't be proven in scripture...it is highly likely a remnant of the faithful also returned from Assyria and.

This is really not important to Haggai 1 having historically transpired. The same people in Haggai 1 are the same in Exra 4:24-6:16. Whether it was just a remnant of the 10 tribes, or much more. It doesn't matter!
 
Upvote 0

Fusion77

Well-Known Member
Dec 18, 2015
756
267
50
Texas
✟62,877.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Just get over it. Haggai completely debunked your fable claim of any shaking happening after 12/06/2015 with Haggai 2:18. So does Zachariah, he too debunked your false delusion the 24th day of the 9th month fell on the year 2015.

By the way, today is 02/06/2016, still no shaking of heaven and earth!

Now all you're doing is trying to discredit Haggai with more deceptions, this time claiming the temple being a spiritual temple using scriptures cherry picked of out context: Isaiah 28:16, Ephesians 2:20-22, 1 Peter 2:4-6.



Get your facts straight boy! No temple has ever been built on Mount Zion, and neither will the next temple. Both 1st and 2nd temple sat on Mount Moriah.

Your attempt to discredit the book of Haggai using 1 Peter 2:6 foiled again and just blew up in your face.

growing-up-geek-dad-dont-blow-my-face-off


***********************************************

Do you know what your problem is Fusion77?

You're telling people based on Haggai 2:20-23, the date of this shaking happens shortly after 12/06/2015. I already told you the year is incorrect. The bible points to a different year. You refused to believe me. Than I tried to show you in Haggai 2:18-19 that Haggai mentioned the temple foundation had to be completed before any shaking begins.

We don't see construction on a 3rd temple at this time. There's no evidence of a foundation as of 12/06/2015. You continue to blatantly disregard scripture: Haggai 2:18 and other parts of the bible that reveals a different year.









.

.[/QUOTE] out of context, what? We are the living stones! We are being built up into a spiritual temple!!!

1 Peter 2:4-6

4And coming to Him as to a living stone which has been rejected by men, but is choice and precious in the sight of God, 5you also, as living stones, are being built up as a spiritual house for a holy priesthood, to offer up spiritual sacrifices acceptable to God through Jesus Christ.

6For this is contained in Scripture:
“BEHOLD, I LAY IN ZION A CHOICE STONE, APRECIOUS CORNER stone,
AND HE WHO BELIEVES IN HIM WILL NOT BEDISAPPOINTED.”

Ephesians 2:20-22
20having been built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Christ Jesus Himself being the corner stone,21in whom the whole building, being fitted together, is growing into a holy temple in the Lord, 22in whom you also are being built together into a dwelling of God in the Spirit.

Zerubbabel is a spiritual builder in Haggai 2 and Zechariah 4! It's spiritual work!

Zechariah 4:9 The hands of Zerubbabel have laid the foundation of this house, and his hands will finish it. Then you will know that the LORD of hosts has sent me to you.

Zerubbabel did NOT lay the foundation of the second temple. This is spiritual!

Ezra 3:9-10
9And Jeshua with his sons and his brothers, and Kadmiel and his sons, the sons of Judah, together supervised the workmen in the house of God, along with the sons of Henadad and the Levites, their sons and brothers.

10And when the builders laid the foundation of the temple of the LORD, the priests in their vestments came forward with trumpets, and the Levites, the sons of Asaph, with cymbals, to praise the LORD, according to the directions of David king of Israel. NO Zerubbabel!!!

Ezra 5:16

16Then this Sheshbazzar came and laid the foundations of the house of God that is in Jerusalem, and from that time until now it has been in building, and it is not yet finished.’

No Zerubbabel!!!!

ZERUBBABEL is a symbol of the witness in Haggai 2 and Zechariah 4!!!

Zechariah 3:8
Now listen, Joshua the high priest, you and your friends who are sitting in front of you—indeed they are men who are a symbol, for behold, I am going to bring in My servant the Branch.

YOU and your friends are a SYMBOL! WHO WAS JOSHUAS MAIN ASSOCIATE? Zerubbabel! He is a symbol of the witness.

3 verses later you have Zechariah 4 it's the same encounter with the same angel and then....


1Then the angel who was speaking with me returned and roused me, as a man who is awakened from his sleep.2He said to me, “What do you see?” And I said, “I see, and behold, a lampstand all of gold with its bowl on the top of it, and its seven lamps on it with seven spouts belonging to each of the lamps which are on the top of it; 3also two olive trees by it, one on the right side of the bowl and the other on its left side.”

