Does anyone have a favorite Bible Story? Why so little discussion on Bible Stories in TT?

Gxg (G²) said:

On the prophecy being fulfilled, I've always been reminded of what scripture seems to elude to when it makes clear how much Arabs have been highly significant throughout the Word of God, even in the very teachings of Christ whenever it comes to Jews and Gentiles.

And for more info, the story of Elijah is something that comes to mind ...

1 Kings 17:3-16
Then the word of the LORD came to Elijah: 3 "Leave here, turn eastward and hide in the Kerith Ravine, east of the Jordan. 4 You will drink from the brook, and I have ordered the ravens to feed you there."

5 So he did what the LORD had told him. He went to the Kerith Ravine, east of the Jordan, and stayed there. 6 The ravens brought him bread and meat in the morning and bread and meat in the evening, and he drank from the brook.

8 Then the word of the LORD came to him: 9 "Go at once to Zarephath of Sidon and stay there. I have commanded a widow in that place to supply you with food."​

On the issue, as seen in I Kings 17, one must have understanding that the beginning of I Kings 17 describes Elijah on the run from Ahab since the King wanted to kill him. And the means that God chose to take care of Elijah are intriguing. For the text says that God chose to turn to ravens as a means of feeding the prophet. Some take issue with this, as ravens are unclean birds and by law, to be avoided/detested (Genesis 8:6-8 Leviticus 11:14-16 / Leviticus 11/Deuteronomy 14:13-15 / Deuteronomy 14 )..and though it'd still be mraculous for God to use them to feed Elijah in 1 Kings 17:1-3, it would still seemed hard to comprehend.



However, there's actually another view that's not often considered.....one which is held by some not willing to accept the "unclean bird" view ..as they think that Ravens could mean "Arabs" and should be the preferred translation. The view is very intriguing seeing how those of Moorish descent/dark coloration were often viewed by the Jewish people......as seen in an older issue of Expository Times (Vol. 68) a letter-writer made the point that there were Arabs in the 1800s in that area so dark-skinned that they were called "ravens".

As the man behind the statement indicated, it would be logical to adopt this reading solely because of its congruity with the sequel, where Elijah is fed by an alien Phoenician woman. And for another place one can go for information, one can go online/investigate the following article entitled "The Applied Epistemology Library : History (I Kings 17) "

If you've ever seen the story "Othello", you recall the issue of Dark Complexion---especially amongst Moorish people.....and with that in mind, the racial issue is indeed an intriguing one to consider----seeing how if Elijah was sent to be among people that most of Israel considered beneath them, then it'd be a very radical miracle indeed.....and going right in line with the view that Elijah (and his successor, Elisha) were types of Christ----sent among those in the Gentile realm that Israel considered "unclean". As it stands, there were already issues in scripture with racial/ethnic problems, like Moses's marrying a Cu[bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse]e/Ethopian woman and his siblings grumbling on it ( Numbers 12:1-3 ( Numbers 12 ). And with Elijah going to hide with the indigenous Bedouin, it makes the reality of God blessing others outside of Jews that much more powerful.

For Arabs and Jews were Blood Brothers...yet did not often get along...just as it was with their ancestors, Issac and Ishmael. But the Bible makes clear that Abrahams sons both loved him had, as seen in Genesis 25:1-3 Genesis 25. I'm certain you've probably heard often of others saying that the Jews are the only people God has blessed---and with that, when it comes to the Palestinian Conflict, many acting as if all of the Middle-Eastern/Arab people are the main ones in the wrong/outside of God's Blessing......and yet, when looking in the Word, it seems clear that even with Abraham's promised son, God did not just have favor for him. For even with others like Ishmael, God made very clear that even those of Ishmael's descent (namely, Arabs) would be blessed ( Genesis 16:11 / Genesis 17:19-21/ Genesis 21:7-9 /Genesis 25:10 /Genesis 28:8-10 / Genesis 28 / Galatians 4:27 ).

God's Blessing was for Gentiles as well. He promised Hagar that her son would beget twelve princes who would become a great nation. And later, Ishmael then went to live in the wilderness region of Hejaz in what became known as the Arabian Peninsula, east of where his brother Issac was...and with the Bible and Islamic tradition both agreeing that Ishmael became the leader of all the great desert peoples of the Middle East.


And with Elijah going to these dark-skinned "RAVENS" in I Kings 17 could have been seen as a picture of reconcillation.

