Muslim migrants throw Christians overboard

Senator Cheese · Apr 16, 2015

Muslim migrants threw Christians overboard, police say - CNN.com

Rome (CNN)Muslims who were among migrants trying to get from Libya to Italy in a boat this week threw 12 fellow passengers overboard -- killing them -- because the 12 were Christians, Italian police said Thursday.

Italian authorities have arrested 15 people on suspicion of murdering the Christians at sea, police in Palermo, Sicily, said.

Illegal immigrants from North Africa into Europe are a big topic in European news outlets today. So far, the German national press has not commented on the aforementioned arrests.

HannahT · Apr 16, 2015

I read about that as well on Yahoo. Its Terrible.

During the crossing, the migrants from Nigeria and Ghana believed to be Christians were threatened with being abandoned at sea by some 15 other passengers from the Ivory Coast, Senegal, Mali and Guinea Bissau.

Eventually the threat was carried out and 12 were pushed overboard. The statement said the motive was that the victims "professed the Christian faith while the aggressors were Muslim."

The surviving Christians, the statement said, only managed to stay on board by forming a "human chain" to resist the assault.

seashale76 · Apr 16, 2015

Lord, have mercy! Memory eternal to these martyrs, and may they pray for us.

It also deeply saddens me that yet more people are engaging in absolutely demonic acts. They are lawless and immoral.

mindlight · Apr 17, 2015

Senator Cheese said:
Muslim migrants threw Christians overboard, police say - CNN.com

Illegal immigrants from North Africa into Europe are a big topic in European news outlets today. So far, the German national press has not commented on the aforementioned arrests.

Sickening!

Senator Cheese · Apr 17, 2015

I don't know what's more sickening - the fact that 15 radical Muslims are committing murder because they hate Christians (and yet are seeking refuge in predominately Christian countries) - or the fact that 85 "moderate" Muslims did nothing to stop them and will now be granted asylum from "religious persecution".

ChristsSoldier115 · Apr 17, 2015

It is a good thing us Americans helped liberate Libya, eh guys?

ChristsSoldier115 · Apr 17, 2015

Senator Cheese said:
I don't know what's more sickening - the fact that 15 radical Muslims are committing murder because they hate Christians (and yet are seeking refuge in predominately Christian countries) - or the fact that 85 "moderate" Muslims did nothing to stop them and will now be granted asylum from "religious persecution".

People stand by and watch when bad things happen all the time, man. Thanks to the internet and cell phone, a lot of it gets recorded now.

Desk trauma · Apr 17, 2015

American Christians whining about imagined persecution take note, this is what actual persecution looks like.

Supreme · Apr 17, 2015

I can't fathom how low the scum life would be that would drown people for their faith. I've tried, but I've got nothing.

Anyways, I'm sure these people will be dealt with appropriately. Not only are the murderers evil, they're also incredibly moronic- going to Italy, a predominately Christian nation, with a future of nothing but prison if found guilty.

mindlight · Apr 17, 2015

Senator Cheese said:
I don't know what's more sickening - the fact that 15 radical Muslims are committing murder because they hate Christians (and yet are seeking refuge in predominately Christian countries) - or the fact that 85 "moderate" Muslims did nothing to stop them and will now be granted asylum from "religious persecution".

Yes it seems in may ways this boat load of people mirrors the situation on the ground in the Middle East and North Africa. The Christians die, the radicals terrorise the rest or die fighting in some pointless war. The moderates turn a blind eye and claim that everything was not their fault.

mindlight · Apr 17, 2015

ChristsSoldier115 said:
People stand by and watch when bad things happen all the time, man. Thanks to the internet and cell phone, a lot of it gets recorded now.

Western nations intervened in Libya in part because Gadhafi was just about to massacre the population of Benghazi for opposing his rule. Rather than stand by and let that happen we intervened to save people with whom we had little common ground but whose humanity we respected nonetheless.

It seems that the refugees now fleeing from radicalised Islamist states have no similar desire to protect the weak against the strong but will nonetheless call on us to save them from their persecutors and feel entitled to a better life in the West.

Smells bad really!

ChristsSoldier115 · Apr 17, 2015

mindlight said:
Western nations intervened in Libya in part because Gadhafi was just about to massacre the population of Benghazi for opposing his rule. Rather than stand by and let that happen we intervened to save people with whom we had little common ground but whose humanity we respected nonetheless.

It seems that the refugees now fleeing from radicalised Islamist states have no similar desire to protect the weak against the strong but will nonetheless call on us to save them from their persecutors and feel entitled to a better life in the West.

Smells bad really!

These countries are only going to get worse if the people in them don't learn to make a stand. I mean a real stand. Anything we do to intervene in a major way will only give the radicals more reason to linger and spread their poison among the muslim majority. I think I must sadly admit a lot of people must die for that to happen.

mindlight · Apr 17, 2015

ChristsSoldier115 said:
These countries are only going to get worse if the people in them don't learn to make a stand. I mean a real stand. Anything we do to intervene in a major way will only give the radicals more reason to linger and spread their poison among the muslim majority. I think I must sadly admit a lot of people must die for that to happen.

Actually even after the experience of 2 bloody wars in the Middle east I still believe this to show a deep misunderstanding of how Islamic societies actually work.

Islam grows when these radicals have the power and terrorise normal people into thinking they cannot make a difference without jeopardising their own lives and those of the people they love. As with Soviet Communism a whole generation has grown up with self preservation as the highest goal of existence.

The only way to change this is to remove the radicalised elite and to impose secular or Christian government in which peoples freedoms of worship and choice are respected. Islam expands by force and is only ever defeated when force and political control are a part of the strategy.