(You can't separate this vision from Zerubbabel! It's the word of the Lord God Almighty to Zerubbabel!... The olive trees, the olive branches, the oil, the lamps and the lampstand...THAT IS HIS MESSAGE!!!!!!!)

4Then I said to the angel who was speaking with me saying, “What are these, my lord?” 5So the angel who was speaking with me answered and said to me, “Do you not know what these are?” And I said, “No, my lord.” 6Then he said to me, “This is the word of the LORD to Zerubbabel saying, ‘Not by might nor by power, but by My Spirit,’ says the LORD of hosts.

(It says right here, those objects are the Lords message to ZERUBBABEL!!!!! Do you think the Spirit of God is concerned with physical building???)

7‘What are you, O great mountain? Before Zerubbabel you will become a plain; and he will bring forth the top stone with shouts of “Grace, grace to it!”’”

8Also the word of the LORD came to me, saying, 9“The hands of Zerubbabel have laid the foundation of this house, and his hands will finish it. Then you will know that the LORD of hosts has sent me to you.

(Zerubbabel did NOT lay the foundation of the second temple!!!!)


3248. yesudah is where the word for foundation is derived, in Zechariah 4:9. It's a feminine NOUN. 1 other occurrence! Psalms 87:1
1His foundation is in the holy mountains.


Zechariah 4:10
10“For who has despised the day of small things? But these seven will be glad when they see the plumb line in the hand of Zerubbabel—these are the eyes of the LORD which range to and fro throughout the earth.”

(Only the Spirit of God sees what Zerubbabel did in 7-10!!! He is a Spiritual builder!!!!)

11Then I said to him, “What are these two olive trees on the right of the lampstand and on its left?” 12And I answered the secuond time and said to him, “What are the two olive branches which are beside the two golden pipes, which empty the golden oil from themselves?” 13So he answered me, saying, “Do you not know what these are?” And I said, “No, my lord.” 14Then he said, “These are the two anointed ones who are standing by the Lord of the whole earth.”

(It's a further explanation of the vision In Zechariah 4:2-3! You CANT separate these objects from Zerubbabel! It's The word of the LORD to Zerubbabel!!!!

Zechariah 3:8
Now listen, Joshua the high priest, you and your friends who are sitting in front of you—indeed they are men who are a symbol, for behold, I am going to bring in My servant the Branch.

JOSHUAS friend ZERUBBABEL is a symbol!!! Of the witness! There's nothing physical in Zechariah 4! Nothing in Zechariah 4 pertains to the Zerubbabel of the second temple era!!! It's ALL about the 2 witnesses!!!!

Haggai 2:4-5 4‘But now take courage, Zerubbabel,’ declares the LORD, ‘take courage also, Joshua son of Jehozadak, the high priest, and all you people of the land take courage,’ declares the LORD, ‘and work;
(this is NOT speaking of physical work! It is building living stones!)

for I am with you,’ declares the LORD of hosts. 5‘As for the promise which I made you when you came out of Egypt, My Spirit is abiding in your midst; do not fear!’

(The Spirit of God is involved in this spiritual work!! It is NOT pyhsical work).

The first day of the feast of dedication is sundown on 24th day of the 9th month. In 2015 it was 12/06. This year it will be December 24th. How do the prophets say that the first day of Chanukah didn't begin on sundown on 12/06/2015?

The Spiritual temple has been rededicated for building, and a revival will begin after this shaking! The Lord will pour out his Spirit and people will be receptive to receive Christ after this! There will be a war! It's described in Haggai 2:20-23! Be sure your spiritual house is in order, because we don't know where it will be centered.

It's perfectly Okay, you don't accept plan of The Lord God Almighty which is being unveiled, that's fine. But, It's probably not a good idea to mock it. It is The Lords Plan! It is NOT mine! But, I think it's awesome!


YOU CANT SEPARATE ZERUBBABEL FROM THE OBJECTS IN Zechariah 4:2-3
2 He said to me, “What do you see?” And I said, “I see, and behold, a lampstand all of gold with its bowl on the top of it, and its seven lamps on it with seven spouts belonging to each of the lamps which are on the top of it; 3also two olive trees by it, one on the right side of the bowl and the other on its left side.”