Wanted to give out some more info, for anyone who would be interested to gain further research on the issue. One can discover more by choosing to go to "Google Books" and consider investigating the online book under the title of "Palestine, past and present: With Biblical, literary, and scientific notices" by Henry Stafford Osborn. Very solid research/study of the language, IMHO, as it concerns some of the difficulties of trying to make the term "ravens" in I Kings 17 equate to "Arab." only. ...even though it's still the case that many Arabs were of dark complexion as "ravens"

For another resource, in favor of the Raven view meaning "Dark" or "Arab", one can go online and investigate the article entitled "Expository Times (Vol. 68)" ( //ext.sagepub.com/cgi/pdf_extract/68/1/26 )

Some of it I think is interesting to consider, especially as it concerns people being referred to by animal names since places such as Mark 7 and Matthew 15 involve Gentiles being refered to in Jewish culture as animals...such as calling them "dogs" ..and with other instaces of animal terminology used of people such as in Psalm 22:15-1, Psalm 22:19-21, Isaiah 56:9-11 and Matthew 7:5-7 & Philippians 3:1-3 / Revelation 22:14-16


And outside of that, as it stands, the root of the word "Arab" has many meanings in Semitic languages including "west/sunset," "desert," "mingle," "merchant," "raven" and are "comprehensible" with all of these having varying degrees of relevance to the emergence of the name. Often Blacks were known in the Arab world as "Ravens"---and for more info, one can go online/look up " ARAB VIEWS OF BLACK AFRICANS AND SLAVERY: by John Hunwick" ( //www.yale.edu/glc/events/race/Hunwick.pdf ). Of course, if blacks were often (or sometimes) known as "ravens", it would be a bit odd to witness scripture never refer to others of Black Descent in such a manner....though that can also be due to the fact that just because scripture does not refer to all other blacks as "ravens" does not mean that there're no times to consider when one time of the usage was appropiate

Of course, some have issue with trying to equate "ravens" with "dark-skinned people when it comes to the Word Usage of the term "raven"--and that's something I'm still wrestling with, though I will try to share more on that later...


The Arab view of "ravens" seems to make much sense with the context of I Kings 17---as immediately after Elijah's feed by the Ravens, he goes down to another non-Israelite town to be taken care of.......and with the widow that Elijah went to, its interesting to see God methodology there. For Elijah could have easily tripped about the widow as well when it came to him being supplied by her----as again, she was a foreigner from Phonecia, which is the home territory of the Wicked Jezebel--who was also from Sidon (1 Kings 16:30-32 /1 Kings 16 /1 Kings 11:32-34 /1 Kings 11 ). Yet the Spirit of the Lord was at work regardless. For God has/calls others to give help where we least expect it...and He provides for us in ways that go beyond our narrow definitions or expectations.....as His providence has often gone in strange places.

And when it comes to those who Love the Lord, its faith in Him that matters.


Of course, others may not agree on the theory that an Arabic prescence/blessing being fulfilled was already present in the scriptures in the usage of the term "ravens".

However, regardless of whether or not others agree, its all good----as "dark" is still cool..& already in scripture is it amazing to see how much dark coloration was used to describe others.....much of it indicating aspects of beauty.

Song of Solomon 5:10-12 / Song of Solomon 5
His head is purest gold; his hair is wavy and black as a raven

Song of Solomon 1:5
Dark am I, yet lovely, O daughters of Jerusalem, dark like the tents of Kedar, like the tent curtains of Solomon.​

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............God promised to bless Ishmael as well as Israel----as the Word makes exceptionally clear in Genesis 16 and 17.



Genesis 21:7-9, Genesis 25:10 and Genesis 28:8-10 / Genesis 28 also deal with the issue. Of course, the issue of Hagar and Ishmael was all in reality an issue that also had a spiritual principle to it----as best seen in Galatians 4:27 . Even then, God's Blessing was for Gentiles as well as for the Jews. He promised Hagar that her son would beget twelve princes who would become a great nation. And later, Ishmael then went to live in the wilderness region of Hejaz in what became known as the Arabian Peninsula, east of where his brother Issac was...and with the Bible and Islamic tradition both agreeing that Ishmael became the leader of all the great desert peoples of the Middle East.

