CNN accuses Fox News viewers of being brain-washed

NightHawkeye said:

Really?

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Noting that Brian Williams did not make his claim on the Nightly News. Not that it matters to some folks.

I remember when FOX News first started out. At that time almost all of the news had a heavy political bias to the left. They were only slightly right of center then and the change was refreshing. Unfortunately they kept playing more and more to their conservative watchers. Now their news is highly biased an no longer is very trustworthy. And of course most of their commentary is much worse.

Now FOX News is one of the reasons I no longer consider myself a Republican.

This is suspiciously like the old Coke vs. Pepsi thing.

Also, too many people are not looking at the real issue here, which is that they've become programmed to tune in to various news editorialization channels. What you're getting really isn't the news on any of them.

Gadarene said:

This is absolute piffle from start to finish. Everything you've listed here I've seen liberals do in one form or another. I'm still happy to identify as liberal, but the sanctimony on our side really has to end. Pretending that liberals don't resort to tribalism and faith-based beliefs in exactly the same way as conservatives do is completely wrongheaded.

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Note that I said "extreme conservatives" and am not talking about normal conservatives.

Also note how successful the conservative campaign on the word "liberal" is, as you inadvertently equate liberal with "extreme conservative" instead of equating "extreme liberal" with "extreme conservative".

food for thought.

seashale76 said:

....Also, too many people are not looking at the real issue here, which is that they've become programmed to tune in to various news editorialization channels. What you're getting really isn't the news on any of them.

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I think this is part of the problem, however to me the real issue is that most people are not familiar with identifying, conducting, or evaluating a logical argument. Most people inadvertently fall for , emotional appeals, quibbling, spin, and logical fallacy arguments that news orgs use (Fox gets the blue ribbon for this).

Similarly, most people can't distinguish between "news" and "editorials" which are laced with opinions. And truth be told, news orgs have perfected the art of rendering an opinion in such a way that it comes across as a fact to the viewer.

I think a big part of the above is the 24 hour news cycle and the sharp decline of investigative journalism and newspaper journalism (their sales and subsequent closures and downsizing of respected news orgs). It's much cheaper to run with a story someone else did and then just interject your opinion and regurgitate your opinion over and over again so you can fill that 24 hour news cycle...

dgiharris said:

Note that I said "extreme conservatives" and am not talking about normal conservatives.

Also note how successful the conservative campaign on the word "liberal" is, as you inadvertently equate liberal with "extreme conservative" instead of equating "extreme liberal" with "extreme conservative".

food for thought.

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Lol, hardly.

You used the term "extreme conservatives" once, then went on to use the term "conservatives" without qualifier about half-a-dozen times in the remainder of your posts.

Your closing statement:

"FWIW, you could accuse liberals of similar actions but truth be told, liberals just are not as good as conservatives with the above. Liberals are in elementary school with the above actions whereas Conservatives are finishing up their PhDs"

is an example of this, where you do not specify any difference between extreme libs/cons or libs/cons in general. That statement is exactly the same sort of tribalism you claim your side is incapable of.

Going on to blame a conservative campaign (not an "extreme conservative" campaign, I note) for your own crummy writing is rather disingenuous.

More generally, blaming anyone but liberals for how poorly we come across is really not helping our image as sanctimonious and out of touch. Sure, opposing political parties will tend to misrepresent, but we're still more than capable of making ourselves look bad all on our own.

dgiharris said:

I think this is part of the problem, however to me the real issue is that most people are not familiar with identifying, conducting, or evaluating a logical argument. Most people inadvertently fall for , emotional appeals, quibbling, spin, and logical fallacy arguments that news orgs use (Fox gets the blue ribbon for this).

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I agree with your for the most part. I would say MSNBC gets the blue ribbon though! lol!

I will admit even our local news in our state tends to use melodramatic statements every time a 'cut' is mentioned in the budget. Let's pick a hot button issue like reducing money towards a public service - the response? You don't care about the POOR! Or YOU HATE the POOR! You know at that point adult conversation isn't going to happen. Why? Once the 'don't care or hate' statements surface then the attacks on the entire party or group start. What happens next? Pretty much nothing, because its a contest on who can act more infantile.

Sadly, today its more like which ever side can comes out with the more emotionally manipulative rhetoric, and nastier cut downs towards the other side...WINS! Politian's use that - media uses that - heck personal debate now uses that that regularly. Nothing gets settled because people can't deal with it. I think Politian's do it, because its easier than getting something done...which would take effort. The game is much easier.