THE OLIVE TREES, OLIVE BRANCHES, OIL, LAMPSTAND, BOWL AND LAMPS ARE THE WORD OF GOD TO Zerubbabel!!!! NO ONE ELSE!!!!!

All bible verses are Nasb or ESV.


4 physical temples in Haggai including but not limited to.

Haggai 1:8 (SECOND TEMPLE)
8Go up to the mountains, bring wood and rebuild the temple, (SECOND TEMPLE). that I may be pleased with it and be glorified,” says the LORD.

Haggai 2:3 (FIRST AND THIRD TEMPLE)

3‘Who is left among you who saw this temple in its former glory? (FIRST TEMPLE) And how do you see it now? Does it not seem to you like nothing in comparison? (THE THIRD TEMPLE WITH THE ABOMINATION OF DESOLATION STANDING IN THE HOLY PLACE).

Haggai 2:9 (FOURTH TEMPLE)

9‘The latter glory of this house (4TH MILLENIAL TEMPLE) will be greater than the former,’ says the LORD of hosts, ‘and in this place I will give peace,’ (4TH TEMPLE) declares the LORDof hosts.”

Here are the references to the spiritual temple
Haggai 2:18
(SPIRITUAL TEMPLE AS DESCRIBED IN Ephesians 2:20-22)

18 ‘Do consider from this day onward, from the twenty-fourth day of the ninth month;from the day when the temple of the LORDwas founded, (SPIRITUAL TEMPLE) consider:

Haggai 2:4

4'But now take courage, Zerubbabel,’ declares the LORD, ‘take courage also, Joshua son of Jehozadak, the high priest, and all you people of the land take courage,’ declares the LORD, ‘and work; (THE FINAL WORK ON THE SPIRITUAL TEMPLE STRUCTURE, FINAL 3.5 YEARS) for I am with you,’ declares the LORD of hosts.

These are references to all 4 physical and the spiritual temple. I did not include all references but gave and example of all 4 physical and the spiritual temple. They are all at least made reference to in the book of Haggai.

You will not accept this now. But you will, at some point!


This shaking should happen this year. Before 12/26/2016 which is the 24th day of the 9th month 2016. It could be next year so be prepared.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

Psalm3704

And He shall give you the desires of your heart.
Aug 10, 2015
1,723
391
✟7,925.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Private
Always a remnant left! To say that ONLY Judah and Benjamin returned can't be proven in scripture...it is highly likely a remnant of the faithful also returned from Assyria and.

We keep going over the same things but you disregard the bible. You say the other 10 tribes didn't return during Ezra. But, Ezra 1:5 says EVEN EVERYONE whose spirit the Lord stirred retuned. Along with the head fathers if of Judah, Benjamin, and the priests and Levites. Please read the bible. Ezra 2:2 mentions the people of ISRAEL! Ezra 4:3 Mentions the chief fathers of ISRAEL! Ezra 6:16 mentions the sons of ISRAEL! Jerusalem is right on the lands of Judah and Benjamin! That's their allotted portion.

No, you're wrong like everything else you've posted. Count the number of tribes below.

The twelve tribes are as follows: Reuben, Simeon, Judah, Issachar, Zebulun, Benjamin, Dan, Naphtali, Gad, Asher, Ephraim and Manasseh.


Map of Ancient Israel
tribemap.gif


They were named Asher, Dan, Ephraim, Gad, Issachar, Manasseh, Naphtali, Reuben, Simeon, and Zebulun


*Do you see Levi's name in the list? NO!
*Do you see Levi's name on the map? NO!
*How many tribes do you think there are with Levi, 13? NO!
*Does the book of Ezra mentioned the tribes of Reuben, Simeon, Issachar, Zebulun, Dan, Gad, Asher, Ephraim and Manasseh returning to Jerusalem after the Babylonian exile? NO!

Map of future Israel
ezekialmillennium_land.gif

*Do you see Levi's name in the map above of future Israel? NO!

Get it through you head, after Joshua lead the Jews into the promised land, he did not distribute any land to Levi, therefore making Levi's family lineage not a de facto tribe. Joshua 14:3-4

"The bible doesn't need to say "ONLY" the tribes of Judah and Benjamin when it only mentioned the tribes of Judah and Benjamin returning to Jerusalem and not mentioned any other tribes." Your arguments are faulty and pathetic!

