Antichrist

Interplanner said:

Doug, the rev's 1st chapter says it is about that time. Shall we just agree to ignore that since you know more?
Dan 8:13 is the passage that the priests were taught about in connection with the destructive rebellion happening in 490 years. it is ridiculously simple, you just have to sync with historical understanding. 8:13 defines what we have in ch 9. Why do you persist in going straight to 12 as though I'm completely absent-minded that there is already 8 and 9? I don't think 12 has a thing to do with it because of the Hellenist vs Maccabean situation.

Knowledge exploded for those people in the formation of the alexandrine library was put together.

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Men have been riding horses, on foot, sailing, as the modes of transportation since the flood and up to the 1800's. Now it is cars, ships, trains, planes. Our generation, not first century.

That doesn't resolve Dan 8:13 and the historical reality that the priests were taught that the 490 years included the fateful rebellion that destroyed Israel.

clemenslee said:

They may use Allah to reference God

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That they most certainly do.

you must recognize and them as well that Allah was pre-islamic and comes from al-ilah which is a generic term for god.

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You mean kinda like the word "god", which can refer to Zeus or Odin or Ahura Mazda or... God? You gonna claim that English-speaking Christians are actually worshipping Quetzalcoatl because he (or it) is referred to as a god?

During the time of pre-islamic times and even through Muhammad the moon-god religion was the greatest of all the pagan religions.

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You failed the history test there. Mahound was all about putting an end to pagan worship by any means necessary, including (or especially) the sword.

The god SIN was given the title al-ilah which means the deity. Al-ilah was shortened to Allah.

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Pure rubbish. Mahound based Islam on Jewish and Christian writings, which persuaded him that "there is no god but Allah", and that paganism must be destroyed. Allah was never, in Islamic terms, anyone other than the God of Abraham, Issac, Jacob, and in Muslin belief, Ishmael.

Allah is not to be confused with Yahweh or El, Elohim of Christianity.

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Sorry, but in Islam, Allah is believed to refer solely to God the Creator of the Universe.

Islam is a diabolical perversion of the Christian Faith, but to make up falsehoods about it in the hope of discrediting it is as stupid, and as intellectually dishonest, as it is futile. Any literate Muslim hearing such obvious twaddle would dismiss whoever said it as an utter ignoramus, and pay no attention to anything else the person said even if it was the very Truth of God. Islam is of diabolical origin, but so is lying, and one can hardly hope to defeat the Father of Lies at his own game.

Interplanner said:

That doesn't resolve Dan 8:13 and the historical reality that the priests were taught that the 490 years included the fateful rebellion that destroyed Israel.

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You haven't noted the difference between the transgression of desolation in Daniel 8 and the abomination of desolation in Daniel 12. Jesus was referring to the abomination of desolation which is found in Daniel 12.

You are not even identifying what priests you are talking about. So how can anyone respond to you when you write incomplete thoughts?

Daniel 8: 13 Then I heard one saint speaking, and another saint said unto that certain saint which spake, How long shall be the vision concerning the daily sacrifice, and the transgression of desolation, to give both the sanctuary and the host to be trodden under foot?

Do you not know the difference between the transgression of desolation and the abomination of desolation?

Jipsah said:

Sorry, but in Islam, Allah is believed to refer solely to God the Creator of the Universe.

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But it is a false referral, a false belief, not only a false claim in language, but goes way beyond language. It is an insult to God's name.

In the judgment of Islam in Ezekiel 39,after God destroys their armies.

Ezekieli 39:7 So will I make my holy name known in the midst of my people Israel; and I will not let them pollute my holy name any more: and the heathen shall know that I am the Lord, the Holy One in Israel.

You tell me what muslim is worshiping Allah saying he is the Holy One in Israel.

dougangel said:

Simon bar Kochbah is not a description of what is happening in Revelation 13 so can't be right.

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Thats onltðy if you think "anti-christ" of Johns reference to him is also one of the beasts or false prophet of rev 13. HE is not. They (rev 13) are first century while John likely wrote his letters (not the gospel or revelation) in post 70 AD asia minor.

"Antichrist is mentiined in Is 8 as a post Immanuel whom the people call Immanuel. God mocks this by saying "oh Immanuel" in conjunctiin with the name maher shalhal hash baz. That name means to loot and plunder which is the same program which is/was prophecied of Gog in Ez 38,39.