It may well be that the withdrawal from Iraq is in fact an admission of weakness, of a loss of moral purpose and a failure of vision.

EDIT:

However against this I also believe that a people get the government they deserve. If Islam was really radically engaged with the living God then I would expect the peoples of the Muslim world to be less tolerant of such abuses of power as are currently rampant and more willing to take a stand against it.

Senator Cheese · Apr 17, 2015

mindlight said:
Actually even after the experience of 2 bloody wars in the Middle east I still believe this to show a deep misunderstanding of how Islamic societies actually work.

Islam grows when these radicals have the power and terrorise normal people into thinking they cannot make a difference without jeopardising their own lives and those of the people they love. As with Soviet Communism a whole generation has grown up with self preservation as the highest goal of existence.

The only way to change this is to remove the radicalised elite and to impose secular or Christian government in which peoples freedoms of worship and choice are respected. Islam expands by force and is only ever defeated when force and political control are a part of the strategy.

It may well be that the withdrawal from Iraq is in fact an admission of weakness, of a loss of moral purpose and a failure of vision.

EDIT:

However against this I also believe that a people get the government they deserve. If Islam was really radically engaged with the living God then I would expect the peoples of the Muslim world to be less tolerant of such abuses of power as are currently rampant and more willing to take a stand against it.

I wholeheartedly agree. Islam is a totalitarian political ideology that has found its way to exploit the democratic principle of tolerance to the point that it is spreading internationally. Leftists, traditionally actually defenders of democracy and human rights, are lead to believe that opposing Islam is inherently flawed - whereas it is absolutely imperative to oppose individuals for their opinions if these opinions entail oppression and despotism.

There is and never has been a Muslim pluralist state with a democratic government that grants equal rights to all minorities. Islam is an ideology driven by hate and is in no way different from German national socialism.

Nonetheless, much akin to the Cold War, I believe the best strategy is containment - that is, surveillance of those identifying as Muslims in the West - and a cessation of trade and cooperation with countries or regions under Islamist rule.

The rise of Islam is mainly due to financing by the West - whether by support of Saudi Arabian "allies" or Syrian "rebels" - and to a large part by the appeasement policies, antisemitic opposition to Israel and falsely understood "tolerance" that allows these kind of acts to occur.

NightHawkeye · Apr 17, 2015

Senator Cheese said:
Nonetheless, much akin to the Cold War, I believe the best strategy is containment - that is, surveillance of those identifying as Muslims in the West - and a cessation of trade and cooperation with countries or regions under Islamist rule.

The rise of Islam is mainly due to financing by the West - whether by support of Saudi Arabian "allies" or Syrian "rebels" - and to a large part by the appeasement policies, antisemitic opposition to Israel and falsely understood "tolerance" that allows these kind of acts to occur.

^^^ this ^^^

TLK Valentine · Apr 17, 2015

Senator Cheese said:
I don't know what's more sickening - the fact that 15 radical Muslims are committing murder because they hate Christians (and yet are seeking refuge in predominately Christian countries) - or the fact that 85 "moderate" Muslims did nothing to stop them and will now be granted asylum from "religious persecution".

or if these particular Christians hadn't been "martyred," they'd have been rounded up with the rest of the "illegals" and sent home packing.

Senator Cheese · Apr 17, 2015

TLK Valentine said:
or if these particular Christians hadn't been "martyred," they'd have been rounded up with the rest of the "illegals" and sent home packing.

None of the migrants were "rounded up" or "sent home packing". The shipping companies have a policy of not returning the migrants to the Libyan coast in spite of the fact that they are picked up closer to Africa than to the EU.

Regardless of whether or not that is a good thing, you're pulling a strawman.

TLK Valentine · Apr 17, 2015

Senator Cheese said:
None of the migrants were "rounded up" or "sent home packing". The shipping companies have a policy of not returning the migrants to the Libyan coast in spite of the fact that they are picked up closer to Africa than to the EU.

Regardless of whether or not that is a good thing, you're pulling a strawman.

In this case, yes -- but only because we're dealing with European, not US law.

Funny how the same people who would have turned them away (possibly to death in their home country) are now up in arms that they died too soon.

Some folks are just more valuable dead than alive.

Redac · Apr 18, 2015

The Religion of Peace at work again, I guess. Ugh.

mindlight · Apr 18, 2015

Senator Cheese said:
I wholeheartedly agree. Islam is a totalitarian political ideology that has found its way to exploit the democratic principle of tolerance to the point that it is spreading internationally. Leftists, traditionally actually defenders of democracy and human rights, are lead to believe that opposing Islam is inherently flawed - whereas it is absolutely imperative to oppose individuals for their opinions if these opinions entail oppression and despotism.

There is and never has been a Muslim pluralist state with a democratic government that grants equal rights to all minorities. Islam is an ideology driven by hate and is in no way different from German national socialism.

Nonetheless, much akin to the Cold War, I believe the best strategy is containment - that is, surveillance of those identifying as Muslims in the West - and a cessation of trade and cooperation with countries or regions under Islamist rule.

The rise of Islam is mainly due to financing by the West - whether by support of Saudi Arabian "allies" or Syrian "rebels" - and to a large part by the appeasement policies, antisemitic opposition to Israel and falsely understood "tolerance" that allows these kind of acts to occur.

Agreed and containment may well be the only viable practical strategy for now. But this problem will be solved at source or not at all. In my view the strategy is containment until the political capital exists to do something more long term. It is only a matter of time before some terrorist group goes a step too far and blows away all restraint from Western governments. When some idiot sets off a packet nuke in New York containment will not be enough of a response. In the meantime making allies with more moderate regimes in the Gulf that seem to be moving in the right direction is also a good idea.

Muslim migrants throw Christians overboard

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