This is the current view for the majority of the Christian, Islamic and Jewish faiths. Many amazing things when it comes to the Arabs...for throughout most of the "dark ages" in the West, the Arabic peoples were the leaders in science and culture--perhaps the greatest of all peoples at that time.Some of it's odd, if seeing the many accounts of those in Arab nations/the accomplishments they've done---as many Arab Nations have had long-standing alliances with the descendants of the Assyrians and the Medes. And when looking at the Arab nations in existence:

• Lebanon

• Palestine

• Jordan

• Syria

• Sudan

• Egypt

Taking one Arab nation such as Syria, in example, it's already interesting that Christ chose to go there for ministry/do amazing things---as seen in Matthew 4:23-25 Matthew 4 and Mark 7:25-2 Mark 7 ---with Naaman himself being from Syria, as Jesus noted in Luke 4:26-28/Luke 4


Additionally, there are many biblical records there are passages that tell of Solomon’s trading for gold with the Arabs, as well as wars with Arabs by subsequent kings, such as Jehoram and Uzziah, and threats by Arab tribes after the restoration.....but the Arabs--Gentiles are just as blessed as God's People, Israel...and heard on some things.

Gxg (G²) said:

Missions: Our Story (

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There's one resource I've been looking forward to being able to read soon, as it concerns the relationship between Israel and Ishmael and how beautiful it is seeing how God used both groups setting the stage for the Messiah----for both are "Blood Brothers" and apart of God's plan...and that's something many need to realize.

Concerning the name of the book I'm discussing, one can go online and research it under the name of "Arabs in the Shadow of Israel: The Unfolding of God's Prophetic Plan for Ishmael's Line.

Its by Tony Maalouf and from what I've gathered, its a good read as well as a compelling call for Christians to rethink the role of Arabs and also descendents of Abraham and recipients of his blessing.

In Dr. Tony Maalouf's book, he starts his discussion by noting that before the modern era, Jews and Arabs lived side by side in harmony for centuries. In reality, conflict between the descendants of Isaac and Ishmael has been the exception rather than the rule.

As another noted/summed up wonderfully on the book:

Yet he is quick to bring us to the biblical text to uncover some of the long-standing misconceptions that have clouded the thinking of Western Christians regarding Arab people. The central passage he tackles is Genesis 16:12, "He will be a wild donkey of a man, his hand will be against everyone, and everyone's hand will be against him; and he will live to the east of all his brothers." Contrary to popular opinion, this prophecy by the God of Abraham was actually a blessing rather than a curse. Although Hagar was enslaved, her son, Ishmael, will be free as a donkey to roam the desert in pursuit of his own destiny. Unlike his subjected and powerless mother, he will be independent and strong, able to hold his own in the fierce Bedouin culture of the day. And he will dwell "before the face of his brothers" the Jews (p. 73). As such, Ishmael and his descendants are granted the unrivaled position of inhabiting a region of the world where they could be observers and recipients of the unfolding revelation of God to the nation of Israel throughout redemptive history. Hence, this prophecy would have been nothing but beautiful music to Hagar's ears.

But did not Ishmael mock (Gen. 21:9) and even persecute Isaac (Gal. 4:29), causing him and his mother to be driven from the house of Abraham at Sarah's initiative? Yes, but look closer. As Dr. Maalouf insightfully explains, "[f]rom God's perspective, his plan for Isaac is incompatible with his purposes for Ishmael. No matter how severe Sarah's demand was, and no matter how serious Abraham's concern for his firstborn, God saw it better for Hagar and her son Ishmael to be dismissed to the wilderness and live under his care than to be kept in Abraham's house and live in rivalry with Sarah and her son Isaac. The patriarch had a limited inheritance, and it was ordained to go to the promised seed. . . . This is the primary reason for his summoning of Abraham to listen to Sarah's voice, and not because of any cursing of Ishmael" (p. 92).

The New Testament shows, however, that in an act of divine reversal the Magi (tribal chiefs of Arab descent as Dr. Maalouf convincingly argues) are accorded the privilege of returning to witness and worship the true seed of Abraham, namely, the Messiah (Mt. 2:1ff.). Moreover, Arabs were present in Jerusalem on the day of Pentecost and no doubt were counted among the 3,000 baptized (At. 2:11, 41). Surprisingly, they were even given priority in the missionary program of the Apostle Paul (Gal. 1:15-17). And in the future, at the pilgrimage of the Gentile nations to Israel in the Messianic Age, Arabs are first in line to offer their homage (Isa. 60:5-7).