I get tired of the alphabet stations carrying the cover-up badge for the corruption in our government.

All you ever hear is that Fox News lies - but they never list the lies. I have found they report both sides, however I can't listen to most of the liberals on Fox, but realize they have to have them.

SharonL said:

I get tired of the alphabet stations carrying the cover-up badge for the corruption in our government.

All you ever hear is that Fox News lies - but they never list the lies. I have found they report both sides, however I can't listen to most of the liberals on Fox, but realize they have to have them.

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Here's a list of lies for you http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-m...t-checks-behind-daily-shows-50-fox-news-lies/

Armoured said:

Here's a list of lies for you http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-m...t-checks-behind-daily-shows-50-fox-news-lies/

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Some of those lies are correct, some of them are debatable. For example the quote on more children dying from accidental gunshots than from drowning in the bathtub. They had to count kids that were 15-17 to claim that was a "lie" and at that age I am not sure if the title "children" still applies. And it was still fairly close.

And of course Obama did create the largest tax increase ever seen for the American people. what was not brought up by your source there is the fact that the Affordable Health Care Act is a tax, the Supreme Court used that rationalization to say that it was legal. If it was not a tax the action taken would not have been constitutional. That it did not make that much difference in the average American net earnings is besides the point. Technically it is still a tax, and a huge one.

dgiharris said:

FWIW, you could accuse liberals of similar actions but truth be told, liberals just are not as good as conservatives with the above. Liberals are in elementary school with the above actions whereas Conservatives are finishing up their PhDs

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yeah right.

Extremists are - by definition - idiots. And it doesn't matter which "side" they're on. Just 2 sides of the same ridiculous, blind, and totally irrational coin.

bill5 said:

yeah right.

Extremists are - by definition - idiots. And it doesn't matter which "side" they're on. Just 2 sides of the same ridiculous, blind, and totally irrational coin.

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And that is the gist of why FOX News is no longer a reliable source. Too many fans still remember when they actually had some value. Just as both the History Channel and The Learning Channel started out with good educational shows and then they found that there was more money to be made by aiming at the least educated of all viewers. They used to be stations worth watching for informative programs, now the most "informative" shows that they have are about hoarders or pawn shops.

And that's different from CNN how? Please.....they're both more interested in this Jerry Springer garbage than acting like a real news source, and for only one reason: more web site hits.

Subduction Zone said:

Some of those lies are correct, some of them are debatable. For example the quote on more children dying from accidental gunshots than from drowning in the bathtub. They had to count kids that were 15-17 to claim that was a "lie" and at that age I am not sure if the title "children" still applies. And it was still fairly close.

And of course Obama did create the largest tax increase ever seen for the American people. what was not brought up by your source there is the fact that the Affordable Health Care Act is a tax, the Supreme Court used that rationalization to say that it was legal. If it was not a tax the action taken would not have been constitutional. That it did not make that much difference in the average American net earnings is besides the point. Technically it is still a tax, and a huge one.

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I make no claim either way. SharonL said they never list the lies, I provided a list. Debate the specifics all you like.

I haven't been very active here since the change, but this post provided sufficient motivation.

dgiharris said:

Whenever I've argued with extreme conservatives, I am always impressed at their ability to refuse to acknowledge truths or admit they are wrong about something. It's like a kind of truth immunity, that is, they have a system of beliefs that are immune to any fact, argument, evidence, or data that disproves their beliefs.

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Then you haven't truly argued with many conservatives. Your claim conservatives have a problem with acknowledging the truth was your first obfuscation, as it wasn't conservatives who proffered and then promoted the "hands up don't shoot" lie of Ferguson. It wasn't FOX News who falsely edited George Zimmerman's 911 call to make him appear racially motivated. It wasn't FOX News that fabricated a story concerning George Bush's National Guard records. It wasn't conservatives who promoted a false story concerning the use of the N word directed by Tea Party members at Andre Carson upwards of fifteen times, and then failed to present any evidence of it occurring once, let alone fifteen times, when a one-hundred thousand dollar award was offered by Andrew Brietbart for any video or audio proof. It wasn't a conservative or a Republican who claimed George Bush was a "deserter" from the US military, or that he went AWOL from the Air National Guard. That was Michael Moore and Democrat Party chief Terry McAuliffe, respectively, promoting those lies. It is Democrat revisionist history which attempts to demand the Civil Rights movement was opposed by Republicans, when the truth is the Democrat Party of the day was the party of Bull Conner and Alton Maddux, not the party of Martin Luther King. It is the liberal/progressive crowd which screamed racism as the first knee-jerk response to any criticism of Obama's policies, yet rolled over and died when Obama repeated the blatant lie "if you like your healthcare plan you can keep your healthcare plan" again and again. It was the Democrats, the liberal/progressive crowd, who championed Bill Clinton when he shook his finger at the American people and told the blatant and obvious lie "I did not have sex with that woman...", and it is many of those same Democrats who still champion Hillary Clinton as she continues to lie concerning Libya and her e-mail accounts. It is the liberal/progressive crowd who has and continues to lie concerning issues such as late-term and partial-birth abortion, the global warming agenda, the supposed war on women, illegal immigration, voter fraud, the history of America, the formation of the KKK, the Constitution, the Separation of Church and State, the 2000 election, the Rosenbergs, The Mexican and Spanish-American Wars, Ronald Reagan, and a litany of other issues and subjects.