Also get this through your thick head. The bible does not mention the other 10 tribes returning to Jerusalem anytime during the period of the second temple! They haven't returned from the Assyrian exile yet!

*****************************************

As the priestly Tribe, Levi was given no land. (Numbers 18:20-24) Instead of land, God gave Levi the tithes of the people of Israel.

Numbers 18:20-24 (ESV)
20 And the Lord said to Aaron, “You shall have no inheritance in their land, neither shall you have any portion among them. I am your portion and your inheritance among the people of Israel.
21 “To the Levites I have given every tithe in Israel for an inheritance, in return for their service that they do, their service in the tent of meeting, 22 so that the people of Israel do not come near the tent of meeting, lest they bear sin and die. 23 But the Levites shall do the service of the tent of meeting, and they shall bear their iniquity. It shall be a perpetual statute throughout your generations, and among the people of Israel they shall have no inheritance. 24 For the tithe of the people of Israel, which they present as a contribution to the Lord, I have given to the Levites for an inheritance. Therefore I have said of them that they shall have no inheritance among the people of Israel.”

So stop constantly being a dumb ox trying to rewrite the history of the Jewish people. When the bible said the tribes of Judah and Benjamin in Ezra 1:5 returned to Jerusalem, it's 110% correct. It's not the tribes of Levites, Judah and Benjamin. Every translation associated Levites with the priests, not a tribe in Ezra 1:5.

Ezra 1:5 NLT
Then God stirred the hearts of the priests and Levites and the leaders of the tribes of Judah and Benjamin to go to Jerusalem to rebuild the Temple of the Lord.

You're 110% ignorant unable to comprehend things you read and when the bible or myself disagrees with your view, you go out of your way to prove us wrong when you're the one who's in error.

And I'll say it again! Only the tribes of Judah and Benjamin returned from the Babylonian exile. The other 10 tribes did NOT return at that time, nor any time during the period of the 2nd temple, nor in 1948.

Now stop constantly being a dumb ox trying to prove others wrong (namely the bible) when you don't know their history.

***********************************************

Do you know what your problem is Fusion77?

You're telling people based on Haggai 2:20-23, the date of this shaking happens shortly after 12/06/2015. I already told you the year is incorrect. The bible points to a different year. You refused to believe me. Than I tried to show you in Haggai 2:18-19 that Haggai mentioned the temple foundation had to be completed before any shaking begins.

We don't see construction on a 3rd temple at this time. There's no evidence of a foundation as of 12/06/2015. You continue to blatantly disregard scripture: Haggai 2:18 and other parts of the bible that reveals a different year.






.








.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

Psalm3704

And He shall give you the desires of your heart.
Aug 10, 2015
1,723
391
✟7,925.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Private
out of context, what? We are the living stones! We are being built up into a spiritual temple!!!

1 Peter 2:4-6

6For this is contained in Scripture:
“BEHOLD, I LAY IN ZION A CHOICE STONE, APRECIOUS CORNER stone,
AND HE WHO BELIEVES IN HIM WILL NOT BEDISAPPOINTED.”

Get it through your dumb thick ox head, 1 Peter 2:6 was not referring to any temples built in Jerusalem. The 1st and 2nd temple sat on Mount Moriah as well as the 3rd temple once completed.

In 1 Peter 2:6, Jesus lays a cornerstone in Zion! Wrong mount knucklehead! Mount Zion is not Mount Moriah!

Every time you attempt to twist scriptures around to conform to your view.........KABOOM in thy face!


4 physical temples in Haggai including but not limited to.

Haggai 1:8 (SECOND TEMPLE)
8Go up to the mountains, bring wood and rebuild the temple, (SECOND TEMPLE). that I may be pleased with it and be glorified,” says the LORD.

Haggai 2:3 (FIRST AND THIRD TEMPLE)

3‘Who is left among you who saw this temple in its former glory? (FIRST TEMPLE) And how do you see it now? Does it not seem to you like nothing in comparison? (THE THIRD TEMPLE WITH THE ABOMINATION OF DESOLATION STANDING IN THE HOLY PLACE).

Haggai 2:9 (FOURTH TEMPLE)

9‘The latter glory of this house (4TH MILLENIAL TEMPLE) will be greater than the former,’ says the LORD of hosts, ‘and in this place I will give peace,’ (4TH TEMPLE) declares the LORDof hosts.”