All this confirms Dr. Maalouf's belief that "the religious fate of biblical Israel as a nation and that of the Arabs" are divinely and inextricably linked (p. 223). Accordingly, "this should create among Christians [in the West] a desperate burden to refrain from political agendas and invest in the spiritual awakening predicted among both the Arabs and Jews" (p. 223). Indeed, by "[r]emoving unwarranted biases against Arabs, which neither the Bible nor history sustains, [we can] play a healing role in the Middle East conflict" (p. 223). May it be so!


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Concerning the book, what was mentioned on Isaiah 60:6-7 was highly interesting seeing how Isaiah was speaking in that chapter on how God's light will shine on Israel, who will radiate his light to the nations and dispell darkness of the surrounding world.....and the places mentioned in Isaiah 60:6-7 belonged to obscure tribes in the Arabian desert hundreds of miles from Israel.

In many ways, what occurred with Issac being chosen to give birth to the Messiah is akin to a director of a play choosing someone to play the star role. The person chosen cannot boast as if they in/of themselves are simply better than everyone else....for their role was given to them by the director at his own desire. He could have easily chosen someone else, just as the Lord made clear in Deuteronomy 9:3-8 when saying that Israel's righteousness is not the casue of its being given the land. As it stands, the Israelites were so stubborn/stiffnecked that they rarely upheld their end of the bargain that God had made with them (Genesis 15, Genesis 17, Exodus 19-20)---though God had promised to be faithful to them and would always be faithful to his part. For it was all about God's story/His desires. And in any play/story, a drama must have multiple parts to be successful...such as having a deuteragonist (second most important character, after the protagonist and before the tritagonist..and one who may switch from being with or against the protagonist depending on the deuteragonist's own conflict/plot). One also must have background characters---such as those who are a foil, supporting character, minor characters who have small roles and yet without them the story cannot go on.

With Ishmael, in many ways they could be seen as the secondary characters in the play God designed for His glory....for their part was what made the role of the primary character possible. Techincally, Ishmael would be the third most important character whereas Israel was the Secondary and Jesus the Messiah is the main/central character who all other roles support. With Ishamael, they could be seen as Issac'ss Older brother that would always ensure Israel develop properly for the calling that the Lord had given them in bringing forth the Messiah....just as older brothers often train their siblings indirectly through rites of passage, fighting, competition, tough love and oversight when others try to mess with their siblings. God seemed to have this in mind when it came to His care for Hagar and the love for Ishmael by Abraham.......as even when brothers fight or have distance, they don't stop being brothers.

As seen in Genesis 16:The promises to Ishmael were four:

(1) promise of descendants;

(2) promise of divine attention [God hears and rescues the outcast and the afflicted and will not let them perish],

(3) promise of a unique character [a wild donkey of a man, a complement--tough, reliable, valued, and suited to the terrain],
and

(4) the promise of a divine destiny--antagonism and conflict with everyone, and his brothers will fear him. When the descendants act like the ancestor, they will fulfill this destiny of animosity.
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All of this was due to how Sarai took matters into her own hands by giving her servant girl to Abram, with Abram going along with the plan/refusing to help solve the problem and Hagar running away from the problem initially. In spite of this messy situation, God demonstrated his ability to work all things together for the good (Romans 8:28)---for Sarai and Abram still recieved the son they so desperately wanted while God solved Hagar's problem despite Abram's refusl to get involved. Though Genesis 16:8 shows how Hagar took flight in the direction of Egypt, her homehald, the Angel of the Lod came directly to her and promised she'd have numerous descendants (Genesis 17:20, Genesis 25:12-18)....making clear in Genesis 16:12 that unlike his mother, the son would not need to be servile toward others since he would live a life of hostility toward others. She was impressed by the perceptiveness of God as revealed through his angel-messenger....as seen in the name she gives the Lord calling Him "God of Seeing" (Hb. 'El Ro'i ). As seen later in Genesis 20:8-21, when Ishmael was about 16yrs old (Genesis 21:5-8), the angel of God came back again in light of Hagar being sent away and His intervention saved Hagar, confirming to her that her son would become a great nation...echoing the promise given to Abraham in Genesis 21:18. Indeed, Ishmael because ruler of a large tribe/nation....

Gxg (G²) said:

Others are often shocked by that since they deem everything of Ishmael to be wrong..but even Ishmael was included into the Covenant via Genesis 17. His role and purpose (as designed by the Lord) was meant to be different than his brother Issac. And Ishmael was still beloved by Abraham, burying his father right alongside Issac in Genesis 25:8-10 /and being in peace with his brother...as well as having lines come together.