Thus Gog = Maher shalhal hash baz = anti-Immanuel or anti-christ = 2nd century Simon Bar Kochbah.

His administratiin was Over 65 yrs after 70 AD as a fulfillment of Is 7:8.

Notrash said:

Thats onltðy if you think "anti-christ" of Johns reference to him is also one of the beasts or false prophet of rev 13. HE is not. They (rev 13) are first century while John likely wrote his letters (not the gospel or revelation) in post 70 AD asia minor.

"Antichrist is mentiined in Is 8 as a post Immanuel whom the people call Immanuel. God mocks this by saying "oh Immanuel" in conjunctiin with the name maher shalhal hash baz. That name means to loot and plunder which is the same program which is/was prophecied of Gog in Ez 38,39.

Thus Gog = Maher shalhal hash baz = anti-Immanuel or anti-christ = 2nd century Simon Bar Kochbah.

His administratiin was Over 65 yrs after 70 AD as a fulfillment of Is 7:8.

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There's several things that don't add up with your candidate.

Daniel says the person is going to show up at the end times.

He going to be amazing. He's going to make all other world leaders look like amateurs.

The trading mark hasn't happen yet.

dougangel said:

There's several things that don't add up with your candidate.

Daniel says the person is going to show up at the end times.

He going to be amazing. He's going to make all other world leaders look like amateurs.

The trading mark hasn't happen yet.

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Daniel say "time of the end", not end of time. The apostles asked about the end of the age,not the end of the world.

You never answered this question before.

What latter days and latter end is in mind in Gen 49:1-10; deut 5:25,26; deut 31:29 , 32:20,29, dan 10:14?

clemenslee said:

Just a curious thought, If antichrist is such a huge figure to appear on the scene, why is it only referenced 4 times by the name antichrist in the entire bible and only in 2 books 1 ,2 John?

I would just like to see your opinions, I really haven't made one yet LOL.

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The antichrist exists during the time of the two symbolic witnesses as they preach the gospel into the world. He has existed for almost 2000 years playing the role of vicar of Christ when he ignores the power of God completely and places himself above everything that is God.

Notrash said:

Daniel say "time of the end", not end of time. The apostles asked about the end of the age,not the end of the world.

You never answered this question before.

What latter days and latter end is in mind in Gen 49:1-10; deut 5:25,26; deut 31:29 , 32:20,29, dan 10:14?

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Genesis 49:

8 “Judah, your brothers will praise you;

your hand will be on the neck of your enemies;

your father’s sons will bow down to you.

9 You are a lion’s cub, Judah;

you return from the prey, my son.

Like a lion he crouches and lies down,

like a lioness—who dares to rouse him?

10 The scepter will not depart from Judah,

nor the ruler’s staff from between his feet,

until he to whom it belongs shall come

and the obedience of the nations shall be his.

11 He will tether his donkey to a vine,

his colt to the choicest branch;

he will wash his garments in wine,

Jacob’s blessing saying the ruler will come out of Judah . So with the donkey its talking about Christ first coming.

Also as in a lot of scripture it has another message for the tribes as well as a prophecy.

Just as an aside. The ruler was to come from Judah. The other disciples came from Israel. Except for Judas. He was an imposter because he came from Judah also. There couldn’t be 2 kings.



Deut 5 :25, 26

25 But now, why should we die? This great fire will consume us, and we will die if we hear the voice of the Lord our God any longer. 26 For what mortal has ever heard the voice of the living God speaking out of fire, as we have, and survived?

The context of that is the elders have seen the the fire on the mountain after Moses is shown the 10 commandments. ???

Ok well, I'll be humble enough to say I don't know what your trying to say with those scriptures. Not going to go through them all here but I have read them all . Why don't you tell me ?

Notrash said:

Daniel say "time of the end", not end of time. The apostles asked about the end of the age,not the end of the world.

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9 He replied, “Go your way, Daniel, because the words are rolled up and sealed until the time of the end. 10 Many will be purified, made spotless and refined, but the wicked will continue to be wicked. None of the wicked will understand, but those who are wise will understand.