Here are the references to the spiritual temple
Haggai 2:18
(SPIRITUAL TEMPLE AS DESCRIBED IN Ephesians 2:20-22)


Typical! Always trying to make the bible conform to your theories.

Whenever bible verses debunks your delusional theories, you just go out of your way to discredit what the bible said. Claim one verse being past and fulfilled while the next verse below being future. One verse applies to one temple, next verse below applies to another temple. One verse applies to a spiritual temple, next verse below applies to a physical temple.

No evidence either!

The first day of the feast of dedication is sundown on 24th day of the 9th month. In 2015 it was 12/06. This year it will be December 24th. How do the prophets say that the first day of Chanukah didn't begin on sundown on 12/06/2015?

actually that date represents the first day of Chanukah, which is the feast of dedication. The first day of Chanukah was at sundown on 12/06/2015 you might want to recheck your calendar to get the correct information.

The book of Haggai is divided by messages. It has some for the past 520 BC and some for now. The one I referenced has gone forth on 12/06/15.

You're inhaling shoe polish here. The 24th day of Kislev always falls on the day of Chanukah every year. There's nothing significant about it.

http://www.hebcal.com/hebcal/?year=...n&o=on&vis=on&d=on&c=off&maj=on&min=on&mod=on

Chanukah, the Jewish festival of rededication, also known as the festival of lights, is an eight day festival beginning on the 25th day of the Jewish month of Kislev.

Chanukkah is probably one of the best known Jewish holidays, not because of any great religious significance, but because of its proximity to Christmas. Many non-Jews (and even many assimilated Jews!) think of this holiday as the Jewish Christmas, adopting many of the Christmas customs, such as elaborate gift-giving and decoration. It is bitterly ironic that this holiday, which has its roots in a revolution against assimilation and the suppression of Jewish religion, has become the most assimilated, secular holiday on our calendar.

http://www.jewfaq.org/holiday7.htm

So this is your evidence the 24th day of Kislev fell on 2015? Hence the date-setting time of 12/06/2015.

What about 2013 or 2014? The 24th day of Kislev also fell on Chanukkah on those years too.





This shaking should happen this year. Before 12/26/2016 which is the 24th day of the 9th month 2016. It could be next year so be prepared.

You're just gonna end up pushing it another year and another year into the future. The shaking of heaven and earth won't happen till after Israel expands all her borders in all directions also: Isaiah 26:15, then comes the rapture: Isaiah 26:19 and finally Second Coming: Isaiah 26:21.

Isaiah 26:15-21 GNT
15 Lord, you have made our nation grow,
enlarging its territory on every side;

and this has brought you honor.
16 You punished your people, Lord,
and in anguish they prayed to you.
17 You, Lord, have made us cry out,
as a woman in labor cries out in pain.
18 We were in pain and agony,
but we gave birth to nothing.
We have won no victory for our land;
we have accomplished nothing.

19 Those of our people who have died will live again!
Their bodies will come back to life.
All those sleeping in their graves
will wake up and sing for joy.
As the sparkling dew refreshes the earth,

so the Lord will revive those who have long been dead.
20 Go into your houses, my people, and shut the door behind you.
Hide yourselves for a little while until God's anger is over.
21 The Lord is coming from his heavenly dwelling place to punish

the people of the earth for their sins. The murders that were secretly
committed on the earth will be revealed, and the ground will no longer
hide those who have been killed.

So much for your date-setting prediction of 12/06/2015. (And the winner is..............not you! U can't touch this! LA LA LA! I told ya homeboy!)



***********************************************

Do you know what your problem is Fusion77?

You're telling people based on Haggai 2:20-23, the date of this shaking happens shortly after 12/06/2015. I already told you the year is incorrect. The bible points to a different year. You refused to believe me. Than I tried to show you in Haggai 2:18-19 that Haggai mentioned the temple foundation had to be completed before any shaking begins.

We don't see construction on a 3rd temple at this time. There's no evidence of a foundation as of 12/06/2015. You continue to blatantly disregard scripture: Haggai 2:18 and other parts of the bible that reveals a different year.












.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

Fusion77

Well-Known Member
Dec 18, 2015
756
267
50
Texas
✟62,877.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
No, you're wrong like everything else you've posted. Count the number of tribes below.

The twelve tribes are as follows: Reuben, Simeon, Judah, Issachar, Zebulun, Benjamin, Dan, Naphtali, Gad, Asher, Ephraim and Manasseh.