What Issac recieved was the Blessing of a Covenant, whereas Ishmael recieved the Promise of a Blessing--both important to the work of the Messiah...for the older son (Ishmael) would be blessed in radical ways but he would be close to the work of what the Lord did through his brother (Issac), looking out for him in many ways and ensuring the job gets done. And with Ishmael, he was indeed included in one aspect of the Abrahmic Covenant as were all others apart from the Covenant God made with Abraham through Issac.

The first covenant community was Abraham's household. It did not include only his immediate family but also slaves and strangers. They were all members of the household BEFORE they were circumcised. Gen. 17:14 says: " And the uncircumcised male child, who is not circumcised in the flesh of his foreskin, that person shall be CUT OFF FROM HIS PEOPLE; he has broken my covenant." For in Genesis 17:1 (also seen in Acts 7:7-9 ), God was making a covenant, or contract, between Himself and Abraham. The terms were simple: Abraham would obey God and circumcise all the males in his household----and interestingly, those also who were NON-Jewish as well...including servants like Eleazer of Damascus ( Genesis 15:1-3, Genesis 15 ).......which is an Arab nation the last I checked...and of course, with Ishmael--the father of the Arab Nations ( Genesis 16 , Genesis 17:19-21 , Genesis 21, Genesis 25:8-10, Genesis 25, Genesis 28:8-10, Genesis 36:2-4, 1 Chronicles 1:27-29, 1 Chronicles 1 Romans 9:7, Galatians 4:21-31)--him being circumcised as well. Much of it very similar to what occurred in Joshua 5 with the people being included/considered as apart of the Lord's people even before they were circumcised.....and much as Romans 4 and I Corinthians 7 note with circumcision. As Dr. Tony Maalouf notes wonderfully, there are numerous scriptures showing where even Ishmael was apart of the Covenants the Lord made with Abraham (as there were multiple Abrahamic covenants or parts of them--but the promised seed of the Messiah was meant to come through Issac.

............There can be no escaping the reality of how the OT shows that the Lord was Ishmael's God..and the only reason he was sent away was due to Sarah not liking how he represented competition with Isaac. But there's nothing showing where Isaac and Ishmael were enemies. The Angel of the Lord Himself spoke to Hagar and sustained her in the desert place. Couple this theophany to the religiousity of Abraham's clan of 300+ and IMHO, I don't see how Ishmael in any way or manner could not be a believer, at least in appearance in regards to religious protocols. The God of the Bible blessed and kept Ishmael and brought through him 12 princes.

But the God of the Bible purposely choose Isaac as the line to bring the Messiah through.

1. Ishmael was under the covenant of which Abraham was the covenant head.

2. Ishmael was not chosen as the line to bring the Messiah through.
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I believe when God speaks of "Covenant", it is not by any means static. I believe there is "The Covenant", vs Other Covenants.

Abraham was specifically called out for "The Covenant". What "The Covenant" entailed was separation and the creation of a nation that would carry the oracles of God which would culminate in the Messiah. It is through "this Covenant", the world has been blessed. All blessings that were afforded to mankind was because of "The Covenant".

It was "The Covenant", that God told Abraham that Isaac would inherit. This in no way nullified any possibility or God's electing purpose in saving Ishmael, Midian, Zimran, Jokshan, Medan, Ishbak, Shuah (Abrahams's other sons--all noted in Genesis 25 from his wife, Keturah.....as. Abraham didn't have only 2 sons and he blessed all of his children), Abraham's servants especially Eleazar, Job and Lot. All people who are saved are saved by God's electing decree, but God's electing decree is justified by "The Covenant" through Abraham culminating in Jesus our Lord.

Because Abraham covenanted with God, and was the covenant head of his household which included 300+ it follows by necessity everyone under him had to partake of the religious protocols that Abraham partook of. Even Ishmael, Zimran and Midian had to be circumsized, offer prayers and sacrifices to God. Abraham had to instruct all under him the counsel of God and how to live Godly etc. A major manifestation of this was when Abraham went to war to rescue Lot. Abraham's going to war to rescue Lot was in many ways apart of his religious duties by which he taught by practice to his household godliness.

In speculating the state of Ishmael and others under Abraham's headship.

1. Abraham being the covenant head automatically disseminated and diffused the knowledge of the true God to those under him. This was their religion. We see this being manifested in God even appearing to Hagar thereby confirming exactly what Abraham taught to those under him. The honor and respect and the imbuing of this is manifested when Ishmael went with Isaac (as the two eldest of Abraham's children) and buried Abraham when he died. This alone shows that they were still in contact and had a homogeneous culture between them.