You want to argue with conservatives, the first thing you have to do is ditch the dogma in favor of some actual facts.

dgiharris said:

But it goes further than that.... its hard to explain. Conservatives have done a great job demonizing and sabotaging opposing views.

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This is a joke, right? Have you ever bothered to research the true depth of depravity evidenced by the liberal/progressive opposition to Sarah Palin? Rick Santorum? Michelle Malkin? Condoleezza Rice? Just look over the recent Ann Coulter thread here and you will see how silly your comment is. If you are honest about it.

dgiharris said:

In fact, it's like there is a systematic campaign to not only demonize the other side but to ensure that no matter what, opposing viewpoints cannot get through the brainwashing.

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Apparently you have never heard of CNN, MSNBC, ABC News, NBC News, CBS News, the New York Times, the Huffington Post, Mother Jones, etc. etc. etc. Oh, then there is this:





Yeah, nothing gets through Conservative brain-washing. Geez...

dgiharris said:

For instance, Take the word "liberal". Conservatives have actually turned that word into a serious negative over the past two decades. But it goes further than that... Man it's so hard to explain....

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No it isn't. When you honestly look at the issues you find liberals have turned the word liberal into a serious negative. Liberal Democrats will always reveal who they are by championing the causes they do. The repression of Christianity, the promotion of illegal immigration and open borders, forcing the acceptance of gay marriage on everyone and punishing all who dare differ, federal control of local police forces, the racist narrative attached to all issues, and attacks on both the First and Second Amendments.

dgiharris said:

I remember arguing once with a conservative about XYZ...

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Anecdotal evidence is just that, and does nothing to support your point.

dgiharris said:

Having watched Fox News for years and listened to Rush Limbaugh for years, I honestly have to give them credit for the level of brainwashing, spin, obfuscation, quibbling, twisting, and downright lies they spew.

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Yet I noticed you failed to provide even one example.

dgiharris said:

They have created an impressive paradigm in which it is impossible to disprove them.

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I question you have ever seriously listened to Rush Limbaugh. Or if you have if you ever bothered to go to his website and check the evidence posted supporting his comments. What is far more probable is you read or heard what someone else has said about Rush Limbaugh and instantly decided that must be the truth.

dgiharris said:

Trying to disprove them is akin to trying to catch a fish swimming in a vat a vegetable oil with your bare hands.

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This is the second time in only a few days I have seen this metaphor employed. It is quite a ridiculous metaphor. You want to catch a fish swimming in vegetable oil? Wait the sixty seconds it would take the fish to die. If you actually want to disprove what a Conservative says, there are these things called books, and something called the internet.

dgiharris said:

And truth be told, I am impressed by the brainwashing paradigm conservatives have created.

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Take this challenge. Illustrate the brainwashing paradigm.

dgiharris said:

#1) Turning "liberal" into a bad word.

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As stated, liberals have done that themselves, with no help from Conservatives.

dgiharris said:

#2) Associating "liberal" with all things evil.