Map of Ancient Israel
tribemap.gif


They were named Asher, Dan, Ephraim, Gad, Issachar, Manasseh, Naphtali, Reuben, Simeon, and Zebulun


*Do you see Levi's name in the list? NO!
*Do you see Levi's name on the map? NO!
*How many tribes do you think there are with Levi, 13? NO!
*Does the book of Ezra mentioned the tribes of Reuben, Simeon, Issachar, Zebulun, Dan, Gad, Asher, Ephraim and Manasseh returning to Jerusalem after the Babylonian exile? NO!

Map of future Israel
ezekialmillennium_land.gif

*Do you see Levi's name in the map above of future Israel? NO!

Get it through you head, after Joshua lead the Jews into the promised land, he did not distribute any land to Levi, therefore making Levi's family lineage not a de facto tribe. Joshua 14:3-4

"The bible doesn't need to say "ONLY" the tribes of Judah and Benjamin when it only mentioned the tribes of Judah and Benjamin returning to Jerusalem and not mentioned any other tribes." Your arguments are faulty and pathetic!

Also get this through your thick head. The bible does not mention the other 10 tribes returning to Jerusalem anytime during the period of the second temple! They haven't returned from the Assyrian exile yet!

*****************************************

As the priestly Tribe, Levi was given no land. (Numbers 18:20-24) Instead of land, God gave Levi the tithes of the people of Israel.

Numbers 18:20-24 (ESV)
20 And the Lord said to Aaron, “You shall have no inheritance in their land, neither shall you have any portion among them. I am your portion and your inheritance among the people of Israel.
21 “To the Levites I have given every tithe in Israel for an inheritance, in return for their service that they do, their service in the tent of meeting, 22 so that the people of Israel do not come near the tent of meeting, lest they bear sin and die. 23 But the Levites shall do the service of the tent of meeting, and they shall bear their iniquity. It shall be a perpetual statute throughout your generations, and among the people of Israel they shall have no inheritance. 24 For the tithe of the people of Israel, which they present as a contribution to the Lord, I have given to the Levites for an inheritance. Therefore I have said of them that they shall have no inheritance among the people of Israel.”

So stop constantly being a dumb ox trying to rewrite the history of the Jewish people. When the bible said the tribes of Judah and Benjamin in Ezra 1:5 returned to Jerusalem, it's 110% correct. It's not the tribes of Levites, Judah and Benjamin. Every translation associated Levites with the priests, not a tribe in Ezra 1:5.

Ezra 1:5 NLT
Then God stirred the hearts of the priests and Levites and the leaders of the tribes of Judah and Benjamin to go to Jerusalem to rebuild the Temple of the Lord.

You're 110% ignorant unable to comprehend things you read and when the bible or myself disagrees with your view, you go out of your way to prove us wrong when you're the one who's in error.

And I'll say it again! Only the tribes of Judah and Benjamin returned from the Babylonian exile. The other 10 tribes did NOT return at that time, nor any time during the period of the 2nd temple, nor in 1948.

Now stop constantly being a dumb ox trying to prove others wrong (namely the bible) when you don't know their history.

***********************************************

Do you know what your problem is Fusion77?

You're telling people based on Haggai 2:20-23, the date of this shaking happens shortly after 12/06/2015. I already told you the year is incorrect. The bible points to a different year. You refused to believe me. Than I tried to show you in Haggai 2:18-19 that Haggai mentioned the temple foundation had to be completed before any shaking begins.

We don't see construction on a 3rd temple at this time. There's no evidence of a foundation as of 12/06/2015. You continue to blatantly disregard scripture: Haggai 2:18 and other parts of the bible that reveals a different year.






.








.
Even if not one soul from the ten tribes returned to help build the second temple. It doesn't matter! The point is Haggai 1 has already historically transpired, in the second year of Darius. All parallel accounts are given in Ezra 4:24-6:16.

Of course, I will admit that I can't prove that even a remnant of the 10 tribes returned the rebuild the second temple.

I don't know why your telling me that Levi didn't receive a portion of the land, as if I didn't know that. When did I say that they received an allotment of land?



Again my error. I can not prove that even a remnant of the 10 tribes returned. I'll admit that. Yes, the priests and Levites are not included in the 12 tribes...I caught that, and am aware of that.