2. Jethro a descendent of Midian (Midian is one of Abraham's sons) was from all appearances a believer in God. It was his daughter whom Moses married. And we know that Jethro was a Priest. This is overwhelming proof that the religious instruction that Abraham gave to his household was so intense and highly concentrated that 400 years later his descendants through Midian had a religious institution to the true God and God did not establish his covenant through Midian, only through Isacc...And what of Melchizidek? In Genesis 14, he was a Priest to God and we see of no covenants being established with him, but yet he for all purposes is considered saved

3. When one puts all these pieces together it is unfair, IMHO, for anyone to conclude that because God did not establish "The Covenant" through Ishmael that Ishmael was not saved because God likewise did not establish "The Covenant" with Job, Melchizedek, Jethro, Midian and we see them saved.

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As one excellent study source said best:

The promise to Abraham. Abraham himself is promised that he would be the father of a great nation (Gen 12:2), compared to the dust of the earth and the stars of the heaven in number (Gen 13:16; 15:5 ), and including kings and nations other than the “seed” itself (Gen 17:6). God promises His personal blessing on Abraham. His name shall be great and he himself shall be a blessing. All of this has had already the most literal fulfillment and continues to be fulfilled.

The promise to Abraham’s seed. In addition to the promises to Abraham, the covenant includes blessings for Abraham’s seed. The nation itself should be great (Gen 12:2) and innumerable (Gen 13:16; 15:5 ). The nation is promised possession of the land. Its extensive boundaries are given in detail (Gen 15:18-21). In connection with the promise of the land, the Abrahamic Covenant itself is expressly called “everlasting” (Gen 17:7) and the possession of the land is defined as “an everlasting possession” (Gen 17:8). It should be immediately clear that this promise guarantees both the everlasting continuance of the seed as a nation and its everlasting possession of the land.

Miscellaneous promises are included in the covenant. God is to be the God of Abraham’s seed. It is prophesied that they would be afflicted, as fulfilled in the years in Egypt, and that afterwards they would “come out with great substance” (Gen 15:14). In the promise to Abraham, “In thee shall all families of the earth be blessed,” it is anticipated that the seed should be a channel of this blessing. In particular this is fulfilled in and through the Lord Jesus Christ.

All the promises to the “seed” in Genesis are references to the physical seed of Abraham. General promises of blessing to Abraham’s seed seem to include all his physical lineage, but it is clear that the term is used in a narrower sense in some instances. Eliezer of Damascus, while according to the customs of the day regarded as a child of Abraham because born in his house, is nevertheless disqualified because he is not the physical seed of Abraham (Gen 15:2). Further, not all the physical descendants of Abraham qualify for the promises to the seed. Ishmael is put aside. When Abraham pleads with God, “O that Ishmael might live before thee!” God replies, “Sarah thy wife shall bear thee a son indeed; and thou shalt call his name Isaac: and I will establish my covenant with him for an everlasting covenant, and with his seed after him” (Gen 17:18-19). The line of the seed and its promises is narrowed to the one son of Abraham. Later when Jacob and Esau are born, God in sovereign choice chooses the younger as the father of the twelve patriarchs and confirms the covenant to Jacob. The particular Abrahamic promises and blessings are thereafter channelled through the twelve tribes.

While the promises to the “seed” must be limited in their application according to the context, it is clear that much of the general blessings attending the Abrahamic Covenant such as the general blessing of God upon men is larger in its application. Thus the sign of circumcision (Gen 17:10-14, 23-27) is administered not only to Isaac later, but also to Ishmael and the men in Abraham’s house either born in the house or bought with money. Circumcision is wider in its application than the term seed, as far as the use in Genesis is concerned.

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So God provided for the pregnant woman who was thrust out into the desert. God promised that Hagar would be a matriarch – her son would become the father of a great tribe of wild, hostile people (cf. 25:18), living in the Arabian desert (25:12-18). But they would not be the promised seed; they would only complicate matters. Sarai’s sin caused the origin of the Ishmaelites, a harvest that is still being reaped.[2]​

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He [the Angel of the Lord] describes Ishmael and his progeny in him as resembling the wild ass. This animal is a fit symbol of the wild, free, untamable Bedouin of the desert. He is to live in contention, and yet to dwell independently, among all his brethren.[3]​

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