11 “From the time that the daily sacrifice is abolished and the abomination that causes desolation is set up, there will be 1,290 days. 12 Blessed is the one who waits for and reaches the end of the 1,335 days.


13 “As for you, go your way till the end. You will rest, and then at the end of the days you will rise to receive your allotted inheritance.”

apart from saying the time of the end. the 1290 days lines up with Rev 13.

dougangel said:

Genesis 49:

8 “Judah, your brothers will praise you;

your hand will be on the neck of your enemies;

your father’s sons will bow down to you.

9 You are a lion’s cub, Judah;

you return from the prey, my son.

Like a lion he crouches and lies down,

like a lioness—who dares to rouse him?

10 The scepter will not depart from Judah,

nor the ruler’s staff from between his feet,

until he to whom it belongs shall come

and the obedience of the nations shall be his.

11 He will tether his donkey to a vine,

his colt to the choicest branch;

he will wash his garments in wine,

Jacob’s blessing saying the ruler will come out of Judah . So with the donkey its talking about Christ first coming.

Also as in a lot of scripture it has another message for the tribes as well as a prophecy.

Just as an aside. The ruler was to come from Judah. The other disciples came from Israel. Except for Judas. He was an imposter because he came from Judah also. There couldn’t be 2 kings.



Deut 5 :25, 26

25 But now, why should we die? This great fire will consume us, and we will die if we hear the voice of the Lord our God any longer. 26 For what mortal has ever heard the voice of the living God speaking out of fire, as we have, and survived?

The context of that is the elders have seen the the fire on the mountain after Moses is shown the 10 commandments. ???

Ok well, I'll be humble enough to say I don't know what your trying to say with those scriptures. Not going to go through them all here but I have read them all . Why don't you tell me ?

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Gen 49 begins as a prophecy about the latter days of the geneological importance of the sons of Israel and Gods working through those sons. These latter days would come in coincidence with the coming of Shiloh, meaning Jesus.

The first reference in deut should have been deut 4:25,26, not 5:25,26 though that reference is associated to deut 18:15-18.

The point that's being made should be clear because of the statement saying that Daniel was given prophecies about tge time of the end, not the end of time.

All the prophecies mentioned spoke of the end of the mosaic covt nation and its temporary way or the latter days of tge geneological purposes of the sons of Israel which occurred at the same time.

Thuis was in response to Douggs statement that the anti-christ was to come at the end of time.

It (he) or the beasts etc of Daniels prophecies were to come (and came) at the time of the end of the mosaic covt which came at tge time of the fulfilling of the everlasting covt by the visutatiin of the lifemaker.

Notrash said:

It (he) or the beasts etc of Daniels prophecies were to come (and came) at the time of the end of the mosaic covt which came at tge time of the fulfilling of the everlasting covt by the visutatiin of the lifemaker. googletag.cmd.push(function() { googletag.display('div-gpt-ad-1431698694306-1'); });

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Daniel 11

40 “At the time of the end the king of the South will engage him in battle, and the king of the North will storm out against him with chariots and cavalry and a great fleet of ships. He will invade many countries and sweep through them like a flood. 41 He will also invade the Beautiful Land. Many countries will fall, but Edom, Moab and the leaders of Ammon will be delivered from his hand. 42 He will extend his power over many countries; Egypt will not escape. 43 He will gain control of the treasures of gold and silver and all the riches of Egypt, with the Libyans and Cushites[e] in submission. 44 But reports from the east and the north will alarm him, and he will set out in a great rage to destroy and annihilate many. 45 He will pitch his royal tents between the seas at[f] the beautiful holy mountain. Yet he will come to his end, and no one will help him.

Daniel 12

1 “At that time Michael, the great prince who protects your people, will arise. There will be a time of distress such as has not happened from the beginning of nations until then. But at that time your people—everyone whose name is found written in the book—will be delivered. 2 Multitudes who sleep in the dust of the earth will awake: some to everlasting life, others to shame and everlasting contempt. 3 Those who are wise[a] will shine like the brightness of the heavens, and those who lead many to righteousness, like the stars for ever and ever. 4 But you, Daniel, roll up and seal the words of the scroll until the time of the end. Many will go here and there to increase knowledge.”


Daniel 12 carries on from 11. Dan 12: 1 – 4 seems to be talking about the tribulation and 2nd coming