This has no bearing on the fact that Haggai 1 has historically transpired!
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

Fusion77

Well-Known Member
Dec 18, 2015
756
267
50
Texas
✟62,877.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Get it through your dumb thick ox head, 1 Peter 2:6 was not referring to any temples built in Jerusalem. The 1st and 2nd temple sat on Mount Moriah as well as the 3rd temple once completed.

In 1 Peter 2:6, Jesus lays a cornerstone in Zion! Wrong mount knucklehead! Mount Zion is not Mount Moriah!

Every time you attempt to twist scriptures around to conform to your view.........KABOOM in thy face!





Typical! Always trying to make the bible conform to your theories.

Whenever bible verses debunks your delusional theories, you just go out of your way to discredit what the bible said. Claim one verse being past and fulfilled while the next verse below being future. One verse applies to one temple, next verse below applies to another temple. One verse applies to a spiritual temple, next verse below applies to a physical temple.

No evidence either!





You're inhaling shoe polish here. The 24th day of Kislev always falls on the day of Chanukah every year. There's nothing significant about it.

http://www.hebcal.com/hebcal/?year=...n&o=on&vis=on&d=on&c=off&maj=on&min=on&mod=on

Chanukah, the Jewish festival of rededication, also known as the festival of lights, is an eight day festival beginning on the 25th day of the Jewish month of Kislev.

Chanukkah is probably one of the best known Jewish holidays, not because of any great religious significance, but because of its proximity to Christmas. Many non-Jews (and even many assimilated Jews!) think of this holiday as the Jewish Christmas, adopting many of the Christmas customs, such as elaborate gift-giving and decoration. It is bitterly ironic that this holiday, which has its roots in a revolution against assimilation and the suppression of Jewish religion, has become the most assimilated, secular holiday on our calendar.

http://www.jewfaq.org/holiday7.htm

So this is your evidence the 24th day of Kislev fell on 2015? Hence the date-setting time of 12/06/2015.

What about 2013 or 2014? The 24th day of Kislev also fell on Chanukkah on those years too.







You're just gonna end up pushing it another year and another year into the future. The shaking of heaven and earth won't happen till after Israel expands all her borders in all directions also: Isaiah 26:15, then comes the rapture: Isaiah 26:19 and finally Second Coming: Isaiah 26:21.

Isaiah 26:15-21 GNT
15 Lord, you have made our nation grow,
enlarging its territory on every side;

and this has brought you honor.
16 You punished your people, Lord,
and in anguish they prayed to you.
17 You, Lord, have made us cry out,
as a woman in labor cries out in pain.
18 We were in pain and agony,
but we gave birth to nothing.
We have won no victory for our land;
we have accomplished nothing.

19 Those of our people who have died will live again!
Their bodies will come back to life.
All those sleeping in their graves
will wake up and sing for joy.
As the sparkling dew refreshes the earth,

so the Lord will revive those who have long been dead.
20 Go into your houses, my people, and shut the door behind you.
Hide yourselves for a little while until God's anger is over.
21 The Lord is coming from his heavenly dwelling place to punish

the people of the earth for their sins. The murders that were secretly
committed on the earth will be revealed, and the ground will no longer
hide those who have been killed.

So much for your date-setting prediction of 12/06/2015. (And the winner is..............not you! U can't touch this! LA LA LA! I told ya homeboy!)



***********************************************

Do you know what your problem is Fusion77?

You're telling people based on Haggai 2:20-23, the date of this shaking happens shortly after 12/06/2015. I already told you the year is incorrect. The bible points to a different year. You refused to believe me. Than I tried to show you in Haggai 2:18-19 that Haggai mentioned the temple foundation had to be completed before any shaking begins.

We don't see construction on a 3rd temple at this time. There's no evidence of a foundation as of 12/06/2015. You continue to blatantly disregard scripture: Haggai 2:18 and other parts of the bible that reveals a different year.












.
I'm guessing you're not reading much of what I write? These describe the spiritual temple! Aren't you reading the verses?
Why would a spiritual temple be on a physical mountain? The location of this spiritual temple is in the heavenly Zion! Do you think Christ is the Cornerstone of a spiritual temple that will rest on a physical mountain? Well of course, not. Here is that location.


Hebrews 12:22-23

22But you have come to Mount Zion and to the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and to myriads of angels, 23to the general assembly and church of the firstborn who are enrolled in heaven, and to God, the Judge of all, and to the spirits of the righteous made perfect,

The city of the living God where SPIRITS ARE MADE perfect!