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Hyperbole. Not all liberals are evil, and there exist a substantial difference between holding a political position and embracing evil. However you won't find many Christian Conservatives hanging out at the Folsom Street Fair.

dgiharris said:

#3) Deifying Reagan to a Conservative God while simultaneously forgetting "liberal" actions Reagan championed

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This is a canard. Reagan has not been Deified, as the majority of conservatives understand the concept of God and the Son and the fallen nature of man. Reagan is respected because he was a good president. Conservatives do not admire him because he was successful in scoring with White House interns, but rather because following the disaster of the Carter administration he was successful in making America a better place to live, because he promoted American strength and exceptionalism, because he actually enhanced America's status in the world as opposed to making it a laughing stock.

dgiharris said:

#4) Rewriting , Revising, and Spinning History

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Oh, please. The liberal left has turned the public education system into halls of indoctrination cranking out graduates barely able to conjugate a verb but perfectly comfortable with screaming about how unjust America is. As for revisionist history, try reading "48 Liberal Lies About American History: That You Probably Learned in School," by Larry Schweikart. Or "Slander" by Ann Coulter. Or just go to townhall and read this:

7 Lies Liberals Tell Young Americans

Source: http://townhall.com/columnists/john...erals-tell-young-americans-n1781015/page/full

Or this at the Spectator:

Lies and Liberalism

Source: http://spectator.org/articles/55121/lies-and-liberalism

I mean, seriously, read something other than Mother Jones.

dgiharris said:

#5) Keeping the fight alive for legal issues that have long been decided by the Supreme Court and American Public

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Right, because that is a tradition we need to junk right now. I mean, my God, how could anyone have questioned slavery when the legal issue had been settled. Of course you are referring to the liberal sacrament of abortion, but trust me, that issue isn't going away just because you guys evoke the Supreme Court.

dgiharris said:

#6) Creating a list of "enemies" of the conservative party and thus enemies of America

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Cite this list.

dgiharris said:

#7) Creating a state of mind where only Conservatives love and protect America while everyone else is hell bent on destroying the country (this is absolute genius and deserves a tip of the hat)

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Again hyperbole and distortion of the issues. For one example, tell me which side is attempting to destroy the fabric of the country in context of millions of illegal immigrants pouring across the American southern border in what amounts to an unarmed invasion?

dgiharris said:

#8) Creating a false dichotomy to where opposition to Conservative ideals and principles is synonymous with destroying America

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This comment is nothing more than a rephrasing of the previous comment. Which means it is more unsupported hyperbole.

dgiharris said:

I could go on.

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Oh, please, do.

dgiharris said:

FWIW, you could accuse liberals of similar actions but truth be told, liberals just are not as good as conservatives with the above.

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You really don't pay much attention, do you?

CNN is sinking so fast that they have to try something sensational in order to try to attract some attention, any attention, even something as pathetic as this.

NightHawkeye said:

I would merely suggest one might consider that the word "liberal" was itself hijacked by "progressives" when the American public became horrified with the progressive agenda of the first half of the 20th century.

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Examples please.

Sistrin said:

7 Lies Liberals Tell Young Americans

Source: http://townhall.com/columnists/john...erals-tell-young-americans-n1781015/page/full

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Who says morality doesn't matter? I think most people think morality matters... they just don't agree with your morality.

Also, faith isn't good. It represses an oppresses people, and has no justification. All good done by Christians can be done by non-Christians.

It's an outright lie that conservative faith doesn't keep you from fun stuff. The one's which can be risky aren't always harmful, and it's your choice to risk that harm anyway. Not sky diving might reduce risk, but it doesn't mean sky diving is immoral.

If someone doesn't want to risk sex before marriage, that's completely fine, just don't pretend it ha anything to do with morality.

Paradoxum said:

Who says morality doesn't matter?

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Liberals and Liberalism. Didn't you read the article" No mind; it's quite obvious. Whatever sleaze or dishonesty or selfishness it is, Liberals will find a way to rationalize it as good and normal.

Also, faith isn't good. It represses an oppresses people, and has no justification.

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Yeh. That's what I explained in the previous answer above.

All good done by Christians can be done by non-Christians.

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"Can be" doesn't do much to help people. By contrast, Christians did it...and because of their faith.

Albion said:

Liberals and Liberalism. Didn't you read the article" No mind; it's quite obvious. Whatever sleaze or dishonesty or selfishness it is, Liberals will find a way to rationalize it as good and normal.

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I'm liberal and I think morality matters. Of course some disagree. My point is that not all liberals think one way on this issue. I'd think most believe in morality.

Many liberals do believe in morality... do you agree? Just because liberals disagree with you, that doesn't mean they don't have their own morality.

Albion said:

Yeh. That's what I explained in the previous answer above.

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The morality of conservative faith does tend to be pretty shallow, and perverts peoples thinking, in my opinion. No offence?

Albion said:

'Can be'

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Albion said:

doesn't do much to help people. By contrast, Christians did it...and because of their faith.

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Christians were the massive majority... they were the ones who did almost everything.