This is the spiritual temple described in 1 Peter 2:4-6

4And coming to Him as to a living stone which has been rejected by men, but is choice and precious in the sight of God, 5you also, as living stones, are being built up as a spiritual house for a holy priesthood, to offer up spiritual sacrifices acceptable to God through Jesus Christ.

6For this is contained in Scripture:
“BEHOLD, I LAY IN ZION A CHOICE STONE, APRECIOUS CORNER stone,
AND HE WHO BELIEVES IN HIM WILL NOT BEDISAPPOINTED.”

This Cornerstone (Christ) is a Cornerstone laid in the Heavenly Mount Zion...The City of GOD! Where would you get that I'm suggesting the spiritual temple is a physical temple?

And again in Ephesians 2:20-22

20having been built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Christ Jesus Himself being the corner stone,21in whom the whole building, being fitted together, is growing into a holy temple in the Lord, 22in whom you also are being built together into a dwelling of God in the Spirit.

We make up the spiritual temple of the Lord. We are living stones! We will dwell in the Heavenly Mount Zion!


This ZERUBBABEL is a spiritual builder. The Zerubbabel of the second temple era, was a symbol of him. He was a physical builder...this Zerubbabel is a spiritual builder!

The feast of dedication was important enough for Christ himself to be at the temple on that day and during the feast of dedication!

John 10:22-23

22At that time the Feast of the Dedication took place at Jerusalem; 23it was winter, and Jesus was walking in the temple in the portico of Solomon

Regardless, these are a type and shadow of things to come

Colossians 2:16-17

16Therefore no one is to act as your judge in regard to food or drink or in respect to a festival or a new moon or a Sabbath day— 17things which are a mereshadow of what is to come; but the substance belongs to Christ.

The Spiritual temple has been rededicated and work will begin after this shaking. The world will be ready to receive the gospel after this war

Remember...there are 2 separate shakings in the book of Haggai.

Haggai 2:20-23 the first shaking

20Then the word of the LORD came a second time to Haggai on the twenty-fourth day of the month, saying, 21“Speak to Zerubbabel governor of Judah, saying, ‘I am going to shake the heavens and the earth. 22‘I will overthrow the thrones of kingdoms and destroy the power of the kingdoms of the nations; and I will overthrow the chariots and their riders, and the horses and their riders will go down, everyone by the sword of another.’23‘On that day,’ declares the LORD of hosts, ‘I will take you, Zerubbabel, son of Shealtiel, My servant,’ declares the LORD, ‘and I will make you like a signet ring, for I have chosen you,’” declares the LORD of hosts.

This will be upon us soon. This describes a war where brother will fight against brother. It shakes only the heavens and the earth.


The final shaking is found in

Haggai 2:6

6"For thus says the LORD of hosts, ‘Once more in a little while, I am going to shake the heavens and the earth, the sea also and the dry land.

This will shake the heavens, earth, dry land and the seas! It is final shaking!

The writer of Hebrews quotes this passage in Hebrews 12:26-27

26 And His voice shook the earth then, but now He has promised, saying, “YET ONCE MORE I WILL SHAKE NOT ONLY THE EARTH, BUT ALSO THE HEAVEN.” 27This expression, “Yet once more,” denotes the removing of those things which can be shaken, as of created things, so that those things which cannot be shaken may remain.


Note the words "yet once more" indicating this is the final, but not the first shaking in the book of Haggai! If it's not first, what is? The one in Haggai 2:20-23

Be sure to have your Spiritual house in order! Though this will mostly affect the heathen nations. Christians will likely be caught in this crossfire. After this shaking the rebuilding of the spiritual temple resumes in full force. As the Holy Spirit will be poured out upon His faithful! A great revival will sweep the earth! The spiritual temple has been rededicated for building!

Really what interest does the Almighty have in a physical temple?

Acts 17:24.
24“The God who made the world and all things in it, since He is Lord of heaven and earth, does not dwell in temples made with hands;

His concern now is with the "Spiritual Temple" US!!!

That's the awesome thing about Haggai! It makes at least mention of all 4 physical temples, and the spiritual temple that Zerubbabel the other witness and the end time faithful will be building! It's spiritual work! Directed by the Holy Spirit!

The 2 witnesses won't be building a physical temple. It's spiritual work, that's the Lords concern! Not a physical temple!


All verses Nasb or ESV
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0